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First Time PH Cycle after 9 Years of Hardwork Naturally

Very nice I wish I was on bulking season but sadly no bulking for a loooong time I'm going to hold my abs through the whole summer
 
Thank guys! and I stay on bulking cycle all year round lol, damn metoblism just aint having it any other way, cant even gain water weight/bloat if I wanted to LOL im highly tempted to start a 12 week pin cycle with either test p & e or sustanon 250 and I would love to get some dbol to run for 4-6 weeks as well would appreciate any thoughts and feedback on this idea, im dying to experience that euphoric feeling that I hear only Dbol gives you, not the aggressive throw weight aroun like trest one but I guess this ones a little different and its an all day thing like the world is great your day is great type feeling lol
 
KilaCali said:
Thank guys! and I stay on bulking cycle all year round lol, damn metoblism just aint having it any other way, cant even gain water weight/bloat if I wanted to LOL im highly tempted to start a 12 week pin cycle with either test p & e or sustanon 250 and I would love to get some dbol to run for 4-6 weeks as well would appreciate any thoughts and feedback on this idea, im dying to experience that euphoric feeling that I hear only Dbol gives you, not the aggressive throw weight aroun like trest one but I guess this ones a little different and its an all day thing like the world is great your day is great type feeling lol
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Sustanon would be my suggestion
 
Yea that's what I was thinking, might as well get the best of all 3 worlds, what about the dbol, whats the typical dosing go for that and average length of a cycle? I was only thinking of throwing that in after 4 weeks of starting the sust. and going 4-6 weeks on that then finishing with another 4-6 weeks of sust for a total of around 12-14 weeks
 
Pct and chill out for a while. You've had nothing but negative experiences recently. Relax. Recover. Figure it out. Plan properly and don't rush into something. Sorry your double cycle didn't go so swell. Step back and take some time off.

Then do your cycle.
 
Dma378 said:
Pct and chill out for a while. You've had nothing but negative experiences recently. Relax. Recover. Figure it out. Plan properly and don't rush into something. Sorry your double cycle didn't go so swell. Step back and take some time off.

Then do your cycle.[/QUOT
Thanks for the cold hard truth LOL I do appreciate it, that's already my plan, just pondering things for the future, maybe near future or late, anyhow im on my last week doing the diabolix at 90mg and it works out perfect I will run out exactly next Tuesday, then its pct time and to think things out and figure out what the best course of action should be, this last cycle lost a lot of steam right before and during the holidays over all the negative personal things going on, then of course the most recent issue to boot, so im kind of glad to be pcting it so im not just wasting money or anything else, the good news though is labs came back great, liver and all are in great shape so the 4 methyl deal didn't harm the liver, I actually feel just as healthy as before, no shutdown, never had an issue with dark urine, only thing I had which I kind of think was related to either the halo or the sdmz was the leg swelling up two/three weeks ago, thinking it could of been some sort of allergic reaction and one of those were bunk, cause I didn't really notice a kick out of the second bottle of halo, nor did I notice anything after the first week of sdmz anyhow, I will have plenty of time to think, research, plan and stock up and come back and hit it twice as hard with a fresh set of plans and circumstances

I honestly feel that minus the personal issues from December on and off into the end of this month with the whole leg swelling that I could of definitely made twice the gains, I know weekly natural I can just about make drastic changes, so with the help of the synthetics its a given that I would be blasting away and I did at points during this cycle, just bad timing with a lot of things, people dying, getting sick, jobs and so fourth. anyways thanks for all the support bro's and will keep you up to date on the pct, hopefully like some of these guys (Dma/yates) and others, I can smash some gains in the off season. big love & respect always
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Dma378 said:
Pct and chill out for a while. You've had nothing but negative experiences recently. Relax. Recover. Figure it out. Plan properly and don't rush into something. Sorry your double cycle didn't go so swell. Step back and take some time off.

Then do your cycle.
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Solid advice.
 
you got a lot of research to do brother. you gotta figure out if these compounds aromatize, what ai to use, NO OTC, what dosages of everything to take. and all the stuff to combat side effects. I'll tell you right now, I spent nearly double what I spent on my gear on supps to combat side effects and PCT, and research chemicals, all stuff to help my body deal with the gear. Not to mention HCG. if your gonna pct and not go on test replacement therapy for the rest of your life your probably going to want to understand and use HCG.
 
I DID A TON OF RESEARCH BEFORE I DID MY CYCLE. but that god because everything is going smooth and IM getting GREAT results. no side effects.
 
HardEarned said:
you got a lot of research to do brother. you gotta figure out if these compounds aromatize, what ai to use, NO OTC, what dosages of everything to take. and all the stuff to combat side effects. I'll tell you right now, I spent nearly double what I spent on my gear on supps to combat side effects and PCT, and research chemicals, all stuff to help my body deal with the gear. Not to mention HCG. if your gonna pct and not go on test replacement therapy for the rest of your life your probably going to want to understand and use HCG.
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Alright slow down Bro's I'm not a highschool kid on here for my first time and just started working out a month ago and started watching movies with body builders and all the sudden wanna jump into this ****, I have been around this **** my whole life and am actually one of the only guys out of about 6 or 8 of us who hasn just BARELY crossed the line into synthetics, everyone else I know IN person for the last 10-15 years has been doing this ****, and not just pumping random nonsense, most of my bros are STACKED and I still never desired it growing up around them, only until 4 or 5 years ago did I REALLY start THINKING about doing another other then some damn creatine and amino's and start diving into books (well I was stuck in prison no computers) and every damn webpage and site I can find now that im free to research everything surrounding AAS/DS use, uses, side effects etc.. there is a huge reason I've spent 31 years of my life natural guys, and that reason is cause im not just some dumbass trying to get high or big off the next best thing, I've been putting nonstop months/weeks/days/hours into this **** planning things out very meticulously and then


when I have a solid plan guess what? I PLAN SOME MORE So with all due respect I do appreciate you guys looking out for my health and testicles almost as much as I myself do, but I do pay a lot of attention to what I am doing, the risk, the negative, positive and everything in between short term and long term not only a year or two down the road by when im 60-70 years old making sure that im going to be where I want to be when im that age, when I mention things on here and talk about trying this or that, you better believe its a long ways off from actually going fourth with doing it, a lot of things I mention I probably wont even think about it seconds after and have a whole other game plan the next hour day or week, I know where I want to be physically and mentally, and I choose my roads very wisely and not only do I ask you guys on here for advice and research till 3-4am most the time just to have a small clue of what im getting into im discussing this **** daily with family and friends that are extremely knowledge and educated as well as expierenced in every aspect one way form or another. I respect and appreciate constructive criticism but im

starting to get the feeling from some of you that I am all the sudden someone who is charging into this **** with wreckless abandon with no clue what its going to do to me today tomorrow or the next day, well just so you all know, im thinking a lot further up the road then a lot of folks and still don't play the game thinking I know everything, I know I will NEVER know everything and nobody ever will but im gonna investigate, and soak up every last bit of knowledge I can for the most successful results I can possibly end up with. not to come off like a dick, just reminding you all who your talking to behind this little monitor and keyboard and if someone don't wanna chime in with some constructive advice wether positive or negative it's all good, but I'm a 31 year old man who's got this far in life on his own two feet, who broke several barriers from alking around at 125lbs to 155lbs to 175lbs to 192lbs completely natural and stacked to the ****in hilt with muscle and asked several times for the last 5 years if I do steroids without ever giving that idea any thought and actually quite annoyed at the fact that earning every ounce of muscle on my body naturally and 95% without even a damn amino acid supplement or pre workout or even fancy meal because I spent 8 years in prison where they don't sell none of that **** and underfeed you and you gotta make your own meals out of dehydrated refried beans and ramen soups, I was and still am pretty ****in proud that I gained and broke through all those barriers and plateu's the last 10 years to be out on the streets and be asked those questions


and honestly having no respect for people that juiced or used any kind of dietary supplement to further their physical being because I felt it was cheating and finally decided the last 8 months that ive reached somewhat of another barrier and though I could probably push it a little further, I honestly just wanted to try a few cycles here and there to see where I can really take this hype to, but not at the idea of losing anything I earned naturally and never being able to gain back, ive watched some of my partners who juiced for years go from being 265lb monsters to 225lbs and

never able to get back to that size without the use of aas's and I don't plan on that.. anyways im rambling now just felt like letting everyone know where im at, how I was starting to feel from the feedback I been receiving lately and if yall wanna be my "bro" and see my smash out more accomplishments and aid me in doing so well no one is getting hurt of course and to have me at your side to aid in the same idea, then im always here. to the rest I still love ya, and appreciate everything, life is blessing, being pissed off, ungrateful, holding grudges? that's all for the weak. im just trying to lift a little weight, and look and feel good well im doing it, as well as benefit my everyday life from it as well wether it be self defense, work, sports, whatever, its what I train for everyday. not just to look good, but to feel good and be able to apply it.
 
At the end of the day your decisions are your own. Just watch your health and everything. And that is great and smart that you have been getting lab tests to check the organs my dude.
 
homie do what you feel I'm you got bloods and we're fine I'm sure we been I'm alot worse situations I don't even know what pct is but at my age it don't matter I Always want to be so big people think I just came home. You know what I mean
 
I know what you mean mixed up your definitlety living a slightly different direction to me, but who knows I may be doing your plan run day just running for life, ive actually thought about when I get about 50ish that im just gonna stock pile and run til im 70 or 80 lol and thanks nbshazeezee
that's what its all about bro wether someone is with you or against or thinks their with you but is working against you its your individual decision. love & respect always
 
KilaCali said:
I know what you mean mixed up your definitlety living a slightly different direction to me, but who knows I may be doing your plan run day just running for life, ive actually thought about when I get about 50ish that im just gonna stock pile and run til im 70 or 80 lol and thanks nbshazeezee
that's what its all about bro wether someone is with you or against or thinks their with you but is working against you its your individual decision. love & respect always
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Well you are also younger I'm in 40s and have 3 kids I qualify for trt if I ever want to go on it my endocrinologist would prescribe
 
Hell yea, definitely bro, and still new to the world if pros and anabolics so im just slowly getting my feet wet, experimenting with ideas and researching them several times over before moving on to other idea's before I find what suits me perfectly at this present time and my lifestyle ya know? not trying to go all crazy just yet, and definitely not running into **** without knowledge of all the possibility's good and bad but im thinking when I do decide to pin I'm gonna run sust250 twice a week, with dbol but im trying to figure out if it has a long enough half life I can run EOD but from what im seeing you gotta pin every day to multiple times a day at 25-50mgs on the light side, any ideas from experience??
 
Now your talking the dbol right? cause im for sure doing the sust I figure Monday and Thursday would be my plan with an initial front load of 600mg to start but the dbol im trying to figure that one out and figure id run it about 6 weeks to get the maximum effects.. but ive been seeing conflicting ideas, tests etc..
 
Volvo140G said:
Take dbol daily
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Thanks for the input bro
JUST for EVERYONES benefit if im not actually commited and haven't stated I have decided to do this, then its all PURE SPECULATION on my part, I in no way am promoting this, committing to it, I haven't even decided if ILL EVER PIN, I still hate needles, I hate the idea of open wounds on my body and causing that daily/weekly/monthly whatever it may be. there fore once again, I am purely speculating on all of this for the benefit of my own doubt, I find everything related to athletic sports/fitness/health/anatomy (particularly muscular/skeletal anatomy) and all aspects, not only do I spend most my day researching this aspect of alternative supplementation, but I also continue to educate myself on natural ways to longevity and staying **** diesel for as long as god will allow me to. thanks again ;) :grouphug:
 
Hell yea! that's what i'm talking about, I'm trying to figure out what PH most resembles it, also

I have been seeing a lot of actual Dianabol tabs on gear sites and so fourth, wondering if any are legit??? can anyone chime in on that or should I start a thread on it? lol
from what ive seen its relatively inexpensive to make, resources are easy to come by so supposedly you wouldn't expect a lot of fraudulent packages...
 
Several folks on another board preferred dimethabold (Celtic labs) to actual dbol, fwiw. Not tons of info on this new compound yet, but it looks promising.
 
whats fwiw ?? not familiar with all the text short talk lol, and which new compound are you referring to, the CL dimethabold? ive been checking a lot of logs and info on that as well and some seem to compare it more to dbol then m14add or dianadrol from celtic, Ive been very interested in obtaining the dianadrol, and will be trying m14add soon enough in the quad stack, but kinda of sucks cause 2 of the compounds I never tried in the quad stack so it wwill be a little hard to tell which ones are doing what, the m14-add and max lmg, then its got the dmz and msten, also even though its a stack im wondering if the doses will be high enough for the m14add being at 40 or 50mg and max lmg as well being at 40 or 50mg I believe, the msten is at 40 and dmz is at 50 which is the only one that looks kind of high, well msten as well I think? but looking forward to trying it out in a while... any experiences from anyone else, and wheres my good buddy Abelincoln been at?!?! hes one I think would know lol
 
Volvo140G said:
Fwiw = for what its worth
And yea, was referring to dimethabold
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oh ok, thanks for the lesson, and hasn't dimethabold been around for quite some time now by them?? ive read some older logs from last year and I think even older, and its been in the discussion with IF Diabolix, CL Dianadrol and M14-ADD for ph's closest to dbol... definitely interested in trying them all out separately, this damn ban kind of made some of that a little difficult, I don't think dimethabold was on the list though was it?? if Im correct it wasn't..
 
dbol is methandrostenolone
 
KilaCali said:
oh ok, thanks for the lesson, and hasn't dimethabold been around for quite some time now by them?? ive read some older logs from last year and I think even older, and its been in the discussion with IF Diabolix, CL Dianadrol and M14-ADD for ph's closest to dbol... definitely interested in trying them all out separately, this damn ban kind of made some of that a little difficult, I don't think dimethabold was on the list though was it?? if Im correct it wasn't..
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Personally and I've run both ran two bottles of dimethabold but m14add felt alot more like dbol I think 90mg of that was my sweet spot
 
HardEarned said:
dbol is methandrostenolone
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Yes Sir it is, I'm not sure if you were correcting me thinking I was hinting at ph forms, but I meant ph's closest to it, but I have been trying to find the actual dbol pills, ive seen some around but hard to tell if reputable sources or not.. and thanks for the feedback mixedup !! that helps a lot, your not the first or last to say that, did it happen to give you a lot of water retention and did it have this "dbol euphoria" they talk about it having??
 
KilaCali said:
Yes Sir it is, I'm not sure if you were correcting me thinking I was hinting at ph forms, but I meant ph's closest to it, but I have been trying to find the actual dbol pills, ive seen some around but hard to tell if reputable sources or not.. and thanks for the feedback mixedup !! that helps a lot, your not the first or last to say that, did it happen to give you a lot of water retention and did it have this "dbol euphoria" they talk about it having??
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The euphoria wasn't there which was what I was looking for some water but I run heavy ai doses and take xpel when I'm feeling bloated
 
KilaCali said:
Yes Sir it is, I'm not sure if you were correcting me thinking I was hinting at ph forms, but I meant ph's closest to it, but I have been trying to find the actual dbol pills, ive seen some around but hard to tell if reputable sources or not.. and thanks for the feedback mixedup !! that helps a lot, your not the first or last to say that, did it happen to give you a lot of water retention and did it have this "dbol euphoria" they talk about it having??
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Dbol does make you retain water! From what I understand; none of the PHs even come close to the real Dbol. Its all marketing gimics and stuff. The improved sense of well being is a myth pretty much. I think users report an improved sinse of well being because they see themselves getting bigger really fast and it makes them happy and confident. The alpha male feeling from the test is more noticeable to me!!!! But the pumps from DBOL are CRAZY. Probably the combo of test and dbol is what is giving me this crazy mental supremacy.

The dbol does make you put on crazy weight fast though. I'm up 15lbs as of yesterday and thats only 3.5 weeks! And my diet was no where near spot on! I'm loving it, however I do not advise Dbol without Test! Dbol without test might make you lethargic and no motivation and no sex drive and all that! The test makes you a sex GOD!
 
I think PH's are straight up lame compared to the real stuff. The real stuff has way less side effects and way way way better results
 
HardEarned said:
does make you retain water! From what I understand, none of the PHs even come close to the real Dbol. Its all marketing gimics and stuff. The improved sense of well being is a myth pretty much. I think users report an improved sinse of well being because they see themselfs getting bigger really fast and it makes them happy and confident. The alpha male feeling from the test is more noticeable to me!!!!

The dbol does make you put on crazy weight fast though. I'm up 15lbs as of yesterday and thats only 3.5 weeks! And my diet was no where near spot on
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Yea I was wondering how much water retention he had cause I know it causes bloat for a lot of people and retention im sure dose dependent, but ive heard from a lot of guys it has an anti-depressant like effect that no other drug has done, other then trest but unlike trest where its more of an aggressive kickass feeling the dbol gave the mmore of a relaxed everything is fine feeling.. how much dbol are you running and how often for how long? and im sure you did put on 15lbs! im sure half to 3 quarters is water but its still nice cause theres definitely solid gains in that once it falls off.
 
I was running 40mg a day. just bumped it up to 50mg a day. My ai is dosed pretty high so I think less than half is water! My strength is through the roof. I was bentover barbell rowing 295lbs like nothing the other day. IM doing pullups with a 70lb dumbbell in between my legs for high reps!

STrength is CRAZY!

That is why after the dbol stops (5 weeks) I still have 10 weeks of test e to go. This will help me harden up what I got and drop some water so that when i go into PCT, its easier to keep!!!!
 
HardEarned said:
I was running 40mg a day. just bumped it up to 50mg a day. My ai is dosed pretty high so I think less than half is water! My strength is through the roof. I was bentover barbell rowing 295lbs like nothing the other day. IM doing pullups with a 70lb dumbbell in between my legs for high reps!

STrength is CRAZY!

That is why after the dbol stops (5 weeks) I still have 10 weeks of test e to go. This will help me harden up what I got and drop some water so that when i go into PCT, its easier to keep!!!!
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That's awesome, and your dosing that once per day? and that's been my plan for sometime now is running the dbol for 4-6 weeks and finishing with another 4 on sust solo to keep from dropping gains drastically if any and solidify what I gain from it.
 
KilaCali said:
Well that's a given, which ph's have you run in the past??
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i never personally ran a PH. But i was right there every step of the way when my boy ran Hdrol and the original superdrol back in 2009. I was considering doing it and was in my research phase back then. I weighed only 155lbs and was not even that cut up. Thank God i went natty for as long as a did and thank god that I used the real gear when i decided to cross over. I'f im gonna mess with my HPTA, its gonna be for some legit **** that yields big gains, not no hdrol or nothin.

My friend gained 12lbs from the superdrol and kept 7. He gained 7lbs from the Hdrol and kept 4. So 4lbs fror 3 months of hard work and messing with your hormones and all that money... no thank you.


My dbol is dirt cheap, cheaper than any of the PH's out there. I cant name prices, But the support supplements and AI,s and HCG, and PCT stuff cost over double what my gear cost me. My gear is test e and dbol by the way, im gonna kick stop with epistane starting at week 8 and ending at week 14. Just so i can say I ran a PH. Plus epi is supposed to dry you out and harden you up. (spring break)
 
run the sust from week 1 with the dbol cuz it will take a few weeks for the sust to kick in. by the time it fully kicks in you will be getting off the dbol so it will be a smooth transition!

I dose 10mg dbol in the morning , 30mg dbol pre workout, and 10mg dbol at night.

some poeple dose it all pre workout, others take a dose every 4 hours because the halflife is 4 hours! Studdies show that whatever way you choose to dose, it doesnt really matter, results are similar. dosing heavy preworkout gives more strength supposedly, but dosing thoughout the day is supposed to be for growthn
 
HardEarned said:
i never personally ran a PH. But i was right there every step of the way when my boy ran Hdrol and the original superdrol back in 2009. I was considering doing it and was in my research phase back then. I weighed only 155lbs and was not even that cut up. Thank God i went natty for as long as a did and thank god that I used the real gear when i decided to cross over. I'f im gonna mess with my HPTA, its gonna be for some legit **** that yields big gains, not no hdrol or nothin.

My friend gained 12lbs from the superdrol and kept 7. He gained 7lbs from the Hdrol and kept 4. So 4lbs fror 3 months of hard work and messing with your hormones and all that money... no thank you.


My dbol is dirt cheap, cheaper than any of the PH's out there. I cant name prices, But the support supplements and AI,s and HCG, and PCT stuff cost over double what my gear cost me. My gear is test e and dbol by the way, im gonna kick stop with epistane starting at week 8 and ending at week 14. Just so i can say I ran a PH. Plus epi is supposed to dry you out and harden you up. (spring break)
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Sdrol and phEradroll I will put up against any thing 1test to those weren't ph they were just as that weren't commercially released and companies found a way to make a profit
 
yea i already planned on running the sust from anywhere of 8-10-12 weeks depending on how scaired i am of deeper shutdown which it probably wont make that much of a difference after week 1 your shutting down anyays from it, on top of throwing the dbol in for 4-6 weeks with it, im actually thinking about doing the sust with a ph before i do the dbol run just for the hell of it, possibly m14add, msten, something pretty potent as far as ph goes with some aromatizing effects who knows right now its all up in the air, but as far as ph's go i think everyone respnds differently as well like your boys gains, some people have drastic gains compared to that and don't lose but a pound or two so it was well worth it to some people, its all on the individual and what works for them and makes them happy in the end, i cant speak much on either right now, maybe a year or two down the road after trying different things i can actually voice an opinion on what i prefer and think is better, that's good ya get the gear for dirt cheap that seems like how it is anyways you end up spending more money on support supps AI's,Organ Health,SERMs,all that on cycle and post cycle **** is a pain in the ass but well worth it in the end.
 
mixedup said:
Sdrol and phEradroll I will put up against any thing 1test to those weren't ph they were just as that weren't commercially released and companies found a way to make a profit
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i could definitely see that, i know back when PH's were as good as the real thing seeing the dudes around me back in the early 2000 era dudes might as well have been pinning or not, dudes were gaining 15-20-25lbs off poppin pills in weeks to a months time, sucks that its gotten so over commercialized and so many bunks out there.. always ruins it for people that really appreciate ****
 
KilaCali said:
yea i already planned on running the sust from anywhere of 8-10-12 weeks depending on how scaired i am of deeper shutdown which it probably wont make that much of a difference after week 1 your shutting down anyays from it, on top of throwing the dbol in for 4-6 weeks with it, im actually thinking about doing the sust with a ph before i do the dbol run just for the hell of it, possibly m14add, msten, something pretty potent as far as ph goes with some aromatizing effects who knows right now its all up in the air, but as far as ph's go i think everyone respnds differently as well like your boys gains, some people have drastic gains compared to that and don't lose but a pound or two so it was well worth it to some people, its all on the individual and what works for them and makes them happy in the end, i cant speak much on either right now, maybe a year or two down the road after trying different things i can actually voice an opinion on what i prefer and think is better, that's good ya get the gear for dirt cheap that seems like how it is anyways you end up spending more money on support supps AI's,Organ Health,SERMs,all that on cycle and post cycle **** is a pain in the ass but well worth it in the end.
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you wont have to worry about a "deep shutdown" if you run HCG. I say go 12 weeks and run hcg starting in week 2 or 3, and run it until the last wek of the cycle before pct.

but seriously, why complicate things with something complex like sustanon? why not just run got old Test E or Test C with a dbol kickstart like me? The dbol will give you instant results and satisfaction, and by the time the dbol is about to thend the TEST is in FULL FORCE.

I think it woud be a mistake to run a PH wish high side effects as a kickstart AND THEN run dbol
 
mixedup said:
Hey I got new pics up did you two see them
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seen them. the belly fat is definately coming down while the rest of your body is starting to get real hard looking
congratz
 
HardEarned said:
you wont have to worry about a "deep shutdown" if you run HCG. I say go 12 weeks and run hcg starting in week 2 or 3, and run it until the last wek of the cycle before pct.

but seriously, why complicate things with something complex like sustanon? why not just run got old Test E or Test C with a dbol kickstart like me? The dbol will give you instant results and satisfaction, and by the time the dbol is about to thend the TEST is in FULL FORCE.

I think it woud be a mistake to run a PH wish high side effects as a kickstart AND THEN run dbol
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I get what your saying, but whos to say there will be high sides from the ph? nobody knows for a fact whats gonna happen to any one individual even if your a certified medical professional, to each their own bro, but I know what you mean, and I just prefer to get the best of different worlds wit hthe sustanon, maybe ill finish with some test E, or maybe ill start with test E and finish with sust, im still far from making up my mind lol
 
KilaCali said:
I get what your saying, but whos to say there will be high sides from the ph? nobody knows for a fact whats gonna happen to any one individual even if your a certified medical professional, to each their own bro, but I know what you mean, and I just prefer to get the best of different worlds wit hthe sustanon, maybe ill finish with some test E, or maybe ill start with test E and finish with sust, im still far from making up my mind lol
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i woiuldnt switch from test e to sust. maybe from sust to test e but why complicate things. you might as well just run test e with a tes p kickstart.

PH's are so new and honestly, as much as people, like the reps, like to claim they know everything about their hormone, they dont. This stuff is so new , the side effects are such are ultimately unknown. What about a few years when Phera Phlex was the shiz but then they found out that it enlarges the heart and now nobody messes with it!!! PH are altered chemicals of oldschool hormones. one small alteration can change the compound juristically and all its properties!

like superdrol. It is methylated masteron. but masteron will make you look a lot different that superdorl and they both got totally different sides.

if your looking into a lean bulk, why don't you consider like, test, masteron, with a winny kickstop(last 4 week 50mg intra muscular ed) and a tbol kickstart?
 
anadrol is pretty chill but you cant use an ai to block the estrogen, you HAVE to use a SERM like NOLVA or RALOX. (clomid wont work)

anadrol and dbol are pretty similar except anadrol increases aggression and sex drive more than dbol, to me dbol does nothing for sex drive or aggression (outside of the gym). but anadrol is supposed to be more liver toxic...
 
you might wanna look into turnibol too

oral turnibol is what halodrol was trying to immitate. similar to dbol is form with no conversion to estrogen and no water retension
 
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