Hair Loss Prevention

[newbie2222]

Ok. First off, im pretty sure im ****ed and im really worried. Backstory: I began to thin very young around 18 and started propecia immediately(im pretty vain and the idea of being bald just was not an option). Within a few months i was growing new hairs along my hairline and throughout my scalp. I could feel them with my fingertips as i ran my hands through my hair and could visibily see them on my hairline. I could not have been happier as i seemingly was saved from ever balding. i caught it early and was able to preserve just about all of my hair. No one would say i looked like i was balding in any way. Did a cycle last summer of dbol, deca, and sus and ran my propecia normally at 1mg per day. i didnt notice any hair loss. prior to this summer i started my second cycle of sus and tren. I did it for 9 weeks at 500mg of sus and 300 of tren. pct of clomid at 100/100/50/50. I ran letro also in pct bc i had it on hand from a previous gyno thing. About 2 weeks into my pct i started to notice hairs on my hands in the shower and when i was gelling my hair. I wasnt too worried bc it was only a few. by the 4th week(1 week ago), I am losing serious hair over here. Im talking if i gently touch my hair over the sink i will have 10 hairs falling out. In the shower im losing more than i can count. I literally have a visible notice in the thickness and even my hairline over the last 2 weeks. I dont have money for crazy bloodwork or anything. I can be pretty sure its not bc of dht bc propecia blocks that and i have never had a problem before. When i first started noticing the hair loss in week 2 of pct i began upping my dose of propecia to 3x recommended dose thinking that it was needed to counteract more dht in my blood from the test. No luck it is just getting worse. But now ive come to realize it almost undoubtedly is either tren or the clomid.
I've done some reading and it appears tren causes hair loss but not hair loss associated with DHT??? This is just what ive read so more info on this would be fantastic. I also read clomid can cause hair loss...I would think this is the more likely thing just bc i was fine while on cycle and didnt notice any hair loss until after i started clomid. last cycle i used nolva. at this rate i am not exaggerating i could be bald by the end of the year. whatever hair i saved using propecia all these years is probably extra vulnerable thus causing the accelerated hair loss. I stopped clomid and im off everything.
Now for my questions:
1) Is there solid proof that clomid can cause hairloss and if so are there documented cases anyone has heard of where it is this bad.
2) What exactly happens to cause hairloss from tren and is there any drug to stop it from attacking the hair follical.
3) exact question as number 2 but switch clomid for tren
4) what the **** do i do now?

thanks to anyone who takes the time to respond.

 

[dallasboy22]

I dont know about clomid, but tren is defiantly know to cause hair loss. In fact tren and 1-test are up there and it is not DHT related, it is from another pathway. Saying that, a lot of people who shed says it will grow back but if your hairline is moving backwards then that is permanent.

I

 

[prld2gr8ns]

Now for my questions:
1) Is there solid proof that clomid can cause hairloss and if so are there documented cases anyone has heard of where it is this bad.
2) What exactly happens to cause hairloss from tren and is there any drug to stop it from attacking the hair follical.
3) exact question as number 2 but switch clomid for tren
4) what the **** do i do now?

thanks to anyone who takes the time to respond.

1. anything that increases test has the possibility of increasing hair loss. The more test equals more targets for 5AR.
2. Anything highly androgenic can stimulate and inflame the hair follicles. It doesn't have to convert to dht to do this. Some speculate that using propecia in combination with tren actually increases dht, further increasing hair loss. Your combo of tren plus a test ****tail like sus is responsible for your hair loss. A good antifungal topical or shampoo would be the proposed course of action.
3. See 1.
4. Never take highly androgenic roids again, or roids period if you are this susceptible. Start using a good shampoo like has been mentioned in this thread, perhaps adding in a spironolactone topical with minoxidil and AA.

 

[HereToStudy]

1. anything that increases test has the possibility of increasing hair loss. The more test equals more targets for 5AR.
2. Anything highly androgenic can stimulate and inflame the hair follicles. It doesn't have to convert to dht to do this. Some speculate that using propecia in combination with tren actually increases dht, further increasing hair loss. Your combo of tren plus a test ****tail like sus is responsible for your hair loss. A good antifungal topical or shampoo would be the proposed course of action.
3. See 1.
4. Never take highly androgenic roids again, or roids period if you are this susceptible. Start using a good shampoo like has been mentioned in this thread, perhaps adding in a spironolactone topical with minoxidil and AA.

Highly agree here. I would also consider the toco 8 as well

 

[newbie2222]

Highly agree here. I would also consider the toco 8 as well

thanks for replies. couple more questions...what is the toco 8? and is this hair loss permanent? What i mean is i stopped shooting almost 5 or 6 weeks ago. shouldnt the test have been out of my system? hair loss just started 2 weeks ago. I started rogaine yesterday but its proving useless because i have hair all over my head and its 3 inches long. trying to get it to the scalp takes a quarter of the bottle. i am still on the propecia but what appears to have maybe happened is now propecia has been completing negated by something i took permanently!!! this would be horrible but idk. thanks for help

 

[HereToStudy]

thanks for replies. couple more questions...what is the toco 8? and is this hair loss permanent? What i mean is i stopped shooting almost 5 or 6 weeks ago. shouldnt the test have been out of my system? hair loss just started 2 weeks ago. I started rogaine yesterday but its proving useless because i have hair all over my head and its 3 inches long. trying to get it to the scalp takes a quarter of the bottle. i am still on the propecia but what appears to have maybe happened is now propecia has been completing negated by something i took permanently!!! this would be horrible but idk. thanks for help

Toco 8 is an 8 isomer vitamin e supplement that is supportive of hair regrowth.


Permanent hair loss is hard to say for sure and highly depends on the individual

 

[prld2gr8ns]

thanks for replies. couple more questions...what is the toco 8? and is this hair loss permanent? What i mean is i stopped shooting almost 5 or 6 weeks ago. shouldnt the test have been out of my system? hair loss just started 2 weeks ago. I started rogaine yesterday but its proving useless because i have hair all over my head and its 3 inches long. trying to get it to the scalp takes a quarter of the bottle. i am still on the propecia but what appears to have maybe happened is now propecia has been completing negated by something i took permanently!!! this would be horrible but idk. thanks for help

For the minox, use a dropper and place it directly on the scalp. It will be effective no matter how long your hair is.

 

[newbie2222]

I have upped dose of propecia to 2 mgs per day and started with the rogaine. I will keep an update as to whetther the rogaine helps or not. I bought the foam like a rougher but I need the drops as prld mentioned. That would make it a little easier to get to the scalp. I can't even tell you have bad this sucks. Does anyone know if the test or tren or clomid cause a chemical reaction making the finasteride useless forever? All the roids should be completely out of my system by now but hairloss is still verrrrry evident. Again, hairloss did not begin until 2 weeks into pct. About 12 weeks after starting cycle.

 

[HereToStudy]

Seems like there is some research involving Resveratrol as well for hair loss:
http://www.hairloss-research.org/UpdateResveratrol11-07.html

Thanks to the member who sent this to me

 

[prld2gr8ns]

I have upped dose of propecia to 2 mgs per day and started with the rogaine. I will keep an update as to whetther the rogaine helps or not. I bought the foam like a rougher but I need the drops as prld mentioned. That would make it a little easier to get to the scalp. I can't even tell you have bad this sucks. Does anyone know if the test or tren or clomid cause a chemical reaction making the finasteride useless forever? All the roids should be completely out of my system by now but hairloss is still verrrrry evident. Again, hairloss did not begin until 2 weeks into pct. About 12 weeks after starting cycle.

None of them should. Tren is suspected but never proven.

 

[prld2gr8ns]

Seems like there is some research involving Resveratrol as well for hair loss:
http://www.hairloss-research.org/UpdateResveratrol11-07.html

Thanks to the member who sent this to me

I take it this was dosed orally right. I'm too lazy to give it a good reading. It's interesting, especially this:

According to the invention, the pharmaceutical composition can comprise also vitamin E and/or wheat germs containing vitamin E. In fact, the powdered wheat germs are one of the richest natural resources of vitamin E (or tocopherol) and are one of the most effective antioxidants against free radicals, the aggressive substances that proliferate in our body because of the action of pollution, inaccurate diets, sun or just age.

 

[rambo679]

Studies indicate an oral dose, smaller amounts than you'd think too of each ingredient

 

[HereToStudy]

Studies indicate an oral dose, smaller amounts than you'd think too of each ingredient

The topical application would provide better results, I would guess. If not, we still offer LV sustain

 

[HereToStudy]

The topical application would provide better results, I would guess. If not, we still offer LV sustain

BTW guys, coupon works on Sustain. hit me up.

 

[jakethemus]

Do coupons work if i order from the UK distributor predator nutrition?

 

[prld2gr8ns]

Do coupons work if i order from the UK distributor predator nutrition?

Only at PP's website.

 

[HereToStudy]

Only at PP's website.

Correct, retailers may run their own promotions, but our codes only work at our home site!

 

[newbie2222]

just an update on my rapid hairloss post from about 2 weeks ago. Its still so bad. i kept on with the propecia at 2mg a day and am still using rogaine. To give an idea of the scale of hairloss when i use the rogaine its a tad sticky...so the dead hairs really stick to my hands. i just used it about 15 minutes ago and have AT LEAST 100 hairs on my hands. my hair was full before all this started. it is now pretty god damn thin. I can no longer gel it without showing major scalp so i have been styling it without gel. I know that hair sheds in cycles of a few months but i am 90 percent sure now that when i started the tren it began to offset the effects of the propecia. so after a couple months the hairs had thinned out and began to lose them. I was thinning bad at age 20 when i began propecia. it regrew a good amount of hair and thickened the rest up better than i could have ever hoped. I didnt have any balding or even thinning for 8 years on the medication.

So my question is when the **** will the effects that tren has on the propecia medication subside so i can start regrowing the hairs back?

I also had some acne on my upper arms and shoulders on the cycle. this also has not stopped. its not horrible just a few huge pimps here and there that i didnt get before the cycle. i just got a script for bloodwork but could my test levels still be elevated two months after i am done pinning. any help would be worth millions to me lol.

 

[Syringe]

K guys....I would love some advice over here.

I've been thinning and receding little by little over the years and would love to at least prevent more hairloss from happening. I'm currently running 225 npp e3d along with a very low dose of test prop...about 30mgs e3d. I started nizoral and slowly added natural topicals like coconut, cayenne, and emu oil over the last year to prevent further hair loss.

So far the hair loss on my current cycle has been minimal *knocks on wood* but essentially I would like to add more products to my regime in attempts to minimize future hairloss and hopefully even regain a little.

I'm thinking about adding 5% minox and 5% azelaic acid to my hair loss stack. Don't know if spiro would be recommended...
Also, not on any finasteride as of yet but if and when I switch my cycle to mostly test I will definitely get on that but for now I think its best if I skip it.

thanks in advance!!

 

[HereToStudy]

K guys....I would love some advice over here.

I've been thinning and receding little by little over the years and would love to at least prevent more hairloss from happening. I'm currently running 225 npp e3d along with a very low dose of test prop...about 30mgs e3d. I started nizoral and slowly added natural topicals like coconut, cayenne, and emu oil over the last year to prevent further hair loss.

So far the hair loss on my current cycle has been minimal *knocks on wood* but essentially I would like to add more products to my regime in attempts to minimize future hairloss and hopefully even regain a little.

I'm thinking about adding 5% minox and 5% azelaic acid to my hair loss stack. Don't know if spiro would be recommended...
Also, not on any finasteride as of yet but if and when I switch my cycle to mostly test I will definitely get on that but for now I think its best if I skip it.

thanks in advance!!

I recommend avoiding the finastride. Some will disagree, bug DHT is a necessary hormone.

I have talked about toco-8 previously in this thread, if you are interested in adding it to your stack, hit me with a PM for a coupon

 

[prld2gr8ns]

K guys....I would love some advice over here.

I've been thinning and receding little by little over the years and would love to at least prevent more hairloss from happening. I'm currently running 225 npp e3d along with a very low dose of test prop...about 30mgs e3d. I started nizoral and slowly added natural topicals like coconut, cayenne, and emu oil over the last year to prevent further hair loss.

So far the hair loss on my current cycle has been minimal *knocks on wood* but essentially I would like to add more products to my regime in attempts to minimize future hairloss and hopefully even regain a little.

I'm thinking about adding 5% minox and 5% azelaic acid to my hair loss stack. Don't know if spiro would be recommended...
Also, not on any finasteride as of yet but if and when I switch my cycle to mostly test I will definitely get on that but for now I think its best if I skip it.

thanks in advance!!

Sounds like you don't need any advice. The 5% minox and 5% AA should be all you need if things are going well with your current stack.

 

[greaser]

The ONLY things proven to combat hairloss are minoxidil and finasteride. I understand concerns about messing with finasteride, but minoxidil is really a no brainer. EVERYONE who wants to slow down their MPB should be running minoxidil. It's the first line of defense, not the last. As to the other stuff, there is evidence that they are anti-androgens, but that's all in vitro (test tube) evidence. It MIGHT work in vivo, but it might not. So if money isn't an issue for you, then you can run natural products like Revivogen, etc. I'm sure they won't hurt your hair, but they might not be helpful and they will impact your wallet. Generic minox is cheap as dirt and works. I'm pretty sure Spiro also helps, but it has a very short half life and your head will smell like rotten eggs.

In your case, the most obvious thing you should do is stop running test. Supra-physiological amounts of test mean supra-physiological amounts of DHT, which means bad news for your hairline. I know it sucks, but those are the facts. :02:

K guys....I would love some advice over here.

I've been thinning and receding little by little over the years and would love to at least prevent more hairloss from happening. I'm currently running 225 npp e3d along with a very low dose of test prop...about 30mgs e3d. I started nizoral and slowly added natural topicals like coconut, cayenne, and emu oil over the last year to prevent further hair loss.

So far the hair loss on my current cycle has been minimal *knocks on wood* but essentially I would like to add more products to my regime in attempts to minimize future hairloss and hopefully even regain a little.

I'm thinking about adding 5% minox and 5% azelaic acid to my hair loss stack. Don't know if spiro would be recommended...
Also, not on any finasteride as of yet but if and when I switch my cycle to mostly test I will definitely get on that but for now I think its best if I skip it.

thanks in advance!!

 

[HereToStudy]

The ONLY things proven to combat hairloss are minoxidil and finasteride. I understand concerns about messing with finasteride, but minoxidil is really a no brainer. EVERYONE who wants to slow down their MPB should be running minoxidil. It's the first line of defense, not the last. As to the other stuff, there is evidence that they are anti-androgens, but that's all in vitro (test tube) evidence. It MIGHT work in vivo, but it might not. So if money isn't an issue for you, then you can run natural products like Revivogen, etc. I'm sure they won't hurt your hair, but they might not be helpful and they will impact your wallet. Generic minox is cheap as dirt and works. I'm pretty sure Spiro also helps, but it has a very short half life and your head will smell like rotten eggs.

In your case, the most obvious thing you should do is stop running test. Supra-physiological amounts of test mean supra-physiological amounts of DHT, which means bad news for your hairline. I know it sucks, but those are the facts. :02:

Worst part about having MPB is avoiding test

 

[greaser]

Worst part about having MPB is avoiding test

I know. That's why I've never run test. It's a bummer, but I'm very prone to MPB and I'd look terrible bald, so I'm not going to risk it.

 

[rockme]

I know. That's why I've never run test. It's a bummer, but I'm very prone to MPB and I'd look terrible bald, so I'm not going to risk it.

Are there any PH, DS, or AAS that you have run with success? I want to run something eventually, but have some susceptibility to MPB. Currently looking at halodrol and superdrol...

 

[greaser]

Are there any PH, DS, or AAS that you have run with success? I want to run something eventually, but have some susceptibility to MPB. Currently looking at halodrol and superdrol...

Hdrol/Tbol/Halodrol are quite safe for the hairline. The 4-chloro group prevents it from being 5AR reduced so there is no conversion to DHT. I haven't run superdrol but I believe has a low androgenic rating as well and should be safe on your hair (though rough on your liver). I've also run Epi/Havoc without any noticable increase in shedding, even though it is a DHT based steroid. Tren is safe on the hairline as well.

 

[rockme]

Hdrol/Tbol/Halodrol are quite safe for the hairline. The 4-chloro group prevents it from being 5AR reduced so there is no conversion to DHT. I haven't run superdrol but I believe has a low androgenic rating as well and should be safe on your hair (though rough on your liver). I've also run Epi/Havoc without any noticable increase in shedding, even though it is a DHT based steroid. Tren is safe on the hairline as well.

Tren is safe on the hairline? I assume you are referring to the AAS Tren. From everything I've read, Tren is destructive to the hairline. But good to know that the halo was kind to you. Always helpful to hear encouraging stories like that

 

[prld2gr8ns]

Hdrol/Tbol/Halodrol are quite safe for the hairline. The 4-chloro group prevents it from being 5AR reduced so there is no conversion to DHT. I haven't run superdrol but I believe has a low androgenic rating as well and should be safe on your hair (though rough on your liver). I've also run Epi/Havoc without any noticable increase in shedding, even though it is a DHT based steroid. Tren is safe on the hairline as well.

Tren is not safe on the hairline.

 

[HereToStudy]

Tren is not safe on the hairline.

Yeah, this is opposite of the truth.

 

[rockme]

Yeah, this is opposite of the truth.

I'm not interested in Tren anyways. Looking to strengthen my anti-hairloss regimen. Currently alternating Thymuskin shampoo with Regenepure shampoo. I also cycle holistic oils on my scalp and hairline pre-bedtime. Was thinking about Toco-8, as I'm all about natural remedies, but am open to minoxidil when on cycle.

 

[HereToStudy]

I'm not interested in Tren anyways. Looking to strengthen my anti-hairloss regimen. Currently alternating Thymuskin shampoo with Regenepure shampoo. I also cycle holistic oils on my scalp and hairline pre-bedtime. Was thinking about Toco-8, as I'm all about natural remedies, but am open to minoxidil when on cycle.

Both should do well while on cycle. If you decide on the toco, hit me up for a coupon.

 

[rockme]

Anybody have success with low level laser therapy brushes? I read about them at the onset of this thread. Would be willing to invest, but would like to know if others experienced results.

 

[HereToStudy]

Anybody have success with low level laser therapy brushes? I read about them at the onset of this thread. Would be willing to invest, but would like to know if others experienced results.

Before investing in something like that, I would investigate the science. I am not saying it works or does not, but anything that seems slightly gimmicky requires research.

 

[Jessep76]

I know there's little data on low doses of S4, but anyone have any breaking data on whether this SARM could actually help the prostate and/or hairloss? All I read are people with slight shedding.

 

[HereToStudy]

I know there's little data on low doses of S4, but anyone have any breaking data on whether this SARM could actually help the prostate and/or hairloss? All I read are people with slight shedding.

I never researched any SARMS, but why would you think it helps the prostate or hairline?

Also, awesome avatar.

 

[Jessep76]

I never researched any SARMS, but why would you think it helps the prostate or hairline?

Also, awesome avatar.

Breaking Bad is probably the best crime series next to The Wire IMO. I jumped on it late though so I had to catch up on Netflix and even pay for season 4 on amazon, but totally worth it even though netflix just added season 4.

As far as Sarms helping prostate, I've read on some of the sites selling sarms (questionable I know) about Sarms reducing the weight of the prostate and/or size. After searching for more credible research I found this

"SARMs with either partial agonist or anti-androgen actions in the prostate might provide a novel approach for androgen suppression in BPH treatment, without causing side-effects in the anabolic tissue and hypothalamus–pituitary–testis axis. SARMs with partial-agonist activity in the prostate and full-agonist activity in muscle and other peripheral tissues would decrease prostate size (because of their ability to work as antagonists in the presence of endogenous DHT) while avoiding the side-effects caused by nonselective inhibition by anti-androgens. Tissue selective anti-androgens are a novel approach for the treatment of BPH and prostate cancer, and can be considered as a new class of SARMs. These ligands should behave as antagonists in the prostate with either no activity or agonist activity in other target tissues."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2072879/

 

[rambo679]

I've been wondering that myself, if they could develop a SARM that only binds to Androgen Receptors in the hair follicle but doesn't block it anywhere else.

 

[Jessep76]

That would be sweet. Hair and muscle growth.

 

[rambo679]

Anyone know any scientists we can pitch this one to?

 

[HereToStudy]

Ha I wish, too much **** I would recommend.

 

[Rhant8492]

Great thread, really gave me a better outlook on my next cycle and how to best combat mpb

 

[HereToStudy]

Great thread, really gave me a better outlook on my next cycle and how to best combat mpb

If you decide to incorporate toco, hit me up for a coupon.

 

[lboston]

I'm going to start using Nizoral (when it gets here) for some hair shedding brought on by TRT.

How soon after starting would one see results if it's going to help you?

Also...how much/ how often?

I tried Nioxin thinning hair system...doesn't seem to be doing sh&t!

 

[prld2gr8ns]

depends on the person. Usually within a few weeks to months. Shampoo with it once every two to three days.

 

[lboston]

depends on the person. Usually within a few weeks to months. Shampoo with it once every two to three days.

Thanks. So doing it every day would be overkill?

What do you recommend on the off days?

 

[prld2gr8ns]

You can try every day. Some people get some bad inflammation side effects from using it everyday. I know I get a lot of head pimples just from shampooing with it every other day, which are annoying and can be a little painful. It's recommended to use on an every other day schedule for a reason. On off days, you can keep using the nioxin or look into getting some regenapure shampoo or some non keto based hair restoration shampoo to use as well. Also, add toco 8.

 

[HereToStudy]

Does Niz have the potential for shedding in first week that some see with Rogaine?

 

[prld2gr8ns]

Does Niz have the potential for shedding in first week that some see with Rogaine?

I've never experienced it or heard anything about it causing this problem. Minox works by increasing hair growth phase from resting phase to active phase, which causes the increase shedding of old (re: dead) hairs. Niz is just a potent dht inhibitor, no effect on hair growth and rest phases.

 

[Jessep76]

I've never experienced it or heard anything about it causing this problem. Minox works by increasing hair growth phase from resting phase to active phase, which causes the increase shedding of old (re: dead) hairs. Niz is just a potent dht inhibitor, no effect on hair growth and rest phases.

Where do you get your minoxidil?

 

[rambo679]

I just buy the kirklands brand off of amazon.