Misfit28
Well-known member
Invalid Link Removed
Donald Trump running for president
- Thread starter LiftWithDonuts
- Start date
Invalid Link Removed
ax1
Legend
Socialism, which is already part of the system, helps quite a bit.
Socialism is already here
We are 20 trillion in debt, my SS statement says the system is going broke and that Im only getting a lesser percentage than the current statement. We need to end socialism right away.
I wanna get rid of socialism, not accept it just because its here.
Government just wants people dependent on them to monopolize power.
Geoforce
Well-known member
Socialism, which is already part of the system, helps quite a bit.
Socialism is already here
A mixed market economy like we have is almost undoubtedly far superior to no government or all government systems. Their is a reason why this has essentially won out in developed countries.
Of course Ax is free to make up his mind to start a no government free market utopia, wonder why he won't do it?
Geoforce
Well-known member
Under your definition of socialism it has been here since the government was founded. Somehow we've become a beacon for opportunity, freedom, quality of life, etc. All despite this awful nasty government involvement that is keeping you down so much you have all this free time to post on the internet.
ax1
Legend
It would be alot more if government didnt keep printing money out of thin air devaluing my savings to bail out wall-street and falsely prop up the economy and also steal money from my earnings.
I dont give as much as I used to because I cant anymore. Obamacare even raised my insurance costs. I quit giving to beggars on the street after that happened to make up for it.
ax1
Legend
If socialism is so good, make it optional. People are free to buy in, and free to opt out. Where in 1776 did they pillage peoples income to pay for other people?
Government isnt keeping me down, its keeping me alive and strong. Im here to fight not like the millions that beg for government dependence.
ax1
Legend
He is an idiot. If he was the real deal he would be coming out to audit the fed and then finally get rid of the central banking system.
Geoforce
Well-known member
God forbid a nation tries to provide health care for its citizens. I forgot though if it wasn't for government doctors would work for free and see everyone because that makes sense because they took an oath. So your argument is that without government we'd have perfect health care because doctors and nurses would work for free.
In free market utopia if people don't freely give enough what happens to the disabled? What happens to those with special needs? You do realize most government has come about in existence because of inequalities created by a purely free market right? I can get on board with less government, being efficient, rethinking things. It's just this no government would be so amazing utopia that I have to laugh at.
Once again though I don't see these free market worshipping people creating their own non government society.
ax1
Legend
What is it with the obsession where liberals want to force everybody against their will to buy into their political ideology? At least Libertarians want to leave people alone.
Geoforce
Well-known member
ax1
Legend
There is no such thing as perfect health care. You cant force people to provide their services either. I guarantee there will be alot of free and especially cheaper and real affordable health care (patient directly to doctor, no bureaucracy in the middle) and most people in a developed society will be able to afford it for the most part.
People who are disabled still have it bad even with the current system. I remember there were vets laying on the street in front of the military base begging for help when they were giving free top of the line health care to illegal children that just crossed the border. Dont forget to cut costs vets were dying in basements with treatable injuries. Government care about green, not you.
Really, there is no reason to believe the planet is going to collapse without socialism, life is hard we all know that but you cant just steal other people's money and give it to others against their will. That is immoral.
ax1
Legend
First off, Im not a libertarian.
I think your slogan is "We love tyranny!"
Speaking of "own" country, this country is set up with 50 mini countries. The government has been diminishing state powers unfortunately and growing its illegal Federal powers and influence, but thats not the point.
I wouldnt have an issue with socialism should you give it as state rights rather than federal rights. Let the states compete with each other and give people options to choose their own better life path rather than just forcing socialist ideology and criminalizing opting out.
ax1
Legend
And forcing big government to steal my money to support your political ideology and criminalizing my own life path isnt self centered and completely selfish?
At least libertarians are stealing the money out of your check before you get it.
ax1
Legend
This isnt the 1800's anymore. Just because we want to give people freedoms and liberties to have their own free will doesnt mean kids are going to work in sweat shops. Its not going to happen.
ax1
Legend
Im staying here even if the ship sinks, that makes me a true patriot.
Being that Im not going anywhere, Ill be comfortable putting my vote where it matters and my money where people want to restore the Bill of Rights and Constitution.
Running from your problems is an act of coward, so sorry no Africa for me. Im here to defend the human rights of Americans.
ax1
Legend
Im a political atheist.
ax1
Legend
Ding dong...I wanted to vote for Bernie in NY a short while back.
ax1
Legend
No, I just dont blindly cling to any political ideology and I especially dont join political groups.
I can respect socialists, Im flexible. Im here arguing my points, but that doesnt exactly mean your dead wrong. I can compromise when it matters.
youngandfree
Well-known member
Michelle Obama's food deserts are a huge problem.
Misfit28
Well-known member
youngandfree
Well-known member
I've been behind a lady in checkout using her EBT card, talking on a Galaxy Note giant I Phone, buying a couple things. The cashier said " I see your back again:. Welfare lady mumbled someyhing, and didn't have enough on her card, so she told cashier to keep one item. Welfare lady said I'll be back tomorrow. As I walk to my car, welfare lady is getting into a Lexus IS that's can't be more than 2 or 3 years old, with shiny 20" chrome wheels on it.
ax1
Legend
I do believe its possible to be rich and not take advantage of those with less. The problem are humans in general, both poor, middle class and rich people take advantage of other people.
I think its best to judge on a case by case basis rather than putting down a group as a whole.
youngandfree
Well-known member
It depends on what your skewed definition of "take advantage of those with less" is.
ax1
Legend
Thats crazy.
Not far from me a gas station were giving like $100 cash for $150 in welfare transactions, most of this was so people can go out and buy drugs.
They got their azz.
Its unfortunate how people advantage the system. Id like to see some better screening rather than just wiping out assistance at this current stage.
ax1
Legend
Those taxes arent de-meaning the way the income tax is. A man who doesnt own their labor is a slave.
With other taxes we have more control on how and when we want to spend at least.
Im not for no taxes, just no income tax.
ax1
Legend
Damn Obama's, they have their harvesty non-gmo organic garden but are financed by the lords of Monsanto.
Geoforce
Well-known member
Calling BS here. Every far right person has some similar story. Remember Ronnie's welfare queen story that didn't actually happen? While it is possible and even probable that fraud exists in the system, this idea that the vast majority of people are somehow rich from this stuff just isn't based in reality. I teach in an impoverished district where almost 75% of children qualify for free and reduced lunches. I don't see any Lexus in our parking lots. Somehow everyone who is anti-government assistance has stood in line behind somebody buying something extremely expensive off of welfare or seen them get into something super nice.
You want to talk about fraud let's talk about the militaries over 1.5 trillon F-35.
ax1
Legend
At least they made something.
Real military fraud is Rumsfeld announcing the day before 9/11 that there is 2.3 trillion dollars missing and unaccounted and the next day the computer servers that would have enabled and audit get knocked out. Move on, nothing to see here, 2.3 trillion, oh well.
Geoforce
Well-known member
So your argument is that health care will be fine because it was in the past (long before technology and people living much much longer), but the inequalities of the past won't happen in pure free markets like they did in the past.
Essentially look to the past when it helps your argument and take your word it won't happen again? With 0 child labor laws and 0 gov't assistance what happens to the 7 year old who's parents pass away? He's going to work before starve? And big business has a real good track record with not exploiting cheap labor right?
thebigt
Legend
it is impossible to become filthy rich without taking advantage of those with less...even the bible makes mention of this--something about a rich man and a camel going thru the eye of a needle...then you have love of money...then you have jesus in the temple upturning the money lenders tables...the list is long.
show me a filthy rich person and I will show you someone who has taken advantage of others...kick em when their up, kick em when their down....
but to be fair, almost everyone jumps on an opportunity to take advantage...ever negotiated to buy a car from someone who really needs cash desperately?
Misfit28
Well-known member
What does that even mean?
youngandfree
Well-known member
Come down to the hood in VA and I'll point them out to you for hours.
ax1
Legend
Im telling you what happened, I used to go to that gas station. It was in my paper all detailed.
Ive met plenty of people in my lifetime that were on probation and still did drugs and passed the test. Cocaine and certain other drugs leaves your system pretty fast too. And yes, I know alot of people on welfare that do drugs and drink. Does the government judge drinkers btw?
Geoforce
Well-known member
If they are wealthy why would they be in the hood? Wouldn't they use all that sweet welfare cash to find better dwellings. If you have to go to impoverished places to find examples of people getting wealthy from welfare you've already lost my man.
This idea that most welfare people are somehow better off than most working Americans isn't backed up by anything rational. Fraud undoubtedly exists, but let's not blow the problem out of proportion and act like most nice cars you see are because someone scammed welfare.
youngandfree
Well-known member
So now food deserts don't exist? There's been a lot of research on that topic, about to drive home and can't access it right now.
Getting right into my wheelhouse here.
The term Food desert is a joke in and of itself. Along with Social Justice. The people that coined those terms need to have their mama slapped.
ax1
Legend
This can all be addressed, no problem.
youngandfree
Well-known member
With your far left ideology, what is your definition of that phrase? It's a pretty concise question for such a knowledgeable person like yourself.
Misfit28
Well-known member
Oh really? I don't think you've ever really lived in or even seen a "hood".
Not surprised that you reject things that have been studied by experts, though.