Rebirth, Sup3r PCT, Post Cycle 3X and Form XT

[Canadian]

What is good, what isn't and what could make a decent stack for a 1 andro cycle?
(dosed at 160mg for 1 weeks and 270mg for 7 weeks - I use IML's 1-andro + OL's 1-andro - Easier to scale up or down)

I was thinking Rebirth + Sup3r PCT or Rebirth + Form XT (I have Rebirth and intend to use it)
My logic is to go for a stack that has test boosting ingredients and some AI ingredients.

I have Nolva and Exemestane on hand in case things don't go as well as planned, btw.

 

[AntM1564]

If you have a SERM, use that with Sup3r PCT. It has test boosting ingredients and an AI. You do not want to go overboard with the AI. Your goal is to control estrogen, not kill it.

 

[Canadian]

The claim by BLR about Rebirth is, "Rebirth is NOT an estrogen blocker, it’s more like an estrogen bodyguard, it lets the the good estrogen in, and the bad gets left behind."

and the other one is a bold claim but let's just add it, "E Cottioni: a polyphenol rich, heart-healthy, and cancer fighting edible red seaweed extract that has been shown to suppress breast tumor growth. Recent studies have shown this ingredient was able to outperform Tamoxifen while not showing any signs of liver or kidney toxicity."


Also, Tamox (nolva) is said to act in the same way, so why is one too much and the other just fine? Not being bitchy, I just wonder why you said that.

 

[vujade]

What is good, what isn't and what could make a decent stack for a 1 andro cycle?
(dosed at 160mg for 1 weeks and 270mg for 7 weeks - I use IML's 1-andro + OL's 1-andro - Easier to scale up or down)

I was thinking Rebirth + Sup3r PCT or Rebirth + Form XT (I have Rebirth and intend to use it)
My logic is to go for a stack that has test boosting ingredients and some AI ingredients.

I have Nolva and Exemestane on hand in case things don't go as well as planned, btw.

Rebirth and Super PCT will be just find for a 1-andro cycle. Especially at those doses.

I would do blood work after 60 days and if not fully recovered, then you could use your SERM on hand.

 

[vujade]

The claim by BLR about Rebirth is, "Rebirth is NOT an estrogen blocker, it’s more like an estrogen bodyguard, it lets the the good estrogen in, and the bad gets left behind."

and the other one is a bold claim but let's just add it, "E Cottioni: a polyphenol rich, heart-healthy, and cancer fighting edible red seaweed extract that has been shown to suppress breast tumor growth. Recent studies have shown this ingredient was able to outperform Tamoxifen while not showing any signs of liver or kidney toxicity."


Also, Tamox (nolva) is said to act in the same way, so why is one too much and the other just fine? Not being bitchy, I just wonder why you said that.

i think because you want to use Form XT and Super PCT. Both have AI's in them,

 

[Canadian]

And if by this winter I change my mind and add Epi-andro, any risks? I know both have AI properties and I wonder if I'll be reducing my estogen levels for too long, which is why I prefer going for 1-andro as a standalone

 

[Canadian]

Maybe Rebirth + Follidrone + DAA? I already have DAA left from a previous cycle, but I Sup3r PCT has some in it so...

 

[vujade]

Only risk from one andro and woo Andro would be possible hair loss if you're prone. You may have elevated BP and prostate issues. But all that can be countered with the proper cycle supports

 

[vujade]

Maybe Rebirth + Follidrone + DAA? I already have DAA left from a previous cycle, but I Sup3r PCT has some in it so...

I don't see anything wrong with rRebirth and super PCT I would drop the form XT

 

[brundel]

Rebirth and sup3r pct will work perfectly.

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

Why does everyone underestimate Rebirth... I love it.. For mild cycle's it does the job... I even add it to my clomid/torem for my harsh cycles

 

[vujade]

Why does everyone underestimate Rebirth... I love it.. For mild cycle's it does the job... I even add it to my clomid/torem for my harsh cycles

The reason why everyone doubts it, is because so many reps from other companies bash it.

I get a laugh out of them, because most of these reps, work for companies that sell OTC AI's, but
for some reason believe that something natural can be anti-estrogenic, but something natural cant
mimic a SERM.

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

The reason why everyone doubts it, is because so many reps from other companies bash it.

I get a laugh out of them, because most of these reps, work for companies that sell OTC AI's, but
for some reason believe that something natural can be anti-estrogenic, but something natural cant
mimic a SERM.

i got blood work from a 4 week run of it and back at basline, my LH wasn't as high as i liked so i ran another 4 weeks of it and felt amazing and beyond recovered, i can see if i can call my Endo and if i can get the blood work to post. It deserves some recognition IMO.

 

[Thunder]

Rebirth and Super PCT will be just find for a 1-andro cycle. Especially at those doses.

I would do blood work after 60 days and if not fully recovered, then you could use your SERM on hand.

Apologies for bringing this thread back from the dead, but it addresses the exact question that I have at this moment.

I asked the same question in another forum on AM, but the responses were far from helpful and more or less insisted that PCT after a 1-Andro cycle, without a SERM, was insanity.

In a nutshell, my plan has been to run Olympus Labs' version of 1-Andro @ 330mg ED for 4, 6 or 8 weeks. 4 weeks initially appealed to me because I wanted to avoid the potential shutdown that comes from running it for longer, however the general consensus is that it only starts to work around week 4 and that stopping there would be an exercise in futility and a waste of money. Having run the compound twice before, I do agree that 4 weeks is too short, but again, I want to avoid shutting myself down so much that I require a bunch of toxic chemicals like Tamoxifen or Clomiphene in order to get out of the hole I've dug myself into.

I am now just at the 4 week mark and am forced in to deciding how I want to continue from here. I've had none of the usual side effects that I experienced the previous times, including lethargy, which I'm so grateful for this time around, however my testicles have shrunk noticeably and are less full and softer than they were, even 2 weeks ago. Honestly, this scares me a little as this is only the half way mark if I continue for another 4 weeks, and by that time, they might be the size of Skittles lol. Besides this, I feel great, and look great.

So my question basically boils down to - when should I wrap up my cycle in order to avoid having to use Clomiphene to get my boys back on line. I have two bottles of Olympus Labs Sup3r PCT and I have just ordered two bottles of Rebirth. I also have about 5,000 IUs of HCG in the refrigerator from a couple years back when I was prescribed it for fertility purposes.

I'd very much appreciate some advice beyond, "use Tamoxifen or Clomiphene or you're f*cked."
If that is the case, then I guess I have no choice, but I am deathly afraid of both it and Tamoxifen due to their toxicity and potential for visual problems, so any chance to avoid them is greatly welcomed.

Thanks guys

 

[AnabolicGuru]

Apologies for bringing this thread back from the dead, but it addresses the exact question that I have at this moment.

I asked the same question in another forum on AM, but the responses were far from helpful and more or less insisted that PCT after a 1-Andro cycle, without a SERM, was insanity.

In a nutshell, my plan has been to run Olympus Labs' version of 1-Andro @ 330mg ED for 4, 6 or 8 weeks. 4 weeks initially appealed to me because I wanted to avoid the potential shutdown that comes from running it for longer, however the general consensus is that it only starts to work around week 4 and that stopping there would be an exercise in futility and a waste of money. Having run the compound twice before, I do agree that 4 weeks is too short, but again, I want to avoid shutting myself down so much that I require a bunch of toxic chemicals like Tamoxifen or Clomiphene in order to get out of the hole I've dug myself into.

I am now just at the 4 week mark and am forced in to deciding how I want to continue from here. I've had none of the usual side effects that I experienced the previous times, including lethargy, which I'm so grateful for this time around, however my testicles have shrunk noticeably and are less full and softer than they were, even 2 weeks ago. Honestly, this scares me a little as this is only the half way mark if I continue for another 4 weeks, and by that time, they might be the size of Skittles lol. Besides this, I feel great, and look great.

So my question basically boils down to - when should I wrap up my cycle in order to avoid having to use Clomiphene to get my boys back on line. I have two bottles of Olympus Labs Sup3r PCT and I have just ordered two bottles of Rebirth. I also have about 5,000 IUs of HCG in the refrigerator from a couple years back when I was prescribed it for fertility purposes.

I'd very much appreciate some advice beyond, "use Tamoxifen or Clomiphene or you're f*cked."
If that is the case, then I guess I have no choice, but I am deathly afraid of both it and Tamoxifen due to their toxicity and potential for visual problems, so any chance to avoid them is greatly welcomed.

Thanks guys

I would just run the cycle 6-8 weeks. I think you’re overestimating the side effects of serms. I’ve never had any issues with either nolva or clomid. I’d just get one or the other and run it for a quicker recovery. I think that the main purpose of a serm in pct is a quicker recovery, as opposed to a guaranteed recovery. You could run lower doses of either serm if you’re that concerned.

 

[vujade]

I recovered from 1-andro cycle with just otc products. But rebirth and a good test booster, can definitively even
help recover from stronger cycles.

 

[Thunder]

Thanks for the replies, gents.

What would you suggest I do in regards to the cycle length? Stop it short at 4 weeks, continue for 6, or push on to 8? The testicular atrophy has me a little worried, to be entirely honest. They really are noticeably smaller and softer. Did you encounter the same thing when using andro, and did they recover after PCT?

Cheers

 

[vujade]

for most andros 6 weeks is usually good. If you run 4 andro with 1 andro then 8 weeks would be fine.

I fully recovered from 1 Andro, it was not that hard of a shut down. Did start to feel lethargic around week
5 or 6 without 4 andro, or a test base.

 

[Thunder]

for most andros 6 weeks is usually good. If you run 4 andro with 1 andro then 8 weeks would be fine.

I fully recovered from 1 Andro, it was not that hard of a shut down. Did start to feel lethargic around week
5 or 6 without 4 andro, or a test base.

You mentioned that shutdown wasn't that hard, but did you experience any testicular atrophy? My libido's definitely down, but not to the point of it being a problem. I usually have quite large testicles (lol), so the change in size is quite striking to both me and also my wife. I'd be horrified if they continued to shrink for another 4 weeks and came out looking like Tic Tacs.

 

[Transhuman]

Why are you so worried about testicular atrophy knowing that they'll recover after your PCT? I don't understand the thought process of doing a cycle yet being overly worried about the side effects of a cycle.

 

[Thunder]

Why are you so worried about testicular atrophy knowing that they'll recover after your PCT? I don't understand the thought process of doing a cycle yet being overly worried about the side effects of a cycle.

Because almost all of the reports I've seen from people who have used 1-Andro, didn't report testicular atrophy as a side effect; even though it is documented as being a potential side for some people. It makes me feel a little like I might be reacting more sensitively in that department than others, and if that's the case, I don't want to run the gauntlet of permanently buggering my nuts.

 

[brundel]

If you run a steroid or something like a pH that converts to a highly suppressive steroid you can and should expect Suppression and testicular atrophy.
Unfortunately this is why phs suck.
Test and dht are anabolic right.
1 andro suppresses test and dht but the amount of 1test it converts to isn't enough to replace the lost test let alone put you into an anabolic state.

Steroid 101.
You never run a cycle without test except in specific situations like pre contest.
Your basically shutting your hpta down for potentially a net loss.
There will never be a point where the conversion of 1andro>test and dht.
This is why dhea analogies are terrible. Unless your running multi grams of several of them I would vote against.

This also why vector is so good.
0 suppression
Anabolic
Burns fat
Improves performance
No pct

 

[Whisky]

Just a couple of observations OP.

Regarding a serm, as AG points out it’s more about using a proven way to recover QUICKLY rather than being about recovery at all. The longer it takes to recover the more chance of losing the gains made on cycle. You probably will recover without a serm but you’ll probably have lost more gains than if you’d used a serm (and given the gains from a 4-8 week 1-andro cycle won’t be massive anyway that’s even more important).

Regards the length - I don’t personally see the point of putting anything like this in my system unless I’m getting the full benefits - you don’t go to a Hooker for a hug do you....if the sides of standard ph cycle lengths are an issue I’d honestly look at natty stuff (vector looks interesting right now).

My nuts definitely shrunk running 1-andro (even with 4-andro and epiandro in the stack). Honestly I don’t see why that’s an issue, your suppressing your own production so I think it’s a pretty standard reaction, you don’t take this stuff to keep your plums looking nice though.....you take it to get bigger and stronger - is that happening? If so embrace the fact the ph is doing what it’s meant to and apologise to the missus for taking longer to blow your lot over the next few weeks (actually I just found I didn’t fancy sex, was able to perform as normal when we did, I just wasn’t bothered either way).

I think 8 weeks is a good length but I’ve never run it solo - I get the feeling the lethargy would be brutal.

Good luck

 

[JoePaul39]

Apologies for bringing this thread back from the dead, but it addresses the exact question that I have at this moment.

I asked the same question in another forum on AM, but the responses were far from helpful and more or less insisted that PCT after a 1-Andro cycle, without a SERM, was insanity.

In a nutshell, my plan has been to run Olympus Labs' version of 1-Andro @ 330mg ED for 4, 6 or 8 weeks. 4 weeks initially appealed to me because I wanted to avoid the potential shutdown that comes from running it for longer, however the general consensus is that it only starts to work around week 4 and that stopping there would be an exercise in futility and a waste of money. Having run the compound twice before, I do agree that 4 weeks is too short, but again, I want to avoid shutting myself down so much that I require a bunch of toxic chemicals like Tamoxifen or Clomiphene in order to get out of the hole I've dug myself into.

I am now just at the 4 week mark and am forced in to deciding how I want to continue from here. I've had none of the usual side effects that I experienced the previous times, including lethargy, which I'm so grateful for this time around, however my testicles have shrunk noticeably and are less full and softer than they were, even 2 weeks ago. Honestly, this scares me a little as this is only the half way mark if I continue for another 4 weeks, and by that time, they might be the size of Skittles lol. Besides this, I feel great, and look great.

So my question basically boils down to - when should I wrap up my cycle in order to avoid having to use Clomiphene to get my boys back on line. I have two bottles of Olympus Labs Sup3r PCT and I have just ordered two bottles of Rebirth. I also have about 5,000 IUs of HCG in the refrigerator from a couple years back when I was prescribed it for fertility purposes.

I'd very much appreciate some advice beyond, "use Tamoxifen or Clomiphene or you're f*cked."
If that is the case, then I guess I have no choice, but I am deathly afraid of both it and Tamoxifen due to their toxicity and potential for visual problems, so any chance to avoid them is greatly welcomed.

Thanks guys

I am currently using Olympus Labs SUP3R PCT for post cycle therapy along with other natural test boosters along with several other supplements after running an 8 week cycle fully dosed with all 3 andros.I was also going to include Rebirth like yourself, but noticed Rebirth only contains 2 ingredients-Ellagic Acid and E Cottoni Extract. Olympus Labs SUP3R PCT already contains one of these two ingredients at twice the dose. It has 600 mg E Cottoni, thus I saved myself money and just bought the Olympus Labs pct along with the other ingredient it doesn’t have, the Ellagic Acid as a stand alone. This will save money and avoids doubling up on the Ellagic Acid by buying both Rebirth and the Olympus Labs product. All in all I believe I am recovering well, but only the blood work in 2 weeks will tell me objectively for sure. Good luck on your cycle.