does god exist

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DmitryWI said:
You cannot stand the thought of a God who loves no one in a way which is more special than any other, and so you create fiction about a God who only loves certain people for certain reasons. And you call these fictions "religion." For any thought that God loves one more than another is false--and any ritual which asks you to make the same statement is not a sacrament, but a sacrilege.
People will "make" God say whatever you need God to say in order to continue limiting each other, hurting each other, and killing each other in God's name.
People have invoked God's name, and waved God's flag, and carried crosses on your battlefields for centuries, all as proof that God love one people more than another, and would ask you to kill to prove it.
Yet, I tell you this; God's love is unlimited and unconditional.
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Dude I agree with pretty much everything you said but would just like to point out a few things. Yes it is true that god loves is unlimited and unconditional. He loves everyone. Gods love does NOT equal access to heaven though. This is were I think a lot of people get hung up. They think that if they are good they will go to heaven. That is a lie straight from hell. You can only escape hell two ways. The first would be to not sin. The second would be to accept Jesus as your personal Saviour. You CAN be a rapist, murderer, and thief and go to heaven while on the other hand a person can live a almost perfect life and go straight to hell. God set the bar at an unreachable level on purpose.
 
skunkman said:
Dude I agree with pretty much everything you said but would just like to point out a few things. Yes it is true that god loves is unlimited and unconditional. He loves everyone. Gods love does NOT equal access to heaven though. This is were I think a lot of people get hung up. They think that if they are good they will go to heaven. That is a lie straight from hell. You can only escape hell two ways. The first would be to not sin. The second would be to accept Jesus as your personal Saviour. You CAN be a rapist, murderer, and thief and go to heaven while on the other hand a person can live a almost perfect life and go straight to hell. God set the bar at an unreachable level on purpose.
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Yet another thing about religion that makes no sence!All that does is scare people into believing.You can't believe if you don't believe though.Saying you do would be lying and just trying to be on the safe side.Tell me this.If you're god and you have two people who have to be let into heaven or sent to hell.One has killed,rapped,lied,had pre marital sex,cheated on his wife,beat his wife,mollested his kid,but now he believes and accepts jesus as his saviour.Then yougot a guy who lived a great life and doesn't think god exists.Which one are you letting in?I can see someone thinking jesus exist and not accepting as his saviour,but not accepting cause he doesn't think he exist and being sent to hell is crazy talk!Poeple don't believe things all the time and theirs nothing wrong with that.To tell you the truth,if god would do something like that,I'd rather be in hell then to bless him with my presence!
 
pantera101 said:
Yet another thing about religion that makes no sence!All that does is scare people into believing.You can't believe if you don't believe though.Saying you do would be lying and just trying to be on the safe side.Tell me this.If you're god and you have two people who have to be let into heaven or sent to hell.One has killed,rapped,lied,had pre marital sex,cheated on his wife,beat his wife,mollested his kid,but now he believes and accepts jesus as his saviour.Then yougot a guy who lived a great life and doesn't think god exists.Which one are you letting in?I can see someone thinking jesus exist and not accepting as his saviour,but not accepting cause he doesn't think he exist and being sent to hell is crazy talk!Poeple don't believe things all the time and theirs nothing wrong with that.To tell you the truth,if god would do something like that,I'd rather be in hell then to bless him with my presence!
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this is one of the major flaws of christianity. acceptance to heaven is based on one distinct belief that in truth should have no bearing on the decision.
 
bryan4980 said:
When the government becomes unjust is is the responsibility of the people to revolt. Or something like that, I forget whose quote that was.
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"Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security." - Declaration of Independence.
 
pantera101 said:
Yet another thing about religion that makes no sence! All that does is scare people into believing. You can't believe if you don't believe though. Saying you do would be lying and just trying to be on the safe side.
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So you are really contradicting yourself in this statement...no? I as a Christian believe as a consequence of evidence found in a relationship with God as the Christ Jesus. That is why I believe. I believe I am not any more scared than anyone else.

I believe that if you sought, independently of mans flawed word, hypocritical, contradictory document called the Bible, or had a relationship with God as the Christ Jesus then you would believe but that is inherently incapable because you have insisted that He does not exist and or furthermore have not sought Him out because of your belief in and of other options. I am not discrediting that there of course is the possibility that there are other options. But in the case of God and Jesus the Christ you have already made up your mind and do not believe...yet...and or may never.
 
Wow, I've been away from this thread for a few days, and I have 10 pages to catch up on.

First, let me applaud and commend everyone who has politely shared their opinion from any standpoint.

Zero V: I applaud you for your faith, for your willingness to believe, and your passion for your religion. However, I agree with B5150 that in text, you do come across quite strongly in your arguments. And in the sake of not repeating anything already said over the past 10 pages, your refuting of science and the claims that you make about evolution versus creationism absolutely astound me. I apologize if the following statement offends, as it is not meant to, however, your argument against evolution smacks strongly of religious rhetoric as opposed to constructive disagreement. I am an engineer, a scientific kind of guy, yet I still believe in the existence of a God. Reference my earlier post (#31) for a better explanation of my stance.

B5150: You're insight into the situation from the standpoint of a firm believer who is unwilling to push their beliefs on another is not only refreshing, but has given me the desire to go back and read the bible again after a few of your quotes. And as posted earlier in this thread, I believe in God, I just don't believe that any specific religion is correct. Not saying I'm converting to any form of organized religion, I'm just interested in reading the bible now that I'm older.

To the rest of you guys Reaper329, pantera101, bryan4980, bassgod272, b unit, bigironkiller, and anyone else I've missed. It's been an informative thread, sharing viewpoints from all ends of the spectrum. And I don't know about you gentlemen, but I believe that I've learned a good bit from this thread and will leave it a more knowledgeable and thoughtful person.
 
pantera101 said:
Yet another thing about religion that makes no sence!All that does is scare people into believing.You can't believe if you don't believe though.Saying you do would be lying and just trying to be on the safe side.Tell me this.If you're god and you have two people who have to be let into heaven or sent to hell.One has killed,rapped,lied,had pre marital sex,cheated on his wife,beat his wife,mollested his kid,but now he believes and accepts jesus as his saviour.Then yougot a guy who lived a great life and doesn't think god exists.Which one are you letting in?I can see someone thinking jesus exist and not accepting as his saviour,but not accepting cause he doesn't think he exist and being sent to hell is crazy talk!Poeple don't believe things all the time and theirs nothing wrong with that.To tell you the truth,if god would do something like that,I'd rather be in hell then to bless him with my presence!
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One thing I forgot to mention which may or may not be obvious is the christians who commit easily avoidable sins over and over yet think they are going to heaven simply cause they believe the bible is true.Then they will tell a non believer they are going to hell.Again,if I'm god,I'm holding the person who believes to slightly higher standards than the non believer.Thats just a slap in the face of god everytime a believer does things like getting pi$$ faced drunk,pre marital sex,adultery,cussing,and any other sin that is easily avoidable by just not doing it and knowing that your saviour doesn't aprove of it.I'm not a christian and would never cheat on a gf or wife.Yet millions of believers do on a regular basis.They will say they are going to heaven and I'm not.Logically it should be the other way around.I'm honestly not scared of going to hell though if the bible turns out to be true.I don't think gay people should either.But the church goers who sin repeatedly for personal gain when knowing it's outright wrong when they "know" a god exist.............:twisted:
 
B5150 said:
So you are really contradicting yourself in this statement...no? I as a Christian believe as a consequence of evidence found in a relationship with God as the Christ Jesus. That is why I believe. I believe I am not any more scared than anyone else.

I believe that if you sought, independently of mans flawed word, hypocritical, contradictory document called the Bible, or had a relationship with God as the Christ Jesus then you would believe but that is inherently incapable because you have insisted that He does not exist and or furthermore have not sought Him out because of your belief in and of other options. I am not discrediting that there of course is the possibility that there are other options. But in the case of God and Jesus the Christ you have already made up your mind and do not believe...yet...and or may never.
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I don't see how thats contradicting anything.I'm saying they use hell as a tool to turn non believers into believers.The satanic bible said how the church should start giving credit to satan as he has had a tremedous impact in keeping christianity alive.I believe this too.As well as the thought of living after dying and meeting back up with old family memebers and other good things like that.My Dad didn't realy become a true chritian untill after his Dad died.My Mom told me that if I was right about religion then when I die I'm dead and thats it,but if I'm wrong I'm going to hell.She was basically telling me to believe just to be safe.Doesn't seem right to me.I don't think god would aprove of that.She also said how she can start asking questions too,but stops herself.

Like I said earlier,I used to be a christian,I went to church many times,I prayed before bed.Then I started questioning christiananity or god,which by the way is a sin.......I wonder why?could it be to scare people into not asking questions that will ultimately turn their beliefs into something much like mine?

Anyways It's been a long time since I prayed last,but I have while not believing.(now thats contradiction!)Just to give an example I might call god dude,or man,in my prayer.Lol!I have forgotten to say amen at the end and realised it afterwards.It's usually something like I'm sorry I don't believe you exist and all,and if you are there I am thankfull for everything you did for me and love you very much.I don't explain why I feel the way I do cause I figure he probably knows and understands.Maybe in the 1800's he wouldn't understand a non believer,but he's probably extatic right now that he still has any!
 
Nabisco said:
To the rest of you guys Reaper329, pantera101, bryan4980, bassgod272, b unit, bigironkiller, and anyone else I've missed. It's been an informative thread, sharing viewpoints from all ends of the spectrum. And I don't know about you gentlemen, but I believe that I've learned a good bit from this thread and will leave it a more knowledgeable and thoughtful person.
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Yeah man,I'm loving this thread!I'm so happy they didn't close it and that it's going well and civil like.
 
pantera101 said:
I don't see how thats contradicting anything.I'm saying they use hell as a tool to turn non believers into believers.
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Who are they?

Like I said earlier,I used to be a christian,I went to church many times,I prayed before bed.Then I started questioning christiananity or god,which by the way is a sin.......I wonder why?could it be to scare people into not asking questions that will ultimately turn their beliefs into something much like mine?
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That is no more than someone who goes to church, went to church many times and prayed before bed.
 
Nabisco said:
I am an engineer, a scientific kind of guy, yet I still believe in the existence of a God. Reference my earlier post (#31) for a better explanation of my stance.

B5150: You're insight into the situation from the standpoint of a firm believer who is unwilling to push their beliefs on another is not only refreshing, but has given me the desire to go back and read the bible again after a few of your quotes. And as posted earlier in this thread, I believe in God, I just don't believe that any specific religion is correct. Not saying I'm converting to any form of organized religion, I'm just interested in reading the bible now that I'm older.
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I am a blue collar quality engineer who considers himself a metrologist. I program CNC CMM's (coordinate measurement machines) for the inspection of CNC machined semi-conductor, aerospace aircraft, missile and other flight hardware and components.

I am a NON denominational Christian. Emphasis on NON denominational. Meaning I do my best to follow Christ. Nothing more.

You could not have flattered me any greater had I written that myself.
 
The visions of my head as I lay in bed were these: I saw, and behold, a tree in the midst of the earth; and its height was great. The tree grew and became strong, and its top reached to heaven, and it was visible to the end of the whole earth. (Daniel 4:10-11)

The "whole" earth? No matter how tall the tree was, it would not have been visible from the other side of the earth.
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The tree in this passage was part of Nebuchadnezzar's dream that Daniel interpreted for him. Couple schools of thought are that it represented the reach of Nebuchadnezzar's power which would be cut down or it represents the nation of Israel. Regardless of what the vision was intended to mean, I don't see how it could be interpreted as a commentary on weather the Earth was flat or not.....
 
has anyone ever wondered if god isnt so much a seperate entity, as existing only in each human. what im speculating is that god were he real is a greatly powerful envocation(not in the witch sense) of the human mind. im not trying to make the point that god isnt real, im being really sincere about this posibility of his existance. like i stated before, the mind is a incredibly powerful piece of equiptment that we only take a small advantage of. i think we are able to absorb 4billion bits of info/sec but only process about 2000. what do yall think???
 
bigironkiller said:
has anyone ever wondered if god isnt so much a seperate entity, as existing only in each human. what im speculating is that god were he real is a greatly powerful envocation(not in the witch sense) of the human mind. im not trying to make the point that god isnt real, im being really sincere about this posibility of his existance. like i stated before, the mind is a incredibly powerful piece of equiptment that we only take a small advantage of. i think we are able to absorb 4billion bits of info/sec but only process about 2000. what do yall think???
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look at what the post number of your post was Big Iron.

is it a sign? an omen of such? are you Damian Thorn?
 

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pantera101 said:
One thing I forgot to mention which may or may not be obvious is the christians who commit easily avoidable sins over and over yet think they are going to heaven simply cause they believe the bible is true.Then they will tell a non believer they are going to hell.Again,if I'm god,I'm holding the person who believes to slightly higher standards than the non believer.Thats just a slap in the face of god everytime a believer does things like getting pi$$ faced drunk,pre marital sex,adultery,cussing,and any other sin that is easily avoidable by just not doing it and knowing that your saviour doesn't aprove of it.I'm not a christian and would never cheat on a gf or wife.Yet millions of believers do on a regular basis.They will say they are going to heaven and I'm not.Logically it should be the other way around.I'm honestly not scared of going to hell though if the bible turns out to be true.I don't think gay people should either.But the church goers who sin repeatedly for personal gain when knowing it's outright wrong when they "know" a god exist.............:twisted:
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Well in todays world of a more relaxed society, you are right about some christians acting completly stupid and sinning and thinking they are ok because they said sorry. It is my belief they are not safe. When I screw up, I will it takes me at least a week before I feel right before God again. There is no, I'm sorry its all better. Those who believe that I believe are in great danger. And they give christians a bad name.

Now let me say, there are days that come by where I may make a mistake and hang my head in shame. Temptation usually comes to christians lot harder than a does a secular person becase we tend to view it as spiritual warefare. In a sense a certain temptation, lets say sex (i have done without this one for a long long long time... I need to get married LOL) Since I have done that back in my past, I always have that desire. Well to me it is bad and sinful, thus it is forbidden.

Human nature wants what it cant have so much more than what it can have. Forbidden fruit is the best, no?

So to a secular person it is life, sex that is, and not in turn a temptation as much as a normal act for them.

For christians, and I will use the argument of our belief that the devil is our enemy, we face him. He brings the temptaion and whispers in our mind, and builds up that desire, and we have to cast it out. It is more of a struggle than some people can imagine. My friends at work always give me compliments because they cant go 3 days without it...and I am working on 2 years thus far, and Wont be making that mistake at all. Just looking for my future wife...

You are right about some of them thinking they can act however they want and be safe. And there ar every many stuck up christians... truth is though pride is a sin also, and a christian should never point his nose up at someone.

I do understand though new christians have to break old chains and habits, and I give them a little bit more credit.

I will even poit out some parts of the bible where mankind makes stupid mistakes...

But even the greatest men of God, even in the bible found ways to completly screw things up. "for all fall short of the glory of God". David slept with Bathsheba and murdered her husband, Moses needed anger management and murdered and egyptian earlier in his life, Jonah ignored God until he was stuck in a whales stomach for transport lol... Even his people after being freed from egypt started to complain and grumble, which is why that generation never saw the promised land savve for two I believe(been awhile...) Peter denied Jesus 3 times... a christian should undersand that sin is a bad thing, and that it can oftentimes carry a heavy price. The wages of sin are death. Maybe not physically, but that leaves open spiritual, emotional, financial, relationship....

No one is perfect. My old sunday school teacher had a saying
"They crucified the only perfect man"

I will always make a mistake everyonce in awhile. Sometimes I think God lets it happen to remind me of my humility. Without humility a christian becomes overtaken with pride, and when that happens...well neither christians or secular folk alike are happy with that person usually...

****This post is based of Zero's personal believes.Hi I am Zero and I aprove this message. Not in part of any organization or doctrin.****:toofunny:

I tried not to come across too bad on this post, I hope I did a better job than usual lol :hammer:
 
B5150 said:
Follow Christ, not the Christian ;)

Peace.
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Best way to put it man. A christian is a student, listen to the teacher not the peer :clap2:

And yes this thread has been greatly interesting. As well as a learning process.
 
Bum Mahoney said:
The tree in this passage was part of Nebuchadnezzar's dream that Daniel interpreted for him. Couple schools of thought are that it represented the reach of Nebuchadnezzar's power which would be cut down or it represents the nation of Israel. Regardless of what the vision was intended to mean, I don't see how it could be interpreted as a commentary on weather the Earth was flat or not.....
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How can you not.It even states just below where they were comming from.I wonder if things like that had something to do with people thinking the world was flat?
 
Zero V said:
DNA cannot change. Evolution is an ideal that was thrown out by its very creator on his deathbed when he realized he was wrong the enitre time and simply misguided by satan.

The only truth is that everyone believes in God eventualy, once your standing in for your judgement...
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This is a myth that creationist types like to trot out...

"A few more details on the spread of the story and its subsequent rebuttal, taken from the book The Survival of Charles Darwin: a Biography of a Man and an Idea by Ronald W. Clark, published by Weidenfeld & Nicholson, 1985 (p. 199)

Shortly after his death, Lady Hope addressed a gathering of young men and women at the educational establishment founded by the evangelist Dwight Lyman Moody at Northfield, Massachusetts. She had, she maintained, visited Darwin on his deathbed. He had been reading the Epistle to the Hebrews, had asked for the local Sunday school to sing in a summerhouse on the grounds, and had confessed: "How I wish I had not expressed my theory of evolution as I have done." He went on, she said, to say that he would like her to gather a congregation since he "would like to speak to them of Christ Jesus and His salvation, being in a state where he was eagerly savouring the heavenly anticipation of bliss."

With Moody's encouragement, Lady Hope's story was printed in the Boston Watchman Examiner. The story spread, and the claims were republished as late as October 1955 in the Reformation Review and in the Monthly Record of the Free Church of Scotland in February 1957. These attempts to fudge Darwin's story had already been exposed for what they were, first by his daughter Henrietta after they had been revived in 1922. "I was present at his deathbed," she wrote in the Christian for February 23, 1922. "Lady Hope was not present during his last illness, or any illness. I believe he never even saw her, but in any case she had no influence over him in any department of thought or belief. He never recanted any of his scientific views, either then or earlier. We think the story of his conversion was fabricated in the U.S.A. . . . The whole story has no foundation whatever." (Ellipsis is in the book)"
 
Here's a LOT of info on radiometric dating:
(with and without responses to creationists arguments)

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the catholic church itself up to the 16th and 17th century believed that the earth was flat and denouced Galileo, Copernicus and science itself.

the catholic church had Galileo under house arrest until he died.
 
b unit said:
the catholic church itself up to the 16th and 17th century believed that the earth was flat and denouced Galileo, Copernicus and science itself.

the catholic church had Galileo under house arrest until he died.
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There are reasons Chrisianity broke away from the Catholic Church...the reformation changed alot.
 
Zero V said:
ALSO I wanna bring back up why are dinosaurs going through multiple layers of rock that are supposidly hundreds of thousands of years apart? Was I right on my headstand theory?

And if we came from monkeys where are the remains of the millions of in between creatures that would have HAD to exist and die. Convenient that none have been found, therefore evolution is nothing more than a belief just like religion actually...because no proof can be given it works. Actually no linking species have been found.

I will get with the guy I have been refrencing though, and get better info on things for you guys and resources. It will take until at least friday like I said though.
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I'm assuming your dinosaur appearing in multiple layers of rock refers to this whale story...if not, please let me know.

"The Real Story: Just the Facts

Had anybody taken the time and trouble to check the facts, they would have found that the story by Russel (1976) took some liberty with the facts and lacked very important information. First, the skeleton was not found in a vertical position, but was lying at an angle 50 to 40 degrees from horizontal. Finally, although at this angle, the whale skeleton lay parallel to the bedding of strata which at one time was the sea floor on which the dead whale fell after its death. These facts were confirmed by inquiring with the people at the Los Angeles Museum of Natural History who excavated the whale. Although nothing had been published on the whale, Russel (1976) clearly identified the staff who excavated the skeleton and they could have been easily called at the Los Angeles Museum of Natural History in Los Angeles, California.

The strata containing the whale consists of diatomites that accumulated within deep bays and basins that lay along the Pacific coastline during Miocene times. As a result of folding and tectonics associated with the formation of the Transverse Ranges, the strata containing the enclosed skeleton has been tilted into a less-than vertical position. These sediments lack any sedimentary structures that would indicate catastrophic deposition. Rather, the strata exhibit laminations indicative of slow accumulation on an anoxic bay bottom. Within the adjacent strata, several hardgrounds occurs. A hardground is a distinctive cemented layer of sedimentary rock that forms when the lack of sediments being deposited over a very long period of time on the sea bottom allows the surface sediments to become cemented (Isaac 1981, Garrison and Foellmi 1988). In fact, identical sediments are currently accumulating without the involvement of a Noachian-like flood within parts of the Gulf of California (Curray et al. 1992; Schrader et al. 1982).

Furthermore, a partially buried, articulated whale skeleton slowly being covered by sedimentation in the deep ocean off the coast of California was observed by oceanographers diving in submersibles. It is an excellent modern analogue of how this particular whale fossil was created without the need of a Noachian Flood (Allison et al. 1990; Smith et al. 1989).

The geology of these quarries is documented by publications of the California Division of Mines and Geology (Dibblee 1950, 1982) United States Geological Survey geological maps (Dibblee, 1988a, 1988b), graduate students at University of California, Los Angeles (Grivetti 1982), and field trip guidebooks (Isaacs 1981). The other whale skeletons which have been found in these quarries lie parallel to the bedding and owe their modern attitude to tectonics rather then some mythical catastrophe. The written documentation for the attitude of the whale skeletons is contained within field notes and locality records of the Los Angeles Museum of Natural History in Los Angeles, California.


Some Commentary

It appears the creationists repeating this whale-of-a-tale, (including the editors of Creation Ex Nihilo) either failed to check their facts or didn't want a good story to be ruined by the facts. In either case, none of these people apparently took the time and trouble to find out what the facts were before putting pen to paper. What they claim to be God's truth is nothing more than an urban folktale used to validate personal religious beliefs.

What was found to be most disturbing was the tendency for creationists to deliberately omit specific locational data and references. Thus, they made it as difficult as possible for a person to independently confirm the data on which they offered as proof of a Biblical world-wide flood. As a result, only someone who had come across Corliss (1980) and Mr. Ginenthal's article could track down Russel (1976) and by comparing descriptions of this fossil whale to Anonymous (1988) and other places where it was used evidence by creationists determine the source of the claims about a 80-ft fossil whale having been found in California buried in a vertical position. It almost seems that the people making the claims about this whale being evidence for a catastrophic or Noachian Flood wanted the reader take their claims taken as a matter of faith as being true and make it impossible for anybody to check the veracity of the story. This is propaganda, not science in the form of paragraph- to page-size versions of media sound-bites.

In addition, Mr. Charles Ginenthal in The Velikovskian (as posted by Ted Holden) appears to have quoted from a secondary source, without apparently looking up the original article, because the reference that he gives for the whale article is badly garbled. Compare his reference given below to Russel (1976):


18 Frederic B. Jueneman, "Workers Find Whale in Diatomaceous Earth Quarry," Chemical and Engineering News 54 (October 11,1976): 40.
According to museum staff at the Los Angeles Museum of Natural History in Los Angeles the whale that started this particular piece of folklore in 1976 still remains in its cast on a flatcar in one of the GREFCO diatomaceous earth quarries as a result of lack of the money and space needed to curate it. Currently, it is rumored to have a small tree growing in it. If this story is true, the story of the "whale found on its tail", in addition to being completely false, has a sad ending"


Regarding no transitional fossils...there have been many.
Tiktaalik - fish to amphibian
archeopteryx - reptile to bird
 
Heres some more reasons why people might of thought the world was flat because of the bible implying it is.These are all quotes from the bible

For he looks to the ends of the earth,and sees everything under the heavens.

It is he who sits above the cirle of the earth

To him who spread out the earth

and the lord will scatter you among all peoples,from one end of the earth to the other

He shall push the peoples,all of them,to the ends of the earth(many quotes saying ends of the earth or world)

under the whole heaven he lets it go,and his lightning,to the corners of the earth

and gather the dispersed of judah from the 4 corners of the earth

Heres some showing the earth is staionary

tremble before him.all earth,yeah;the world stands firm never to be moved

thou didst set the earth on it's foundations,so that it should never be shaken.(I guess they forgot about earthquakes)

for the pillars of the earth are lords,and on them,he has set the world

and heres one about the sun moving

sun stand thou still at gibon,and thou moon in the valley of aijaln,and the sun stood still.(others said the same thing about god making the sun stand still)
 
Zero V said:
Done, sorry lol. Same for pant. Busy day, just got done cutting the grass.Gym was sooo good.... and Im so tired. I was gona do it when I started my log tonight.
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I just noticed you're 5'10" at 140.I was 130 at 5'8" when I started.I worked hard for a couple years and made minor improvements.Learned how to eat right and began consuming many cals every day with lots of carbs and protien and started to grow like a weed.The moral of this story is to eat like you're trying to get fat!!!!Not junk food and all.Keep sugar and bad carbs to a minumum.But eat as much carbs and protien as you can,and then eat a little more.Every 2-3 hrs.If you do and keep working out consisitently and learning more and more with time,It's just a matter of time before a kid at church comes and ask about his urges to juice and what you're point of view is cause he will feel you'll understand.I swear!!!!
 
pantera101 said:
I just noticed you're 5'10" at 140.I was 130 at 5'8" when I started.I worked hard for a couple years and made minor improvements.Learned how to eat right and began consuming many cals every day with lots of carbs and protien and started to grow like a weed.The moral of this story is to eat like you're trying to get fat!!!!Not junk food and all.Keep sugar and bad carbs to a minumum.But eat as much carbs and protien as you can,and then eat a little more.Every 2-3 hrs.If you do and keep working out consisitently and learning more and more with time,It's just a matter of time before a kid at church comes and ask about his urges to juice and what you're point of view is cause he will feel you'll understand.I swear!!!!
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Thanks for the advice!

I do eat alot, I just had chicken breast. But I usually eat pork 2 times a day on wheat bread. I eat chicken on workout days for dinner. I eat natural peanutbutter on wheat bread sandwiches 2 times a day. I always munch on roasted peanuts if its been a few hours since a meal. I drink at least 3 protien shakes a day, with 2% milk. I weighed 133 less than a month ago, I am now 140.

Reason I dont wiegh more, I couldnt work out my legs do to tendonitis. Well I started for the first time Sat, using machines so that I dont actually have to stress my achilles tendons. Oh it burned baad. And I am starting to cycle 3 times a week, on the days I dont lift. 20 minute cycle. With 1 minute all outs.... Last time I cycled sat I pushed my HR so far it went over the top of the meter and started back at the bottom.........I thought I was dead for a second..LOL

My biggest new move too... I now try to get 8 hours of sleep a night. I made those gains getting 4 hours of sleep. Now I am going to be getting about 8 plus taking IGF-2 :)


...that was just a little off topic >.> But about the dinosaur thing, no it is not about the whale. The whale is one of the stories in the bible. Jonah and the whale :)

And yes it was my grass.
 
bigironkiller said:
has anyone ever wondered if god isnt so much a seperate entity, as existing only in each human. what im speculating is that god were he real is a greatly powerful envocation(not in the witch sense) of the human mind. im not trying to make the point that god isnt real, im being really sincere about this posibility of his existance. like i stated before, the mind is a incredibly powerful piece of equiptment that we only take a small advantage of. i think we are able to absorb 4billion bits of info/sec but only process about 2000. what do yall think???
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wouldnt this make god every bit as real as reality????
 
B5150 said:
Follow Christ, not the Christian ;)

Peace.
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You see this is my biggest issue with religion and I asked this question in this thread several times. What your believes are based on besides Bible? I know you, B, for many years on this board and I know how much knowledge regarding God comes from your personal experience in life, not just because it says so in the Bible. I know, you and I had our arguments and fights more than once here about our believes, but I've learned from you more than from the rest of the people combined on this board (no offence to anyone LOL) because again it comes from your own personal experience not from "somebody else in church told me so".
 
Zero V said:
Has the idea of the false prophets been brought up? In your viewpoint lets say satan exists for a minute, could he not fuel and give the knowledge to scientists to come up with all their ideas and findings? Even satan will heal a lame man if it is a strike against Gods kingdom. So how can you prove 100% that you have not been tricked?
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Could he not fuel and give the knowledge to religious people to come up with their ideas and findings? I'm not saying that I believe that, but why do you so sure that what you believe is from God, and if something opposite of your believes than it comes from devil or something? What if there are third way or forth way, that has nothing to do with science or religion? So how can you prove 100% that you have not been tricked?
 
to be totally honest, all i care about it being as good as you can to fellow human beings and the enviroment, AND IF (a huge friggin IF) there is an after life and i have made the mistake in not believing then i'll just have to deal with it then and there, if being good to fellow human beings and mother Earth is not enough for god and some smuck who's killed and raped but has then gone on to see the light gets in and i don't, then i don't want in anyway.

just a rant really lol
 
DmitryWI said:
You see this is my biggest issue with religion and I asked this question in this thread several times. What your believes are based on besides Bible? I know you, B, for many years on this board and I know how much knowledge regarding God comes from your personal experience in life, not just because it says so in the Bible. I know, you and I had our arguments and fights more than once here about our believes, but I've learned from you more than from the rest of the people combined on this board (no offence to anyone LOL) because again it comes from your own personal experience not from "somebody else in church told me so".
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There is NO difference that we have ever had that grace cannot overcome. Otherwise we are both missing it. Likewise I learn from you.
 
b unit said:
to be totally honest, all i care about it being as good as you can to fellow human beings and the enviroment, AND IF (a huge friggin IF) there is an after life and i have made the mistake in not believing then i'll just have to deal with it then and there, if being good to fellow human beings and mother Earth is not enough for god and some smuck who's killed and raped but has then gone on to see the light gets in and i don't, then i don't want in anyway.

just a rant really lol
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If worse comes to worse......I'll se you in hell b unit! :wave: I'm sure that south parks interpertation of hell is the right one anyways.
 
pantera101 said:
If worse comes to worse......I'll se you in hell b unit! :wave:
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rest assured bro, hopefully there will be a nice long queue so it will take some time, i suspect there'll be a lot of people heading that way and i'll be looking for a few a__holes down there to put the boot into but i think there also might be a queue, especially for hitler and that a--hole from the other day Invalid Link Removed
:thumbsup:
 
b unit said:
to be totally honest, all i care about it being as good as you can to fellow human beings and the enviroment, AND IF (a huge friggin IF) there is an after life and i have made the mistake in not believing then i'll just have to deal with it then and there, if being good to fellow human beings and mother Earth is not enough for god and some smuck who's killed and raped but has then gone on to see the light gets in and i don't, then i don't want in anyway.

just a rant really lol
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:goodpost: i agree 100% bro. there are good people and there are bad people. if you're good, you'll be fine. if you're bad, you're fvcked, lol. this is like you said, IF there is a god. reps to you!!
 
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