M-Sten Side Effects?

BioHackJack

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I'm curious what sides you guys have gotten from M-Sten and if they're similar to mine. Unfortunately, I had to quit after just 2 1/2 weeks at 10mg/15mg. I should mention, I'm also taking 30mg Trestolone ED (a few more weeks remaining), 1/2 TrT Test dose, and ancillaries.

Here are my sides:
  1. BP shot up into a consistent 130-160+ range (top number).
  2. Face, head, ears, eyes feel like they're going to explode (likely because of high BP)
  3. Anger / quick tempered (though manageable)
  4. Decreased appetite...maybe even a little touch of nausea at times though tolerable.
  5. Daily headaches ranging from mild to major.
  6. Cramps and painful pumps at times though manageable with taurine, electrolytes, lots of water.
  7. Sleeplessness.
  8. Joint pain.
This is too bad because it was giving my Trest cycle a nice little boost here at the end. Trying to drink 1+ gallons of water, taking taurine, bp meds, baby aspirin, electrolytes....all helpful but no match for the M-Sten in lowering BP. Have an appointment to donate blood this afternoon if they take me with my high BP. You know, if it wasn't for my BP and face/head feeling like I'm about to have a problem, I'd man-up and push through.

Anyway, are my sides rare or common? What sides have you experienced with M-Sten (Methylstenbolone)?
 

Jstrong20

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Nah msten is rough for a lot of people. I run it at 40mgs and feel fine and some feel horrible on 20mgs. Only thing negative I get is some nasty indexation from it sometimes.
 
Smont

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I have a serious question, and I don't mean anything by it other then I'm genuinely curious. Your name is biohackjack, I was under the impression that biohacking was about self improvement with health and longevity in mind but you keep pick the most side effect ridden unhealthy steroids with trestolone and methylated oral steroids. Isint that kinda the opposite of biohacking?
 

Jstrong20

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Ment indigestion. Also how's the trest at 30mgs a day? I can't run more then 5mgs of it without some ralox.
 
Smont

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Nah msten is rough for a lot of people. I run it at 40mgs and feel fine and some feel horrible on 20mgs. Only thing negative I get is some nasty indexation from it sometimes.
And I seccond this. I'm good on 40. Many can't tolerate more then 20
 

BioHackJack

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Haha...yeah you're absolutely right Smont. Not the most fitting name for me to say the least. I think I just picked it on a whim because I've been into learning about and trying supplements since college and then eventually peptides....and now I guess I've taken another turn...maybe to the dark side.

JStrong20, the Trest at 30mg ED has been good to me. This time, I never let me estrogen rise to the point that my nips felt anything and I've been able to back off on the freqency a little on my AI and Ralox. Really my only 'noticeable' negative side effect is a red face/neck. I won't truly know until I get blood done of course.
 
Smont

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Haha...yeah you're absolutely right Smont. Not the most fitting name for me to say the least. I think I just picked it on a whim because I've been into learning about and trying supplements since college and then eventually peptides....and now I guess I've taken another turn...maybe to the dark side.

JStrong20, the Trest at 30mg ED has been good to me. This time, I never let me estrogen rise to the point that my nips felt anything and I've been able to back off on the freqency a little on my AI and Ralox. Really my only 'noticeable' negative side effect is a red face/neck. I won't truly know until I get blood done of course.
Ok lol, I'm like man this is not biohacking. If your big into experiments with this stuff look into peptides, Carnitine and ergo stuff between cycles. You can get healthier and maintain progress better. I do suggest you back off the harsh stuff tho. You can run testosterone and things like npp, primo, Masteron and eq at 5x the doses of trestolone and be much healthier and make more progress with less potential for side effects
 
Mathb33

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Do yourself a favor and stop taking orals of that kind or all orals all together. They are the most toxic **** on earth. You’d be way healthier taking 400-500mg of test.
A few years of taking methyl orals is enough to absolutely destroy your health long term and shorten your lifespan of several several years.

they are poison plus they are garbage at adding muscle. It adds temporary weight that’s mostly intra muscular water and glycogen that you’re all gonna lose once you stop.

muscles are built in months not in a 4-6 weeks oral cycle.
 
SSJ4GOD

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Do yourself a favor and stop taking orals of that kind or all orals all together. They are the most toxic **** on earth. You’d be way healthier taking 400-500mg of test.
A few years of taking methyl orals is enough to absolutely destroy your health long term and shorten your lifespan of several several years.

they are poison plus they are garbage at adding muscle. It adds temporary weight that’s mostly intra muscular water and glycogen that you’re all gonna lose once you stop.

muscles are built in months not in a 4-6 weeks oral cycle.
Shorten lifespan Several several years? 🙄 biggest exaggeration I think i may have heard.
 
Smont

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Shorten lifespan Several several years? 🙄 biggest exaggeration I think i may have heard.
It's really not. Abusing oral steroids over the long term can cause serious problems. Obviously abusing steroids in general can shorten your lifespan but abusing orals and is way worse than abusing injectables. This is why you only see pros talking about using things like tren, dhb and orals pre contest only and in the off-season they stuck to basic injectables.

I'd bet my house that someone Using oral steroids for 3 to 4 cycles a year for 10 years will definitely shave some years off their life and put you at a much higher risk for a heart attack when you get into your fifties or older then if you had not used those orals.
 
Smont

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And again, it has nothing to do with liver health it has to do with cholesterol elevated blood pressure And other things relating to heart health
 
Smont

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There's also going to be a genetic factor just like smoking cigarettes or drinking alcohol. Some people can abuse the crap out of it and live to be 90 and others drop dead in their forties
 
SSJ4GOD

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It's really not. Abusing oral steroids over the long term can cause serious problems. Obviously abusing steroids in general can shorten your lifespan but abusing orals and is way worse than abusing injectables. This is why you only see pros talking about using things like tren, dhb and orals pre contest only and in the off-season they stuck to basic injectables.

I'd bet my house that someone Using oral steroids for 3 to 4 cycles a year for 10 years will definitely shave some years off their life and put you at a much higher risk for a heart attack when you get into your fifties or older then if you had not used those orals.
I’m not talking about abusing them like that.. But two 6 week oral cycles I bet wouldn’t do much in the long run. Especially when we are speaking of a few years.
 
Smont

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I’m not talking about abusing them like that.. But two 6 week oral cycles I bet wouldn’t do much in the long run. Especially when we are speaking of a few years.
I agree with you but you're talking about somewhat reasonableuse. Most of the guys on this forum go ham on the orals. Every cycle guys wants to know how to kick start his cycle and what to use for a finisher or there asking about rotating orals. Most of them are not getting the proper bloodwork and almost none of them are getting heart scans.some of these guys are also smokers which is a multiplying effect. And using orals on a bulk is double damage because you're doing damage through all the extra calories you're eating from a cholesterol aspect because no one on here is eating 4000 clean calories A-day. Almost every single person on this forum Is using orals on every cycle they run and that's gonna shave years off your life. Or at least it has the potential to
 
Smont

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And I'm not pointing fingers because I'm guilty too, Early on I always had an oral in my cycle for extended periods of time. The problem is these things are like smoking cigarettes. You're not gonna see the damage today you're not gonna see it next week and you're not gonna see it next month but you will see it 20 years down the road
 
Smont

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Also running trest for whole cycles is not much different than running tren for whole cycles so there's always that too. It's another double whammy on health. The human safety dose for trest is like 2mg per week so your standard 150 mg a week trest run is 75 X the studied human safety dose.

We have studies showing testosterone safe at 600mg
 
Smont

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Safe is a bad choice of words but you get what I'm saying
 
Mathb33

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Shorten lifespan Several several years? 🙄 biggest exaggeration I think i may have heard.
Yeah you obviously have very little experience seeing bloodworks and dealing with people who actually take x or y steroids and see how it affects their bloodworks. No offense sir but for decades people spew misinformation on forums and internet while maybe 5-10% of people actually did bloodworks and actually researches how they affect your organs and this is why we have most folks thinking like you are.

i have the chance to be linked with very good coaches and sports doctors here and it’s astounding what you’ll see through bloodworks.
I guarantee you 75% of people doing over 4-6 weeks of orals will have ALT and or AST 2-3-4 over the range… I can garantee you nobody checks his blood pressure but most of the people taking orals have **** BP over 140 and high BP IS absolutely the worst **** you can put your body through

do that 2-3 times a year for a couple years and yes, you possibly did a lot of damage to your body.
Id rather see someone on 500mg of test YEAR ROUND then someone doing 3 cycles of 4-6 weeks methyl orals a year.

ive been bodybuilding for 4 years very seriously and I’ve basically never OFF completely and my bloodworks have NEVER been really off.. liver value was NEVER off. Before my last show we incorporated orals 6 weeks out which I never did and bloodwork showed ALT at 575 on a range of 0-45 and I had absolutely 0 symptoms and felt absolutely amazing. First thing my doctor said was had you spent a couple more months at those levels and you possible permanently damaged your liver. Went off winstrol, kept all the other drugs in (test and masteron) and within 8 weeks my ALT was back at 48. Yes orals are poison plus absolutely fucking useless unless for aesthetic.
 
Mathb33

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And I'm not pointing fingers because I'm guilty too, Early on I always had an oral in my cycle for extended periods of time. The problem is these things are like smoking cigarettes. You're not gonna see the damage today you're not gonna see it next week and you're not gonna see it next month but you will see it 20 years down the road
Yeah same my first year was orals only and I see and know the damage it did. I also have a friend who’s possibly needing liver transplant from abusing orals. Really I don’t want to trash on nobody I just wish people knew how fucking horrible they are for you.
 
Mathb33

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I’m not talking about abusing them like that.. But two 6 week oral cycles I bet wouldn’t do much in the long run. Especially when we are speaking of a few years.
I agree! If no abuse is done and someone really keeps it at like 8-12 or whatever weeks a year then it’s another story! But most Guys who do orals only steroids are as invested as guys doing injectables but usually don’t want to dabble in that zone so they rely on orals and tend to get on a habit of doing longer and longer oral cycle and it starts by 1-2 a year then 3 then 4. I was pointing finger more towards those guys and hope they are careful!
 
Smont

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Yeah same my first year was orals only and I see and know the damage it did. I also have a friend who’s possibly needing liver transplant from abusing orals. Really I don’t want to trash on nobody I just wish people knew how fucking horrible they are for you.
I will say I dont think I've ever seen someone get life threatening liver damage from orals Without preexisting medical conditions or abusing alcohol and recreational drugs alongside it. But the cholesterol and BP issues are very real and it's the accumulative effects of all 3 of these things that ppl don't understand. I'm pro choice and pro steroid to a degree So I think that everyone should do whatever they want but I also think that they should be well educated about the potential risks. And the risks are definitely real. If someone wants to stack anadrol and sd for 10 weeks then do you but im gonna tell you why its a bad idea. I think ppl just get thrown off by the way you presented it. Your the kind of guy that wants ppl do do things right so they succeed, you just give them all the answers while yelling at them lol.
 
Smont

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I agree! If no abuse is done and someone really keeps it at like 8-12 or whatever weeks a year then it’s another story! But most Guys who do orals only steroids are as invested as guys doing injectables but usually don’t want to dabble in that zone so they rely on orals and tend to get on a habit of doing longer and longer oral cycle and it starts by 1-2 a year then 3 then 4. I was pointing finger more towards those guys and hope they are careful!
Was he running orals year round? Like full 12 week cycles. I can see that crushing your liver pretty seriously
 
Smont

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I agree! If no abuse is done and someone really keeps it at like 8-12 or whatever weeks a year then it’s another story! But most Guys who do orals only steroids are as invested as guys doing injectables but usually don’t want to dabble in that zone so they rely on orals and tend to get on a habit of doing longer and longer oral cycle and it starts by 1-2 a year then 3 then 4. I was pointing finger more towards those guys and hope they are careful!
If guys would leverage the basic injectables and only use the orals in short bursts To break through plateau's or leading up to when they wanna look there best once or twice a year it would make for much more productive years. Another big problem is everybody looks at the current cycle they're on and what they want right now and they forget to look at the big picture
 

johnny412

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It's really not. Abusing oral steroids over the long term can cause serious problems. Obviously abusing steroids in general can shorten your lifespan but abusing orals and is way worse than abusing injectables. This is why you only see pros talking about using things like tren, dhb and orals pre contest only and in the off-season they stuck to basic injectables.

I'd bet my house that someone Using oral steroids for 3 to 4 cycles a year for 10 years will definitely shave some years off their life and put you at a much higher risk for a heart attack when you get into your fifties or older then if you had not used those orals.
so thats why we have seen all these pros dying recently? lol yeah ok
edit: and he didnt say 10 years...he said several years. several means 3 or less...
 
UnrealMachine

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individuality is a strong factor. everybody gotta get blood work. Methylated oral **** is bad yeah but “years off lifespan” is generalized conjecture based on nothing. In some cases def true. Who wants sky high LDL and high BP destroying arterial health…

liver is tough, but depends on a lot of things. People’s tolerance for them is a wide range. I read of people getting jaundice from a single oral cycle at normal dose, others have done methyl orals for months

I once stacked 50mg methyl orals for 4 weeks and got blood work at 28 days to assess liver. ALT was at 66. Expected over 100. It was 30 Pheraplex plus 20 SD. Not saying I’m about to run that again… just sayin.
 
Mathb33

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I once stacked 50mg methyl orals for 4 weeks and got blood work at 28 days to assess liver. ALT was at 66. Expected over 100. It was 30 Pheraplex plus 20 SD. Not saying I’m about to run that again… just sayin.
Unfortunately 98% of people explaining their experiences are spewing numbers because it makes their point more valid but nobody actually posts their blood or are willing to when asked to. "My bloodwork was X I was fine" while they obvousosly most of the time didn’t do any bloodworks. I’m not saying this is your case but forums and flooded of this. It’s just annoying
 
Smont

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Unfortunately 98% of people explaining their experiences are spewing numbers because it makes their point more valid but nobody actually posts their blood or are willing to when asked to. "My bloodwork was X I was fine" while they obvousosly most of the time didn’t do any bloodworks. I’m not saying this is your case but forums and flooded of this. It’s just annoying
There's probably only 4 or 5 long time members that have posted there bloodwork and I'm sure you can think of all of them. I used to regularly do bloodwork but I don't nearly as often. Last year I did it in March and that was it for the year. I'm long overdue
 

zendog

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Msten @ 20mg for five weeks many years ago.
1-3 Great mood almost euphoric, big jumps in size and strength, very full almost pumped all day.
4-5 Euphoria replaced with dread at the thought of moving , excruciating flank pain. Stayed on because the body transformation was epic.
Product was original Ultradrol.
 

Stacks1

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There's probably only 4 or 5 long time members that have posted there bloodwork and I'm sure you can think of all of them. I used to regularly do bloodwork but I don't nearly as often. Last year I did it in March and that was it for the year. I'm long overdue
I'm kind of the same now. It was such a pain in the ass to get blood work done here in NY that I would have to cross state lines to get it done because you needed a referral from a doctor in the state. Every year I still get a comprehensive blood panel done but I got lazy having to leave the state every time to get blood work done, so I just did the once per year bloods. I know it's stupid.
 
Smont

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I'm kind of the same now. It was such a pain in the ass to get blood work done here in NY that I would have to cross state lines to get it done because you needed a referral from a doctor in the state. Every year I still get a comprehensive blood panel done but I got lazy having to leave the state every time to get blood work done, so I just did the once per year bloods. I know it's stupid.
In my late 20's I did it often. About 3 to 4 years ago when I got back in the gym I did it twice that year and the following and only 1 time in the past year. Mainly because I didn't have active insurance at one point and wasn't running much. Last year I did like 2 cycle that were baby food "not a real excuse " but I wasn't worried knowing how these things have treated me in the past. I did test mast at 300 each and Through when some random sarms I had at the end and then test eq 300 each, Briefly went up to 450 each for like a week and then back to 300. Last 2 weeks I used winni and the day of the competition I carbed up after weighin with DMZ and that was just like 5 days + competition day. The rest of the year I was on 150mg cyp or enth. Probably my least amount of gear. Basically twice I used whatever I had on hand to do a little competition. The last one worked good. I benched 360 in the 198 class after only training for 10 weeks. I need bloods soon so I can blast next month. I wanna go up a weight class and attempt 405
 

Mikereyn513

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In my late 20's I did it often. About 3 to 4 years ago when I got back in the gym I did it twice that year and the following and only 1 time in the past year. Mainly because I didn't have active insurance at one point and wasn't running much. Last year I did like 2 cycle that were baby food "not a real excuse " but I wasn't worried knowing how these things have treated me in the past. I did test mast at 300 each and Through when some random sarms I had at the end and then test eq 300 each, Briefly went up to 450 each for like a week and then back to 300. Last 2 weeks I used winni and the day of the competition I carbed up after weighin with DMZ and that was just like 5 days + competition day. The rest of the year I was on 150mg cyp or enth. Probably my least amount of gear. Basically twice I used whatever I had on hand to do a little competition. The last one worked good. I benched 360 in the 198 class after only training for 10 weeks. I need bloods soon so I can blast next month. I wanna go up a weight class and attempt 405
You need to hurry up and get this powerlifting phase over eurh so you can start bodybuilding like your supposed to. Sorry to break it to you bro but that's what you're genetically meant to be doing ( dont mean to be sounding like a dick )
 
Smont

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You need to hurry up and get this powerlifting phase over eurh so you can start bodybuilding like your supposed to. Sorry to break it to you bro but that's what you're genetically meant to be doing ( dont mean to be sounding like a dick )
There is no power lifting phaze, I'm not quite sure what you're talking about. I Train the bench press regardless of my goals, I like to bench. Regardless of what my goals are I bench. When I make my biggest gains on bench my chest gets bigger. When I want to do a bench press competition I tweak my bench and everything else stays the same. If anything it has positive effects on my chest growth as long as I'm not getting hurt.
My long term Goal is a good big strong and lean physique. But I have zero real bodybuilding goals, I'm never going to step on a bodybuilding stage but I plan on doing bench press competitions for years to come. I do want to look more like a bodybuilder then anything else but overall size and strength is more important to me. If I wanted to do something bodybuilding related I'd still have to go through the same process to get there. Say I'm training like a body builder for the next 6 months and that's my goal to get as big and strong as possible, and along the way I want to do a bench press competition the only thing that changes is I add an extra bench press day and do lower reps and different accessories on that second workout.
 
Smont

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A real bodybuilder is a lifestyle decision. Even if you don't ever want to compete it's really a lifestyle to be a good looking body builder. I have 2 jobs and 2 kids. I couldn’t do real bodybuilding if I wanted too at this point in my life. I got 2 kids I'm gonna have to put through college soon
 
Smont

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@Mikereyn513 you have a wayyyyyyy batter chance then me at successfully living that lifestyle and your hungry for it. I'm just a hobbiest of these things that happens to compete in something from time to time.

My goal for 2023 is get big and strong as ****
 
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SSJ4GOD

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A real bodybuilder is a lifestyle decision. Even if you don't ever want to compete it's really a lifestyle to be a good looking body builder. I have 2 jobs and 2 kids. I couldn’t do real bodybuilding if I wanted too at this point in my life. I got 2 kids I'm gonna have to put through college soon
2 kids are the perfect amount. I’m glad I stopped there and don’t go for 3
 
Smont

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You need to hurry up and get this powerlifting phase over eurh so you can start bodybuilding like your supposed to. Sorry to break it to you bro but that's what you're genetically meant to be doing ( dont mean to be sounding like a dick )
Not to mention that heavy compounds have a place in bodybuilding as long as yiur not Prioritizing strength over growth
 
Smont

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I think all our bullshit scared off @BioHackJack sorry dude we went way off target. Back to the side effects, how yiu making out
 

Mikereyn513

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There is no power lifting phaze, I'm not quite sure what you're talking about. I Train the bench press regardless of my goals, I like to bench. Regardless of what my goals are I bench. When I make my biggest gains on bench my chest gets bigger. When I want to do a bench press competition I tweak my bench and everything else stays the same. If anything it has positive effects on my chest growth as long as I'm not getting hurt.
My long term Goal is a good big strong and lean physique. But I have zero real bodybuilding goals, I'm never going to step on a bodybuilding stage but I plan on doing bench press competitions for years to come. I do want to look more like a bodybuilder then anything else but overall size and strength is more important to me. If I wanted to do something bodybuilding related I'd still have to go through the same process to get there. Say I'm training like a body builder for the next 6 months and that's my goal to get as big and strong as possible, and along the way I want to do a bench press competition the only thing that changes is I add an extra bench press day and do lower reps and different accessories on that second workout.
My bad it sounded like you were going to do another powerlifting comp..but like you said all yiu have to do is just tweak your training a bit
 

Mikereyn513

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@Mikereyn513 you have a wayyyyyyy batter chance then me at successfully living that lifestyle and your hungry for it. I'm just a hobbiest of these things that happens to compete in something from time to time.

My goal for 2023 is get big and strong as ****
That's what the f.ck I'm talking about ( your 2023 goal)
 

BioHackJack

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Hey Smont,
I mainly only get on AM during the week while at work....you know, when I have some time on my hands :) I had a really good experience this weekend that lowered my blood pressure immediately and took my red face / neck away almost completely. I really feel like I need to tell people about it.

My BP was getting scary high and my face, head, eyes, ears felt like they were going to explode with pressure. I went and donated blood. Going in, my BP was 148/90something and I told them it was just because I have anxiety giving blood. When I got home, it was 120/80 and my head pressure was almost completely gone...and still is today.

The lady said that she could tell that I was either a steroid user or on TrT when I walked in the door because of my red face and neck. My hemoglobin was 16.something which I guess is pretty high and she attributed to the TrT. Of course, I didn't tell her about the Trest and M-Sten (which by the way, I probably won't use the M-Sten again after reading all these threads). She gave me a paper to give my doctor to allow me to come in more often to donate. NOTE: if anyone ever donates, you gotta tell them that you're on TrT so that your blood isn't given to a pregnant woman. Even if I wasn't on TrT but I was taking steroids, I'd probably still say I was.

So, it sounds like the high hemoglobin/RBC/Iron has a lot to do with Red Face....in addition of course to high BP. I'm thinking now that giving blood before a cycle and 8 weeks into the cycle might be good practice.
 
Smont

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Hey Smont,
I mainly only get on AM during the week while at work....you know, when I have some time on my hands :) I had a really good experience this weekend that lowered my blood pressure immediately and took my red face / neck away almost completely. I really feel like I need to tell people about it.

My BP was getting scary high and my face, head, eyes, ears felt like they were going to explode with pressure. I went and donated blood. Going in, my BP was 148/90something and I told them it was just because I have anxiety giving blood. When I got home, it was 120/80 and my head pressure was almost completely gone...and still is today.

The lady said that she could tell that I was either a steroid user or on TrT when I walked in the door because of my red face and neck. My hemoglobin was 16.something which I guess is pretty high and she attributed to the TrT. Of course, I didn't tell her about the Trest and M-Sten (which by the way, I probably won't use the M-Sten again after reading all these threads). She gave me a paper to give my doctor to allow me to come in more often to donate. NOTE: if anyone ever donates, you gotta tell them that you're on TrT so that your blood isn't given to a pregnant woman. Even if I wasn't on TrT but I was taking steroids, I'd probably still say I was.

So, it sounds like the high hemoglobin/RBC/Iron has a lot to do with Red Face....in addition of course to high BP. I'm thinking now that giving blood before a cycle and 8 weeks into the cycle might be good practice.
I'm glad you got that straight, but that lady is a cunt lol. A red face is not a telltale sign of a steroid user, I don't ever have a red face lol. It's funny How you can't say bad things about people's genders or their weight but she can call you out and say she can tell your on anabolics or trt. That's ridiculous
 
Smont

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I don't know @Smont in vigorous Steve latest video on fake natties he talks about the red face and skin as one if the tell tell signs but I stI'll agree with you
But look at Steve, he's in the video saying that's a tell tale sign yet he's on steroids and no red face or red skin
 
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Nick walker is on probably 3 grams of gear and like 275 and his face is pale white.

There's no steroid that turns your skin and face red. That's from water retention and uncontrolled high blood pressure. Go look at any fatty over the age of 50. Soon as they do anything slightly strenuous, Red face because ther BP is through the roof.

It's a byproduct of uncontrolled side effects.

The subjects not super important. I was more so trying to make the point that you can't judge fat people and trannies but it's OK to judge us
 

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Yea Steve said urs from the high blood pressure. Dude I posted a comment on nick walkers latest video telling him to hit the tanning salon dude is pale white. If I looked like him I would be tanned year round.lol
 

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