First PH cycle, seem okay?

[Pumposauras]

I am a 21 year old considering trying out probormones for the first time. Have already posted a forum once and multiple users have told me to focus on diet and stay natty for a few years. I’ve been seriously lifting for about 3 years now, but results are not to my liking. I eat about 3,000 calories a day and definitely try loading up on protein and carbs. Take a daily multivatamin, whey, preworkout, creatine monohydrate, and mass gainer. I graduated high school at about 160 pounds soaking wet... have worked my ass off to get to 185 this past winter, but am down to 173 after I got surgery to remove my tonsils and ate minimal calories and no exercise for 2 weeks, just last month. I do feel that I lift more than I look like I can, very knowledgeable about lifting, but not prohormones. All knowledge has come from online forums and reviews. I am hoping to do a heavy bulk. Have not done blood work yet because still debating taking a PH. It’s not something I really want to do knowing there are permanent health risks, but very frustrating seeing other guys in the gym my age, who clearly cycle, and honestly I can lift just as much as them, but my body doesn’t look as good as theirs at all! Still considering staying natty but was looking for suggestions about the hypothetical cycle I could take in the future if I decide to go for it. Was going to run the standard 30 day cycle of Andro The Giant by Hard Rock Supplements... 110 mg pills of 4-Andro, 3 times per day. Am not sure what a great estrogen blocker or PCT is for this... thanks for suggestions/advice

 

[Pumposauras]

Forgot to mention I am 6’2”... so the weights are not ideal at this height haha

 

[DemntedCowboy]

I think you should listen to those other members that gave you solid advise before. Your 21. Eat right, and lift heavy things

 

[nasrenegade]

Op, read this thread. It's relevant to you.

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/steroids/306485-best-ph-weight.html

 

[LeanEngineer]

I think you should listen to those other members that gave you solid advise before. Your 21. Eat right, and lift heavy things

Agreed with this. The right diet and training should yield nice results at your age.

 

[YoungThor]

Yeah I can’t recommend a PH considering I haven’t done one myself and they don’t interest me, but I will say I agree that it’s a little early to get started. I’m 26 and I still debate with myself whether it’s too early to mess with my hormones (tried some sarms already but with little success). But look at what your saying from a different perspective. The fact that you’re as strong or stronger than these bigger guys should give you a source of quiet confidence, rather than frustrate you. They paid good money and put their health at risk to look that way, but you have the option of getting there naturally, so long as you remain patient and accept the fact that building a good physique takes a very long time without drugs. Also, 3,000 calories probably is a few hundred less than what you should be eating. You’re tall and you’re probably a hard gainer so add in an extra thousand and lift heavy.

 

[YoungThor]

Oh, and be honest with yourself. Do you think you’re going to run one PH cycle and look as big as these more advanced gear users? Well, you won’t. You’ll just start planning another cycle. It’s never one and done. Even when you’re as big as your peers, will you be satisfied then? I doubt it. You’ll make another physique goal and pick some new compounds to accomplish it. Everyone talks about blasting and cruising being a lifetime commitment because it obviously is, but running your first cycle often ends up being a lifetime commitment, or at least a very long one, because of the snowball effect. Some people can run a couple cycles in their early 20s and then give it up forever, but most just keep going. So think about long term goals as well.

 

[Mitch_310]

Oh, and be honest with yourself. Do you think you’re going to run one PH cycle and look as big as these more advanced gear users? Well, you won’t. You’ll just start planning another cycle. It’s never one and done. Even when you’re as big as your peers, will you be satisfied then? I doubt it. You’ll make another physique goal and pick some new compounds to accomplish it. Everyone talks about blasting and cruising being a lifetime commitment because it obviously is, but running your first cycle often ends up being a lifetime commitment, or at least a very long one, because of the snowball effect. Some people can run a couple cycles in their early 20s and then give it up forever, but most just keep going. So think about long term goals as well.

Take some advice from a dude around your age who has done 2-3 cycles consisting of PHs and sarms over the past year or so Thought “oh I would only do 1 PH cycle then stop”. It’s never one cycle. Blew up in size and strength with the andros, then tried dmz and blew up again (only to lose half the gains when coming off)then tried a sarms cycle over the course of over a year. Currently off now and plan on staying that way for a while. These things are addictive. You can train harder, eat more and put on zero bodyfat, and you can recover extremely fast. While I did go from extremely skinny to ripped. If I kept training naturally I would prob still look good. It’s expensive, and it messes with your hormones. (Have had my natural test totally zeroed our before). I plan on staying natural now for at least a very long time. Yeah I get sore now, yeah I can’t do as much volume. But I have to adjust accordingly to what I can handle at a natural level and train smarter as well as lock in my diet more to keep making progress. Will I Weightlifting is fun and I consider it a hobby. I’m starting to realize more and more you can still get pretty damn ripped and huge without taking anything. It just takes a lot longer.

Not to mention what sides you can get. Such as gyno (notorious for a ph).

 

[YoungThor]

Mitch_310 well put. I only actually finished one sarms cycle and got basically nothing out of it. I tried some other sarms and just said screw this and cut the cycle short. Now I’m in the same boat as you, I plan on being natty for a good while.

I also think drugs can take the fun out of an otherwise great hobby. Eventually, you feel like you need the drugs because lifting off cycle isn’t as fun and the progress is slow.

Taking shortcuts also loses you respect. This goes for everything, not just bodybuilding. For example, imagine someone has a great job that earns them a lot of money and someone asks, “How’d you get that job?” If he answers, “My dad is the boss,” do you think that will earn him a lot of respect? No. Now if he says, “I worked a ton of terrible jobs, got in at this company, worked my way up from the bottom, and after 15 years I was promoted to this position,” that’ll earn respect. This same thing goes for PED’s. That’s why PED users are notorious for lying. We all know you still have to eat clean and train hard but you get way better results when on drugs, and they come on extremely fast. If you take the years of hard work out of the process, suddenly it’s not so impressive.

 

[Mitch_310]

Mitch_310 well put. I only actually finished one sarms cycle and got basically nothing out of it. I tried some other sarms and just said screw this and cut the cycle short. Now I’m in the same boat as you, I plan on being natty for a good while.

I also think drugs can take the fun out of an otherwise great hobby. Eventually, you feel like you need the drugs because lifting off cycle isn’t as fun and the progress is slow.

Taking shortcuts also loses you respect. This goes for everything, not just bodybuilding. For example, imagine someone has a great job that earns them a lot of money and someone asks, “How’d you get that job?” If he answers, “My dad is the boss,” do you think that will earn him a lot of respect? No. Now if he says, “I worked a ton of terrible jobs, got in at this company, worked my way up from the bottom, and after 15 years I was promoted to this position,” that’ll earn respect. This same thing goes for PED’s. That’s why PED users are notorious for lying. We all know you still have to eat clean and train hard but you get way better results when on drugs, and they come on extremely fast. If you take the years of hard work out of the process, suddenly it’s not so impressive.

I agree for the most part. However, I don’t really consider it cheating. If someone takes something to look good and do it for themselves. Then I don’t think that there is anything wrong with that. PEDs aren’t good or bad. They are just a compound that illicits a certain response. Now, if someone uses it and claims natural and uses that to sell something. Or someone uses it in sports to get ahead for self gain. Then that is morally wrong.

I see what you’re coming from though. My friends knew I took things. And while I did make a remarkable transformation very fast and worked just as hard as a natural lifter. My friends always have to bring up “we know the work you put in. But that still isn’t natural” so you can lose some street cred for it. Never seen the point about lying about it though. PEDs seem to taboo and counterculture. Yet binge drinking on the weekends and smoking a ton of pot is ok. Just interesting to think about

 

[YoungThor]

I agree for the most part. However, I don’t really consider it cheating. If someone takes something to look good and do it for themselves. Then I don’t think that there is anything wrong with that. PEDs aren’t good or bad. They are just a compound that illicits a certain response. Now, if someone uses it and claims natural and uses that to sell something. Or someone uses it in sports to get ahead for self gain. Then that is morally wrong.

I see what you’re coming from though. My friends knew I took things. And while I did make a remarkable transformation very fast and worked just as hard as a natural lifter. My friends always have to bring up “we know the work you put in. But that still isn’t natural” so you can lose some street cred for it. Never seen the point about lying about it though. PEDs seem to taboo and counterculture. Yet binge drinking on the weekends and smoking a ton of pot is ok. Just interesting to think about

Yeah, drugs in general aren’t good or bad. There’s nothing wrong with a guy putting something potentially harmful into his body. It’s your body and you have the right to do as you please to it. I was just simply pointing out that the general public, and those in the fitness industry who have not crossed over to the “dark side” will not be as impressed by someone’s physique if they find out they have 12 cycles under their belt and have invested thousands of dollars into drugs so they can look that way. Ultimately, we got to do what makes us feel happy and good about ourselves though. Maybe the OP will have a better self-image if he does steroids, or maybe he’ll decide he should’ve just stayed natty. Time will tell.

 

[nasrenegade]

Much of society thinks creatine is a steroid, so whether or not they'd be impressed is the last of my worries, personally.

 

[YoungThor]

I want to add one last thing. Steroids add an extra mental stressor, that being that your bodybuilding efforts will no longer be on a constant upward trajectory. There will be many highs when you’re on cycle, then you’ll see a dip in strength and size when you come off, then you’ll hop back on, and this trend will continue. If you’re natty (and you don’t get injured or take a long break) your progress should always be going up. The OP is 21 so he has at least 20 years of natural improvement ahead of him so long as he stays consistent. But there’s reasons why I’m not interested in the powerful stuff like tren for example. One of them is that it has some absolutely insane cosmetic effects but these go away after the cycle. That dip could be tough mentally.

 

[YoungThor]

Much of society thinks creatine is a steroid, so whether or not they'd be impressed is the last of my worries, personally.

Yeah, it’s easy to say that, but I guarantee you’re bodybuilding efforts aren’t 100 percent for you. People notice your progress, you notice them notice, and then you feel a mild satisfaction. So you might be a bit of a renegade but if people found out you take drugs to look the way you do, and now instead of seeing you as healthy and strong they see you as vain, it’s be hard to be completely indifferent to everyone’s change of opinion. But maybe you really are a lone wolf out in society, like some Clint Eastwood character who doesn’t give a f*ck what anyone thinks.

And yes the general public is a bunch of misinformed sheep.

 

[nasrenegade]

You make a lot of assumptions blood. I wont go into detail, but I do me for me; I'm already married with kids, I don't need to impress anyone else. Lastly, my unfortunate reality is that I've looked way better natty than I have in the last year (when I started cycling), but that's ancient history.

Also, no one notices my progress. They tell me on the daily I'm getting smaller even though my arms up to 20"��