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Low test levels 6 month after PCT

Bolex

Member
So last Summer I did a testosterone enanthate 500mg/week for 12 weeks stacked with 70mg Anavar during the last 8 weeks of the cycle. Used exemestane 12.5mg every 3 days during the cycle or according how I felt. Last 3 weeks before PCT started HCG at 250iu 2x per week.
Did nolva and colmid PCT and alphamax xt for 6 weeks.

I knew my Numbers were bad as my libido has been really low erections are not as strong at least not as on gear but I can function I have no ED
I actualy have morning Woods wich is strange with these Numbers but I don't want to stay like this Forever. it Will compromize my Gains and my feeling as a man I don't have that alpha feeling I had most of times and I am not as interested in sex as before I had a very big appetite for doing it!


Lab numbers below are bad what are my options now TRT at 40 years old If I can convince my doc or can I try something else besides TRT?
Any help would be apreciated thank you!
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Your LH is very low and would cause the low Testosterone production.
 
I'd at least try it.
 
I'll throw you some Arimahex if you post before and after bloods. I'm willing to bet it'll give you a good boost.

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Was your clomid and nolva pharma grade? What dosage did you take of each?

I would do a restart 50mg clomid and 20mg nolva for 4 weeks then drop nolva and do clomid 25mg for a few weeks and retest
 
user567 said:
Was your clomid and nolva pharma grade? What dosage did you take of each?

I would do a restart 50mg clomid and 20mg nolva for 4 weeks then drop nolva and do clomid 25mg for a few weeks and retest
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Tamoxifen was pharma grade fornsure the clomid I have doubts...
Clomid: 25/25/12.5/12.5
Nolva: 20/20/20/10/10/10
 
If hpta is still functioning then a low dose of clomid as little as 25mg EOD will boost test and keep estrogen in check. If hpta is shot then trt is your option. I would give the product nostrum suggested a shot, why not. If that don't work go for the clomid. If that don't work try to get on trt if necessary.
 
Smont said:
If hpta is still functioning then a low dose of clomid as little as 25mg EOD will boost test and keep estrogen in check. If hpta is shot then trt is your option. I would give the product nostrum suggested a shot, why not. If that don't work go for the clomid. If that don't work try to get on trt if necessary.
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The product that Nostrum420 sugested seems to be 6oxo with other stuf but I cant order it from the USA it Will be retained by customs but I can get some 6 oxo in capsule form in UK with no custom problems were I live just not shure it Will work the same ?
 
nostrum420 said:
It will, you just have to use a lot more. At least 300mg
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I have iron Legion virtus would there be any benefit using it along with 12'5mg of clomid a day ?
If so for how long do you think I should take it before doing bloods again?

I also have sustain alpha and alphamax xt but I doubt test boosters Will be of any help in this case ?
 
Bolex said:
I have iron Legion virtus would there be any benefit using it along with 12'5mg of clomid a day ?
If so for how long do you think I should take it before doing bloods again?

I also have sustain alpha and alphamax xt but I doubt test boosters Will be of any help in this case ?
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Aren't you trying to boost your test?
 
Bolex said:
Yes but some ways are more effective than others arent they? I don't know what direction to yake here!
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True enough. I think the items you mentioned have some other benefits as well though.

Anyway, yeah, I think you should add the AI, Virtus.
 
Your SERMs were probably not legit. Throw away the Clomid. It causes gyno, fat gain, depression, suicidal thoughts, etc. in those that are sensitive to the zuclomiphene isomer. Get real Tamoxifen and run 10mg daily x30 days. I personally would do 10mg EOD as more is not better and in my personal experience the lower amount/frequency will still do the same and no side effects.
Fareston is the best SERM, but most can't acquire it; 1/4 tab (15mg) every 4 days x 30 days will also restart your test production.
 
Yeah, you've made a mess of your HPTA, will it come back in a year or two?
Maybe.

Are you wise to wait and find out?
No.

Do PCT drugs improve your HPTA recovery?
No, not really. What they do is boost bits of it to give the illusion it's back.
Clomid stimulates the production of LH & FSH. It doesn't fix anything. And it's effects last months.
Same for other SERMs.
HCG emulates LH & FSH which further exasperates the real issue.
 
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TheBigJS said:
Yeah, you've made a mess of your HPTA, will it come back in a year or two?
Maybe.

Are you wise to wait and find out?
No.

Do PCT drugs improve your HPTA recovery?
No, not really. What they do is boost bits of it to give the illusion it's back.
Clomid stimulates the production of LH & FSH. It doesn't fix anything. And it's effects last months.
Same for other SERMs.
HCG emulates LH & FSH which further exasperates the real issue.
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You are saying I should wait and do nothing about it ??
 
PhoenixGamer said:
Your SERMs were probably not legit. Throw away the Clomid. It causes gyno, fat gain, depression, suicidal thoughts, etc. in those that are sensitive to the zuclomiphene isomer. Get real Tamoxifen and run 10mg daily x30 days. I personally would do 10mg EOD as more is not better and in my personal experience the lower amount/frequency will still do the same and no side effects.
Fareston is the best SERM, but most can't acquire it; 1/4 tab (15mg) every 4 days x 30 days will also restart your test production.
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It was the first time I used clomid and hated it and now I have serious doubts if it was legit stuf I think it was counterfeit...
 
TheBigJS said:
Do PCT drugs improve your HPTA recovery?
No, not really. What they do is boost bits of it to give the illusion it's back.
Clomid stimulates the production of LH & FSH. It doesn't fix anything. And it's effects last months.
Same for other SERMs.
HCG emulates LH & FSH which further exasperates the real issue.
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Ummmmmm, what?
 
Bolex said:
You are saying I should wait and do nothing about it ??
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Bad idea. Your body's LH pituitary signaling to the testes is not working. If you do nothing, you may not recover or in your case take many more months at slow increases.

Run a legit SERM from a physician so you know it's real from a pharmacy. Nolva is miles better than Clomid. Fareston is the best available though.
 
nostrum420 said:
Ummmmmm, what?
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You heard me.

It is my opinion that in general, PCT doesn't aid long term recovery of the HPTA.
It increases natty test in the shorter term.
But a year later your natty levels are where they would have been had you just come off. And for most of us who've done a few cycles that isn't very high.

This is what (I think) happens.

You do pre cycle bloods, test is (say) 650ng/dl.
You do your cycle, you may or may not do mid cycle bloods, whatever.
Your cycle ends.
You do PCT.
You do post cycle bloods, toosoon and still full of PCT drugs.
Your "natty" test looks good, but it's not natty is it?
Then in a few months later you do another cycle never knowing your HPTA is still surpressed.
 
TheBigJS said:
You heard me.

It is my opinion that in general, PCT doesn't aid long term recovery of the HPTA.
It increases natty test in the shorter term.
But a year later your natty levels are where they would have been had you just come off. And for most of us who've done a few cycles that isn't very high.

This is what (I think) happens.

You do pre cycle bloods, test is (say) 650ng/dl.
You do your cycle, you may or may not do mid cycle bloods, whatever.
Your cycle ends.
You do PCT.
You do post cycle bloods, toosoon and still full of PCT drugs.
Your "natty" test looks good, but it's not natty is it?
Then in a few months later you do another cycle never knowing your HPTA is still surpressed.
Click to expand...

What, at that point, would be suppressing one's HPTA?
 
Bolex said:
I have iron Legion virtus would there be any benefit using it along with 12'5mg of clomid a day ?
If so for how long do you think I should take it before doing bloods again?

I also have sustain alpha and alphamax xt but I doubt test boosters Will be of any help in this case ?
Click to expand...
virtus/clomid/sustain alpha should show significant increase...the clomid would do the heavy lifting for test boost, but virtus and sustain should help the 'alpha feel', with sustain alpha boosting sex drive considerably. should give you the swagger you are looking for.
 
thebigt said:
virtus/clomid/sustain alpha should show significant increase...the clomid would do the heavy lifting for test boost, but virtus and sustain should help the 'alpha feel', with sustain alpha boosting sex drive considerably. should give you the swagger you are looking for.
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Could nolva (more used to it) be used instead of clomid with the same effects? Some say clomid is better for this nolva for that you know what I mean...
 
Bolex said:
Could nolva (more used to it) be used instead of clomid with the same effects? Some say clomid is better for this nolva for that you know what I mean...
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Yes, in fact, nova was the standard in the BBing world for a long time, so much so that Gaspari named an OTC test booster after it.
 
Bolex said:
Could nolva (more used to it) be used instead of clomid with the same effects? Some say clomid is better for this nolva for that you know what I mean...
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if you are more used to nolva then by all means go with it...personally when I used to pct I preferred clomid, but nolva should get er done.
 
Thanks for all the advise and help here at the fórum...

How much nolva would you use?
Normal PCT dosage 40/20/20/10/10 ?
 
Bolex said:
Thanks for all the advise and help here at the fórum...

How much nolva would you use?
Normal PCT dosage 40/20/20/10/10 ?
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No reason to dose so high. 5mg is as effective as 10mg in women with estrogen dependent cancer. You don't have anywhere near the estrogen an intact female produces and I'm assuming you don't have cancer. The lower dose cuts down on side effects a lot.

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PhoenixGamer said:
Bad idea. Your body's LH pituitary signaling to the testes is not working. If you do nothing, you may not recover or in your case take many more months at slow increases.

Run a legit SERM from a physician so you know it's real from a pharmacy. Nolva is miles better than Clomid. Fareston is the best available though.
Click to expand...

can you elaborate how Nolvadex is superior to Clomid? Genuinely interested as I always heard Clomid was, so interested in your reasoning

regards
 
AndroRage said:
can you elaborate how Nolvadex is superior to Clomid? Genuinely interested as I always heard Clomid was, so interested in your reasoning

regards
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from my experience clomid is more effective in pct, by how much is hard to nail down...on the other hand I had more 'sides' on clomid. nolva was a smoother ride, imo.
 
Nolva is taken during PCT to mitigate the effects of E2 after test aromatizes to estrogen. Assuming you did the sensitive e2 blood test, your e2 is fine. Clomid sucks regarding potential sides, but to restart your test production, you probably need it. I would add HCG since your LH is low. Adding a SERM or an AI isn’t going to restart you.
 
thebigt said:
from my experience clomid is more effective in pct, by how much is hard to nail down...on the other hand I had more 'sides' on clomid. nolva was a smoother ride, imo.
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Just a quick update for all of you that helped me out and for those that might find themselves in the same situation.
I went to the endocrononogist office today I had bloods from 2017, 2018, and twice in 2019 so he could see the hole picture before pro-hormones and AAS use (2017) until now.
He said the main problema is LH production wich is way low he advised clomid 50mg a day and reevaluate with new blood panel in two month time.
I Will update later.
I have another apointment with my urologist next monday and I will go anyways to compare what he has to say with what the endo told me.
Thanks again for the help provided here at the fórum
 
Bolex said:
Just a quick update for all of you that helped me out and for those that might find themselves in the same situation.
I went to the endocrononogist office today I had bloods from 2017, 2018, and twice in 2019 so he could see the hole picture before pro-hormones and AAS use (2017) until now.
He said the main problema is LH production wich is way low he advised clomid 50mg a day and reevaluate with new blood panel in two month time.
I Will update later.
I have another apointment with my urologist next monday and I will go anyways to compare what he has to say with what the endo told me.
Thanks again for the help provided here at the fórum
Click to expand...

Thanks for the update brother

Best of luck moving forward
 
Bolex said:
Just a quick update for all of you that helped me out and for those that might find themselves in the same situation.
I went to the endocrononogist office today I had bloods from 2017, 2018, and twice in 2019 so he could see the hole picture before pro-hormones and AAS use (2017) until now.
He said the main problema is LH production wich is way low he advised clomid 50mg a day and reevaluate with new blood panel in two month time.
I Will update later.
I have another apointment with my urologist next monday and I will go anyways to compare what he has to say with what the endo told me.
Thanks again for the help provided here at the fórum
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If you can tolerate that much clomid a day, good for you. I did 25mg a day for a month and it was the longest month of my life!
 
AndroRage said:
can you elaborate how Nolvadex is superior to Clomid? Genuinely interested as I always heard Clomid was, so interested in your reasoning

regards
Click to expand...

Clomid gives nasty side effects because of the Zuclomiphene isomer (50%). The other half is Enclomiphene which is actually available by Rx from compounding pharmacies like Tailor Made. Nolva is my 2nd choice behind Fareston because it is structurally a very similar chemical. Nolva is much more ANTI-estrogenic, while Clomid makes some guys get gyno, fat gain, ED, suicidal depression. This happened to me with Rx Clomid 1/4 tab doses within the first couple days.
 
hajisan said:
If you can tolerate that much clomid a day, good for you. I did 25mg a day for a month and it was the longest month of my life!
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I only used clomid mixed with tamoxifen once my last PCT it was terrible hald lots of sides had vision problems, mood swings and felt depressed.
But I really think my clomid was couterfait...
 
PhoenixGamer said:
Clomid gives nasty side effects because of the Zuclomiphene isomer (50%). The other half is Enclomiphene which is actually available by Rx from compounding pharmacies like Tailor Made. Nolva is my 2nd choice behind Fareston because it is structurally a very similar chemical. Nolva is much more ANTI-estrogenic, while Clomid makes some guys get gyno, fat gain, ED, suicidal depression. This happened to me with Rx Clomid 1/4 tab doses within the first couple days.
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My endocronologist said that nolva was not so good for what I need now that is to elevate LH production.
I don't think I'm gyno prone but I have pharma grade exemestane at home if I need it. I can also use the OTC AI Virtus from Iron Legion at a moderate dose just in case...
Anyway I have an apointment with my urologist next monday and Will hear what he has to say regarding the therapy that the endo prescribed me. Lets see if they agree with each other or not ...
 
hajisan said:
Nolva is taken during PCT to mitigate the effects of E2 after test aromatizes to estrogen. Assuming you did the sensitive e2 blood test, your e2 is fine. Clomid sucks regarding potential sides, but to restart your test production, you probably need it. I would add HCG since your LH is low. Adding a SERM or an AI isn’t going to restart you.
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Nolva and letro are just as good if not better than clomid.
 
rtmilburn said:
Nolva and letro are just as good if not better than clomid.
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However, plasma levels of letrozole were reduced by a mean 37.6% during combination therapy (P<0.0001), and this reduction persisted after 4-8 months of combination therapy.

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