Introducing SUP3R-11 - The Ultimate 11-Ketotestosterone Guide - All you need to know!

HIT4ME said:
Yeah, but you can eat donuts and lose weight. If I eat a donut...I will weigh a pound more tomorrow when I step on the scale. No joke. But I still love donuts!

I think being over 20% bodyfat is an advantage for low calorie diets too. I mean, your body has plenty stored up so it isn't like you can't create the energy to a large degree - so the fat gets converted and you keep your blood sugar up a little and it's not as bad. Above 30% BF and I wasn't even hungry, it was always just the habit of eating and overeating. Like, "I don't even like this.....but I guess I'll just finish it anyway."

In the 20-25% range, I have very slight hunger just some of the time, but there is more mental fog/concentration issues.

I'm sure once I get down to 15%, the game will change and I will be in pain, haha.
Click to expand...

Donuts are easy cals but don't have them everyday.

Sure it's easier to lose when you're higher BF. But if you drop cals too rapidly where do you go after you lose 5%?

I would say recomp and then cut again, but there is such a delta between your bmr and cal intake you're bound to regain fat. Just how I see it. I did really low cal dieting 4-5 years ago, spun my wheels.
 
CJNator said:
I've been doing the rubbing alcohol too and I was think more like me giving anyone in the pool a small dosage of 11 keto lol. If 40mins max is what I need then I'm straight, thanks!
Click to expand...

lol, the A game if you are concerned with others is to shower before, but I honestly think it's overkill. Thousands of gallons of water to dilute this stuff....if you're playing with children directly you may want to be careful, but it's more of a moral call in my book.
 
GNO said:
Donuts are easy cals but don't have them everyday.

Sure it's easier to lose when you're higher BF. But if you drop cals too rapidly where do you go after you lose 5%?

I would say recomp and then cut again, but there is such a delta between your bmr and cal intake you're bound to regain fat. Just how I see it. I did really low cal dieting 4-5 years ago, spun my wheels.
Click to expand...

Well, honestly, I just view this through the laws of thermodynamics. Energy can't be created, nor destroyed. It has to come from somewhere. And you can't just magically create energy in your body - but your body will need energy no matter what. I don't care if you're an Ethiopian who can only eat once per week, your body will still burn calories and need to get them from somewhere. Metabolic adjustments are not as dramatic as people think, because there is no reason for them to be. Your body won't start doing things unnecessarily just because it has extra fuel - and few people would believe that they can just eat more and their metabolism will adjust to it. Yet, everyone believes that if we just eat less, our metabolism will magically adjust and we will require fewer calories. I'm not saying it doesn't happen - but it's not as dramatic as people believe.

Having said that, if you have a metabolism and lose 30 pounds, your metabolism will drop because it takes much less energy to move a body that weighs 30 pounds less - this is true. But beyond that drop in metabolism, and slight adjustments, it's not going to be a huge difference. I can pretty much guarantee I will always lose weight eating 800 calories/day, because my metabolism can't slow to 800 calories/day or less unless I drop to about 90 pounds probably (and I would probably die before that, and I would probably start having issues such as fainting, etc. before I die). May the loss become slower? Sure, slightly. And we stall for a lot of different reasons. Hormones effect things. We can only transport so much fat in a day from our stores, etc.....yeah, there are issues and limits. But 800 calories will be effective for a loooong time for me :)

But, it's still an extreme diet and not for everyone by any means. But there are some people out there who have serious weight to lose, and may try what I'm doing but haven't because everyone has said it won't work because of this or that, or it's unhealthy, etc. I was one of those people and never got on the horse and lost weight until someone on this board pointed me to Lyle Macdonald's RFL/PSMF. It worked, I've lost over 70 pounds, and I like it. In 2 years before doing that, I lost 45 pounds. I've had bumps and slow downs, and stalls....but every diet will. It just takes time.
 
HIT4ME said:
Well, honestly, I just view this through the laws of thermodynamics. Energy can't be created, nor destroyed. It has to come from somewhere. And you can't just magically create energy in your body - but your body will need energy no matter what. I don't care if you're an Ethiopian who can only eat once per week, your body will still burn calories and need to get them from somewhere. Metabolic adjustments are not as dramatic as people think, because there is no reason for them to be. Your body won't start doing things unnecessarily just because it has extra fuel - and few people would believe that they can just eat more and their metabolism will adjust to it. Yet, everyone believes that if we just eat less, our metabolism will magically adjust and we will require fewer calories. I'm not saying it doesn't happen - but it's not as dramatic as people believe.

Having said that, if you have a metabolism and lose 30 pounds, your metabolism will drop because it takes much less energy to move a body that weighs 30 pounds less - this is true. But beyond that drop in metabolism, and slight adjustments, it's not going to be a huge difference. I can pretty much guarantee I will always lose weight eating 800 calories/day, because my metabolism can't slow to 800 calories/day or less unless I drop to about 90 pounds probably (and I would probably die before that, and I would probably start having issues such as fainting, etc. before I die). May the loss become slower? Sure, slightly. And we stall for a lot of different reasons. Hormones effect things. We can only transport so much fat in a day from our stores, etc.....yeah, there are issues and limits. But 800 calories will be effective for a loooong time for me :)

But, it's still an extreme diet and not for everyone by any means. But there are some people out there who have serious weight to lose, and may try what I'm doing but haven't because everyone has said it won't work because of this or that, or it's unhealthy, etc. I was one of those people and never got on the horse and lost weight until someone on this board pointed me to Lyle Macdonald's RFL/PSMF. It worked, I've lost over 70 pounds, and I like it. In 2 years before doing that, I lost 45 pounds. I've had bumps and slow downs, and stalls....but every diet will. It just takes time.
Click to expand...
I don't think eating 800cals/day avg and running PSMF is an effective strategy.

The only thing that you have convinced me of is it works for you. If so, great do that.

For myself it's cals in / cals out. If I have 6 donuts in one day I'll have to burn that (cal equivalent) or consume less that week or I'm gaining...
 
GNO said:
I don't think eating 800cals/day avg and running PSMF is an effective strategy.

The only thing that you have convinced me of is it works for you. If so, great do that.

For myself it's cals in / cals out. If I have 6 donuts in one day I'll have to burn that (cal equivalent) or consume less that week or I'm gaining...
Click to expand...

Cals in/cals out - we agree. We're not so far off. It's just a matter of how you achieve that.

And long term, you are right, PSMF is not the best strategy. It's a short term get from point A to point B strategy. As we were discussing in my log - staying there is a different story.
 
HIT4ME said:
Cals in/cals out - we agree. We're not so far off. It's just a matter of how you achieve that.

And long term, you are right, PSMF is not the best strategy. It's a short term get from point A to point B strategy. As we were discussing in my log - staying there is a different story.
Click to expand...

Always good to change things up after a while ...
 
If fat loss was your primary goal, would you do 2ml a day lasting (should be) 60 days or the normal 4ml a day for 30 days? I'm thinking 2ml a day to extend the cycle longer but just wanted to see what you guys thought. I want to grab a bottle or two for future use, I still have TD 11-oxo from a few years back hehe
 
flarestar said:
If fat loss was your primary goal, would you do 2ml a day lasting (should be) 60 days or the normal 4ml a day for 30 days? I'm thinking 2ml a day to extend the cycle longer but just wanted to see what you guys thought. I want to grab a bottle or two for future use, I still have TD 11-oxo from a few years back hehe
Click to expand...

Within certain limits Id usually tend to prefer longer myself.
 
I agree, if you can only get one bottle, I would run 8 weeks at 125 instead of 4 at 250 on a cut. 8 weeks is better than 4.

Beyond that, the more you can use during those 8 weeks, the better.
 
is two pumps required I see a lot of other 85mg/ml products about, so 125mg would seem on point for recomp?
 
Toff said:
is two pumps required I see a lot of other 85mg/ml products about, so 125mg would seem on point for recomp?
Click to expand...
You don't want to go below 125mg.

You can start there and see what you notice after 1-2 weeks and go up. Personally I prefer 200-250mg
 
I'm a little concerned about people mentioning the short life of bottles? I haven't had any issues with EPIC tho. I might order 4 bottles anyways.
 
Toff said:
is two pumps required I see a lot of other 85mg/ml products about, so 125mg would seem on point for recomp?
Click to expand...

fdigioia99 said:
Yup I have used it several times. The others are way to low.
Click to expand...

GNO said:
You don't want to go below 125mg.

You can start there and see what you notice after 1-2 weeks and go up. Personally I prefer 200-250mg
Click to expand...

I am going to update what I said earlier about more is better. I have been off S11 for a few days and I am noticing some things in retrospect.

When Patrick Arnold came out with 11-Oxo he said that small doses were good for fat loss and larger doses were more anabolic.

I ran T3 with S11 and it seemed completely ineffective. At one point I had liquid RC T3 and dropped 200 mcg and got nothing, so I figured it was bunk and ordered pharma grade from a trusted source. I slowly built up to 100 mcg and noticed nothing from it. Now, about 5 days off of S11 I am starting to notice mild effects from the same T3 and decided it would be smart to drop the dose to 50 mcg.

After researching, I learned that low cortisol can inhibit the entry of T3 into cells, thus slowing metabolism.

This coincides with my experience. At 500 mg per day, my weight loss completely stalled. It could be because I was on a PSMF for a while and I just hit a plateau. I still felt like I was revamping a little, even though weight wasn't coming off. But I definitely noticed it felt much more anabolic and my recovery time was improved greatly. I was also sleeping a lot.

Since coming off the S11 the T3 is slowly starting to be felt and my weight has been coming off faster...feels like I am cruising.

This is not a knock on S11 at all. It shows that it is highly effective at reducing cortisol, to the point it can maybe hinder T3 and weight loss goals at higher doses. 500+ mg is definitely more anabolic and noticeable though.

But it also suggests that the 125 range may be greater for strictly cutting. I've used the 80 mg per day products and they are def. Under dosed and I always felt 250 mg is the sweet spot. Buy I am wondering if I just think that because I notice the anabolic effects more at 250. It may be great for fat loss only at 125 mg.

Like GNO said, start at 125 and increase from there if you feel the need. I think 125 will be subtle but noticeable.
 
Double post.
 
fdigioia99 said:
1000 Mg's it's awesome!!!!
Click to expand...

For fat loss, muscle building? What effects did you notice. I may try this at some point...I believe it will be awesome, but I wonder if the results are skewed toward muscle/recompile more than cutting.
 
one thing that always bugged me was wondering if transdermal 11-oxo/11-kt had some sort of spot reducing quality? Whenever I used 11-oxo transdermally in the past, I always remembered my veins popping out in my forearm/bicep region which could be from the overall fatloss effects but seemed to me it was from applying the product in that region.

I stocked on some sup3r-11 for later use.
 
NoAddedHmones said:
So you going through a bottle a week...sounds like a terrible waste of money to me. Why not just jab?
Click to expand...

Honestly, I see your logic here. I will say that running 500 mg was very different than 250. In retrospect to everything, for fat loss, I would say 125 to 250 is actually where you want to be. At 500, I was definitely noticing faster recovery time, and some signs of anabolism even though I'm on the crazy low calorie diet. It was noticeable and I would bet 1000 mg is pretty anabolic.

Having said that, for the $50/week I doubt it's as anabolic as actual Test and not nearly a good cost/return ratio like you point out. I'd be interested in playing with it at 1,000 per day, but not sure I'd dish out the cash...although I periodically check stock on Nutriverse and consider buying 4 more bottles to add to the 3 I have in my stash to run it higher....
 
are you guys getting the full 120ml? I used a syringe to meause, and got only 90ml =(

bought 2 more bottles, used a digital scale, weight the empty one and the new one, and guess what? there was only a difference of 90g =/
 
1kerry said:
are you guys getting the full 120ml? I used a syringe to meause, and got only 90ml =(

bought 2 more bottles, used a digital scale, weight the empty one and the new one, and guess what? there was only a difference of 90g =/
Click to expand...

Seems to be a common complaint with a lot of transdermala
 
1kerry said:
are you guys getting the full 120ml? I used a syringe to meause, and got only 90ml =(

bought 2 more bottles, used a digital scale, weight the empty one and the new one, and guess what? there was only a difference of 90g =/
Click to expand...

Have you weighed 1ml? Its possible that 1ml does not equal 1gm...
 
ive not lost any fat in maybe a decade, no matter what i try.

A week into 11-keto transdermal at 125mg per day im actually seeing results. Im over the moon

My gut is smaller but harder and the love handles are deminishing already - i thought it would take months.

I eat clean generally but i dont eat enoug hi think and I get very stressed. I think the cortisol reduction is great fo rme, im already going to buy more for future as its clearly working, its giving me a little lbm too.
 
Likewise I'm just a few days in and already I'm feeling tighter and leaner.
Dieting for me isn't hard, it's getting the body to respond to my efforts.
This along with Ashwaganda are really making a difference.

How long can this be run for?
 
huxley309 said:
Likewise I'm just a few days in and already I'm feeling tighter and leaner.
Dieting for me isn't hard, it's getting the body to respond to my efforts.
This along with Ashwaganda are really making a difference.

How long can this be run for?
Click to expand...

I would recommend an 8 week run, but you could push it to 12 if you really wanted...
 
to anyone that tried 11 kt did u experience any calming effects ?
iIhad my first dose today and after that i had this quick feeling of being calm that i wasn't expecting ,not sure if placebo cos i wasn't expecting anything
 
Used it a few times it's been around Patrick Arnold first came out with it called it 11spray. Dose I go as high as 1000mgs but 500 was great.
 
fdigioia99 said:
Used it a few times it's been around Patrick Arnold first came out with it called it 11spray. Dose I go as high as 1000mgs but 500 was great.
Click to expand...

I thought PA's 11 Spray was 11 Oxo, not 11 Keto...?

11 Oxo has to be dosed much higher then 11 Keto.
 
And no his spray was ketotestosterone he brought it to the mainstream a long time ago OLYMPUS acts like it's something new it not at all.
 
Oh didn't mean like that relax I use all your stuff it was hyped up like it was new . But your bottles are way short use three with a oral syringe all three came way short????
 
Yup measure them out for yourself alot of people have had same issue. Kind of disappointed they didn't even offer any kind of compensation or explanation? Hmm. Now they stopped making it? Hmm?
 
Any product issues brought to the attention of reps are passed along to customer service. This option is available to customers as well.

Please understand that board reps are neither omniscient nor omnipotent.
 
I understand and it's not your fault what is disappointing is Olympus knows about it and did nothing at $70.00 a bottle something should have been done. When you are short 8 TO 10 dose's a bottle! Wow!
 
hamdysayed said:
to anyone that tried 11 kt did u experience any calming effects ?
iIhad my first dose today and after that i had this quick feeling of being calm that i wasn't expecting ,not sure if placebo cos i wasn't expecting anything
Click to expand...

Its an anticortisol product. so ,if youre stressed it will relieve it.
Yes, im calmer (and nicer) around my life frustrations - its a good thing.

Instead of the usual hot headedness
 
Toff said:
Its an anticortisol product. so ,if youre stressed it will relieve it.
Yes, im calmer (and nicer) around my life frustrations - its a good thing.

Instead of the usual hot headedness
Click to expand...
thank u so much for confirming because I thought i was tripping for real.
and yeah im very stressed in general.
 
My bottle seemed short. Finished it a week before I was supposed to
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top