Oral Primo + Enclomiphene (+hCG if needed) Cycle - Log

[mokoko]

Hello everyone,
Before I get hate comments, yes, its an oral only cycle, but not because im afraid to inject.

I'm going to run an oral primo and enclomiphene cycle for 3 to 6 months.

Week 1: 150mg oral Primo ED, 12.5mg Enclomiphene E2D
Week 2-14: 200mg oral Primo ED 12.5mg Enclomiphene E2D

Im taking each Enclomiphene tablet with Bioperine (black pepper) and Omega 3, usually with caffeine too. I also have Milk thistle, ginger root extract, Tongat Ali, Zinc, Boron and Ashgawanda.

Im going to do some bloodwork in week 3 or 4, if all goes as planned and I'm not suppressed, I will extend the cycle and increase the dosage to 250-300mg ED. If im suppressed, I will also add hCG injections. (HCG 2-3 times per week) and keep taking enclomiphene.

Why am I doing this?
I have used steroids up to 2 years ago, im not willing to cruise / blast or even trt anymore (fertility, health, keeping my endocrine system running) and im not looking to gain a massive amount of mass.I need to lean out and gain a few kg of lean muscle and i will be fine with that.

Originally, I wanted to do a SARM + SERM cycle, but SARMs gave me pretty bad results in the past and they are liver toxic. I would have gone with Anadrol if it wasn't liver toxic as well. (Anadrol is not really suppressive). Anavar was an option but seems to be too suppressive. Oral primo seems to be a perfect choice, as it's not liver toxic and should not be that suppressive at least in theory. Also, the short half-life of the acetate salt should also help minimize suppression in comparison to enanthate.

I also have primo enanthate laying around, which I might use if I find myself suppressed, and just gonna use it with the oral primo, HCG, and enclomiphene.

Cycle cost: around 400$ USD. Not cheap. If extended could cost an additional 400$.

I have seen the thread about using clomid with AAS and while I think it would not work with 90%, im pretty certain it will work with primo ace and anadrol, and i want to give it a shot.

Right now I am still at my first week, feeling fine, but will update. If some have ever done this in the past (either a solo primo cycle or a primo + enclo cycle) I would love to know

 

[Mikereyn513]

You were able to source primobolan acetate tablets?

 

[BBiceps]

I’m would save the Enclo for PCT and just run Primo Ace by itself. You are using a good enough amount so you should see results in a month or so.

I’m using 40mg Primo Ace ed now with 400mg Primo E ew (and Test at the same amount), I’m only 3 weeks in but I think it kicked in faster than what Primo E normally do by itself.

Good luck and keep updating, this is the first oral only cycle I’m interested in

 

[mokoko]

You were able to source primobolan acetate tablets?

yes, i make my own caps from raws...

I’m would save the Enclo for PCT and just run Primo Ace by itself. You are using a good enough amount so you should see results in a month or so.

I’m using 40mg Primo Ace ed now with 400mg Primo E ew (and Test at the same amount), I’m only 3 weeks in but I think it kicked in faster than what Primo E normally do by itself.

Good luck and keep updating, this is the first oral only cycle I’m interested in

I have thought about it but prefer to use the enclo during the cycle...i really don't want to risk getting suppressed and so far i feel good.

Its been exactly one week since I started, my libido is through the roof (to the point its really annoying). My joints are a bit stiff which is to be expected but nothing too major.

In terms of energy and training I feel the same, no difference in pump/looks yet.

will update in a week or so.

 

[BBiceps]

I have thought about it but prefer to use the enclo during the cycle...i really don't want to risk getting suppressed and so far i feel good.

I doubt it will prevent any suppression, I think it’s a waste on cycle but you do as you want.

 

[JKVol]

You were able to source primobolan acetate tablets?

This was literally my first thought

 

[JKVol]

Anadrol isn’t that suppressive?

 

[mokoko]

I doubt it will prevent any suppression, I think it’s a waste on cycle but you do as you want.

So running oral primo for 4-6 months without the enclo won't be a problem in your opinion? just curious, not attacking.

Anadrol isn’t that suppressive?

Its probably one of the least suppressive AAS:

Effect of Oral Anabolic Steroid on Muscle Strength and Muscle Growth in Hemodialysis Patients

Sarcopenia is common in hemodialysis patients. This study examined whether the anabolic steroid oxymetholone improves muscle mass and handgrip strength in hemodialysis patients and possible mechanisms that might engender such changes.Forty-three eligible ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Table 5. Changes in serum hormone concentrations

Serum testosterone (ng/dl) Male Baseline 604.9±165.5 vs 528.3±176.0 Week 24 247.2±207.8 vs 658.1±333.2 Change from baseline −357.7±91.3 vs 129.8±328.4

Serum luteinizing hormone (mIU/L) Male Baseline 16.4±11.1 vs 14.3±9.8 Week 24 10.3±18.5 vs 15.6±11.3 Change from baseline −6.0±20.4 vs 1.3±3.4

 

[BBiceps]

So running oral primo for 4-6 months without the enclo won't be a problem in your opinion? just curious, not attacking.

If it is a problem Enclo won’t make a difference.

 

[Mikereyn513]

yes, i make my own caps from raws...


I have thought about it but prefer to use the enclo during the cycle...i really don't want to risk getting suppressed and so far i feel good.

Its been exactly one week since I started, my libido is through the roof (to the point its really annoying). My joints are a bit stiff which is to be expected but nothing too major.

In terms of energy and training I feel the same, no difference in pump/looks yet.

will update in a week or so.

Ahhh...didn't even think of that lol...right on

 

[mokoko]

If it is a problem Enclo won’t make a difference.

there was a guy on the "clomid during cycle"thread that used primo E with clomid and claimed he was not suppressed according to bloodwork. I hope it will indeed do something.

Ahhh...didn't even think of that lol...right on

Very easy to cap because you don't need to be that accurate... I do 45-55mg per capsule, i don't have a capsule machine i just weight them one by one.

 

[Jeremyk1]

If you “can’t risk suppression”, why take any steroids? They’re all a risk.

 

[mokoko]

If you “can’t risk suppression”, why take any steroids? They’re all a risk.

Sure I agree, but there is a big difference between dbol and primo in terms of suppression and long term risk like liver damage.

Oral Primo is still being used in Japan for example. It is the safest oral AAS as far as I can tell.

 

[BBiceps]

Sure I agree, but there is a big difference between dbol and primo in terms of suppression and long term risk like liver damage.

Oral Primo is still being used in Japan for example. It is the safest oral AAS as far as I can tell.

True, I get it, you’re trying to find a “cheat code” to gains. Unfortunately it won’t work, anytime you get unnatural results it will be sides, Primo might be one of the safer but it won’t be safe in the amounts you’re taking and the length will definitely create suppression. Enclo will only save you in your fantasy world.

Dbol vs Primo A, true mg per mg Primo A is safer but I would argue that low dose Dbol is safer than high dose Primo, you’re taking a high dose for an example.

I’m not hating on your cycle, if you have quality gear I’m sure it’ll turn out good. I do hate on your unrealistic thought process though, it’s nothing safe with PED use and it will create suppression. How much? Only time will tell. Will you survive? Most likely.

 

[NegativeMass]

I would suggest just using the HCG instead of enclo. I've tried enclo + oral cycle and it worked but HCG + oral works much better for me and I feel a lot better. Ymmv

 

[mokoko]

True, I get it, you’re trying to find a “cheat code” to gains. Unfortunately it won’t work, anytime you get unnatural results it will be sides, Primo might be one of the safer but it won’t be safe in the amounts you’re taking and the length will definitely create suppression. Enclo will only save you in your fantasy world.

Dbol vs Primo A, true mg per mg Primo A is safer but I would argue that low dose Dbol is safer than high dose Primo, you’re taking a high dose for an example.

I’m not hating on your cycle, if you have quality gear I’m sure it’ll turn out good. I do hate on your unrealistic thought process though, it’s nothing safe with PED use and it will create suppression. How much? Only time will tell. Will you survive? Most likely.

I somewhat agree though dbol is IMO definitely not safe regardless of the dose. But a fair point.

In 2 weeks I will do the blood work, then I will be able to tell for sure. Worse case, I got hCG.

I would suggest just using the HCG instead of enclo. I've tried enclo + oral cycle and it worked but HCG + oral works much better for me and I feel a lot better. Ymmv

Fair enough... I thought about it as well and got some hCG laying around just in case. hCG + Primo sounds really good as the primo can help as an AI.

 

[BBiceps]

hCG + Primo sounds really good as the primo can help as an AI.

This is actually a pretty good idea.

 

[mokoko]

Next week i'll do the blood work (most likely) I can do them until March, so I'm still considering when would be the best time to do them.

Overall, I'm just starting to notice the primo. Its very subtle but I notice I'm drier and my muscle are more full.

In terms of overall feeling, it does increase my well-being, my strenth has been the same, maybe a bit better.

My libido is OKish, but my orgasms and penis sensitivity is decreased significantly, I think this is due to the Enclo.

I have also changed my cycle a bit, I'm not taking Enclo every day (12.5.mg). And I do some "off" days where I don't take anything to let my body recover.

My balls have decreased a bit in size, but nothing major.

 

[mokoko]

if anyone is still interested, im dropping the enclo (suspect its bunk).

im starting to feel like crap, don't like how I feel so im changing plans.

im going to use hcg + primo for now.

 

[mokoko]

Bloodwork on 150mg primo (I stayed on 150mg because 200mg gave me horrible sleep) and Enclomiphene (did 12.5mg E2D and then 12.5mg ED... but I suspect Enclo was bunk, read more below):

LH - 1
FSH - basically 0
Testosterone - almost zero

Everything else was ok besides ALT which was a bit above range at 57.

==
Bloodwork from 2 years ago:
==

LH - was in the 3-4 range.
FSH - can't recall
Testosterone 500-600 range.

(if anyone wants the exact values I can look it up)

So it's safe to assume that either:

• The Enclomiphene was bunk
• Enclomiphene is not enough to prevent suppression on Primo

I suspect it's a combination of both. As getting LH and FSH in this range means it's bunk.

I did my first dose of hCG today (250 IU just to see how I feel) and I already feel much better. Gonna do 500 IU tomorrow then gonna switch to 250 IU x2 per week.

 

[Hyde]

It’s probably bunk; real enclo with this cycle you should have very low (but NOT non-existent) LH, and very low testosterone because SERMs on cycle are still insufficient to prevent suppression (based on my own bloodwork).

Time to load that barrel up with 3cc of primo e and start popping the Abombs preWO! The low frequent HCG you’re introducing will keep estrogen sufficient and facilitate more growth & hormonal balance.

 

[Mikereyn513]

It’s probably bunk; real enclo with this cycle you should have very low (but NOT non-existent) LH, and very low testosterone because SERMs on cycle are still insufficient to prevent suppression (based on my own bloodwork).

Time to load that barrel up with 3cc of primo e and start popping the Abombs preWO! The low frequent HCG you’re introducing will keep estrogen sufficient and facilitate more growth & hormonal balance.

Fire in the hole...boom!!!

 

[Hyde]

Fire in the hole...boom!!!

Love Anadrol preWO…instant strength increase

 

[Mikereyn513]

Love Anadrol preWO…instant strength increase

After i stopped mine about 2 weeks ago or whenever it was I think my last day was a Saturday by Tuesday I was like wtf!? Why does this leg day suck so bad, oh yea the abombs are gone

 

[mokoko]

Love Anadrol preWO…instant strength increase

never touched anadrol but really want to try it someday...

how do you compare anadrol, anavar and oral primo as a preworkout?

Seems like anavar makes me more harder and vascular than primo, im curious whats your experience with it

 

[NegativeMass]

I did my first dose of hCG today (250 IU just to see how I feel) and I already feel much better. Gonna do 500 IU tomorrow then gonna switch to 250 IU x2 per week.

250 HCG 2x a week is very little HCG. I dividual reactions vary widely but I find 250 DAILY to do the trick.

 

[mokoko]

250 HCG 2x a week is very little HCG. I dividual reactions vary widely but I find 250 DAILY to do the trick.

that's sounds like a lot buy makes sense.

how long can i run it? i heard about hcg causing ledig cells to de-sensitize

 

[Hyde]

never touched anadrol but really want to try it someday...

how do you compare anadrol, anavar and oral primo as a preworkout?

Seems like anavar makes me more harder and vascular than primo, im curious whats your experience with it

Looking at preWO administration:

Nothing is like Anadrol. Puts me in the zone a little bit, but more relevant it acutely increases force output, so much so that it’s undeniable . More than any other oral if you take enough, although people claim Halotestin is better. The 24mg of Halotestin I used wasn’t as good at all, but could have been bunk.

Anavar increases pumps significantly. Drives up my blood pressure as much as Anadrol probably, acutely. Definitely hardens you with routine administration.

Oral primo: never used it; it’s ludicrously expensive and weak. My wife didn’t even notice it adding it on top of 5-10mg Var the time we experimented with it. Expect basically everything to do more than this at typical dosages.

that's sounds like a lot buy makes sense.

how long can i run it? i heard about hcg causing ledig cells to de-sensitize

I’ve used it for ~10 weeks on cycle at 250iu 2-3x a week with zero issue. More than that would bug my gyno quickly. Some guys can use way more.

With estrogen, for growth you generally want it high as you’re not getting side effects like excessive water retention, libido dysfunction, or gyno aggravation. Everyone will be different in the amount they tolerate, so slowly work it up if you have enough HCG on hand.

 

[BBiceps]

250 HCG 2x a week is very little HCG. I dividual reactions vary widely but I find 250 DAILY to do the trick.

No, 250mg 2x week is fine and a good starting dose, ppl think you need to use a ton of it but it’s not true, with too much you getting sides like high Estro.

 

[NegativeMass]

No, 250mg 2x week is fine and a good starting dose, ppl think you need to use a ton of it but it’s not true, with too much you getting sides like high Estro.

I don't think 1750 per week is overkill while I'm an anabolic, but maybe I'm wrong.

 

[BBiceps]

I don't think 1750 per week is overkill while I'm an anabolic, but maybe I'm wrong.

I mean, it depends what you use it for, if it’s to keep healthy balls/sperm you don’t need that much. If you really feel like you need more you could do 500 x2 week but I can’t see any reason to go higher than that.

 

[KvanH]

I mean, it depends what you use it for, if it’s to keep healthy balls/sperm you don’t need that much. If you really feel like you need more you could do 500 x2 week but I can’t see any reason to go higher than that.

500 - 1 000 IU / week is what I've typically seen people use as well. Divided in to 2-4 pins.

 

[Smont]

if anyone is still interested, im dropping the enclo (suspect its bunk).

im starting to feel like crap, don't like how I feel so im changing plans.

im going to use hcg + primo for now.

Clomid is probably not bunk, serm on cycle just dosent work for like 99% of ppl

 

[Smont]

I haven't used hcg in years but I always dosed it EOD.

And who told you anadrol is not supressive, don't take advice from that person anymore.

 

[Smont]

Also did anyone take into consideration his oral primo might be fake and it could possibly be a low dose of winni or anadrol. That would explain bloodwork. I've seen a few girls get anadrol when it was supposed to be oral primo. Ive even heard some speculation there oral primo was 2mg superdrol tabs

 

[mokoko]

Also did anyone take into consideration his oral primo might be fake and it could possibly be a low dose of winni or anadrol. That would explain bloodwork. I've seen a few girls get anadrol when it was supposed to be oral primo. Ive even heard some speculation there oral primo was 2mg superdrol tabs

How can I tell?

I don't notice any strength increase to be honest. Its not Anavar for sure.

Winni i also haven't used in the past.

It can be anything but comes from a decent source. The Enclo was def fake though.

 

[Smont]

How can I tell?

I don't notice any strength increase to be honest. Its not Anavar for sure.

Winni i also haven't used in the past.

It can be anything but comes from a decent source. The Enclo was def fake though.

You can tell by testing it.


If you know the enclo was definitely fake then send the primo to where you had the enclo tested at

 

[Smont]

And was clomid from the same source as the primo? If so then if the clomid is fake the primo is definitely fake

 

[Smont]

And what does a "decent" source mean.

I know a good source sells everything 100% legit and accurately dosed. If that source puts out 1 bad batch and dosent own up and fix it then they are no longer a good source.

There's good sources and bad sources

To me when you say decent source it sounds like there "ok", like they might be good or you heard they were good.

If you got the enclo from these guys and it was bunk then there a terrible source.

Sorry for the rant. I just want everyone to not support crappy sources.

If you buy a 10ml vial of testosterone then you should receive 10ml of properly dosed test, not 9ml that's only 187mg per ml

Or if you buy 50x50mg anavar then you should get exactly what you paid for. When we support shitty sources that send bunk products or relabeled products or underdosed and swapped gear we are telling them (hey, it's ok to screw us over, we will keep giving you money anyway)

Don't support shitty sources

 

[Mikereyn513]

You can tell by testing it.


If you know the enclo was definitely fake then send the primo to where you had the enclo tested at

@Smont Speaking of home testing what do you think of roid test on Palumbo's website, seems interesting and would be cool if it was legit, have you used it or anyone you know have?

 

[Smont]

@Smont Speaking of home testing what do you think of roid test on Palumbo's website, seems interesting and would be cool if it was legit, have you used it or anyone you know have?

It works to tell you if the compound is in there but it won't tell you how much.

So you might test your primo and it may show up as legit primo. But instead of 200mg it could be 50mg.

So it works, but it's not a gurenteed win if you know what I'm trying to say

 

[BBiceps]

The Enclo was def fake though.

What’s the reason to believe that but that the Primo is real?

 

[Hyde]

Clomid is probably not bunk, serm on cycle just dosent work for like 99% of ppl

He should probably still have very low, but not crashed, LH & FSH, assuming his SERM is real.

At least, that was my experience.

I was on all kinds of SARMs and DMZ and such making sick gains (PR Boxsquat at the time while leaning out and obviously adding muscle) taking 30mg Toremifene daily and my LH was somewhere around 1-2 going off memory on my end of blast bloods. Total Test was very low, sub 200 for sure.

So if DMZ et all didn’t absolutely crush it, Anadrol or Winstrol wouldn’t be any different. It was not effective at all at preventing testosterone suppression, but there was obviously an element of HPTA stimulation. That was also an estrogen-less cycle. I was boxsquatting because my knees couldn’t handle free squats, and I didn’t understand the importance of estrogen yet. I felt terrible lol, no test or estrogen, nothing to aromatize, not even DHEA intake. Very dumb, but educational.

 

[Smont]

He should probably still have very low, but not crashed, LH & FSH, assuming his SERM is real.

At least, that was my experience.

I was on all kinds of SARMs and DMZ and such making sick gains (PR Boxsquat at the time while leaning out and obviously adding muscle) taking 30mg Toremifene daily and my LH was somewhere around 1-2 going off memory on my end of blast bloods. Total Test was very low, sub 200 for sure.

Good points.

I'm wondering if his serm and gear came from the same place

 

[Hyde]

Good points.

I'm wondering if his serm and gear came from the same place

I added a bit more to my post above - namely, I had no estrogen, which is very suppressive.

 

[mokoko]

It works to tell you if the compound is in there but it won't tell you how much.

So you might test your primo and it may show up as legit primo. But instead of 200mg it could be 50mg.

So it works, but it's not a gurenteed win if you know what I'm trying to say

They are not from the same source. The enclo is liquid form from a big UK vendor. I won't mention names but I'm sure you all know them. I won't be buying from them again...

Primo e and primo are from the same source.

Primo e was sent for testing by me and came legit. Primo a was sent for testing by another customer around the time i ordered and came legit.

BTW I'm not using the Primo e at all at the moment. I have around 200ml of it (100mg/ml).

Adding hcg made me feel much better. Primo and hcg go very well together.

 

[Mikereyn513]

It works to tell you if the compound is in there but it won't tell you how much.

So you might test your primo and it may show up as legit primo. But instead of 200mg it could be 50mg.

So it works, but it's not a gurenteed win if you know what I'm trying to say

Go on Palumbo's website he now has the strips that show you the exact amount, you have to buy them separately but they're on there now

 

[KvanH]

They are not from the same source. The enclo is liquid form from a big UK vendor. I won't mention names but I'm sure you all know them. I won't be buying from them again...

Primo e and primo are from the same source.

Primo e was sent for testing by me and came legit. Primo a was sent for testing by another customer around the time i ordered and came legit.

BTW I'm not using the Primo e at all at the moment. I have around 200ml of it (100mg/ml).

Adding hcg made me feel much better. Primo and hcg go very well together.

RC sellers are ok to mention. It isn't Receptor Chem now is it?

 

[mokoko]

An

RC sellers are ok to mention. It isn't Receptor Chem now is it?

It is.

Imo they are totally junk.

 

[KvanH]

An

It is.

Imo they are totally junk.

Damn. I'm using their Enclo right now for PCT. I'm planning to draw bloods, but was going to do that on the 4th week. They have a good rep and many like them..