Hypothetical Cycle

[saderboy80]

I cannot stress that this is a hypothetical cycle and not something I’m going to do. I’m just doing research and gathering anecdotal evidence/opinions.

8 weeks
Test P
Trest ACE (MENT)
Tren Ace
Superdrol (only 4weeks)

Igf1-lr3
HGH
Mk-677
Insulin
Follistatin
YK-11

Letrozole
Prami

Ancillaries: literally every thing but the kitchen sink.
Blood work pre, then every 2 weeks until pct is done

Pct
Letro (only if needed)
Nolvadex
Prami (if needed)
HCG

 

[Smont]

It dosent make any sense

 

[Smont]

The more I look at it the more I think this is the worst cycle i've ever seen lol. I'm very glad it's theoretical.

Half the stuff in the cycle would be overshadowed by something else and do absolutely nothing. Folli does nothing, we are close to the myoststin thing But were still a few years away. The medical field and astronauts will have access to real myo inhibitors first and then we will start seeing them in the bodybuilding world. Yk 11 will be completely overshadowed. Mk677 has no use to us while on hgh and igf, the igf is probably overkill too. High systemic IGF1 levels are not a good thing. There are terrible thing.

Im gonna just here stop cus i could pick this apart forever. Lets get some other opinions

 

[Ryan40]

There is alot going on there.. Agree with Smont on it would be counter productive.
I am not a fan of using so much at one time but this made for an interesting hypothetical and I have been around enough to know some people run 25 diffrent things at one time. Lol..

 

[saderboy80]

The more I look at it the more I think this is the worst cycle i've ever seen lol. I'm very glad it's theoretical.

Half the stuff in the cycle would be overshadowed by something else and do absolutely nothing. Folli does nothing, we are close to the myoststin thing But were still a few years away. The medical field and astronauts will have access to real myo inhibitors first and then we will start seeing them in the bodybuilding world. Yk 11 will be completely overshadowed. Mk677 has no use to us while on hgh and igf, the igf is probably overkill too. High systemic IGF1 levels are not a good thing. There are terrible thing.

Im gonna just here stop cus i could pick this apart forever. Lets get some other opinions

Keep picking it apart @Smont. I just ask you use sound logic and science to back your claims.

Yeah I kinda thought the Follistatin was a little bit premature. So YK11 wouldn’t do much either right?

 

[Smont]

Keep picking it apart @Smont. I just ask you use sound logic and science to back your claims.

Yeah I kinda thought the Follistatin was a little bit premature. So YK11 wouldn’t do much either right?

If you're expecting me to spend a lot of time going into scientific studies to detail the reasons why I don't like the cycle i cant help you. Ive done plenty of my own research but I don't have any interest exerting any effort into a theoretical cycle that I wouldn't ever suggest anyone do. Even if you completely throw health concerns out the window, the cycle still doesn't make sense. It's just a bunch of random stuff thrown in the mix.

This cycle is a perfect example of people trying to reinvent the wheel. Let's pick a bunch of obscure stuff and slap it together and see if it sticks.

Crazy obscure up cycles like this are always garbage, its The basic stuff that works and it's funny because the only guys who don't believe it's the basic Are the same guys chasing the magic secrets for 20 years and never find them.

Every gigantic mass monster body builder is on the exact same recipe. They all talk about it all the time. Test,eq,deca,hgh, insulin. Basic ass ****. The bigger they get the more that they need. Then contest season rolls around and they swap eq for primo and swap deca for tren. Then they had a couple worlds in the last few weeks. Like 99% of All the biggest body builders in the world follow this recipe. It's not some secret either it's very openly talked about.

So why are we gonna try to come up with these crazy Theoretical cycles that are way less effective than the cycles that we already know work for everyone?

That's about all I got for this, I'm somewhat interested to see what other people have to say. But I have a feeling. The large majority of people here are going to say this doesn't make any sense.

It seems like you have access to pretty much everything, If I was in your position I put myself on a gram of test, 6-8iu of gh, some slin and id hire a coach. Is a body building coach who knows body. Building training and body building nutrition will enhance your physique ten times better than random obscure compounds. Anyone who's ever hired a real coach knows how true that is. Gains are made in the kitchen and the cycle doesn't really matter that much. The cycle just needs to be able to keep up with the food in the training

 

[MrKleen73]

More curious after looking at this, what other cycles have you run before, and were the just really bad and you feel you need to throw the kitchen sink at it this time too? I understand it was hypothetical but would assume you wouldn't be wasting our, or your time on planning / assessing a cycle that was never intended to be ran.

 

[saderboy80]

If you're expecting me to spend a lot of time going into scientific studies to detail the reasons why I don't like the cycle i cant help you. Ive done plenty of my own research but I don't have any interest exerting any effort into a theoretical cycle that I wouldn't ever suggest anyone do. Even if you completely throw health concerns out the window, the cycle still doesn't make sense. It's just a bunch of random stuff thrown in the mix.

This cycle is a perfect example of people trying to reinvent the wheel. Let's pick a bunch of obscure stuff and slap it together and see if it sticks.

Crazy obscure up cycles like this are always garbage, its The basic stuff that works and it's funny because the only guys who don't believe it's the basic Are the same guys chasing the magic secrets for 20 years and never find them.

Every gigantic mass monster body builder is on the exact same recipe. They all talk about it all the time. Test,eq,deca,hgh, insulin. Basic ass ****. The bigger they get the more that they need. Then contest season rolls around and they swap eq for primo and swap deca for tren. Then they had a couple worlds in the last few weeks. Like 99% of All the biggest body builders in the world follow this recipe. It's not some secret either it's very openly talked about.

So why are we gonna try to come up with these crazy Theoretical cycles that are way less effective than the cycles that we already know work for everyone?

That's about all I got for this, I'm somewhat interested to see what other people have to say. But I have a feeling. The large majority of people here are going to say this doesn't make any sense.

It seems like you have access to pretty much everything, If I was in your position I put myself on a gram of test, 6-8iu of gh, some slin and id hire a coach. Is a body building coach who knows body. Building training and body building nutrition will enhance your physique ten times better than random obscure compounds. Anyone who's ever hired a real coach knows how true that is. Gains are made in the kitchen and the cycle doesn't really matter that much. The cycle just needs to be able to keep up with the food in the training

Wow thank you for the lengthy reply!!

Oh I agree it’s a complete garbage cycle. I just wanted to have some fun and pick peoples’ brains on a very obscure topic! Like I said I’m never going to run that cycle.


Funny thing I was just about to order some test, eq, deca and hgh. Kinda hesitant about the insulin though (haven’t learned enough about it to use it safely).

 

[MrKleen73]

Wow thank you for the lengthy reply!!

Oh I agree it’s a complete garbage cycle. I just wanted to have some fun and pick peoples’ brains on a very obscure topic! Like I said I’m never going to run that cycle.


Funny thing I was just about to order some test, eq, deca and hgh. Kinda hesitant about the insulin though (haven’t learned enough about it to use it safely).

If you don't plan on crushing calories nonstop then I wouldn't bother with it. If you are going to run HGH at a reasonably high dose, and just smash carbs constantly to the point it makes it hard for the pancreas to keep up with the insulin requirements I wouldn't go without it. From my understanding that is a good way to end up with pancreatitis.

 

[Hyde]

I think everything in the first category, the test/trest/Tren & an oral eventually are perfect. This is exactly what I’m on right now, and I have put back on 20lbs in 20 days. 210 test e, 175 Trest Ace, 140 Tren Ace/wk split into daily shots.

This is a cycle Mike Arnold has used and advised for fast comebacks; he reported something like 35-40lbs regained in 6 weeks after a layoff (maybe during COVID if I recall right). He recommended Anadrol, but I know he’s a Superdrol fan. I can’t eat on orals so I am using 500mg primo/wk.

Context is important here. I had intentionally lost 20lbs over the previous 6 weeks coming off a comp, then decided I really want to pursue a bench goal immediately. There is no reason to need something this aggressive just for general size accrual; Smont already gave some great alternatives that would be much less damaging to the cardiovascular system.

As for the next part, pick HGH & Slin, or IGFLR3, or Mk677, depending on budget, availability, how many pins you will go through. I listed them in their ideal order. I am currently just using Mk677. Its dirt cheap, helps my appetite on this power bulk, and between Trest, Tren & GW my glucose levels are way lower than normal - I have the insulin sensitivity to use all of this food that would normally be problematic with MK.

Follistatin is junk. Yk11 is nothing special, and a lot of it is allegedly actually old cheap Epistane raws, especially the older stuff. Which, you could just run more Superdrol or the like.

Letro will be overkill unless your doses of test & Trest are, and you certainly don’t need it or Prami in PCT. I do not need any AI or SERM currently with the 500 primo in place, and am using P5P to manage prolactin acceptably so far.

Regarding PCT itself…if you need to PCT, don’t use 19-Nors. Trest is not a drug for people who intend to use their own balls again.

 

[Stacks1]

No one should be running that cycle unless they are already on TRT. Good luck PCTing out of this one. Not going to say it can't be done but you'll want a bit of luck on your side.

Never mind, seems @Hyde beat me to it.

 

[Hyde]

No one should be running that cycle unless they are already on TRT. Good luck PCTing out of this one. Not going to say it can't be done but you'll want a bit of luck on your side.

Never mind, seems @Hyde beat me to it.

I think it’s good for other people to see this sentiment expressed by multiple people.

All the kids are gabbing about Tren, and Trest was so widely available as an RC for so long, there’s been a pretty stark lack of attention to the HPTA damage they can cause. It’s well-documented, and experienced guys know this as common knowledge, but I don’t think it’s common knowledge to the demographic that needs to really hear it.

 

[Stacks1]

I think it’s good for other people to see this sentiment expressed by multiple people.

All the kids are gabbing about Tren, and Trest was so widely available as an RC for so long, there’s been a pretty stark lack of attention to the HPTA damage they can cause. It’s well-documented, and experienced guys know this as common knowledge, but I don’t think it’s common knowledge to the demographic that needs to really hear it.

I agree. Everybody thinks PCT is going to be the panacea and that's just not the case. There are plenty of alternatives out there for those who still want to PCT... but when you start talking tren, trest, etc. then forget it. Even if you do recover, it can take a long time and take a lot out of your gains. Dienedione was like that for me. Great compound if you're on TRT, if you're not, yikes. Not sure what I was thinking when I took it. Freakish gains but brutal recovery.

 

[saderboy80]

More curious after looking at this, what other cycles have you run before, and were the just really bad and you feel you need to throw the kitchen sink at it this time too? I understand it was hypothetical but would assume you wouldn't be wasting our, or your time on planning / assessing a cycle that was never intended to be ran.

Woooohhhhh….i never said I was going to run this cycle!

And yes every cycle I have done I throw the kitchen sink of ancillaries at it.

This is just for conversation, fun, education. See if we can come up with some adverse effects of combining those specific PEDs.

I’ve done
A couple of stupid superdrol cycles in high school.
Test 300mg cycle
Test 500mg cycle
Test 500mg , Deca 300mg, eq 300mg
Test 750mg, eq 750mg, Masteron 400mg, with Anadrol for the last 3 weeks
test 1g/week, mk677, cardarine, rad140(was bunk), s23(was bunk)

I am just naturally a very curious person and am legit just trying to have a conversation on the topic of exotic cycles and why or why not they would work. Just for fun and education (hopefully some teenager doesn’t see this and run it).

 

[saderboy80]

I think everything in the first category, the test/trest/Tren & an oral eventually are perfect. This is exactly what I’m on right now, and I have put back on 20lbs in 20 days. 210 test e, 175 Trest Ace, 140 Tren Ace/wk split into daily shots.

This is a cycle Mike Arnold has used and advised for fast comebacks; he reported something like 35-40lbs regained in 6 weeks after a layoff (maybe during COVID if I recall right). He recommended Anadrol, but I know he’s a Superdrol fan. I can’t eat on orals so I am using 500mg primo/wk.

Context is important here. I had intentionally lost 20lbs over the previous 6 weeks coming off a comp, then decided I really want to pursue a bench goal immediately. There is no reason to need something this aggressive just for general size accrual; Smont already gave some great alternatives that would be much less damaging to the cardiovascular system.

As for the next part, pick HGH & Slin, or IGFLR3, or Mk677, depending on budget, availability, how many pins you will go through. I listed them in their ideal order. I am currently just using Mk677. Its dirt cheap, helps my appetite on this power bulk, and between Trest, Tren & GW my glucose levels are way lower than normal - I have the insulin sensitivity to use all of this food that would normally be problematic with MK.

Follistatin is junk. Yk11 is nothing special, and a lot of it is allegedly actually old cheap Epistane raws, especially the older stuff. Which, you could just run more Superdrol or the like.

Letro will be overkill unless your doses of test & Trest are, and you certainly don’t need it or Prami in PCT. I do not need any AI or SERM currently with the 500 primo in place, and am using P5P to manage prolactin acceptably so far.

Regarding PCT itself…if you need to PCT, don’t use 19-Nors. Trest is not a drug for people who intend to use their own balls again.

I can’t tell if you are serious or bullshitting me…..?

 

[Hyde]

I can’t tell if you are serious or bullshitting me…..?

100% on everything. I have my training log here where I discuss everything relevant to my progress, including PED disclosure. Today is Day 20.

So my current blast is:
210 test e/wk
175 trest a/wk
140 tren a/wk
500 primo e/wk

10mg GW/ed
15mg Mk677/ed (taking 2 consecutive days off weekly)
80mg Telmisartan/ed
5mg Ezetimibe/ed
2-400mg L-Carn IM 3-5x/wk
A shitload of health supps

Test/trest/tren are mixed and administered with a slinpin each morning. Primo is one large weekly shot. I added the Tren after a week to get the trest dialed in. I have taken 50mg Anadrol twice now over the 3 weeks on heavy bench days.

I wanted to note Mike Arnold’s proposed cycle was 150/150/150 test/trest/tren per wk. I believe with 50mg Anadrol daily. Again, for a high level/very experienced guy trying to come back FAST.

 

[MrKleen73]

I can’t tell if you are serious or bullshitting me…..?

I think he is talking about the cycle he is on currently.

 

[MrKleen73]

I think he is talking about the cycle he is on currently.

Yep, he posted it while I was typing.

 

[Hyde]

Also, even with controlled bp, my pulse is way higher. This is not a healthy cycle, nor am I advocating it. Minimizing duration is the most sensible course if you are set on something like this trio of oils.

Everything was in range on bloods at 2 weeks in, besides HDL - that is down to 29.

 

[Smont]

100% on everything. I have my training log here where I discuss everything relevant to my progress, including PED disclosure. Today is Day 20.

So my current blast is:
210 test e/wk
175 trest a/wk
140 tren a/wk
500 primo e/wk

10mg GW/ed
15mg Mk677/ed (taking 2 consecutive days off weekly)
80mg Telmisartan/ed
5mg Ezetimibe/ed
2-400mg L-Carn IM 3-5x/wk
A shitload of health supps

Test/trest/tren are mixed and administered with a slinpin each morning. Primo is one large weekly shot. I added the Tren after a week to get the trest dialed in. I have taken 50mg Anadrol twice now over the 3 weeks on heavy bench days.

I wanted to note Mike Arnold’s proposed cycle was 150/150/150 test/trest/tren per wk. I believe with 50mg Anadrol daily. Again, for a high level/very experienced guy trying to come back FAST.

where did you see this. You are definately correct or at least damn close Because I remember him talking about this I just can't remember where I heard it? Maybe a old beast fitness radio episode?

 

[Hyde]

View attachment 238653where did you see this. You are definately correct or at least damn close Because I remember him talking about this I just can't remember where I heard it? Maybe a old beast fitness radio episode?

Yes, one of the Beast Fitness Radio podcasts with Alex Kikel. Those were some great episodes; at least on ITunes those all got taken down after getting flagged for discussing anabolics.

 

[Smont]

Yes, one of the Beast Fitness Radio podcasts with Alex Kikel. Those were some great episodes; at least on ITunes those all got taken down after getting flagged for discussing anabolics.

Theres a couple low budget podcast player apps that You can find some of the old episodes on

 

[saderboy80]

If you don't plan on crushing calories nonstop then I wouldn't bother with it. If you are going to run HGH at a reasonably high dose, and just smash carbs constantly to the point it makes it hard for the pancreas to keep up with the insulin requirements I wouldn't go without it. From my understanding that is a good way to end up with pancreatitis.

What do you consider a reasonably high HGH dose?

 

[saderboy80]

100% on everything. I have my training log here where I discuss everything relevant to my progress, including PED disclosure. Today is Day 20.

So my current blast is:
210 test e/wk
175 trest a/wk
140 tren a/wk
500 primo e/wk

10mg GW/ed
15mg Mk677/ed (taking 2 consecutive days off weekly)
80mg Telmisartan/ed
5mg Ezetimibe/ed
2-400mg L-Carn IM 3-5x/wk
A shitload of health supps

Test/trest/tren are mixed and administered with a slinpin each morning. Primo is one large weekly shot. I added the Tren after a week to get the trest dialed in. I have taken 50mg Anadrol twice now over the 3 weeks on heavy bench days.

I wanted to note Mike Arnold’s proposed cycle was 150/150/150 test/trest/tren per wk. I believe with 50mg Anadrol daily. Again, for a high level/very experienced guy trying to come back FAST.

Damn that’s very interesting. Why no gh or slin?

How’s it treating you?

 

[MrKleen73]

What do you consider a reasonably high HGH dose?

I would say depending on diet 4IU and up from most of my reading and or research. More about the crazy amounts of food and carbs you end up throwing at it though. GH already lowers insulin sensitivity then on top of that the high needs for a lot of insulin pushes the pancreas very hard without exogenous insulin added in.

 

[saderboy80]

I would say depending on diet 4IU and up from most of my reading and or research. More about the crazy amounts of food and carbs you end up throwing at it though. GH already lowers insulin sensitivity then on top of that the high needs for a lot of insulin pushes the pancreas very hard without exogenous insulin added in.

So exogenous insulin and metformin use?

 

[Hyde]

Damn that’s very interesting. Why no gh or slin?

How’s it treating you?

Because GH doesn’t make me any stronger, which is the point of this effort. So I will save my GH for my next injury (it definitely supercharges effects of BPC & Tb500).

And my blood sugar is already lower than usual, so I don’t need insulin.

Adding this pair would just end up being even more injections - I already have 7 slinpins of oil per week, a 2.5cc shot of primo, and a few slinpins of carnitine. If you were bodybuilding, yes you would want the GH & Slin.

I have regained all of the 20lbs I previously lost, in just 3 weeks as of today. So pretty good as far as intended results.

 

[MrKleen73]

So exogenous insulin and metformin use?

I would guess one or the other, and not both, but I am not a guru, or have enough experience with it to say a whole lot more. Just basically regurgitating what I learned through research on some well respected forums and sites that specialize in P.E.D.s.

 

[saderboy80]

Because GH doesn’t make me any stronger, which is the point of this effort. So I will save my GH for my next injury (it definitely supercharges effects of BPC & Tb500).

And my blood sugar is already lower than usual, so I don’t need insulin.

Adding this pair would just end up being even more injections - I already have 7 slinpins of oil per week, a 2.5cc shot of primo, and a few slinpins of carnitine. If you were bodybuilding, yes you would want the GH & Slin.

I have regained all of the 20lbs I previously lost, in just 3 weeks as of today. So pretty good as far as intended results.

So you are going for a pure strength basis? Or am I interpreting that wrong.
That is some solid gains in 3 weeks. How much has your strength gone up?

 

[saderboy80]

I would guess one or the other, and not both, but I am not a guru, or have enough experience with it to say a whole lot more. Just basically regurgitating what I learned through research on some well respected forums and sites that specialize in P.E.D.s.

Well metformin increases insulin sensitivity. Insulin is well insulin.

 

[MrKleen73]

Well metformin increases insulin sensitivity. Insulin is well insulin.

Yes, I know what they do.

Just not sure if they should be used in conjunction with one another. I know many people use one or the other, but not sure if they use both at the same time. At best the metformin MIGHT help keep insulin sensitivity at usual levels in the presence of the exogenous insulin, but the additional insulin would probably overpower that and still cause sensitivity to drop. That is just me thinking it through though. Someone else might be able to give a much better answer.

 

[Smont]

So you are going for a pure strength basis? Or am I interpreting that wrong.
That is some solid gains in 3 weeks. How much has your strength gone up?

Hyde does powerlifting and strongman ****, he dont cycle with physique goals very often. Hes usally just trying to be big and strong with good leverages. The cycle hes on is going to do a lot for strength, its gonna work for your physique If you're diet and training is bodybuilding oriented. But theres nothing special here thats going to do something that a normal bodybuilding cycle cant do. I know nobody wants to hear it, theres no magic cycles, your diet and training is going To determine how you look way more than your steroid cycle is going to determine how you look.

If hyde tomorrow decided he was done with strength, and wanted to solely focus on bodybuilding or Is physique oriented goals, his cycle might be different but it dosent have to be, but his training style and diet would have to change drastically.

We all use steroids here, we all got simmilar and different goals and we all look very different. The cycles we all do are fairly similar or at least total drug loads are similar but the difference Between all of us is how we eat and how we train. Those are the deciding factors. The gear selection is not very importand, nor does it need to be complicated. 2 or 3 steroids, if you can afford it hgh and if your already lean and your calories and carbs require some help, insulin. Thats all most are doing and the dose is reletive to the level your at. Everything else is 0.001% stuff

 

[saderboy80]

Yes, I know what they do.

Just not sure if they should be used in conjunction with one another. I know many people use one or the other, but not sure if they use both at the same time. At best the metformin MIGHT help keep insulin sensitivity at usual levels in the presence of the exogenous insulin, but the additional insulin would probably overpower that and still cause sensitivity to drop. That is just me thinking it through though. Someone else might be able to give a much better answer.

AnabolicBodybuilding Paul Barnett on YouTube speaks of using them together while bulking and consuming excess carbs.

 

[saderboy80]

Hyde does powerlifting and strongman ****, he dont cycle with physique goals very often. Hes usally just trying to be big and strong with good leverages. The cycle hes on is going to do a lot for strength, its gonna work for your physique If you're diet and training is bodybuilding oriented. But theres nothing special here thats going to do something that a normal bodybuilding cycle cant do. I know nobody wants to hear it, theres no magic cycles, your diet and training is going To determine how you look way more than your steroid cycle is going to determine how you look.

If hyde tomorrow decided he was done with strength, and wanted to solely focus on bodybuilding or Is physique oriented goals, his cycle might be different but it dosent have to be, but his training style and diet would have to change drastically.

We all use steroids here, we all got simmilar and different goals and we all look very different. The cycles we all do are fairly similar or at least total drug loads are similar but the difference Between all of us is how we eat and how we train. Those are the deciding factors. The gear selection is not very importand, nor does it need to be complicated. 2 or 3 steroids, if you can afford it hgh and if your already lean and your calories and carbs require some help, insulin. Thats all most are doing and the dose is reletive to the level your at. Everything else is 0.001% stuff

You are talking as if I’m going to run this crazy ass cycle. I’m not.

 

[Smont]

AnabolicBodybuilding Paul Barnett on YouTube speaks of using them together while bulking and consuming excess carbs.

Thats a great channel, you gotta make sure your in a position to use insulin tho. You definately wanna be lean and have a need for the carbs before adding the slin

You are talking as if I’m going to run this crazy ass cycle. I’m not.

I didn't say you were, But i've seen some of your proposed cycles over the years and they're usually kitchen sink approaches and have a lot of grey area additions

 

[saderboy80]

Thats a great channel, you gotta make sure your in a position to use insulin tho. You definately wanna be lean and have a need for the carbs before adding the slin

I didn't say you were, But i've seen some of your proposed cycles over the years and they're usually kitchen sink approaches and have a lot of grey area additions

I don’t think I’m ready to use insulin yet.
Yes, proposed cycles. But like the one I started this post off with…I never actually ran those exact cycles. I just really like the research, feedback, communication and fun of bringing up topics like this and my other previous cycles.

 

[Smont]

I don’t think I’m ready to use insulin yet.
Yes, proposed cycles. But like the one I started this post off with…I never actually ran those exact cycles. I just really like the research, feedback, communication and fun of bringing up topics like this and my other previous cycles.

Insulin is something you should spend a lot of time on. Its one of those things that i dont think il ever fully be 100% confident in. I know theres usually a little more room for error then ppl believe but its still risky buisness. And its also one of those things where depending how and when you use it greatly determines the outcome. Use it right we get big and full, use it wrong we get fat and hyperinsulinemia, or dead

 

[saderboy80]

Insulin is something you should spend a lot of time on. Its one of those things that i dont think il ever fully be 100% confident in. I know theres usually a little more room for error then ppl believe but its still risky buisness. And its also one of those things where depending how and when you use it greatly determines the outcome. Use it right we get big and full, use it wrong we get fat and hyperinsulinemia, or dead

I shouldn’t have laughed at that, but I did. You are 100% spot on!

 

[Smont]

I shouldn’t have laughed at that, but I did. You are 100% spot on!

I laughed when i typed it!

 

[Hyde]

So you are going for a pure strength basis? Or am I interpreting that wrong.
That is some solid gains in 3 weeks. How much has your strength gone up?

Focusing on benchpress, and I think probably 30lbs on my 1RM probably

Hyde does powerlifting and strongman ****, he dont cycle with physique goals very often. Hes usally just trying to be big and strong with good leverages. The cycle hes on is going to do a lot for strength, its gonna work for your physique If you're diet and training is bodybuilding oriented. But theres nothing special here thats going to do something that a normal bodybuilding cycle cant do. I know nobody wants to hear it, theres no magic cycles, your diet and training is going To determine how you look way more than your steroid cycle is going to determine how you look.

If hyde tomorrow decided he was done with strength, and wanted to solely focus on bodybuilding or Is physique oriented goals, his cycle might be different but it dosent have to be, but his training style and diet would have to change drastically.

We all use steroids here, we all got simmilar and different goals and we all look very different. The cycles we all do are fairly similar or at least total drug loads are similar but the difference Between all of us is how we eat and how we train. Those are the deciding factors. The gear selection is not very importand, nor does it need to be complicated. 2 or 3 steroids, if you can afford it hgh and if your already lean and your calories and carbs require some help, insulin. Thats all most are doing and the dose is reletive to the level your at. Everything else is 0.001% stuff

100% all of this.

 

[Smont]

I think it would make more sence to go for Theoretical cycles where everything has a pourpose. For doses im just gonna pick the doses i would personally start the cycle at, the doses would change as needed.

The goal is bodybuilding, offseason growth with minimal fat gain.

Test- 600, test is the backbone of most effective cycles and i dont think a explination is necessary.

Mast-300, because on 600 test with 300 mast i dont need a ai and were hitting our dht pathway

Deca-200, deca is arguable the best steroid for mass, were leveraging the 19's here and deca is a very high Retentative drug, high nitrogen retention, high mineral and fluid Retention, and thats not always a bad thing, i hold most of my water in my muscles, i get a little spill in the face and ankles but nothing major and this is for mass!

This is the meat and potatoes.

Now if i can afford it im starting 2-3iu of gh, here we have another pathway and i dont know a ton about gh so im starting low and keeping notes on everything.

Insulin is probably necessary for me, im very active, i need like 3500 calories for maitnence at 205-210, at 225 im eating 4000-4500. Assuming im running this cycle for a new level of size and strength im gonna need to push to at least 235-240 given i can do it fairly lean, when my abs are gone my bulk is over but for me to get to that 235 range at a lean 5'9 my calories will be peaking over 5000 for certain. My insulin use is very limited so im starring with 10iu of lantus or levimer and i probably wouldnt use fast slin yet because im not prepared or feel comfortable yet but i may in place use some igf des post workout in the muscles trained and then eat my post w/o meal. Probably 50mcg bilateral.

So im Leveraging all these different pathways and not really overlapping anything or using unnecessary things (igf des is unnecessary) im throwing that in because i enjoy it And can use it a little bit like fast insulin for that insulin response shuttling nutrients into the target.

Test 600
Mast 300
Deca 200

Hgh 2-3iu
Lantus 10iu
Igf des 50-100mcg (not necessary)

Id have exemestane, letro, ralox and caber or prami on hand

Id take telmasartan
Cailis
Nad+
L-carn
And all my normal supps.

I would alternate between increasing the food and increasing the gear.

If i wanted to leverage a oral it would be late in the cycle and i would pick something tuff like anadrol or sd or possibly a combinatin of one of those and epistane. The orals would be to jack up my force production and total mg on the tail end when its needed most.



@saderboy80 what ya think

 

[saderboy80]

I think it would make more sence to go for Theoretical cycles where everything has a pourpose. For doses im just gonna pick the doses i would personally start the cycle at, the doses would change as needed.

The goal is bodybuilding, offseason growth with minimal fat gain.

Test- 600, test is the backbone of most effective cycles and i dont think a explination is necessary.

Mast-300, because on 600 test with 300 mast i dont need a ai and were hitting our dht pathway

Deca-200, deca is arguable the best steroid for mass, were leveraging the 19's here and deca is a very high Retentative drug, high nitrogen retention, high mineral and fluid Retention, and thats not always a bad thing, i hold most of my water in my muscles, i get a little spill in the face and ankles but nothing major and this is for mass!

This is the meat and potatoes.

Now if i can afford it im starting 2-3iu of gh, here we have another pathway and i dont know a ton about gh so im starting low and keeping notes on everything.

Insulin is probably necessary for me, im very active, i need like 3500 calories for maitnence at 205-210, at 225 im eating 4000-4500. Assuming im running this cycle for a new level of size and strength im gonna need to push to at least 235-240 given i can do it fairly lean, when my abs are gone my bulk is over but for me to get to that 235 range at a lean 5'9 my calories will be peaking over 5000 for certain. My insulin use is very limited so im starring with 10iu of lantus or levimer and i probably wouldnt use fast slin yet because im not prepared or feel comfortable yet but i may in place use some igf des post workout in the muscles trained and then eat my post w/o meal. Probably 50mcg bilateral.

So im Leveraging all these different pathways and not really overlapping anything or using unnecessary things (igf des is unnecessary) im throwing that in because i enjoy it And can use it a little bit like fast insulin for that insulin response shuttling nutrients into the target.

Test 600
Mast 300
Deca 200

Hgh 2-3iu
Lantus 10iu
Igf des 50-100mcg (not necessary)

Id have exemestane, letro, ralox and caber or prami on hand

Id take telmasartan
Cailis
Nad+
L-carn
And all my normal supps.

I would alternate between increasing the food and increasing the gear.

If i wanted to leverage a oral it would be late in the cycle and i would pick something tuff like anadrol or sd or possibly a combinatin of one of those and epistane. The orals would be to jack up my force production and total mg on the tail end when its needed most.



@saderboy80 what ya think

Why the igf-des and not lr3? (I’m not all that familiar with Des)

Personally, I think you could start the cycle at those doses but taper up the Deca to 500mg. (Ahh you said alternate between increasing food and gear,right?)

I’d say start insulin off with literally 5iu and 50g carbs/bcaas/glutamine/creatine in a shake. Personally, I’d have a glucometer on hand and be taking measurements every 15min for the few first times you take insulin. But that’s just me.

 

[Smont]

Why the igf-des and not lr3? (I’m not all that familiar with Des)

Personally, I think you could start the cycle at those doses but taper up the Deca to 500mg. (Ahh you said alternate between increasing food and gear,right?)

I’d say start insulin off with literally 5iu and 50g carbs/bcaas/glutamine/creatine in a shake. Personally, I’d have a glucometer on hand and be taking measurements every 15min for the few first times you take insulin. But that’s just me.

High Systemic igf is not a good thing, des is fast acting, you pin it in the muscle trained around around training and you get a way better chance Of getting localized I g f in the muscle

 

[Smont]

Why the igf-des and not lr3? (I’m not all that familiar with Des)

Personally, I think you could start the cycle at those doses but taper up the Deca to 500mg. (Ahh you said alternate between increasing food and gear,right?)

I’d say start insulin off with literally 5iu and 50g carbs/bcaas/glutamine/creatine in a shake. Personally, I’d have a glucometer on hand and be taking measurements every 15min for the few first times you take insulin. But that’s just me.

My insulin use would be based off needs and i would start deca at 200 tops, steroid doses would raise as needed. Everything I do would be as needed, not just randomly picked doses or increasing for np reason. This is why i think you should be lean, full set of abs before starting a bulk. I eat until mu body comp is looking like im gaining fat, then i up the dose, then i eat more till im gaining fat and then i up the dose.

 

[saderboy80]

My insulin use would be based off needs and i would start deca at 200 tops, steroid doses would raise as needed. Everything I do would be as needed, not just randomly picked doses or increasing for np reason. This is why i think you should be lean, full set of abs before starting a bulk. I eat until mu body comp is looking like im gaining fat, then i up the dose, then i eat more till im gaining fat and then i up the dose.

In the latter part of your post are you referring to insulin or gear?

 

[Smont]

In the latter part of your post are you referring to insulin or gear?

Food and gear. But When my food is going up, it's probably gonna be a mostly increase in carbohydrates, so that would create more demand for insulin.

I know your not thinking what im about to say But I just want to include this so nobody's confused. I'm by no means giving instructions on how to use insulin, I'm not comfortable using it myself and i've only played around with the long acting slins and I haven't used more than 10iu mornings only. Its something That I only want to use the minimum necessary to accomplish my goal and thats for 2 reasons, Safty and necessity. If i'm only eating three hundred grams of carbohydrates per day I don't need insulin. If im eating 600+ then slin is much more useful. Of course i could use a tiny bit with less carbs but why? I don't wanna just be taking things for no reason.

 

[saderboy80]

Food and gear. But When my food is going up, it's probably gonna be a mostly increase in carbohydrates, so that would create more demand for insulin.

I know your not thinking what im about to say But I just want to include this so nobody's confused. I'm by no means giving instructions on how to use insulin, I'm not comfortable using it myself and i've only played around with the long acting slins and I haven't used more than 10iu mornings only. Its something That I only want to use the minimum necessary to accomplish my goal and thats for 2 reasons, Safty and necessity. If i'm only eating three hundred grams of carbohydrates per day I don't need insulin. If im eating 600+ then slin is much more useful. Of course i could use a tiny bit with less carbs but why? I don't wanna just be taking things for no reason.

Thank you for the in depth description!!