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Muscle Tech Peptide 185

Chaimiasy

Chaimiasy

Member
So I am not and never been a fan of anything by MT. I never used any of their products. But this is an interesting relase by them, not what I’d have expected. Is anybody familiar with it ? Would anybody give it a chance? Are there any other brands that make this supplement ? Is it any good? Just curious.
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Rad83 said:
666 mg per capsule ….I’d avoid
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I had to laugh at you saying that because when people used to ask why we did a 501 capsule in some things, it was because if we did 500 capsules, then it would have been 166.666..... servings so we went with 501 capsules haha.

In regards to the ingredient, not enough feedback to know for sure.

It was exclusive to Muscletech, but other brands are allowed to use it now, so I'd wait and see if someone offers it at a more reasonable price.
 
I'd like to give it a shot for sure because it's manufactured by Ingenious Ingredients, who seem to be a reputable company...they're the creators of Paraxanthine (enfinity®)

The only problem is the price right now. For that it would HAVE to have a pretty noticeable benefit.
 
I used for just 4 weeks. Certainly not long enough for any major results, but I didn't notice better recovery either. Based on that, I never bothered re-purchasing.
 
AndrewMcD said:
I'd like to give it a shot for sure because it's manufactured by Ingenious Ingredients, who seem to be a reputable company...they're the creators of Paraxanthine (enfinity®)

The only problem is the price right now. For that it would HAVE to have a pretty noticeable benefit.
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What do you think would be a fair price ?
 
Chaimiasy said:
Maybe somehting that needs to be taken long term ?
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Probably, but for the hefty price I expected some recovery benefits within the month. I didn’t want to spend hundreds before seeing or at least feeling something. There are plenty of natural supplements that will kick in within a few weeks that are better priced.
 
JohnnieFreeze said:
Probably, but for the hefty price I expected some recovery benefits within the month. I didn’t want to spend hundreds before seeing or at least feeling something. There are plenty of natural supplements that will kick in within a few weeks that are better priced.
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Nothing natty is worth that price tag. You are right to drop it if no difference was seen within a month.
 
Madevilz said:
Nothing natty is worth that price tag. You are right to drop it if no difference was seen within a month.
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Agreed. Nothing martinis worth that price. There are even some products form companies here that seem a bit over priced for natty products especially for everything having to coincidentally be 30 days. But ya right
 
JohnnieFreeze said:
Probably, but for the hefty price I expected some recovery benefits within the month. I didn’t want to spend hundreds before seeing or at least feeling something. There are plenty of natural supplements that will kick in within a few weeks that are better priced.
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I think that's the biggest issue with the product/ingredient.

I think it has potential, but at the price that they're selling it for, there are just better options available.

That was why when I posted in the thread, I wanted to make sure that people knew it was no longer exclusive to Muscletech, so if anyone wants to try it, there may be some more cost effective options in the coming months.

The ingredient is super expensive, so it's never going to be cheap, but I would expect there to be more cost effective options.

LucasBagoDoce said:
Sounds like total bs
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I don't think that its total BS, but I think that it works through a method of action that will take some time to produce noticeable results, and at the price that Muscletech sells it for, people understandably want to see something fast.

It's not something that I would try myself at that price, but to see it available in the next few months at better pricing and I may would try it then. I wouldn't pick it over certain other things, but would be curious to add it to some other things.

I think its unfortunate, and I've said this about a few ingredients over the years - that sometimes companies will overhype the heck out of something and give unrealistic expectations with their marketing and it will lead people to have unrealistic expectations about an ingredient and then wind up giving people a negative opinion of it - when the ingredient may actually have potential if the information was presented accurately and that way people could have proper expectations.
 
Chaimiasy said:
Agreed. Nothing martinis worth that price. There are even some products form companies here that seem a bit over priced for natty products especially for everything having to coincidentally be 30 days. But ya right
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I don't think there's a single forum sponsor on AM that tries to deceive anyone into buying multiple bottles of product.

If anything, AM has had some in the past that overhyped and made it out like some of their things were going to work super quick and then people wind up mad bc they didn't, whereas if they'd given people more realistic and honest expectations and a real timeline for results, they'd probably be viewed more positively for it.

I'll never criticize any company for being honest with me about how long it will take for a product to work.

Supplements and pharmaceuticals take different time periods to be effective based on their methods of action.

Certain methods of action produce results faster than others to - that's the case whether one is talking about supplements, prohormones, sarm's, peptides, anabolic steroids, anti-depressants, etc.

The average bottle of capsulated supplements is a 30 day supply.

I'd much prefer any brand to be honest with me about how something works and how long it would take for something to work than to try to overhype it and try to convince me that I'm going to get results fast in order to just make money off of me on the first bottle.

If a brand tells me that something may take __ amount of time to work, whatever time period __ is, the brand did their part by being honest with me as to what to expect and didn't just bs me trying to make a sale.

Think about what's being discussed in this thread - its like a no-win situation for honest companies.
  • Muscletech overhypes the hell out of something - it's way overpriced, but it had you interested in it, and market wide it sells out within minutes.
  • But if a company was honest about the ingredient and said that based on method of action it was likely going to take using it for 6 to 8 weeks to start to see the best results, then you'd have the impression that they were trying to sell you on 2 bottles - when in reality, they would be the ones being honest with you.
^^^ I'd much prefer a company to be honest with me and tell me what to really expect, so that I can then decide if its worth it to try.
 
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This post has nothing to do with the product this thread is about - bc I'll be the first one to say that I wouldn't buy it myself at the price that it is, and I'd tell anyone that that ingredient would need to be ran for at least 2 months to start seeing the best results from it.

This post is just for perspective about realistic expectations.

We live in a world where everyone wants results fast.

That's perfectly natural and I'm impatient myself. Anyone on here that knows me and knows how much I hate cutting and how extreme my cutting can be can tell anyone how impatient I can be haha.

But I also think its important to be realistic - unrealistic expectations towards anything can lead people to be disappointed in things that they may otherwise have been happy with had they known what to realistically expect.

We've all known someone that thought they were going to start working out and look like Arnold after 6 months. It doesn't work like that - it takes time. Changes in our diet take time to make a difference, changes in our training take time to make a difference, and supplements (or drugs) take time to work and produce results.

I've never liked it when companies overhype ingredients and create unrealistic expectations. Some companies hype things so much and convince people they're going to get such dramatic gains that when they don't happen, the people are mad (rightfully so), but overlook that they may have actually made decent progress but were expecting the unrealistic results they were promised.

Here are a few things for thought:
  • Anabolic Steroids (AAS)
    • Most anabolic steroid cycles are ran for 12 to 20 weeks and it is accepted that it takes most AAS 3 to 4 weeks to start to produce noticeable results.
  • Growth Hormone
    • It takes 3 to 6 months for most people to experience benefits off of HGH at normal dosages.
  • Peptides
    • This can vary wildly by the peptide, but it is very common to take 6+ weeks to start to see benefits with many of them and it often can take 4 to 6 months to start seeing the best results.
  • Anti-Depressants
    • The American Psychiatric Association (APA) states that it can take 4 to 8 weeks for an antidepressant to be fully effective.
  • TRT - all info is based off of the actual medical guidelines (nothing is opinion)
    • Mood Improvements/Reduced Depression - Improvements in mood and reduced depression can be noticeable after 3 to 6 weeks, with maximum benefits taking 18 to 30 weeks
    • Libido - Increased libido can start to be noticeable in some individuals after 3 to 4 weeks but may take up to 6 weeks for some individuals, with some individuals not seeing a noticeable change.
    • Erections - Changes in erectile function can take several weeks to months to appear, up to 6 months in some cases.
    • Energy and stamina - Increased energy and stamina can start to be noticeable after about 3 months.
    • Muscle mass and strength - Increased muscle mass and strength, along with reduced fat, can be noticeable between months 3 and 4.
I've seen people complain that a natural testosterone booster doesn't increase libido in less than a week, when actual testosterone takes 3 to 4 weeks to start increasing libido for most people.

I've seen people complain that a natural anabolic that is safe and side-effect free doesn't deliver crazy gains in muscle and strength in 3 to 4 weeks, when most anabolic steroid cycles are 12 to 20 weeks and it takes 4 weeks to start seeing a difference on many of them.

The big marketing supplement companies know the impatient world that we live in and that we all want results yesterday, and that's why they market things the way that they do. They know that if they're honest and tell people that it may take 4 to 6 weeks to start seeing results off of something that they won't sell even a fraction of what they will if they convince people they're going to get life-changing results after one bottle.

That sucks for consumers because they get misled and ripped off and it sucks for the honest companies that do things the right way and tell people what they can honestly expect from ingredients and in what time period.

But then, the weird part to me is when a company that's honest gets viewed as 'trying to sell' someone multiple bottles, when they're really just being honest and saying that if you aren't going to try any ingredient for the time period that it takes it to be effective that you're better off to save your money or use something else.

There's a very popular ingredient getting a lot of hype right now - and the company President sent me a bottle to try because he wants us to use his ingredient. He told me straight out - companies are hyping this like you're going to see a big difference in the first bottle, but I'm going to send you 2 because its going to be the second bottle before a lot of people will be able to tell a difference. I respect the hell out of him for that - bc he wanted to make sure I knew what to really expect in order to give his ingredient a fair chance.

I appreciate the honest companies that are left in the world - whether in this industry or in any other.
 
sns8778 said:
That was why when I posted in the thread, I wanted to make sure that people knew it was no longer exclusive to Muscletech, so if anyone wants to try it, there may be some more cost effective options in the coming months.

The ingredient is super expensive, so it's never going to be cheap, but I would expect there to be more cost effective options.
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If you are putting a product with di-leucine, I'm trying it. The science is good, the price was awful, I have faith in SNS :)
 
Madevilz said:
If you are putting a product with di-leucine, I'm trying it. The science is good, the price was awful, I have faith in SNS :)
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Thanks. I'm open to it if its something people would be interested in.

I agree with you - both about the science being good and the price as it is now being awful haha.

It's an expensive ingredient, so its not something that would ever be cheap, but if we did one, it would be a lot more affordable than it is now.

If we do one, I'd tell anyone up front - this is an ingredient that if you want to see the best results, you would need to take it consistently for a period of time and that the results would likely start and get better with time. The way that its shown to work is not a method of action that is going to produce some dramatic overnight result, its more something to deliver good consistent gains over a period of time.

To some people that always want dramatic results, good consistent gains may not seem like a big deal. But to people that have been training for years and their gains are much slower, good consistent gains when viewed over the scope of a consistent period of time is awesome.
 
sns8778 said:
Thanks. I'm open to it if its something people would be interested in.

I agree with you - both about the science being good and the price as it is now being awful haha.

It's an expensive ingredient, so its not something that would ever be cheap, but if we did one, it would be a lot more affordable than it is now.

If we do one, I'd tell anyone up front - this is an ingredient that if you want to see the best results, you would need to take it consistently for a period of time and that the results would likely start and get better with time. The way that its shown to work is not a method of action that is going to produce some dramatic overnight result, its more something to deliver good consistent gains over a period of time.

To some people that always want dramatic results, good consistent gains may not seem like a big deal. But to people that have been training for years and their gains are much slower, good consistent gains when viewed over the scope of a consistent period of time is awesome.
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Right, an affordable price, stacked with something else for a 12-week run then it might be really good.
 
Resolve10 said:
Not super convinced for this ingredient, but some of that is just due to cost and poor marketing.

We get lots of leucine “metabolites” or MPS “boosters” and they always seem to be expensive, poorly marketed, or poor availability. HMB (various forms), HICA, Velocitol, etc. I think they all may have an appropriate place, but come out promising too much and too expensive and basically kill their long term prospects. Some of these definitely have some intriguing prospects for certain applications thohh

The key figure that intrigues me is the FSR values, but I still don’t think I’d expect miracles.

Of course if it was at an appropriate price curiosity would probably end up having me run through a training cycle to see how it would work for me (10 weeks minimum).
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Yeah, a lot of that is what I was referring to in my posts in this thread.

You are absolutely right that this is a category that for whatever reason, new ingredients in almost always get overhyped and it creates unrealistic expectations and when people don't get the unrealistic results that are in the marketing, some turn against the ingredient and down the ingredient, when it really isn't the ingredients fault and the ingredient may have great potential for people with realistic expectations.

When I first saw the study, my first thought was that this could be a cool ingredient and has good potential as a daily use muscle builder over a period of time and that if the price is right, I may be interested in using &/or offering it.

Then when I saw that MT had an exclusive on it for awhile and saw the pricing, I knew the hype in the marketing would both create demand for the ingredient but also create some backlash and have some people down it bc they would have unrealistic expectations.

I think in the most simplistic way of explaining increases muscle protein synthesis, and this is oversimplifying, but when you start taking protein, you don't see dramatic results overnight but its a must for long term, consistent, and steady results and if your protein intake is right, then everything else can work better too.

Now, apply that to muscle protein synthesis - when you increase your muscle protein synthesis, that can prime things for great consistent results and may also help make other things work better too. But realistically, its probably not something you're going to see something super dramatic with in the first month. Some people, especially people newer to training or starting back to training, may see good results in recovery in the first month, but I think for advanced trainers, its something I would plan at least 2 to 3 months on to see best results.
 
For $20-25 a bottle it would be fun to run for one year.

It would be nice if it was cheap enough a solid formula worth the cost existed. With other stuff people already know and trust perhaps.

Even at $20-25 a bottle, plenty of other interesting single ingredients you could chose from. Maybe a couple years from now it will be cheaper.
 
Danksta710 said:
For $20-25 a bottle it would be fun to run for one year.

It would be nice if it was cheap enough a solid formula worth the cost existed. With other stuff people already know and trust perhaps.

Even at $20-25 a bottle, plenty of other interesting single ingredients you could chose from. Maybe a couple years from now it will be cheaper.
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That would be nice, but that price is impossible because of the ingredient cost and what it costs to make.

I always look at things in cost per day - and I don't think you'll ever see a day that this ingredient would cost less than 1.00 per day, but 1.50 to 2.00 per day may be possible, whereas right now its over 3.00 per day in the MT product.
 
sns8778 said:
That would be nice, but that price is impossible because of the ingredient cost and what it costs to make.

I always look at things in cost per day - and I don't think you'll ever see a day that this ingredient would cost less than 1.00 per day, but 1.50 to 2.00 per day may be possible, whereas right now its over 3.00 per day in the MT product.
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What’s the chance you bring this out?
 
sns8778 said:
Thanks. I'm open to it if its something people would be interested in.

I agree with you - both about the science being good and the price as it is now being awful haha.

It's an expensive ingredient, so its not something that would ever be cheap, but if we did one, it would be a lot more affordable than it is now.

If we do one, I'd tell anyone up front - this is an ingredient that if you want to see the best results, you would need to take it consistently for a period of time and that the results would likely start and get better with time. The way that its shown to work is not a method of action that is going to produce some dramatic overnight result, its more something to deliver good consistent gains over a period of time.

To some people that always want dramatic results, good consistent gains may not seem like a big deal. But to people that have been training for years and their gains are much slower, good consistent gains when viewed over the scope of a consistent period of time is awesome.
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I'd certainly try it again, and for much longer than 28 days if it didn't cost nearly $100 per bottle.
 
JohnnieFreeze said:
I'd certainly try it again, and for much longer than 28 days if it didn't cost nearly $100 per bottle.
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As someone that tried it, what do you think a fair price would be for a 30 day supply?
 
sns8778 said:
As someone that tried it, what do you think a fair price would be for a 30 day supply?
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Since you did say that it is an expensive ingredient, realistically there has to be a balance that works for both seller and buyer. (I suspect MuscleTech has an exceptionally high mark-up though.) As a single ingredient at the effective dose of 2,000mg daily....Hmmm....$65 (give or take) for a 30 day supply seems fair, and to give the product a fair shot, I'd run it for a good 90 days. If results are good in that time period, I can see this becoming a staple.
 
JohnnieFreeze said:
Since you did say that it is an expensive ingredient, realistically there has to be a balance that works for both seller and buyer. (I suspect MuscleTech has an exceptionally high mark-up though.) As a single ingredient at the effective dose of 2,000mg daily....Hmmm....$65 (give or take) for a 30 day supply seems fair, and to give the product a fair shot, I'd run it for a good 90 days. If results are good in that time period, I can see this becoming a staple.
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Thank you for the feedback.

Muscletech does have an exceptionally high markup, but I don't mean that in a bad way - they do on most things, but that's because its their business model. They spend a massive amount of money in marketing, so a large ad spend per bottle has to be factored into their product cost.

I was curious to hear your perspective, as someone who has taken it.

So, if by chance a company could offer it for around 49.99 or less, then it seems like you would consider that a great value for it?
 
Stopstalking2 said:
@sns8778 is this similar to peptistrong ? Thinking if you did it, they could be a great stack with pepti-plex
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I think that it may be similar to PeptiStrong in one method of action, but PeptiStrong has more methods of action in my opinion. But yes, I think it would be a great stack with PeptiStrong. ;)
 
sns8778 said:
Thank you for the feedback.

Muscletech does have an exceptionally high markup, but I don't mean that in a bad way - they do on most things, but that's because its their business model. They spend a massive amount of money in marketing, so a large ad spend per bottle has to be factored into their product cost.

I was curious to hear your perspective, as someone who has taken it.

So, if by chance a company could offer it for around 49.99 or less, then it seems like you would consider that a great value for it?
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At the price you mentioned...something like 40% cheaper, it would be quite an exceptional value.
 
sns8778 said:
I think that it may be similar to PeptiStrong in one method of action, but PeptiStrong has more methods of action in my opinion. But yes, I think it would be a great stack with PeptiStrong. ;)
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I guess I’m on stand by when a good company makes it affordable wink wink
 
JohnnieFreeze said:
Since you did say that it is an expensive ingredient, realistically there has to be a balance that works for both seller and buyer. (I suspect MuscleTech has an exceptionally high mark-up though.) As a single ingredient at the effective dose of 2,000mg daily....Hmmm....$65 (give or take) for a 30 day supply seems fair, and to give the product a fair shot, I'd run it for a good 90 days. If results are good in that time period, I can see this becoming a staple.
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Leucine peptides by protein factory and or pa mediator I think is more anabolic
 
JohnnieFreeze said:
At the price you mentioned...something like 40% cheaper, it would be quite an exceptional value.
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Would like to see this blend over di leucine


Salmon Peptides ProGo
4000

Pepti strong
2500

ImmunoLin®
2000

Phosphatidic Acid
1500

Ursolic Acid-SR®
800

Ripped Factor
650



Velositol®
2000

4-Hydroxyisoleucine
250

Delphinol
180

AstraGin®
50
 
djbombsquad said:
Leucine peptides by protein factory and or pa mediator I think is more anabolic
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I know you like pf's leucine peptides, and I'm glad that they work well for you.

Mediator works similar to, but differently from dileucine peptide, and would make a good stack with it.

Based on the studies, I would expect dileucine peptide would be more effective than regular leucine peptides, and in pf's case, their leucine peptides are more expensive than I would expect dileucine peptide to be in the future.
 
djbombsquad said:
Would like to see this blend over di leucine


Salmon Peptides ProGo
4000

Pepti strong
2500

ImmunoLin®
2000

Phosphatidic Acid
1500

Ursolic Acid-SR®
800

Ripped Factor
650



Velositol®
2000

4-Hydroxyisoleucine
250

Delphinol
180

AstraGin®
50
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That would be a 19 capsule per dose product and would be super expensive. I like some of the ingredient combination there, but there's a couple of things in it that I wouldn't take together that would lead me to not being willing to use something like that if it were me.

I think that PeptiStrong and Mediator PA go especially well together, and I think that Dileucine Peptide would go very well with those.
 
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