DMZ Cycle

[Charles42]

About to start a DMZ cycle and want input on anything else you would add. I got a couple bottles of Vicious Labs DMZ left so I want to finish them off.

5 foot 9 195lbs and 33 years old. Looking to add 10-15 lbs

Pre cycle: 2 weeks Nutriissa cycle support

Cycle: Weeks 1-4
DMZ 30mg a day
Super 4 Andro 2 pumps a day. 1am 1pm
Cycle support, Tudca, NAC

Cycle: Weeks 5-8
DMZ 45mg a day
Super 4 Andro 4 pumps a day. 2am 2pm
Cycle support, Tudca, NAC

Post Cycle (4 weeks)
OTC Post Cycle support supplement (still TBD any recommendations?)
Nolva 20-20-10-10

Anything I’m missing or should have on hand just in case?

 

[klbsa]

Just my two cents…… That is WAY TO MUCH DMZ for way too long. You are gonna end up with aching balls and start feeling like total crap by week 6. I speak from lots of DMZ experience. You should drop those dosages by 15 mg IMO. But like I said just my opinion.

I would gain 20+ lbs easy in 6 weeks at those doses you are proposing.

 

[Smont]

You might gain 10 to 15 lbs but your not gonna build more then 2 or 3lbs of actual muscle fiber that's gonna hang around, Just keep that in mind. I would add 4 andro or testosterone

 

[Smont]

8 weeks is kinda pushing it too on dmz. I don't got a problem with 45mg but if you wanna dose high get out fast. 5-6 weeks.

 

[Charles42]

Just my two cents…… That is WAY TO MUCH DMZ for way too long. You are gonna end up with aching balls and start feeling like total crap by week 6. I speak from lots of DMZ experience. You should drop those dosages by 15 mg IMO. But like I said just my opinion.

I would gain 20+ lbs easy in 6 weeks at those doses you are proposing.

Appreciate the input. I’ll stay at 30mgs and attempt to go a 7th week if I’m feeling good. How much did you gain from your previous DMZ cycles?

 

[gmoneypm]

I’ve ran it 6 weeks before. 30mg week one, and then 45mg there after. I felt like 45mg was the sweet spot and didn’t have any sides besides a little blood pressure spike… but this was in my 20’s and without blood work so who knows.

 

[Segansational]

Maybe something for BP, Hawthorne berry and/or Carditone.

 

[Charles42]

Maybe something for BP, Hawthorne berry and/or Carditone.

My support supp has Hawthorne berry in it. 1 gram. I’ll look into Carditone as well

 

[mikeymike85]

8 weeks is too much IMO. I've ran it 5/6 weeks, and by the 6th week, my piss starts turning really dark.

Never had an issue at 45mg, although 30 always did the trick too. Love DMZ

 

[SSJ4GOD]

Yeah chiming in to say stop at 6 weeks. Health is important and all the cycle support in the world can only do so much. Also you will probably hit your 10 lbs-15 lbs in 6 weeks anyways…that extra 2 weeks won’t solidify gains any measurable amount extra.

 

[Charles42]

Yeah chiming in to say stop at 6 weeks. Health is important and all the cycle support in the world can only do so much. Also you will probably hit your 10 lbs-15 lbs in 6 weeks anyways…that extra 2 weeks won’t solidify gains any measurable amount extra.

Okay I’m finally convinced. 6 weeks at 30mg a day it is. Thank you

 

[klbsa]

Appreciate the input. I’ll stay at 30mgs and attempt to go a 7th week if I’m feeling good. How much did you gain from your previous DMZ cycles?

In my mid 30’s I took 25mg of DMZ and 10mg of msten daily…… In 8 weeks I gained almost
30 lbs. I went from 200 to 228 with no visible body fat gain….. Another time I would take 12 mg of DMZ before workouts 4-5 times a week and I was up 10 pounds in just over a month….and that was without even taking it every day with no other gear or trt!

DMZ and MSTEN are the strongest gear I have ever take ln hands down. I never tried superdrol tho, I hear it’s comparable.

We are all different but in general DMZ works well for almost everyone.

 

[UnrealMachine]

In my mid 30’s I took 25mg of DMZ and 10mg of msten daily…… In 8 weeks I gained almost
30 lbs. I went from 200 to 228 with no visible body fat gain….. Another time I would take 12 mg of DMZ before workouts 4-5 times a week and I was up 10 pounds in just over a month….and that was without even taking it every day with no other gear or trt!

DMZ and MSTEN are the strongest gear I have ever take ln hands down. I never tried superdrol tho, I hear it’s comparable.

We are all different but in general DMZ works well for almost everyone.

hey, how much of the 28 pounds did you keep? If it’s anything like SD then there’s a lot of water and glycogen that just falls off post cycle. I’ve never heard of people putting on weight that fast and keeping it. Or else everyone on this board running short oral cycles would be strutting around at 245 pounds and single digit BF.

if it’s anything like SD tho it sounds intriguing

 

[Stacks1]

hey, how much of the 28 pounds did you keep? If it’s anything like SD then there’s a lot of water and glycogen that just falls off post cycle. I’ve never heard of people putting on weight that fast and keeping it. Or else everyone on this board running short oral cycles would be strutting around at 245 pounds and single digit BF.

if it’s anything like SD tho it sounds intriguing

Maybe you can pulse DMZ for us and let us know how it goes

 

[UnrealMachine]

Maybe you can pulse DMZ for us and let us know how it goes

Haha. It would probably work well. Honestly I’ve still got a couple bottles of OLD AF Superdrol… probably still works fine, so I was thinking of that too

for myself tho I never expected Sarms to work well I expected to be a non responder and my low doses wouldn’t work and I’d ramp the doses up and be totally disappointed. Instead I am loving Sarms the hardness, strength and recovery of only 10mg Rad is on par with methyl orals I used back in the day. Except with less shutdown and no methylation.

so now I’m more interested in exploring Rad dosing even higher, and stuff like LGD

 

[Stacks1]

Haha. It would probably work well. Honestly I’ve still got a couple bottles of OLD AF Superdrol… probably still works fine, so I was thinking of that too

for myself tho I never expected Sarms to work well I expected to be a non responder and my low doses wouldn’t work and I’d ramp the doses up and be totally disappointed. Instead I am loving Sarms the hardness, strength and recovery of only 10mg Rad is on par with methyl orals I used back in the day. Except with less shutdown and no methylation.

so now I’m more interested in exploring Rad dosing even higher, and stuff like LGD

Wow. I've actually never used a SARM. I think it's mostly because I just never sat down to do the research on them. Plus I got so many old school PH/DS to last me a lifetime. I am going to get around to pulsing SD like you recommended for sure. I got a couple bottles of it myself. But now you're teasing with with Rad telling me it's on par with methyl orals with less shutdown and no methylation... so I'm intrigued once again.

 

[Hyde]

In my mid 30’s I took 25mg of DMZ and 10mg of msten daily…… In 8 weeks I gained almost
30 lbs. I went from 200 to 228 with no visible body fat gain….. Another time I would take 12 mg of DMZ before workouts 4-5 times a week and I was up 10 pounds in just over a month….and that was without even taking it every day with no other gear or trt!

DMZ and MSTEN are the strongest gear I have ever take ln hands down. I never tried superdrol tho, I hear it’s comparable.

We are all different but in general DMZ works well for almost everyone.

You are an exceptional responder. It’s great you yo-yo so well on modest doses due to infrequent cycling, but that’s not going to be the typical outcome for the routine user.

I have used DMZ at least 4 times, I think 5 possibly. It always puts me on my ass, cranks my bp, destroys my bloodwork and makes me strong AF. As an isolated addition to any scenario for me, it has never yielded more than about 8lbs additional bodyweight, and that’s basically a huge surge in glycogen retention.

Msten, I basically got zero weight off of (Antaeus Ultradrol) It was the hardest compound I’ve ever used that produced almost no actual size. Muscle recovery was incomparable, but it wasn’t worth the side effects for me personally.

Wow. I've actually never used a SARM. I think it's mostly because I just never sat down to do the research on them. Plus I got so many old school PH/DS to last me a lifetime. I am going to get around to pulsing SD like you recommended for sure. I got a couple bottles of it myself. But now you're teasing with with Rad telling me it's on par with methyl orals with less shutdown and no methylation... so I'm intrigued once again.

Unreal has truly been making truly unreal progress on novice level SARM doses, but don’t expect it to compare to the old DS, just a disclaimer. It is a lot lower side/more tolerable for longer though, and stacks well with a lot of scenarios.

 

[UnrealMachine]

Yeah I should caution against my Sarm exuberance because my response has been great but I appear to be an outlier.
But that is just my luck tons of DS I had poor response, I finally got lucky on the Rad.

 

[Stacks1]

Yeah I should caution against my Sarm exuberance because my response has been great but I appear to be an outlier.
But that is just my luck tons of DS I had poor response, I finally got lucky on the Rad.

Maybe I can be an outlier too

 

[Hyde]

Maybe I can be an outlier too

Rad is a fairly “safe” SARM to experiment with, so it may be worth your time to try, depending on needs/expectations. They gave it to women with breast cancer up to 150mg per day orally. All of the women on 150 and most on the 100mg couldn’t hang, but most of the 50mg group stayed on for months without needing to discontinue due to sides.

What a woman with cancer may be willing to tolerate vs a man looking for a pound of muscle is probably a little different, but my point is it didn’t seriously harm anyone short term and most using 50mg didn’t have obscene liver elevations or sides that forced them off of it.

 

[SSJ4GOD]

Main issue I had with rad was acid reflux which I have anyways but it definitely made it worse and much more frequent.

 

[Stacks1]

Rad is a fairly “safe” SARM to experiment with, so it may be worth your time to try, depending on needs/expectations. They gave it to women with breast cancer up to 150mg per day orally. All of the women on 150 and most on the 100mg couldn’t hang, but most of the 50mg group stayed on for months without needing to discontinue due to sides.

What a woman with cancer may be willing to tolerate vs a man looking for a pound of muscle is probably a little different, but my point is it didn’t seriously harm anyone short term and most using 50mg didn’t have obscene liver elevations or sides that forced them off of it.

Now I'm very interested. Thing is, I know nothing about SARMs. I have no idea what dose to run Rad at, how long, if I should be on high alert for estro or prolactin issues... I mean literally nothing. I saw there is Rad 140 and Rad 150... don't even know what the difference is.

I remember when Osta came out and people were running it swearing it wasn't suppressive. Some people were even running it as part of their PCT. I was HIGHLY skeptical at that point and stayed away. Then I saw people actually getting blood work done and it was showing to be quite suppressive. That just kind of turned me off to SARMs and I never picked up interest again.... but now maybe I should.

 

[Hyde]

Main issue I had with rad was acid reflux which I have anyways but it definitely made it worse and much more frequent.

Same thing for me, all 4 times I’ve used it orally. Most orals do this to me, but RAD is definitely one of those reflux irritants for the prone. Read many similar accounts.

I’m a week into adding injectable RAD140/S23 blend on top of my cruise test/mast, and so far so good. We will see.

Now I'm very interested. Thing is, I know nothing about SARMs. I have no idea what dose to run Rad at, how long, if I should be on high alert for estro or prolactin issues... I mean literally nothing. I saw there is Rad 140 and Rad 150... don't even know what the difference is.

I remember when Osta came out and people were running it swearing it wasn't suppressive. Some people were even running it as part of their PCT. I was HIGHLY skeptical at that point and stayed away. Then I saw people actually getting blood work done and it was showing to be quite suppressive. That just kind of turned me off to SARMs and I never picked up interest again.... but now maybe I should.

They’re not all created equal, and in general past a point traditional AAS will outperform them as far as effects vs sides/safety profile.

They don’t aromatize, so the only estrogen concerns would be aromatization from the higher free testosterone levels from the way they drastically lower SHBG when you go on most SARMs initially. You will still want an exogenous estrogen base added in after a few weeks, like testosterone or at least DHEA.

 

[UnrealMachine]

I’m not getting any sides from Rad just mild suppression. There shouldn’t be estrogen or prolactin in theory anyway. I am very susceptible to reflux but using Omeprazole and I haven’t had any differences lately
Probably I’m doing better than I used to in this department since I’m on a very restricted cal diet
@Hyde your post has inspired me I’ll get two more bottles of Rad from MA and I’m going to stack or bridge with LGD on the next cycle and see (an experiment just for fun right ) if I can push my physique close to what it used to be just using Sarms. So far I think it’s doable I was using too much SD and PP back in the day because there was so little that really worked and with Sarms I’m not restricted to 6 week stints.

damn no longer have my institution access
The doses seem so excessive but I might play around up to 20mg next time

A First-in-Human Phase 1 Study of a Novel Selective Androgen Receptor Modulator (SARM), RAD140, in ER+/HER2- Metastatic Breast Cancer - PubMed

RAD140 is a novel oral AR-targeted agent for the treatment of AR+/ER+/HER2- mBC with an acceptable safety profile and preliminary evidence of target engagement and antitumor activity.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Hyde]

I’m not getting any sides from Rad just mild suppression. There shouldn’t be estrogen or prolactin in theory anyway. I am very susceptible to reflux but using Omeprazole and I haven’t had any differences lately
Probably I’m doing better than I used to in this department since I’m on a very restricted cal diet
@Hyde your post has inspired me I’ll get two more bottles of Rad from MA and I’m going to stack or bridge with LGD on the next cycle and see (an experiment just for fun right ) if I can push my physique close to what it used to be just using Sarms. So far I think it’s doable I was using too much SD and PP back in the day because there was so little that really worked and with Sarms I’m not restricted to 6 week stints.

Most RAD I’ve taken is 30mg orally in my stack. I like it at that dose and definitely see more effects than 15mg.

Currently pinning 22.5mg RAD & S23 daily this last week. Definitely getting the hardening and it seems like strength (pulled a deadlift last night fairly easily while quite sick that I really had no business in taking).

I haven’t used LGD much orally, didn’t do much given my anabolic history, but pinning ~25-30mg daily for a month was comparable to a mild oral. I experienced significant lethargy on that, so I’d definitely prefer 50mg Var orally. I’ve known 2 people to try injecting 50mg daily, and they both backed down within a week.

You can handle these for much longer as far as their acute impact on liver and blood pressure (generally), but for myself they hit the lipids just as bad as your typical oral. Nothing is a free lunch.

 

[Stacks1]

They’re not all created equal, and in general past a point traditional AAS will outperform them as far as effects vs sides/safety profile.

They don’t aromatize, so the only estrogen concerns would be aromatization from the higher free testosterone levels from the way they drastically lower SHBG when you go on most SARMs initially. You will still want an exogenous estrogen base added in after a few weeks, like testosterone or at least DHEA.

I'm going to start looking into Rad, LGD, and S3. Those seem to be the ones I keep hearing about. Ostarine was huge when it came out but the hype began to fade from what I can tell. Are most people still sticking to Rad 140 or are most using the newer Rad 150 now? Does it really increase bioavailability and produce better results?

 

[Jeremyk1]

I'm going to start looking into Rad, LGD, and S3. Those seem to be the ones I keep hearing about. Ostarine was huge when it came out but the hype began to fade from what I can tell. Are most people still sticking to Rad 140 or are most using the newer Rad 150 now? Does it really increase bioavailability and produce better results?

I never looked into it much, but I thought the 150 is slower release. Like it has an ester or something. Same compound though. Regular Rad 140 still has a decent half life, so I wouldn’t think it’s worth it, but I could be wrong.

 

[Hyde]

I never looked into it much, but I thought the 150 is slower release. Like it has an ester or something. Same compound though. Regular Rad 140 still has a decent half life, so I wouldn’t think it’s worth it, but I could be wrong.

Yeah I have no way of knowing if it’s just marketing crap. I mean you only need regular RAD eod dosing to begin with, so the only measure would be to take TLB150 1x a week in comparable total dose and still make similar progress. If you did it 2x, I still think you would make good progress even if it was just RAD140. There are guys who pin EQ and Sust once every 3 weeks and still got huge and strong. Let that sink in.

And in general, Rad results are not always crazy dramatic, so I just haven’t really seen anything to trust anything about it beyond the word of people distributing this stuff.

 

[klbsa]

hey, how much of the 28 pounds did you keep? If it’s anything like SD then there’s a lot of water and glycogen that just falls off post cycle. I’ve never heard of people putting on weight that fast and keeping it. Or else everyone on this board running short oral cycles would be strutting around at 245 pounds and single digit BF.

if it’s anything like SD tho it sounds intriguing

It’s hard to say because I purposefully dropped down to 210 lbs right afterwards due to high blood pressure…… But yeah I am willing to bet that most of that 28 lbs was water and fuel.