NAC Correlated to Osteoarthritis

[Hyde]

Just one big retroactive study, but the overall gist was people using NAC at varying dosages daily for at least 28 days a year were shown to have up to 4x greater incidence of osteoarthritis in their knees. This was the opposite of what was expected to be found initially by the study.

Increased risk of knee osteoarthritis in patients using oral N-acetylcysteine: a nationwide cohort study

Knee osteoarthritis (OA) is known to be a progressive degenerative disorder; however, recent evidence suggests that inflammatory mediators contribute to cartilage degradation. Studies have reported that N-acetylcysteine (NAC) had a promising effect on ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I have used NAC chronically for some years now, probably over 5, and after my arthroscopic elbow debridement procedure performed yesterday, the surgeon did mention there was osteoarthritis noted present in my elbow.

Just some food for thought. Not saying it doesn’t have its uses, but it might point to NAC being better left to acute strategic use rather than as a routine preventive measure for respiratory illnesses or improved liver values.

 

[Rad83]

Maybe that’s why my knee been clicking and feeling off lately :/

 

[Hyde]

Maybe that’s why my knee been clicking and feeling off lately :/

Yeah kind of a bummer article to stumble across, but I figured it was worth a share. We have to make the best decisions we can as we go along.

 

[ANABOLICWRWLF]

Thank you for sharing. This is intriguing to say the least. When I read the title I wondered if it was something that came up during the operation or assessment of pathology. Might be putting NAC back in the "cycle support" category instead of daily use.

 

[BBiceps]

This sucks, I have been using NAC daily for the last few yrs… I guess it’s good to rotate anyway.

 

[manifesto]

This is why I'm a big proponent of stacking deca with NAC

 

[DieselNY]

Interestingly, doses of NAC in drinking water reduced osteoarthritis symptoms and cartilage damage in mice.

Antioxidant defender protects against osteoarthritis

A protein involved in multiple cellular processes called ANP32A protects cartilage in the joints against degradation by damaging oxidation, preventing the development and progression of osteoarthritis, according to a new study by Frederique Cornelis and colleagues.

www.eurekalert.org

 

[Jeremyk1]

The only issue I can see here is that they don’t seem to consider that NAC use may have been initiated from some people having knee pain. They note in the intro that NAC can help with knee pain, but they want to investigate what other effects it would have. It could possibly go the opposite way, not that NAC caused it, but that people developing knee osteoarthritis caused people to start NAC treatment. Otherwise, they seemed to control for everything. Statistically, it doesn’t seem great.

This is probably the same kind of thing we all heard about years ago with antioxidants being somewhat counterproductive to muscle growth. A major part of the body’s repair process is the damage signal. A lot of antioxidants and anti inflammatory type substances will block those signals.

Anyway, I hope this is looked into more. I’d hate to have to throw out NAC to save my knees, because it does have benefits. But I hope someone investigates how significant this is and at what dose one would expect to see these effects.

 

[Jeremyk1]

Interestingly, doses of NAC in drinking water reduced osteoarthritis symptoms and cartilage damage in mice.

Antioxidant defender protects against osteoarthritis

A protein involved in multiple cellular processes called ANP32A protects cartilage in the joints against degradation by damaging oxidation, preventing the development and progression of osteoarthritis, according to a new study by Frederique Cornelis and colleagues.

www.eurekalert.org

This is good, but:

“Interestingly, doses of the antioxidant N-acetyl-cysteine (NAC) in drinking water reduced osteoarthritis symptoms and cartilage damage in mice deficient in ANP32A.”

It was shown in mice that are deficient in a substance that was linked to healthy cartilage. It would be useful for someone who has a specific need, but not necessarily for a healthy person.

 

[Hyde]

Interestingly, doses of NAC in drinking water reduced osteoarthritis symptoms and cartilage damage in mice.

Antioxidant defender protects against osteoarthritis

A protein involved in multiple cellular processes called ANP32A protects cartilage in the joints against degradation by damaging oxidation, preventing the development and progression of osteoarthritis, according to a new study by Frederique Cornelis and colleagues.

www.eurekalert.org

That’s a good point, which they actually bring up in the paper if you get a chance to read through (I know it’s pretty long), which is part of why they did the study and expected to see benefits only initially.

It does seem to help symptoms, but what they’re theorizing based on results is that the inhibition of the complete inflammatory response may ultimately promote degradation/lack of complete repair.

So using NAC may reduce symptoms, but seems to further the underlying condition.

The only issue I can see here is that they don’t seem to consider that NAC use may have been initiated from some people having knee pain. They note in the intro that NAC can help with knee pain, but they want to investigate what other effects it would have. It could possibly go the opposite way, not that NAC caused it, but that people developing knee osteoarthritis caused people to start NAC treatment. Otherwise, they seemed to control for everything. Statistically, it doesn’t seem great.

This is probably the same kind of thing we all heard about years ago with antioxidants being somewhat counterproductive to muscle growth. A major part of the body’s repair process is the damage signal. A lot of antioxidants and anti inflammatory type substances will block those signals.

Anyway, I hope this is looked into more. I’d hate to have to throw out NAC to save my knees, because it does have benefits. But I hope someone investigates how significant this is and at what dose one would expect to see these effects.

That’s definitely a possible contribution for some, no doubt, but considering from how far across the range they pulled those nearly 13,000 NAC users, that certainly cannot explain the overarching correlation.

So maybe it’s not quite as bad as the evidence appears due to the chicken/egg dilemma with some users maybe already having OA & using NAC for relief, but it’s got to be a decidedly negative skew in the end.

Yeah the lack of average dosing would have been nice, but it almost seems like in the scheme of it all it wasn’t even that relevant - using it for more than 28 days straight in a year was the only criteria.

 

[Hyde]

I’m not saying this is gospel; I just truly randomly stumbled across it when looking at contraindications with the prescriptions the surgeon wrote and felt it was too serious not to share.

We know NAC can do some incredible things during respiratory illness, it can be used to really support the liver in moments of toxic overload, it has its place still as a potent health tool - but maybe too much of a good thing could be a bad thing.

 

[Hyde]

And I want to add that I’m not a researcher or medical expert; I’m just a guy who has been using NAC for years.

I also want to add that I have been powerlifting/strength training for over a decade, so joint pathology is a certain eventuality. Do not assume that my elbow wouldn’t have shown osteoarthritis if I had never used NAC, because the 100,000 loaded presses/extensions of my elbow over years would surely disagree.

 

[Rocket3015]

I have had bad knee's for years, so who knows ??

 

[Mikereyn513]

I have had but knee's for years, so who know's ??

What are " but knees" ? Lol just messing with you rocket happens to me on here all the time

 

[Hyde]

What are " but knees" ? Lol just messing with you rocket happens to me on here all the time

That’s when everything feels good But your Knees!

 

[Rocket3015]

That’s when everything feels good But your Knees!

You nailed it !!