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not gaining

but only 45 carbs are gonna be added and my pro intake will stay the same, will this be ojk until i figure out how to take out the protein and replace it with carebes without losing cals?
 
oh ok thank you ill do that then.

BTW is that you in your avatar? because maybe since your a ladie that might have something to do with your bulking macros.
 
jmh80 said:
The explain why Bobo had me on 300 grams a day at 170 lbs???
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lol.. do i even need to bother making the "jump off a bridge" analogy? no offense to any member of this forum or anything, but 300 grams of protein for a 150 or 170 lb person ---bulking, cutting or otherwise---is WAY too much protein. flame me if you'd like, but that is the reality of proper nutrition. if you want to bulk, up your protein by a small margin, and add lots of complex carbs and healthy calories. adding more protein isn't going to help you gain weight... it's going to help you be constipated.. so if your goal is to gain weight by preventing digested food from leaving your body, this is the perfect program for you.. lol. if you'd really like to help someone bulk, you can fedex me the extra 150 grams of protein you're wasting per day. :) just let me know.
 
Moyer said:
You are bulking, right?

Bobo has said before that the only reason he raises protein higher than like .8g/lb is for the thermic effect. When I read that, I assumed he meant for cutting. I really don't know why you would want a thermic effect when you're trying to gain weight. I would think you could just eat a little less or do a little more cardio to have the same effect (I might be missing something though).

Of course, Bobo's bulking programs are usually said to be VERY lean, so maybe that's why.
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its simply a waste of money either way. there are far batter ways to cut than that. bike, jog, jump-rope, beat the crap out of a punching bag.. get off your lazy ass and stop eating so much.. friggin bodybuilders... lol
 
Wandy said:
its simply a waste of money either way. there are far batter ways to cut than that. bike, jog, jump-rope, beat the crap out of a punching bag.. get off your lazy ass and stop eating so much.. friggin bodybuilders... lol
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Yeah, lets just drop calories while we lift 5x/week and perform cardio 4x/week as well.


When you start training bodybuilders and have to account for their goals, let me know.
 
Wandy said:
lol.. do i even need to bother making the "jump off a bridge" analogy? no offense to any member of this forum or anything, but 300 grams of protein for a 150 or 170 lb person ---bulking, cutting or otherwise---is WAY too much protein. flame me if you'd like, but that is the reality of proper nutrition. if you want to bulk, up your protein by a small margin, and add lots of complex carbs and healthy calories. adding more protein isn't going to help you gain weight... it's going to help you be constipated.. so if your goal is to gain weight by preventing digested food from leaving your body, this is the perfect program for you.. lol. if you'd really like to help someone bulk, you can fedex me the extra 150 grams of protein you're wasting per day. :) just let me know.
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1. There is no "proper nutrition". The science in itself is mainly a theoretical science in its infancy.

2. Excess protein would cause the opposite of constipation if the the sources are adequate.

3. Adding protein will help you gain weight simply because its calories. Gluconeogenesis and protein turnover rate is calculated mainly by energy requirements and most likely he will utilize his macro's properly as long as its balanced enough. Intake should be based on goal and bodytype, not outdated FDA guidelines.



4. If the food sources are from whole foods and the digestion and absorption is regulated naturally (as whole foods will do) then higher protein intake is fine. If the sources are liquified coming form fast absorbing protein sources then then it most likely won't be absorbed and everyone can tell due to the excess sulfur content in amino acids. The same can be said with fast absorbing carbohydrates as well so its not the macro that is the problems but the absorption rate is the food item. Stating high protein intake gets wasted simply because its high is ridiculous.
 
khan8 said:
would it be ok to double my carbs sources in the first few meals (1.5 oats, double rice, etc)
when i do this, 200 cals are added..
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If you are worried about gaining excess fat, just reduce your fat intake a bit and increase protein (although 330g is quite high enough). If you aren't worried about fat gain and want the highest possible "weight" gain and performance "gain" drop protein, increase fat intake. You can basically adjust your protein and fat intake for your specific goals.

Most people that come to me mainly want the most LBM gains but least fat gain so that is why protein intake is higher. Cutting programs utilize higher protein intake because 99.9% want to keep what they have and drop the fat. You are already training 5x/week and cardio 4x/week so adding more cardio like some people suggest is foolish. Increase the thermic effect of your diet while utilizing cardio/weight training to the max while NOT becoming catabolic is the smart plan.

But what do I know, I'll just tell my next competitor to punch the bag a bit more and he'll be fine.


:rolleyes:
 
Moyer said:
I assume you're talking about an equation to figure his BMR, etc? IMO, those aren't that accurate, they're just a good starting point. He has just figured out that his maintenance is around 3200 (using his current macros), because his weight stayed the same for two weeks.

I actually gain pretty well on around 3400 cals and I'm 190lbs. I don't spar though, or do too much cardio, etc.
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Well when I do my maintenance and this could be wrong what I do is take by BMR add in all the calories I burned during the day then add on 500-750 calories total to my daily intake. So my caloric intake changes daily depending on how much I work out during the day Because if I am doing an MMA session I might burn 800-1000 calories more that day so to stay on the same amount each day wouldn't be as productive tolds bulking I thought. does this sound right?
 
Yeah - if Bobo told me to jump off a bridge - I'd do it.

:bb3:

Thanks for the edjumacation B!
 
mixedup said:
Well when I do my maintenance and this could be wrong what I do is take by BMR add in all the calories I burned during the day then add on 500-750 calories total to my daily intake. So my caloric intake changes daily depending on how much I work out during the day Because if I am doing an MMA session I might burn 800-1000 calories more that day so to stay on the same amount each day wouldn't be as productive tolds bulking I thought. does this sound right?
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Yes. Changing your calories based on how many you think you'll burn that day is a good idea IMO. Especially if you're doing things like MMA on only certain days.
 
Bobo said:
If you are worried about gaining excess fat, just reduce your fat intake a bit and increase protein
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Basically, excess carbs will probably be stored as fat. There's a good chance though that excess protein will either be converted to glucose (if needed) or be excreted from the body. Correct?

Bobo said:
If you aren't worried about fat gain and want the highest possible "weight" gain and performance "gain" drop protein, increase fat intake. You can basically adjust your protein and fat intake for your specific goals.
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Is the performance gain from the body having another source of fuel during exercise? (the new source being more fat)?

:o
 
No, excess fat will be stored first above everything else because the steps to chemically convert dietary fat into stored triglycerides is less than anything else. That and the fact its 9 calories/gram. Carbs into fat is overstated by a mile. If your diet is balanced enough its not a problem.

The body uses all sources at all times. I don't understand why people think it picks and chooses one. Only the ratios and amounts used based on energy requirements changes.
 
Bobo said:
No, excess fat will be stored first above everything else because the steps to chemically convert dietary fat into stored triglycerides is less than anything else. That and the fact its 9 calories/gram. Carbs into fat is overstated by a mile. If your diet is balanced enough its not a problem.

The body uses all sources at all times. I don't understand why people think it picks and chooses one. Only the ratios and amounts used based on energy requirements changes.
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I realize excess dietary fat will be stored first. I thought the body used all sources at all times, but you said the body would get a performance increase from increased fat intake, and I don't understand why that would happen(that's what confused me). My post above was just a guess, hence the question mark.

What I'm really trying to figure out is why you think 2g pro/lb of BW is better than 1.5g/lb when you're bulking. If carbs turning to fat is overstated, then why not replace that extra protein with good carbs? I don't see why an increased thermic effect would be a good thing when you're bulking.

I apologize if I'm being a pain in the ***. I just want to make sure I understand this. It seems a lot more important than most of the topics that are discussed here.

I feel like the dummy at the front of the class asking simple questions, but at the same time I don't feel like many people here really understand this either.
 
Because its a more efficient energy source than protein.

I didn't say it was better, I said it was different for different goals. Increased thermic effect decreases the chance of excess calries being storied as fat. Some people want leaner gains and increases protein intake while keeping carbs and fats moderate will do this but you will take a hit in performamce because its a less efficient source of energy.

Try it. Decrease you protein intake a bit and increase your carbs and fat a bit and you will hit PR's pretty easily.
 
ok is this better for non workout days (ill post workout days later):
and here is my diet for non workout days:
1.5 oats ½ cup egg whites, ½ whey, banana
cals 457 pro 31 carbs 68

chicken with 1 cup brown rice and almonds:
cals 630 pro 48 carbs 72

½ scoop whey/1.5 oats in water:
cals 285 pro 12 carbs 40
chicken with 1 cup (canned) black beans:
cals 370 pro 48 carbs 40

1/2 whey/1.5 oats in water with almonds:
cals 285 pro 12 carbs 40

2 OZ whole wheat angel hair with 1 can tuna:
cals 360 pro 39 carbs 42

chicken with 1 cup rice:
cals 470 pro 42 carbs 66

before bed whey/cottage cheese in water and almonds:
cals 370 pro 42 carbs 15

TOTAL cals 3227
pro 274
carbs: 383
 
Bobo said:
Increased thermic effect decreases the chance of excess calories being storied as fat.
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The thermic effect prevents excess cals from being stored as fat simply because it burns some of those calories, right? Or is there another reason for this effect?

Decrease you protein intake a bit and increase your carbs and fat a bit and you will hit PR's pretty easily.
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Cool stuff. I've never heard that before. I guess that's one reason why powerlifters tend to be less lean than bodybuilders.
 
That's the way I was leaning, but if that's the case, you could just lower your overall calories a bit to compensate. It seems like there must be somewhat of a nutrient partitioning effect, otherwise it would be pointless. I was hoping Bobo would reply, but he hasn't posted on the main boards for a few days.
 
i have a question
i just started skateboarding again and i skateboard ALOT every day and it is drianing and tiring like looong cardio basically, and i do it alot with friends so i dont have time to bring a set meal but is it ok to not count my macros but just to eat alot (what i think is enough) pasta, fruit, oats, chicken, etc each day? i would eat like 4-5 times a day

if i bring set meals and eat them i dont think its worth it i dont even gain damn weight anyways, so is this ok to do ?
 
You're likely to under eat if you start doing it that way but if it's what you want to do then go ahead.
 
khan8 said:
i have a question
i just started skateboarding again and i skateboard ALOT every day and it is drianing and tiring like looong cardio basically, and i do it alot with friends so i dont have time to bring a set meal but is it ok to not count my macros but just to eat alot (what i think is enough) pasta, fruit, oats, chicken, etc each day? i would eat like 4-5 times a day

if i bring set meals and eat them i dont think its worth it i dont even gain damn weight anyways, so is this ok to do ?
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Bad attitude to have man. You WILL gain weight if you eat enough. That's all there is to it. Couldn't you just bring a shake with you in a cooler, in a backpack? Some homemade protein bars? A sandwich, light string cheese, walnuts in a baggie, banana, apple, prunes, etc?

Like Ziricote said though, it's up to you.
 
Its almsot a gurantee that you wont be eating enough to put on muscle. Added in to the intense cardio you are describing in skateboarding you will need so much more than in my opinion you could imagine (thats just based on this approach)

I cant see you eating enough when you need to be eating that extra chicken breast even when you feel like if you take another bite you may pass out.

Planning is well worth the results
 
OCCFan023 said:
Its almsot a gurantee that you wont be eating enough to put on muscle. Added in to the intense cardio you are describing in skateboarding you will need so much more than in my opinion you could imagine (thats just based on this approach)

I cant see you eating enough when you need to be eating that extra chicken breast even when you feel like if you take another bite you may pass out.

Planning is well worth the results
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I agree completely.
 
ok, then the days i go over to friends houses to skate (every day basically)
i will take some snacks that add up to the macros of a meal
 
PVSkyHigh said:
You need to be eating more carbs. I would say add another 100g a day in there, and post what your fat total is. You are young, and most likely your metabolismis through the roof. I used to be 5'10'' 130 lbs. in high school and I used to eat a lot. You may want to add more fat to your diet, don't flame me, I am just saying that if his metabolism is like mine was at that age, he can eat boat loads of fat and not gain any fat. With that in mind, post your fat stats, and most likely I would add another 100g of carbs and possible more fat to your diet.
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:good post:
 
wow this sucks.
i lost 4 pounds this week (coincidentally the week where i started skateboarding and eating like three meals)
anyways,
if i go on my "bulking" diet, is it even worht it? i ask this because i skateboard for hours each day and i cant imagine how thqat doesnt burn muscle.
does anyone have any tips to minimze the muscle i lose when i skateboard? and quitting skateboarding is not an option,


thank you
 
Eat more, a lot more. Around 500-1000kcal on top of your bulking diet will do I think if you're skateboarding everyday.
 
khan8 said:
wow this sucks.
i lost 4 pounds this week (coincidentally the week where i started skateboarding and eating like three meals)
anyways,
if i go on my "bulking" diet, is it even worht it? i ask this because i skateboard for hours each day and i cant imagine how thqat doesnt burn muscle.
does anyone have any tips to minimze the muscle i lose when i skateboard? and quitting skateboarding is not an option,


thank you
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dude you gotta find your BMR and your daily calorie expenditure.
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use this and if the skateboarding is as intense as you say put moderate or very active. Once you find this you have to add on 500 cals to start with to put your body in a calorie excess. If it is as intense as you say then you are going to require alot of food and this can be hard. If you truely want to build muscle you have to find what you need and commit to it. Your body wont be burning muscle even while you skateboarding if you eat every 2-3 hours.
 
whoa,! i have to eat 3600 cals a day!

is it ok to eat my normal diet as above but add a conveniant weight gainer shake?
 
Sure as long as it's not a gainer full of sugar, might be an idea to make your own using oats, whey and milk.
 
If his main problem lies in eating the sheer volume of "clean" food required to meet his caloric needs wouldn't it be beneficial for him to focus on calorie dense foods?

Ie: Add some thick peanut butter sandwiches, nuts, a big fat chicken breast salad with heavy olive oil vinegarette, etc... Hell, maybe even throw in a hamburger here and there.

I realize getting all of his cals from clean food is optimal and I'm not saying to binge on fast food regularly, but at 15 he might just need to eat calories, one way or the other. With your age, body type, and activity level you might need to be hammering down 4500 cals a day before you start actually gaining weight. I know when I was 15 I got a hell of a lot stronger and ripped up, but never ate enough to actually gain any serious mass.

Are you at least gaining strength? There is nothing wrong with being a strong, ripped up 160 pound 15 year old either bro. I'm sure the girls in your high school would agree.
 
if i have to quit skating in order to gain weight (if thats the case)
then would it be alright to eat 3100 which is my maintenance level and just build muscle slowly like that? i wouldnt have to worry about fat either. just need input.. thank you
 
If I could go back and do it again - I would add more dirty foods at that age.

I ate SUPER clean starting at like 14. I had great abs (sorta) - but NO MASS whatsoever.

I think I was "shorting" myself by not getting enough saturated fats.
 
khan8 said:
whoa,! i have to eat 3600 cals a day!

is it ok to eat my normal diet as above but add a conveniant weight gainer shake?
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I like cytogainer by cytosport. Try muscle milk with some 1-2% milk. This can get pretty expensive so try making a weight gainer shake with pb, yogurt, milk, bananas, whey, or anything along those lines (hell even get some ice cream in there if you want.) Just make sure you have some protein and carbs
 
Man, if you like skating, don't give it up. IMO, life's too short to give up something you really enjoy to gain a couple pounds.

All you have to do is get more calories. Your diet's already better than pretty much every 15yr old ever. Have a big shake.

How many 15yr olds get fat while lifting hard three times a week or more? Huh? Maybe not zero, but it's pretty ****in close.

:burger: :burger: :burger: :burger: :burger: :burger: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>:food:
 
It sounds like just not enough calories bro, like most here have said.

I bulk on 3200 calories and Im 5'9" 165lbs, and lift 4x/week and do cardio 2x/week. Youre 2" taller, more active, 15 y.o. and probably still growing. I would think that those 3600 cals would be about minimum for for you to bulk.
 
jmh80 said:
If I could go back and do it again - I would add more dirty foods at that age.

I ate SUPER clean starting at like 14. I had great abs (sorta) - but NO MASS whatsoever.

I think I was "shorting" myself by not getting enough saturated fats.
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Glad to have someone agree with my post. Was a bit worried about getting flamed on this forum recommending eating burgers.

But yeah bud, you just need to eat everything in sight and work hard. Enjoy your metabolism and eat all those calorie dense foods. The strength and size WILL come.

Old school creatine mono did wonders for me when I was about 16-17. Gained about 30 lbs in a bit over a year, still had a sixer.

Oh yeh, and don't even think about stopping skating if you enjoy it that much. You're looking to gain muscle/strength, not get fat; the cardio won't hurt you, just keep eating.
 
I think that's probably the best thing about being a teenager ; you can eat next to anything and still grow. Take advantage of that but try to keep some form of clean diet as a base.
 
YES @ Zircote.

EAT CRAPPY FOOD NOW! When you get above 25 - you have to be much, much more selective.

I'm with SHSU - eat EVERYTHING in site. Quit f*cking around with calories and just EAT!!!!
 
yea but i dont want to gain fat being skinny with fat would suck but thanks for the suggestion ill go for the stuff like exttra virgin olive oil (in my shake) almonds, etc
 
you wont gain fat unless you eat complete crap and dont workout. Eat sensible and dude dont be afraid of getting fat, its a phobia that can cost you muscle. Just dont eat mcdonalds 3 times a day and chips and youll be fine.
 
i dont workout, i only lift weights which i think you are talking about cardio when you say that?
but skateboarding all day can be considered cardio i guess.
i NEVER eat mcdonalds ahh the worst food i will have is pizza or steak n shake but ill either feel bad afterwards or skateboard ha.
 
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