Has anyone tried taking this supp? We all know how hard it is to eat 6-7 meals per day. I've been researching this product and it looks like it can help you absorb more protein in a single sitting. Depending on dose, it can be as much as 400% more!
There isn't a ton of research into this, oddly. We do know that 25-30g of protein is the most the body can absorb from a single meal. It takes the body an hour to naturally process 10g of protein. Assuming you are keeping protein in your system constantly throughout the day and are getting eight hours of sleep, that's roughly 160g absorbed. The rest is excreted in waste. If you supplement enzymes to break the protein down into amino acids, more can be absorbed. One study found 2.5g of enzyme increased absorption by 300% and 5g by 400%! Other studies have used more realistic doses of enzyme with slightly increased absorption.Do people in general have problems absorbing protein? I guess the skeptical side of me is, how do I know this is an actual concern and not a pseudo-issue supplement companies are creating to sell something which is not actually needed?
Im not sure your claims here are accurate at all.There isn't a ton of research into this, oddly. We do know that 25-30g of protein is the most the body can absorb from a single meal. It takes the body an hour to naturally process 10g of protein. Assuming you are keeping protein in your system constantly throughout the day and are getting eight hours of sleep, that's roughly 160g absorbed. The rest is excreted in waste. If you supplement enzymes to break the protein down into amino acids, more can be absorbed. One study found 2.5g of enzyme increased absorption by 300% and 5g by 400%! Other studies have used more realistic doses of enzyme with slightly increased absorption.
There are a lot of them, but I believe this is the one you're referencing?Im not sure your claims here are accurate at all.
From an evolution standpoint, itd be ridiculous to have such a small upper limit on meal absorption; in a modern sense, people/athletes who followed an intermittent fasting protocol would essentially be protein-malnourished?
The science Im aware of simply doesnt support what youre claiming. At all. Schoenfeld has a study directly applicable to athletes, and he puts the ideal upper limit for protein at 0.55gm/kg per meal. For a 100kg dude thats 55gm, double what you are claiming.
And the "issue" or bottleneck isnt gut digestion and absorption, its how large bolus doses of protein are utilised by the body (amino acid vs gluconeogenesis).
It might help if you posted the studies that directly show how supplemental proteolytic enzymes are "increasing protein absorption".
Yip, sure.The study done with 2.5g and 5g.
Protein supplements: Is protein absorption the problem? - Precision Nutrition
Forget how much you're eating. How much are you absorbing? What if you aren't absorbing all – or even half? Find out more about protein absorption in this article.www.precisionnutrition.com
Yes, I fully understand the importance of carbs when on cycle. In fact, it's been proven that much lower amounts of protein (0.6-0.8g/lb) when on cycle will actually help you bulk faster! Cutting fat off cycle is easier with 1-1.2g/lb and that's where I think these enzymes can really shine?Id add, seeing this thread is in the anabolic section...
AAS make the body more efficient at utilising ingested protein. Which effectively means, like training, you can get away with less. Im seeing this anecdotally with more and more coaches putting their (IFBB) athletes on "moderate" protein intakes; a 250lb+ guy eats 200-250gm per day. The "anabolic preference" is now switching to carbs.
I think whey is just an easier thing to control in a study? I imagine this would apply to all protein sources? I definitely agree that you should, whenever possible, get all of your nutrients from whole foods!Yip, sure.
But that study is limited and applicable to whey protein (liquid) intake, not wholefood. The author even recommends wholefood vs whey.
Well, theres obviously a plethora of nutrition (in general) studies done where protein intake isnt limited or restricted to whey. So Im not sure thats a factor here at all. My suspicion is that whey was used simply because of its wide use as a supplement....and the marketing potential for these enzymes.I think whey is just an easier thing to control in a study?
Sure and thats great but itd be even more compelling to see some studies where subjects in our demographic have used these enzymes to some significant advantage.Mostly I was looking for real world results from members. Hoping that someone had tried supplementing enzymes in their diet. I bought some and have been taking 1.5g of an enzyme blend with each meal. I started yesterday. We shall see if recovery time is reduced and if fat loss is expedited.
I completely agree! I am amazed it hasn't been done, given the clear evidence that the enzymes do work!Sure and thats great but itd be even more compelling to see some studies where subjects in our demographic have used these enzymes to some significant advantage.
Last bulking cycle I used Swanson n·zimes, a blend for aiding in the digestion of all macros. It helps when you eat more than 4000 kcal daily. Also cerecalase breaks plants walls so you get more of your vegetables.Well, theres obviously a plethora of nutrition (in general) studies done where protein intake isnt limited or restricted to whey. So Im not sure thats a factor here at all. My suspicion is that whey was used simply because of its wide use as a supplement....and the marketing potential for these enzymes.
The idea is certainly intuitively appealing, and I generally dont have a problem using supplements that have no "perceivable" benefits...but those supps also tend to have studies demonstrating their efficacy. It would seem using these enzymes would require faith that they are actually benefiting. Is that kind of where youre at with them?Last bulking cycle I used Swanson n·zimes, a blend for aiding in the digestion of all macros. It helps when you eat more than 4000 kcal daily. Also cerecalase breaks plants walls so you get more of your vegetables.
I feel like it can't hurt and they are pretty inexpensive. They also are purported to have other benefits that could be good for bodybuilding. I will keep it up through the end of this bottle and see what, if any results I get.The idea is certainly intuitively appealing, and I generally dont have a problem using supplements that have no "perceivable" benefits...but those supps also tend to have studies demonstrating their efficacy. It would seem using these enzymes would require faith that they are actually benefiting. Is that kind of where youre at with them?
Do you use protein shakes much? How much P/C/F do you generally aim for (I guess Im really wanting to know if you tend towards balanced macros, or low fat, or high Pro, etc)I feel like it can't hurt and they are pretty inexpensive. They also are purported to have other benefits that could be good for bodybuilding. I will keep it up through the end of this bottle and see what, if any results I get.
I do ON's Pro Grainer every morning in my coffee. I have been taking two of the pills with that. The rest of the day is whole food meals and maybe 2-3 20g Muscle Milk Lite shakes as snacks throughout the day.Do you use protein shakes much? How much P/C/F do you generally aim for (I guess Im really wanting to know if you tend towards balanced macros, or low fat, or high Pro, etc)
Yes, I don't have any digestive disease so the benefit shouldn't be very relevant, but I got them for cheap and I eat lots of vegetables, I don't lose anything to add enzymes when bulking.The idea is certainly intuitively appealing, and I generally dont have a problem using supplements that have no "perceivable" benefits...but those supps also tend to have studies demonstrating their efficacy. It would seem using these enzymes would require faith that they are actually benefiting. Is that kind of where youre at with them?
Thread starter | Similar threads | Forum | Replies | Date |
---|---|---|---|---|
Elevated liver enzymes? | Nutrition / Health | 6 | ||
Elevated liver enzymes? | Nutrition / Health | 9 | ||
Elevated liver enzymes? | Nutrition / Health | 0 | ||
Digestive enzymes | Supplements | 5 | ||
Proteolytic enzymes | Supplements | 6 |