New Dr. switching me to sublingual HRT

RipdnTxs

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I have recently switched MDs, my old one had a stroke and in my opinion is not fully recovered. My new DR., from the research Ive done on him and some friends that go to him, is ALOT more about supplementation and not all about prescribed meds and tries to treat the body as a whole. He does not prescribe IM testosterone, because with the IM route the levels are high 24/7 until the test starts to clear and then the drop off happens until next shot. He states this is not natural and is causing my hemocrit and hemoglobin levels to rise into the upper limits, with the sublingual ( taken in the morning) it will rise in the A.M. and fall off as the day wears on in a more natural way. This is the first Ive heard of this treatment and was wanting some opinions or thoughts. Ive had to see a Hemotoligist about the high levels I mentioned earlier and he took me off test for a month ( which sucked) and my levels came back down into normal ranges, so the testosterone for me anyway was the cause of this. The new Dr. stated I shouldnt have these issues with this protocol and he has switched any of his new patients to this and all are having success. Thoughts !!!!!!
 
Presa

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Test is a tried and true proven natural hormone; PERIOD. The only thing changing are the delivery systems and protocols. That being said, whatever works for YOU, then so be it. Personally! The new IM injections using insulin syringes and multiple doses each week are winning the battle!!
 
ambulldog

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sublingual troches i believe they are called. like presa said t is t. the difference here is its just test with no ester attached so its used up quickly. as for the blood thickening. not sure thatll make much difference but youll see soon enough. i had high hemo etc at the top of the chart several months ago. started donating whole blood every two months and that didnt do too much in terms of thinning. so the next time i went to give blood i spoke with one of the directors there since i know them now from going regularly and explained why i was giving blood and that it wasnt quite doing what i was hoping for. he said donating what they call a double red blood cell donation would be the route to go for that purpose. you can only do that every 4 months. so i did and the next time i went 4 months later after giving the double red my levels were much improved. dont remember exactly but i was running high 17's to low 18's then when re tested i was low 16's. much much better
 
Royd The Noyd

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Striant buccal adhesive patches have some solid stuff behind them. I wouldnt be worried. I wanted to do some ph's based on the same approach but our fuggin FDA be hating. :(
 

RipdnTxs

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Thanks for the replys, I am a little skeptical about this new delivery having any effect on my blood issues, but of all the Drs. Ive talked with this one seems to be the most knowledgeable and up to date on HRT related topics, so I will give this a chance and see what happens, I still have some Cyp. stashed :yeah: The Doc also ran a salvia test over a whole day and found I have very low cortisol by noon, he stated I have adrenal fatigue and am now supplementing to get that in order as well, I take better care of myself than ever, yet feel tired alot of the time, so I am going to trust the doc and keep researching and see if I can get my mojo back a little.....
 

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Royd The Noyd

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basically just testosterone no ester and cyclodextrin to help it absorb and not be broken down in the saliva. It definitely works, just is $$, and not suitable to particularly reach bodybuilding grade levels.
The pitha studies showed 2000%increases. Although I think he was using higher doses than the new pharm stuff intended for trt.
 
EasyEJL

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The pitha studies showed 2000%increases. Although I think he was using higher doses than the new pharm stuff intended for trt.
I guess thats possible with multiple times a day dosing. I was mostly thinking about short term absorption limits sublingually. But the damn things are expensive from what i remember, like on the order of $3-4 per dose without insurance.
 
Royd The Noyd

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I guess thats possible with multiple times a day dosing. I was mostly thinking about short term absorption limits sublingually. But the damn things are expensive from what i remember, like on the order of $3-4 per dose without insurance.
I've never seen the price. But I'm sure
 

DragonRider

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basically just testosterone no ester and cyclodextrin to help it absorb and not be broken down in the saliva. It definitely works, just is $$, and not suitable to particularly reach bodybuilding grade levels.
So,not alkylated or methylated, no liver issues to worry about like other orals.
 
The Matrix

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nope, so thats nice. the only real side effect is empty wallet. Its worse than Andriol price wise
Any thing through the liver which has to go more then once is going to have a major increases in estrogen and other metabolites. I tell every one to stay away from orals even prohormones which are more dangerous then anabolic steroids no matter how safe they say it is.
 

RipdnTxs

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I picked up my new script and it reads comp testosterone 15 mg SL, take one in the morning and one at noon on Mon.,Tue.,Thur., and Friday. I have not had a chance to talk to the Doc. again yet, but this seems like a strange way of achieveing stable levels when I will not be getting any 3 days a week. I have been searching, but have yet to find any info on this protocol. I was doing the standard 1/2 cc cyp. a week and my labs two weeks ago, three days after shot were TT 890, E2 was 60(ouch)... I,m wondering where and how the Doc. came up with this type of dosing schedule, any insight on this would be great... My last shot was this past Fri. so I will start this next Fri. and how things go.
 

DragonRider

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I picked up my new script and it reads comp testosterone 15 mg SL, take one in the morning and one at noon on Mon.,Tue.,Thur., and Friday. I have not had a chance to talk to the Doc. again yet, but this seems like a strange way of achieveing stable levels when I will not be getting any 3 days a week. I have been searching, but have yet to find any info on this protocol. I was doing the standard 1/2 cc cyp. a week and my labs two weeks ago, three days after shot were TT 890, E2 was 60(ouch)... I,m wondering where and how the Doc. came up with this type of dosing schedule, any insight on this would be great... My last shot was this past Fri. so I will start this next Fri. and how things go.
Does the package insert tell you what the half life is? The only thing I can come up with is the half life may be long enough to give you some overlap for the days when it is not used.

I find the twice a day dosing a little inconvenient. It requires you remember to have some with you at work or anytime you will be away from home for the day. Wouldn't be as bad if you could take it every 12 hours. There would be more likliness of being back home for the next dose, so you don't have to plan to bring some with you.
 
EasyEJL

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Nah it can't be, the ester would ruin the absorption. And 15mg in the tab is maybe 5-8 mg injected
 

DragonRider

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Nah it can't be, the ester would ruin the absorption. And 15mg in the tab is maybe 5-8 mg injected
You are probably right. Now that I think about it, that would be why he has to take 2 doses a day, just a few hours apart (morning and noon)
So, on M,Tu, Th and Fr he is mimicking circadiun rythm, but W, Sa and Su he gets to be a eunich? I shouldn't say that, he might know I'm kidding.
 
The Matrix

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Which part? I've never seen pharmaceutical sublinguals done with an ester, and any dosing I've seen with them is at least 2x injected.
anything hormonally through the liver will convert higher percentage to estrogen
 
Royd The Noyd

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Which part? I've never seen pharmaceutical sublinguals done with an ester, and any dosing I've seen with them is at least 2x injected.
Sorry missed the part about the ester. But sublinguals use a lower dose (administered more often obviously) to create a larger biological effect.
 
RoadBlocK

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Is this a "new drug" thats going to cost the insurance company big bucks? Maybe thats why this new Doc is so hot for it? I dont like the way your posts read about how hes handling your case.
 

RipdnTxs

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Yea, I,m not real sure about how he is handlin it, but I did find on Dr., on line but cant remember his name at the moment, Ive looked at so many, but he said with sublingual it will go directly into the bloodstream and bypass the liver and will clear in 48 hrs, so that may be his thought process on lowering my T level some to help with the blood thickening and high E2 that is happening with cyp. injections, I have tried 1/4 cc every 4 days with little change in my values, so that may be why he is dosing me in this way. I will have new tests run in the near future and that will tell me how this is working.....
 

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The main point of the sublingual is to avoid 1st pass metabolism in the liver. The half-life is not very long normally, but the Striant is supposed to adhere to the cheek and have a sustained release profile. I don't know why he would skip days though.
 

RipdnTxs

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I took my last shot of cyp. two and a half weeks ago and have been on the sublingual for the past week. The pellets disolve pretty quickly leaving a little bit of bitter taste after it disolves, not bad really. I have noticed my nipples are not as hard and tender as they were, they would stick out in the gym sometimes, so that leads me to believe my E2 is coming down some, my sex drive to this point is the same and have not noticed any reduced aggresion in the gym, I know its early still, but so far I feel good, still waking up with a morning wood :)
 

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