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Nate Dawgs 1test cyp/4ad cyp/19 nor/dbol/M5aa cycle

the joint pain could come from the high dose of 1-test. it has been reported by several that taking around a gram a week kills their joints. oh yeah, good decision on the HCG. it should help alot with mood and sex drive
 
Did shoulders/traps tonight, got a really good pump and strength was up. I didnt do back last night, I was just too wore out from legs the previous day. Squatting and deadlifting in the same day will take a toll on ya. Well I think that I am overtrained, I am always tired, and my motivation to lift is not near as high as it usually is. I have been talking with a powerlifter at my gym and he has recommended that I take a week off, because for the last 14 weeks or so I have been lifting balls to the wall, all heavy weights in the 1-3 rep range for core movements. So I think my CNS is just plain wore out, and the past couple weeks my bench has just felt like complete ****, and some of my other lifts havent been up to par like they should be. So I think I am going to take next week off, maybe just hit biceps twice or something, and that will be it. I really hate to do this in the middle of the cycle, but I feel that this is the best decision to continue getting good gains from the cycle. Now with the hindsight, I wish that I would have took the week before I started the cycle off so I would be good to go, but it is alright. If you guys have any opinions, feel free to let me know.
 
i just finished a week off yesterday and while i'm not on cycle now it was definitely a great move i had been going balls out for 3 months and my body definitely needed it

i think taking time off even during cycle given what you've described is a great idea although since you're on perhaps you don't need a full week maybe 3-4 days would be sufficient
 
Nate,

how long did it take for your 1t and 4ad cyp to kick in. I was thinking about running mine for 6 weeks, instead of 10? what do you think?

Also i wanted to add a transdermal, either oht, or 19 nor?
 
To tell you the truth ability, I would say run it at the very minimum 8 weeks. Last week was the 5th week and I could just start to tell it was working, and this is the 6th week and I can feel it pretty good now. I was even running dbol the first 5 weeks, the last 4 being at 50mg/day, that **** had to have been underdosed or something, because i sure as hell didnt get dbol like gains that I hear of, I know it was at least something because after only a few days of being on my nuts were starting to shrink. I am taking this week off, just doing biceps, and yesterdays workout i got an awesome pump. So I would definetly have to say run it at least 8 weeks, preferably 10 or even 12. As for the transdermal, i would think the oht would be a good choice, especially if you are worried about bloat. I have never ran 19nor before this, so i dont know what to expect from it, but i cant really claim that it is doing a whole lot, but i also cant say that it isnt doing anything, hard to tell what is doing what. Personally next time if i had to pick between the two I would go with 40ht, i am not a big fan of water retention. Hope that helps man!
 
thanx nate.

I think im going to go back to my origanal plan, 10 weeks on the cyps, damn, its gonna be a badass cycle.
 
Sorry about the lack of updates lately, been busy with stuff.

Well I took last week completely off other than biceps, and that was the best thing I could have done. I feel so much better and more recovered now. On monday, I got 375 on bench, my best before that was 355, about 4 weeks ago or so. Box squats were up and deadlifts were up a little bit. We have been videotaping a few of our lifts to analyze for and what not, but it is really cool to watch when you get home from the gym. My diet has been pretty good lately, especially protein, I counted up 413g I took in yesterday, so I was happy with that. I havent weighed for probably a week, basically just because I can tell I havent gained a single pound and it will just piss me off when I get on the scale, so I would say it is in the 204-205 range, I will try and weigh tomorrow morning.
 
Nate Dawg said:
Sorry about the lack of updates lately, been busy with stuff.

Well I took last week completely off other than biceps, and that was the best thing I could have done. I feel so much better and more recovered now. On monday, I got 375 on bench, my best before that was 355, about 4 weeks ago or so. Box squats were up and deadlifts were up a little bit. We have been videotaping a few of our lifts to analyze for and what not, but it is really cool to watch when you get home from the gym. My diet has been pretty good lately, especially protein, I counted up 413g I took in yesterday, so I was happy with that. I havent weighed for probably a week, basically just because I can tell I havent gained a single pound and it will just piss me off when I get on the scale, so I would say it is in the 204-205 range, I will try and weigh tomorrow morning.
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Anymore soreness from the 1-test cyp?
 
Manu20- No I havent had any soreness at all, I only gave it the hot water bath at the beginning of the cycle and then after 3 weeks or so, havent done another one since. I cant even tell the next day I have given myself a shot, and I am taking quite a few pokes, maybe my body is adjusting to it or something. On mondays I shoot 2.5cc in right quad, 2.5cc right glute, and .5cc of HCG in right quad also, then on thursdays I shoot 2.5cc in left glute, 1.25cc in left delt, 1.25cc in right delt, and .5cc of HCG in left quad....so a decent number of stabs per week and absolutely no soreness. All the 1test/4ad shots are mixed in a 50/50 ratio by volume, and the HCG is 500IU/ml, so I take 250IU 2x week. It is actually working quite well, my nuts have came back completely.

Knox- Eat a dick:thumbsup:
 
Weighed in at 205lbs this morning. I was actually surprised, I figured I would be somewhere around 202-203. My waist is still about a 1/4-3/8" smaller than the beginning of the cycle so that is a good sign.
 
Did chest yesterday, went pretty good, got 380x1 on flat bench with just a very tiny tap in the bottom from my spotter, I know I could get it but for some reason I lost a little focus during the lift and that hurt me a bit. Legs were today, Box squats werent really up at all, deadlifts were up around 15lbs. Well, I am gonna add a new twist to this cycle..lol....today I ordered some test prop and tren acetate. I am going to run the prop at 100mg EOD and the tren at 75mg EOD. It should be here around next friday or so, and I will start it as soon as I get it. I am going to run it for 4 weeks I am thinking, so that will put the end of the cycle out to about week 13. I have been on HCG for 3 weeks now I believe, and I have plenty more, so I am not too worried about recovering...it may be a little rough, but we shall see. I know this is probably not the wisest decision, but hell, I havent hardly gained any size at all on this cycle!!!!! My strength has gone up really good, but no size, I dont know what the deal is. Every day I get a minimum of 300g protein, usually it is in the 400g range, and the carbs are in the 500g range/day, taking in between 4500-5500 cals/day. Give me some opinions if you wish, but I'm not gonna change my mind on it:D
 
Well I caught a cold this weekend, so I havent been feeling the greatest, but by tomorrow should be back to 100%. Chest on monday didnt go that great, but I really wasnt expecting much considering the circumstances. Did legs today, and box squats were actually down, but my 5RM for deadlifts was up 10lbs. Just wasnt as focused at the beginning of the workout when I was squatting. I recieved my MDHT from sledge on Monday, and today I noticed a little increased energy, but still a little early to tell. Took 50mg 20min preworkout, but next time I think I will take it about an hour preworkout, because as the workout went on, I could feel it more. Took my blood pressure and it was 130/70, so that was much better than what I had expected it to be. Still eating really good, but I havent weighed lately so I dont know exactly where I am at there. Thursday will be my last shot of the 1test and 4ad, I preloaded my syringes tonight just to see how much I had left and emptied both bottles. The test and tren should be here between Friday and Monday, so I will be starting that as soon as I get it. Switching up to a 4 day split and see how that works instead of 5 days a week, it was just getting to be too much and by the end of the week I was feeling pretty burnt out and felt slightly overtrained, so I am going to give the 4 day split a try and see if that helps. Well thats about all I got for now, feel free to ask any questions or give opinions.
 
Weighed in at 205 this morning. By noon today I had already taken in 3550 cals, 220g protein and 350g of carbs, definetly on the right track for today, although alot of those cals are from fat.
 
Did shoulders and tris tonight, switching things up a bit. For shoulders did some seated DB press and side laterals, tomorrow with back I am going to hit rear laterals since my rear delts get more of a hit from back day than they actually do on shoulders. For triceps did some heavy closegrip floor presses in the power rack in the 2-5 rep range, first time I have ever tried them so it was a little akward, but got some marks to shoot for next week. Then did a few sets of DB overhead press, a couple of machine pushdowns and a couple with reverse grip pushdowns. I normally do triceps with biceps on friday, but I am trying to get more of a powerlifting routine set up, so I figured why hit tris on friday and only have two days to recover when I can do them on thursday and have 3 days to recover. It was kinda hard doing both tris and shoulders together, the military presses kinda taxed the tris a bit before I got to them, so I might change it next week...just have to think about it some more. Tomorrow will do back/bis/traps. I usually do traps with shoulders, but my back is still so fried from deads on tuesday that I dont think I would be able to work up as heavy as I wanted to.

I am getting pretty flustered on this whole not gaining weight deal. It is frickin ridiculous. So far this week I have ate every day a MINIMUM of 5800 cals, that was my low day....yesterday I hit 7200 cals!!! In that was 435g protein and 580g carbs, now still about 50% of my cal intake is from fats, but hell, I should at least be getting some fat on me, but I am still not gaining a single pound. If this test/tren dont put some weight on me, I dont know what to think. If you have ANY suggestions, let 'em fly, because I am stumped, I have been talking to several of the experienced lifters in my gym and they think it is weird that I am not gaining too. Surely genetics wouldnt be coming in to play yet I wouldnt think....when I graduated high school 2 years ago I was weighed in the 148-152 range, so I have packed on over 50lbs of weight since then. Also I am sure that I am not overtrained because just 3 weeks ago I took a whole week off, so I am confused. Any ideas?!?!?
 
hmm man i'm really not sure what to say everything is in order...
hopefully the tren/test will work although i know for some tren doesn't really provide for all that much weight gain as it can melt off fat
i know you're weight hasn't really gone anywhere but have you taken your measurements lately? have those improved?
 
Sadly enough....no they havent improved either. I am fucking stumped on this one. I had better gains on my 7 week S1+ cycle last winter, and my diet is even better on this cycle than it was on that one. One thing that seems kinda weird to me is, during this whole cycle I have never really felt that "on" feeling, there have just been a handful of days in the gym where I could tell I was really getting an extra kick, so I dont know.........
 
Saturday shot 75mg tren and 100mg prop in my right glute, it knotted up a little but definetly not as much pain as I had with the 1test in the beginning of this cycle, have another shot today. Weighed in this morning naked after taking a long piss, 200lbs....i dont get why I cant gain any weight, I have been eating like a horse lately, I should start gaining now though. Diet going pretty good today, for breakfast had 6 eggs, protein shake, 1.5cups oatmeal, 24oz orange juice, and 24oz milk, for lunch had 1lb beef, 1 box of mac and cheese, and 32oz milk, should be over 3000 cals already and 210g protein. Let the fun begin!!!
 
.i dont get why I cant gain any weight said:
eat more and/or rest more, you said something before about eating a pizza every couple days, try adding one every day, i gained so much weight doing that, yes it was some fat, but if you are a hard gainer, it shouldnt be too hard to burn that fat off post cycle, last cycle i did, my weight went from about 190 up to 215 in six weeks, it dropped to 205 durring PCT, a month after PCT it was back up to 210 but a lot leaner than the 215...i cleaned up my diet post cycle, not too clean though, im one of the lucky people that no matter how bad i eat i dont go much over 12% BF, even on the pizza and beer diet. eat to grow, dont worry about putting on a little excess BF in pursuit of muscle mass, the fat will come off easier than the muscle adds on
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Nate Dawg said:
Thanks for the tip weeenisss, sounds like a good enough excuse to eat pizza everyday:thumbsup:
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just keep in mind, when you are on an all out bulk, EAT LIKE IT
 
sorry glenihan...havent got around to answering you yet, will do:thumbsup:

Had a pretty good chest workout yesterday, decided to switch things up so started off with floor press, never really tried it much before but it went pretty good, then did several sets of incline barbell bench, then hit a few sets of flat db bench and some flyes. Feeling fairly sore today so thats good. Have legs later today, going to go with free squats instead of box squats, been box squatting for the past several weeks and gains have kinda stagnated, so I am interested to see how just normal squats go. Still eating like a champ, this weight had better start coming on soon.....
 
Did legs on tuesday, had a pretty good workout, first time doing free squats for several weeks, I have been working alot off a box thats about 3 inches below parallel, so thats not much fun. Deadlifts went good too. Took wednesday off, and last night did tris and some back. Started off with weighted dips for tris, and got up to 3 45lb plates strapped around my waist for 12 reps, which is a PR for sure, I have never even tried 3 plates previous to this. Monday I weighed in at a whopping 200lbs even, and today am up to 202lbs, which I think is a definite improvement considering in the past 3-4 weeks all my weight has done is stay the same or go down, despite the high calories. Breakfast this morning was 6 eggs, 1.5cups oatmeal, 32oz OJ, and 24oz milk, then for lunch I had 1lb of beef, 1 box of mac and cheese, 32 oz milk, BBQ buffalo wings and some Doritios...so definetly keeping the cals up there. I think next week I should start to notice some more strength gains. Thats about it for now....
 
jesus how on earth did you possibly consume all that at lunch!?! i usually have 1lb of turkey and spinach and i literally have to force myself to swallow then i can't move for a good 10 minutes

i wish i had your appetite!
hang in there man with the prop and the tren you should definitely start getting freaky
 
I just make myself eat it, at first it was kinda hard, but I think I have stretched my stomach out to where I can hold more food, then also when I think about how pissed I am that I cant gain weight, I start eating more. Did shoulders traps and bis tonight, kinda hard doing shoulder presses the day after triceps, my tris were so dead today, and those heavy dips yesterday killed my elbows, shoulder presses and oddly enough side raises hurt too, so I didnt get in too many sets of those, shrugs went pretty good, and for bis I just did 4 dropsets with 4 drops in each set on the preacher machine curl, but my bis were already fried from back yesterday, but still got a decent pump. Gonna try and get lots of sleep and food in this weekend, I am looking forward to see what next week brings. From monday, all my measurements have already increased 1/4 to 1/2 inch, so that is promising.
 
Well, friday I started noticing some very tiny lumps developing under my nipples, so I started taking nolva at 80mg/day. It has only been 3 days on, so I am not too sure as how long it will take for the nolva to start doing its thing, but they havent started shrinking yet, although no itching or anything for the most part. I really hope it isnt from the tren, I have been taking B-6 at 500mg/day to help a bit with the progesterone, and today I went and got some vitex, not really sure on the dosage for that, but took 2500mg today. I have only taken 4 shots of tren as of today, so I dont see how it could be progesterone related so early, but having been on the 4ad for 9 weeks, I imagine when adding real test that could have caused it. I dropped the 4ad 10 days before my first inject of test, so most of it should have cleared out. If anybody has any tips I would appreciate it!
 
well nolva takes a few days to build up in the system before it can really work so i'd keep at it for a little while long and reassess after a week or so
 
Did chest today, did floor press again for my main max effort exercise, it was up 5lbs, incline was up about 5 too. My tris were still thrashed from thursdays tricep workout, so I know the lifts would have been better if I would not have been as sore. Also feeling a little sick yesterday, felt ok today, not great, but alot better than yesterday. There are alot of people getting sick around, and the weather here is fluctuating almost 40 degrees, so that is doing a number on my allergies. Got legs tomorrow, excited to see what that brings.
 
Did legs today, felt pretty good, but just didnt quite get the numbers I wanted to, so I am kinda confused on why the strength wasnt there as much as I thought it would have been. I ordered some N Large2 and some muscle milk today, I have been eating so much lately that I cant hardly get any more food in for more cals, so I am gonna try and start adding some shakes in there for even more cals. Diet is still going really good, actually the other night I ate so much I threw up, so that was interesting.....
 
Nate,

Im going to be starting my cycle that is similar to yours on sunday. What kind of volume are you using in your workouts? how many reps per bodypart approx?
 
Right now I am using a fair amount of volume, not as much as I used to do, but it is still decent. Say for chest I will pick a main movement like flat bench, floor press, or board presses and work up to a 1RM over approximately 10 sets or so, then go to incline, do 4 sets in the 6-8 rep range, hit some DB presses, either incline or flat, whatever I feel like, and do 3 sets of 6-8 reps, then some flyes with 3-4 sets in the 10-12 rep range. Usually at least 4 exercises with 4-5 sets of each, and all in the 6-12 rep range, so it is a decent amount of volume. What dosages are you going to be running for your cycle Ability? I would say run at least the dosage I did, if not up the 4ad more, I dont know what the deal was with the 1test/4ad cycle, but it just didnt give me the results I wanted.

Weighed in at 202.5 this morning, so up 2.5lbs since I started the test/tren. Last night I had a shot in the right glute and hit a little low, so it knotted up pretty bad today, not real pleasant but it should be fine in a couple days.
 
Im going to be doing 1000mg of 1T, and 1500 mg 4ad, with 90mg m14ad, and 24mg's m4ohn.

I think the doses im going to run for 1t 4ad are around yours or maybe the same.

If you want ill post my projected training program for the first 4 weeks(bulk).
 
Did biceps last night, got a pretty good pump, vascularity was up. Did chest today, started off with regular flat bench for the max effort exercise, nothing special really to report. The full range of motion felt a little akward due to the limited range of motion from the floor presses I have been doing the past couple of weeks. I am expecting next week to go pretty good, today I just wanted to get a good mark to go for to beat next week hopefully. Diet still dialed in really good, this is the absolute best I have ever had it as far as high amounts of cals carbs and protein. I got my muscle milk and N large2 in today, so I will be adding a couple of those shakes to my diet each day to try and take the cals even higher. Legs are tomorrow, they had better be up, last week I felt really good getting ready to squat, but it just went like ****, it was even lower than the week before that, which makes no sense but thats what happened. Aggression is way up too, so that is fun.
 
I will get my weight tomorrow morning, off the top of my head if I remember right, my quads and chest are up almost a 1/2in, arms maybe a 1/4, they are looking a little more cut I think, and waist is the same. I can start to tell that I have gotten bigger, and so can others, so right now going by the scale isnt working out so well, I think it is kind of a body recomp going on, my abs look more defined. One other thing, that muscle milk makes my stomach a little uneasy, I dunno whats up with that, I just drank 2 scoops of muscle milk with 2 scoops of nlarge2 for my bedtime protein and my stomach doesnt feel so hot, I should get used to it. The muscle milk is mocha joe, pretty strong taste, so maybe thats it.
 
i almost feel sorry for you, you eat more than i can imagine, take so many hormones you make arnold look like a wuss, and you can still barely gain :D
 
nate, those last measurements you gave i'm assuming at from when you started the prop/tren right?
i don't think they can be from the beginning of the initial cycle...
 
Yes those are measurements from the beginning of the test/tren, although they arent far off from the beginning of the complete cycle, which sucks. Weighed in this morning at 203, so 3lbs in 18 days, ok I guess, I think I look a fair amount different than I did before the test tren so that is good.
 
Chest on monday went alright, nothing spectacular really to report. The previous two weeks I had done floor presses for my main max effort exercise, so when going through a full ROM this week, it felt a little akward, so I imagine next week should be up. Legs went on tuesday, both squats and deads were up. Squats were up around 15lbs and deads were up another 10lbs for my 5RM. Most of this is probably due to me never deadlifting in the past, but in the last 11 weeks or so, I have added 80lbs to my 5RM on deadlifts. Shoulders and tris last night, got a really good pump, and strength was really good for tris. For dips I got up to 4 45lb plates on the belt and got 4 reps, was going for 5 but about half way up stalled out and kept pushing for about 3-4 seconds, then my nose became a fountain and blood shot out everywhere. I think that I am leaning out, it is kind of hard to tell in the abdominal area because I can tell I am holding alot of sub-q water, such as early in the day when I havent ate or drank as much yet, I look much leaner, then by bedtime the skin becomes alot thicker, but after the workout and sweating alot, it all goes away. I think my sodium intake is pretty high, combined with the test that is probably the reason for the water retention. Weight jumped up pretty good today. Yesterday I weighed in at 203.5lbs, and this morning I was 205.5 lbs, I had to check 3 times, I thought the scale was messed up or something. I even got up twice last night to take a piss and took a long one right before I weighed so I know it wasnt mostly water weight. I have never been so grateful to gain a pound, I have never had to fight this hard to put on weight, it has always been hard, but usually it would come easier than it is now. Doing speed box squats and back tonight, so I will check in later. I think I am going to go eat some pizza and make sure this 2lb gain stays!
 
congrats on the overnight weight gain man

are you feeling any of the sides from the tren? night sweats, insomnia, increased aggression?
 
There have only been two nights this entire time that I havent slept too well, but it was still better sleep than I was getting when I was on the 1test. Absolutely no night sweats at all, I feel warmer most of the time, so I have my room fairly cool at night, it helps me fall asleep faster too. Aggression is through the roof, it is good at times, but other times I can get extremely pissed about little things. I consider myself to have lots of self control and can control my moods pretty good for the most part, but on this stuff, if I get in a bad mood, I have a hard time breaking out of it. I stopped my HCG for the past 2 weeks because I was running low, and I would rather have HCG at the end of the cycle then towards the middle of it, so I took 250IU tuesday, then will take 250IU next tuesday, then take 250IU ed the last three days of the cycle. I dont know how to explain it, but my mood was going pretty shitty for the past week before I took that HCG shot, and after I took it, even within a couple hours it seemed. I was in a much better mood. Today I can tell it has started to wear off a bit, as I got riled up over some stupid **** today, just have to make it till next tuesday!!! Tonights workout did speed squats, speed deads standing on a 4in box which was pretty tough, then some pulldowns, cable rows and shrugs. Went pretty good overall.
 
I thought this was pretty cool, one of my really good friends who is a girl, was over at my house the other night and I was about to get ready for bed and my bro wasnt here to help me with my shot, so I asked her to do it for me. It took alot of convincing and it was funny to watch her while I filled the syringe because she was all freaking out about it, and she is a really good girl so to say, she isnt exactly keen on me doing this stuff. Well I got her to do it and she did a really good job, I just thought I would share that cuz I thought it was pretty neat.
 
haha man if i asked any of my girl friends to do that for me they would COMPLETELY FLIP OUT!

except my actual girlfriend lol, she would do it for me but she's cool as ****
 
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