First Test-E cycle.

Bigmatt57

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Started my first ever Test-E cycle two weeks ago. Today starts week 3. First time ever pinning. 400mg of Test-E weekly Monday and Thursday. Along with the test, I was given half a bottle of DHB (1-Testosterone). It’s 200mg/ML, so I’m just taking 200mg per week of the DHB for only 5 weeks. It was given to me so I thought might as well take it, especially because I’m recomping and know DHB is a good hardener. The post injection pain is truly unbelievable though. Taking 2 grams of Nac a day along with it because of the suppose “liver toxicity” DHB presents. I have also been taking .25 of Arimidex (Anastrozole) every other day. I’m around 10% body fat right and not trying to hold onto any water what so ever. I want to keep a peeled lean look. Not sure the point of this post. But what do you guys think? I’m definitely feeling the test kick in. It’s been 15 days since my first injection and the last 3-4 days everyday I’ve been waking up looking leaner, bigger and veiner. That could be the DHB as well.

Week 1-5 DHB 200mg
Week 1-12 Test-E 400mg
Week 1-12 Arimidex .25mg EOD
Week 14-16 Clomid 50/50/25/25
Week 14-16 Nolvadex 20/20/10/10

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24
5’7
165-170lbs
10-11%BF
 
Hyde

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DHB is about the biggest gun there is besides trestolone. I have heard it essentially said that it’s 4-5x as potent per mg than your traditional players like test, eq, mast, nandrolone. Alex Kikel said the guys he gives 6-800mg of Tren to, he would be using 2-300mg of DHB with, tops.

200mg is a fat dose. If you didn’t already start it 3 weeks ago, I would skip a shot and drop to 100mg a week and run it longer. If it’s built up fully, well, better just roll with it I suppose.
 
Bigmatt57

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DHB is about the biggest gun there is besides trestolone. I have heard it essentially said that it’s 4-5x as potent per mg than your traditional players like test, eq, mast, nandrolone. Alex Kikel said the guys he gives 6-800mg of Tren to, he would be using 2-300mg of DHB with, tops.

200mg is a fat dose. If you didn’t already start it 3 weeks ago, I would skip a shot and drop to 100mg a week and run it longer. If it’s built up fully, well, better just roll with it I suppose.
I’ve shot the DHB three times, each time 100mg. Do you think it would be beneficial to maybe drop the DHB to 100mg (50mg Monday and Thursday) and have 6 more weeks of 100mg a week. Or I could always just stick to 200mg a week and pick up another vial in 3 weeks when it runs out.
 
Hyde

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I’ve shot the DHB three times, each time 100mg. Do you think it would be beneficial to maybe drop the DHB to 100mg (50mg Monday and Thursday) and have 6 more weeks of 100mg a week. Or I could always just stick to 200mg a week and pick up another vial in 3 weeks when it runs out.
I think you should skip the next shot of it to let levels drop a little then move to 50mg twice a week like you suggested to get it down to 100mg per week - or even just do 100mg once a week. It’s cypionate ester and doesn’t aromatize, so it’s not like you need to split it into 2 shots a week. And oil volume isn’t a consideration here either. “Oh man, can’t handle that enormous 0.5cc of oil in one shot”

It’s one of the big 3 advanced compounds (Trest, Tren, DHB). I would keep the dose low as possible now so you can still benefit better from other milder compounds now. DHB is more like what you add when you can’t keep driving up other things reasonably.
 
Bigmatt57

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I think you should skip the next shot of it to let levels drop a little then move to 50mg twice a week like you suggested to get it down to 100mg per week - or even just do 100mg once a week. It’s cypionate ester and doesn’t aromatize, so it’s not like you need to split it into 2 shots a week. And oil volume isn’t a consideration here either. “Oh man, can’t handle that enormous 0.5cc of oil in one shot”

It’s one of the big 3 advanced compounds (Trest, Tren, DHB). I would keep the dose low as possible now so you can still benefit better from other milder compounds now. DHB is more like what you add when you can’t keep driving up other things reasonably.
Being 100% honest I didn’t even know what DHB was before a couple weeks ago. Not really talked about on here. Obviously I did my research before taking it from my buddy. I think I read just about every article/forum post on it. (Which there really isn’t much). Not doubting you whatsoever cause you’ve taken it before and clearly know more than me. But I could really benefit from only 100mg a week? I just keep reading that the average dose is 400-600mg. I’m told that what I’m taking 200mg is a baby dose. But hey if I could only take 100mg and get great results I’m all in!

Also to think I’ve never taken any anabolic like DHB. Sure I’ve ran DMZ,epistane,Msten,M1A, etc. But I’m sure those 400-600mg dosage claims are for guys that you know, have already taken all the strongest stuff such as tren, etc. So maybe 100mg could benefit a 170lb guy like me with some DS cycles under his belt, but has never really touched any of the “real” stuff.
 
Hyde

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Being 100% honest I didn’t even know what DHB was before a couple weeks ago. Not really talked about on here. Obviously I did my research before taking it from my buddy. I think I read just about every article/forum post on it. (Which there really isn’t much). Not doubting you whatsoever cause you’ve taken it before and clearly know more than me. But I could really benefit from only 100mg a week? I just keep reading that the average dose is 400-600mg. I’m told that what I’m taking 200mg is a baby dose. But hey if I could only take 100mg and get great results I’m all in!

Also to think I’ve never taken any anabolic like DHB. Sure I’ve ran DMZ,epistane,Msten,M1A, etc. But I’m sure those 400-600mg dosage claims are for guys that you know, have already taken all the strongest stuff such as tren, etc. So maybe 100mg could benefit a 170lb guy like me with some DS cycles under his belt, but has never really touched any of the “real” stuff.
Exactly - look at what you just wrote:

Just finished my workout, I’ve been working out for 11 years now. I’ve never looked so insane in a workout. This is kicking in FAST!
I cycled for over 8 years before injecting, waiting foolishly until I could barley gain anything new every time I would run a longer and harder oral cycle. When I used just 300mg of test and 20-30mg Pheraplex, I blew up like the strongest oral run I had ever did and felt much better in every way.

Run 100mg DHB now so you can use 200mg in a couple years when you need it more. I mean you could take 400 Tren now, but if 200mg worked why would you go higher now? You can only grow as fast as you can; after that point all the extra drugs are just wasted and become extra stress.

DHB greatly increases insulin sensitivity. Broderick Chavez said he uses it as low as 20mg per week in some athletes to drive hunger to get more food in. Use it to keep the clean carbs high and let the surplus of rice & potatoes fuel some serious muscle-building training!
 
Mathb33

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I think you should skip the next shot of it to let levels drop a little then move to 50mg twice a week like you suggested to get it down to 100mg per week - or even just do 100mg once a week. It’s cypionate ester and doesn’t aromatize, so it’s not like you need to split it into 2 shots a week. And oil volume isn’t a consideration here either. “Oh man, can’t handle that enormous 0.5cc of oil in one shot”

It’s one of the big 3 advanced compounds (Trest, Tren, DHB). I would keep the dose low as possible now so you can still benefit better from other milder compounds now. DHB is more like what you add when you can’t keep driving up other things reasonably.
Am i mixing compounds when I read this bro? You’re like the first ever person I see talk that positive about dhb... pretty much all I hear is, horrible pip, nothing special compared to other stuff and not worth it?? Am I miss informed lol.
 
Bigmatt57

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Am i mixing compounds when I read this bro? You’re like the first ever person I see talk that positive about dhb... pretty much all I hear is, horrible pip, nothing special compared to other stuff and not worth it?? Am I miss informed lol.
I’ve heard a lot of bad things on it, you hear a lot of people claim that it’s a “liver toxic” injectable but there doesn’t seem to be much information out there to back up that claim. It also seems that for most people the only negative side effect is just the painful PIP. There isn’t many logs or people even talking about DHB online in general, but from my circle of friends everyone seems to love it. Great strength, great hardener, increased vascularity, etc. Just gotta deal with the fact your ass feels someone hammered a nail in it 24/7.
 
Mathb33

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I’ve heard a lot of bad things on it, you hear a lot of people claim that it’s a “liver toxic” injectable but there doesn’t seem to be much information out there to back up that claim. It also seems that for most people the only negative side effect is just the painful PIP. There isn’t many logs or people even talking about DHB online in general, but from my circle of friends everyone seems to love it. Great strength, great hardener, increased vascularity, etc. Just gotta deal with the fact your ass feels someone hammered a nail in it 24/7.
Yeah I have the same infos from you form my circle... strength, great hardener etc.. but hyde is saying it’s on par with nandrolone to build muscle... tren etc? That’s a bit pushing it imo.
 
khall1974

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Dhb shot my liver values up 4x my normal when on cycle...just keep an eye out. I was on 500mg for 4 weeks and the pip was insane.
 
khall1974

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Wow, that’s definitely scary to hear!
Just keep an eye out. I knew something was up when I was fatigue all the time. Thought my E2 was up and had bloods done. It took about 3 weeks for my levels to return.
 
Hyde

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Yeah I have the same infos from you form my circle... strength, great hardener etc.. but hyde is saying it’s on par with nandrolone to build muscle... tren etc? That’s a bit pushing it imo.
I’ve only put it in my ass for 2 weeks to replace masteron very end of last meet prep. So I really can’t contribute any legitimate anecdotal feedback, beyond the pip is manageable but you will feel it and need to do tissue work on the depot.

ALLEGEDLY it is very anabolic per mg, it increases insulin sensitivity even more than basically any other DHT compound already dose, and the neurological upregulation (strength, learning, cognition) is more extreme than any other. Broderick Chavez was saying it’s big in throwing circles for the skill learning and to help drive hunger to eat more (most throwers are huge), it’s everywhere in professional chess, it’s getting big in electronic gaming, and of course it’s big in strongman for the biggest guys because of all the things it does (max anabolism, managing blood glucose, driving hunger, learning technique on the myriad events you must compete in, being powerful AF).

Honestly, the big takeaway was it is you can use it as a strength & size drug, but it’s really kinda specific use cases. A bodybuilder in shape is probably not going to need it unless he’s kinda maxed out his gear stack. He shouldn’t particularly need more insulin sensitivity or hunger (compared to a higher bodyfat individual, and hunger alone can be had with peptides), max power isn’t necessary, there are better show hardeners, you don’t need maximal technique acquisition just to use a plate-loaded machine you aren’t getting judged on form, like in a strength comp.
 
Hyde

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Yeah I have the same infos from you form my circle... strength, great hardener etc.. but hyde is saying it’s on par with nandrolone to build muscle... tren etc? That’s a bit pushing it imo.
I’ve only put it in my ass for 2 weeks to replace masteron very end of last meet prep. So I really can’t contribute any legitimate anecdotal feedback, beyond the pip is manageable but you will feel it and need to do tissue work on the depot.

ALLEGEDLY it is very anabolic per mg, it increases insulin sensitivity even more than basically any other DHT compound already dose, and the neurological upregulation (strength, learning, cognition) is more extreme than any other. Broderick Chavez was saying it’s big in throwing circles for the skill learning and to help drive hunger to eat more (most throwers are huge), it’s everywhere in professional chess, it’s getting big in electronic gaming, and of course it’s big in strongman for the biggest guys because of all the things it does (max anabolism, managing blood glucose, driving hunger, learning technique on the myriad events you must compete in, being powerful AF).

Honestly, the big takeaway was it is you can use it as a strength & size drug, but it’s really kinda specific use cases. A bodybuilder in shape is probably not going to need it unless he’s kinda maxed out his gear stack. He shouldn’t particularly need more insulin sensitivity or hunger (compared to a higher bodyfat individual, and hunger alone can be had with peptides), max power isn’t necessary, there are better show hardeners, you don’t need maximal technique acquisition just to use a plate-loaded machine you aren’t getting judged on form, like in a strength comp.
 
Mathb33

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I’ve only put it in my ass for 2 weeks to replace masteron very end of last meet prep. So I really can’t contribute any legitimate anecdotal feedback, beyond the pip is manageable but you will feel it and need to do tissue work on the depot.

ALLEGEDLY it is very anabolic per mg, it increases insulin sensitivity even more than basically any other DHT compound already dose, and the neurological upregulation (strength, learning, cognition) is more extreme than any other. Broderick Chavez was saying it’s big in throwing circles for the skill learning and to help drive hunger to eat more (most throwers are huge), it’s everywhere in professional chess, it’s getting big in electronic gaming, and of course it’s big in strongman for the biggest guys because of all the things it does (max anabolism, managing blood glucose, driving hunger, learning technique on the myriad events you must compete in, being powerful AF).

Honestly, the big takeaway was it is you can use it as a strength & size drug, but it’s really kinda specific use cases. A bodybuilder in shape is probably not going to need it unless he’s kinda maxed out his gear stack. He shouldn’t particularly need more insulin sensitivity or hunger (compared to a higher bodyfat individual, and hunger alone can be had with peptides), max power isn’t necessary, there are better show hardeners, you don’t need maximal technique acquisition just to use a plate-loaded machine you aren’t getting judged on form, like in a strength comp.
That makes sense! So I guess dhb could be a good add on low dose mid cycle to keep pushing / break plateaus according to the way you speak about it
 
KvanH

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Never thought of AAS use to improve cognitive function. I'm intrigued.
 
Bigmatt57

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It’s 2am right now, just woke up to take a piss, and noticed massive veins in my thigh. WTF, even at much lower body fat percentages I never ever in my life had any kind of leg veins. Today was my last shot of week 3. Getting leaner, bigger and fuller every single day.
 
Bigmatt57

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Woke up last night, shirt covered in sweat. Which I’ve had happen before running PED’s. Just thought I’d share.
 

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I thought about trying dhb but after doing research a lot of feedback says it's lack luster and doesn't live up to the hype even around 500mg a week
 
Hyde

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Lawl, for real? Chess players and gamers use it?

Sounds crazy at first, but not when you consider there is much more money in chess than there will ever be in bodybuilding or strength sport, and I believe the same for Esports.
 
Jinsun

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Sounds crazy at first, but not when you consider there is much more money in chess than there will ever be in bodybuilding or strength sport, and I believe the same for Esports.
Yeah, off course. I wasnt even ... Was thinking about the cognitive gains, are they really worth it? Do you have any links to that, as I'm really interested ...
 
Hyde

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Yeah, off course. I wasnt even ... Was thinking about the cognitive gains, are they really worth it? Do you have any links to that, as I'm really interested ...
I have 0 credible sources to share. It came up on the “DHT Roundtable” episode of Beast Fitness Radio in passing towards the end (an awesome listen), and both Broderick Chavez & Andrew Triana seemed to be aware of it. I have met Andy several times because he often has athletes at the world-level strongman competitions (himself being one as well), and he has always seemed extremely knowledgeable, especially considering how young he is.
 

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now I'm tempted to run a cycle of it while playing some games to see if it helps my skill acquisition. Would be sick to get better at smash bros by running gear! Would also be cool to run while working on movies or learning a new sport. Gives you a competitive edge.
 
Hyde

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now I'm tempted to run a cycle of it while playing some games to see if it helps my skill acquisition. Would be sick to get better at smash bros by running gear! Would also be cool to run while working on movies or learning a new sport. Gives you a competitive edge.
10mg Noopept, choline source like 600mg Alpha GPC, 5g Creatine mono pre desired event you want increased skill acquisition & neuro plasticity a couple times a week.

I believe that protocol, along with gaining about 5kg, helped me raise my raw competition squat 25kg from one meet to the next last year. And this is after about a decade of squatting already, no newbie gains.
 
KvanH

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10mg Noopept, choline source like 600mg Alpha GPC, 5g Creatine mono pre desired event you want increased skill acquisition & neuro plasticity a couple times a week.

I believe that protocol, along with gaining about 5kg, helped me raise my raw competition squat 25kg from one meet to the next last year. And this is after about a decade of squatting already, no newbie gains.
I feel like Alpha GPC raises power output signaling (maybe not the right term) temporarily from the first dose.
 

SaucyCurls

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10mg Noopept, choline source like 600mg Alpha GPC, 5g Creatine mono pre desired event you want increased skill acquisition & neuro plasticity a couple times a week.

I believe that protocol, along with gaining about 5kg, helped me raise my raw competition squat 25kg from one meet to the next last year. And this is after about a decade of squatting already, no newbie gains.
I'm a newbie so I'm gonna have to spend a bit figuring out what all that is haha
 
Jinsun

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10mg Noopept, choline source like 600mg Alpha GPC, 5g Creatine mono pre desired event you want increased skill acquisition & neuro plasticity a couple times a week.

I believe that protocol, along with gaining about 5kg, helped me raise my raw competition squat 25kg from one meet to the next last year. And this is after about a decade of squatting already, no newbie gains.
No racetams?
 

BBiceps

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I have 2 bottles of DHB sitting in my cabinet that I haven’t decided if I’m going to use or not. I have done a lot of research but reading what @Hyde is saying makes me want to use it fairly soon... How long did you say you felt it kicking in @Hyde?
 
KvanH

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I have 2 bottles of DHB sitting in my cabinet that I haven’t decided if I’m going to use or not. I have done a lot of research but reading what @Hyde is saying makes me want to use it fairly soon... How long did you say you felt it kicking in @Hyde?
Maybe add it a few weeks before attempting the 600 dl = )
 
Hyde

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I have 2 bottles of DHB sitting in my cabinet that I haven’t decided if I’m going to use or not. I have done a lot of research but reading what @Hyde is saying makes me want to use it fairly soon... How long did you say you felt it kicking in @Hyde?
Maybe add it a few weeks before attempting the 600 dl = )
I only used it 2 weeks to fill the syringe, so to speak. I can only comment on PIP, which is very real but manageable with self tissue work.

I would say that @KvanH’s plan isn’t the worst idea. 4-6 weeks even should, on paper, be enough time to realize some great strength peaking. Longer obviously if using it more for general hypertrophy I would think.
 
Bigmatt57

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Last night during my typical injection I had quite a scary moment. Once my needle is in my glute the feeling just felt different. Hard to explain but I could just feel the oil going inside me and it sorta hurt. After I pull out the needle a stream of blood comes out running from my upper glute to my upper rear thigh. I didn’t have a coughing fit. Got a little urge to cough maybe coughed once or twice. But I was pretty freaked out. Definitely nicked a vein, maybe even injected straight into it. I didn’t aspirate, I’ve heard nurses are no longer told it’s Necessary. Don’t want to turn this forum into war. Will definitely start aspirating now with every shot though.

It’s now the next morning, there isn’t any bruising on my glute. Just looks like a typical injection site. I feel fine, no test flu or breathing difficulties.
 

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Last night during my typical injection I had quite a scary moment. Once my needle is in my glute the feeling just felt different. Hard to explain but I could just feel the oil going inside me and it sorta hurt. After I pull out the needle a stream of blood comes out running from my upper glute to my upper rear thigh. I didn’t have a coughing fit. Got a little urge to cough maybe coughed once or twice. But I was pretty freaked out. Definitely nicked a vein, maybe even injected straight into it. I didn’t aspirate, I’ve heard nurses are no longer told it’s Necessary. Don’t want to turn this forum into war. Will definitely start aspirating now with every shot though.

It’s now the next morning, there isn’t any bruising on my glute. Just looks like a typical injection site. I feel fine, no test flu or breathing difficulties.
I have major issues with injecting in my glute, whatever I do it either hurt or gets bruised after, so I use my delts the most, rarely hurts or get bruised, not even after a 3cc shot. Try it, it might work better for you as well.
 
Hyde

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Nicking a vein is common and no big deal. And supposedly actually injecting into one is pretty difficult (by accident) due to the pressure you’d have to fight. Just always good to have a swab or tissue ready if she starts bleeding on you on removal!
 
Bigmatt57

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So, I got my hands on two vials of Tren-E 300/ml 10ml vials. My buddy had some vials leftover and offered me them for a very low price. So it was a no brainer and I purchased them. Not necessarily using it in this cycle. Just purchased for potential future use. What do you guys think? Start 300mg a week a few weeks after I finish the DHB? What would you guys do? Run it and see I feel or save it for future use?

Really don’t wanna seem like that guy you always see on here that posts “First cycle running tren” and get roasted. This is my first pin cycle but I have ran almost every PH/DS under the sun. Before I would ever even think about taking the Tren I would make sure I know absolutely everything about it, get blood work and have Caber on deck. Just solely looking for opinions.
 
Hyde

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Nope. See my very first initial advice. What are you going to pin in 5 years? Gonna add some primo?

If something works for now don’t sidestep it for harder drugs and cycles. You will need them down the road and you won’t have any big guns left. I mean why not wait even 2 more cycles? The vials will stay good for years likely.
 
KvanH

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Regarding the Tren. Let's back up just a week:
It’s 2am right now, just woke up to take a piss, and noticed massive veins in my thigh. WTF, even at much lower body fat percentages I never ever in my life had any kind of leg veins. Today was my last shot of week 3. Getting leaner, bigger and fuller every single day.
Don't get greedy mate, enjoy what you have going. And what Hyde said - Keep it in the bank for future, so you have a tool to up the ante when there's a demand for it.
 
Bigmatt57

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Ya you guys are absolutely right! It’s only been 26 days since my first injection, the test really still hasn’t even kicked in yet that much in terms of muscle building me. Definitely getting to greedy. Just gotta take a step back.
 
BennyMagoo79

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Nope. See my very first initial advice. What are you going to pin in 5 years? Gonna add some primo?

If something works for now don’t sidestep it for harder drugs and cycles. You will need them down the road and you won’t have any big guns left. I mean why not wait even 2 more cycles? The vials will stay good for years likely.
Ya you guys are absolutely right! It’s only been 26 days since my first injection, the test really still hasn’t even kicked in yet that much in terms of muscle building me. Definitely getting to greedy. Just gotta take a step back.
If I might add to this, when you run tren, I'd suggest starting at 200mg/week. Recently ran this and definitely not keen for any more - sides are pretty extreme.
 
Smont

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I don't know jack about dhb but I do know someone using it right now, last time he used it at 50mg eod and this time he's only using it at 25mg eod and he seems to think you won't ever need more then 200 per week. This is coming from a guy that's bigger and stronger then 99% of the regular gym rats and has been using gear for almost 20 years so take that for what it's worth
 
Bigmatt57

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Update: the Injection spot that hit the vein is starting to bruise up a little bit. About the size of a quarter. Not to dark, just a light brownish bruise.
 
Jinsun

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Update: the Injection spot that hit the vein is starting to bruise up a little bit. About the size of a quarter. Not to dark, just a light brownish bruise.
It would be weird if it didnt tbh. That's just the blood from the hemorrhage, for the short time before it stoped after the pin. Sry if this is obvious to you. Just sayin.
 
Bigmatt57

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Noticed it looks like I’m starting to hold on to a little bit more water than I would like. Plus my gyno I alredy have in my left nipple (not visible just feel able) is starting to get a little sore. Do you think I should start taking the Arimidex 0.25 everyday? Or maybe .50 EOD.
 
Jinsun

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Noticed it looks like I’m starting to hold on to a little bit more water than I would like. Plus my gyno I alredy have in my left nipple (not visible just feel able) is starting to get a little sore. Do you think I should start taking the Arimidex 0.25 everyday? Or maybe .50 EOD.
Well, you have two choices. You can take an Ai or a SERM. Or add mast. If your e2 is high, above, idk, 55, ... I would take an Ai, if not, I would take a serm. Is test all that you're taking? Or is dhb still in the game? The more dht's you have, the more estrogen you need, as it's neuro protective.
 
Smont

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In the future pin smaller doses daily or eod at most, regardless of ester. It helps me with estrogen and I've seen a lot of ppl say it helps them as well. If you switched to that now it might help but seeing how the sides are already present it may take a while that route
 
Whisky

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Just catching up on the thread bro. A squirter happens every now and again. Had maybe two over 3 years but it’s a bit fucked when it does tbf. Just one of them things. nothing to worry about

on the cognitive, I’ve also heard Derek MPMD refer to this but I’ve not looked into it. For skill acquisition i had previously considered getting a halo 2 (i might still get one). Allegedly used by alot of top sports teams etc and seemingly good science behind it.....

 

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