DMZ cycle

DrChicken

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Yo Guys, I posted about this over a year ago but due to graduating chiropractic school and starting my own practice I didn't end up running ****.. (let's skip the fact that school kills gains haha /cry)

Anyways, I still have a bottle of BUILT DMZ in my cabinet, 10mg tablets, x 60
I was thinking about running it for for weeks:

DMZ 20/20/20/20
I've heard from multiple sources it should be GTG. I was thinking about grabbing a bottle of vicious DMZ as well in case I wanted to bump up my dose to 30mg or if it was underdosed.

As for PCT, I'm going to order some clomid and do 25/25/12/12 or should I have it higher?
Either that or Nolva (20/20/10/10) if you guys think that is a better option

On cycle support:
I already have cycle assist and TUDCA on hand by CEL. Going to run them at bottle dosages
I also have PCT assist and I will be grabbing an M test as well to run in PCT.
I have Reduce XT and Oldschool Erase by PES (man their products used to be great back in the day)
I'll def throw the reduce xt into PCT but I'm unsure of the erase.

Anyways, The only other support I'm thinking of getting is like Magnesium 500mg and melatonin 1mg to help with sleep as I have seen some users have sleep issues in the past.

That and a Prostate health support (mainly for the Saw palmetto and another compound I saw that works well for reducing DHT MPB)
Granted I am not prone to balding, that i know of, but I don't want to take any chances.


Sorry this isn't typed up nicely. I'll make it pretty after I get home from the office

Other staples
Omega 3
Metabolic Synergy Multivitamin
vitamin d 5000iu daily

I think thats it..

As for relevant info:
30YOM, 15 years weight lifting. All natty besides one 4 week cycle of Tren XTREME by ACL back in 08.
Hitting some plateaus and after ~15 years lifting natty I think I have the right to say I've actually hit a plateau

Also:
5'8
185lbs
roughly 10% bf

I'd really like to hear your opinions on all of this.
Is a test base necessary? is 3AD sufficient?
Injectable isnt an option ATM



OK here's how my cycle is going to look:


dmz 30/30/30/30
Dermacrine 4-5 pumps daily
CEL TUDCA 2/2/2/2
CEL cycle assist 8/8/8/8..
Going to start the CEL cycle assist 1-2 weeks before the DMZ

PCT will start at week 4, day after last dose of dmz..
Heres what I'm thinking...
Nolva 20/20/10/10
Cel M-test 6/6/6/6
Reduce XT 0/0/3/3/3/3
DAA 3g/3g/3g/3g
Cel PCT assist 4/4/4/4

As for an AI during PCT;
Iron Legion Virtus on hand OR Aromasin? They're basically the same price.
 
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ndiguy

ndiguy

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If this isn't your first cycle, I'd opt to get that second bottle of DMZ through Vicious Labs and run a larger dose than 20 per day. I think even 30 is on the lower end for most. But, if you see good gains from 30 by all means stick to it. If the cycle is going well by the end of week four, run another week or two. 6 weeks is pretty common, especially if your support supplements are in order.

If you're not going to be utilizing actual testosterone for a "base", Dermacrine seems to get really nice feedback in regards to combating lethargy. Some people use epi-andro and say it makes a nice difference for aggression. Vicious has a solid epi-andro product, as well.

Good luck!
 

DrChicken

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If this isn't your first cycle, I'd opt to get that second bottle of DMZ through Vicious Labs and run a larger dose than 20 per day. I think even 30 is on the lower end for most. But, if you see good gains from 30 by all means stick to it. If the cycle is going well by the end of week four, run another week or two. 6 weeks is pretty common, especially if your support supplements are in order.

If you're not going to be utilizing actual testosterone for a "base", Dermacrine seems to get really nice feedback in regards to combating lethargy. Some people use epi-andro and say it makes a nice difference for aggression. Vicious has a solid epi-andro product, as well.

Good luck!
So first of all thanks for the feedback man

I think I mentioned this but previously I ran tren xtreme by American cellular labs for 4 weeks in 2008. I was 18 and stupid. I haven’t done any hormonals since

My only concern about the test base wth dermacrine is will I begin to see estro sides etc
 

DrChicken

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If this isn't your first cycle, I'd opt to get that second bottle of DMZ through Vicious Labs and run a larger dose than 20 per day. I think even 30 is on the lower end for most. But, if you see good gains from 30 by all means stick to it. If the cycle is going well by the end of week four, run another week or two. 6 weeks is pretty common, especially if your support supplements are in order.

If you're not going to be utilizing actual testosterone for a "base", Dermacrine seems to get really nice feedback in regards to combating lethargy. Some people use epi-andro and say it makes a nice difference for aggression. Vicious has a solid epi-andro product, as well.

Good luck!
So first of all thanks for the feedback man

I think I mentioned this but previously I ran tren xtreme by American cellular labs for 4 weeks in 2008. I was 18 and stupid. I haven’t done any hormonals since

My only concern about the test base wth dermacrine is will I begin to see estro sides etc
 
ndiguy

ndiguy

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My only concern about the test base wth dermacrine is will I begin to see estro sides etc
I would have an AI on hand, for any hormonal cycle. Chances are you wouldn't need it for something that doesn't aromatize heavily, but better safe than sorry.

A couple of good over the counter options would be SNS Inhibit E or Iron Legion Virtus. With that being said, I like to keep a bottle of aromasin on hand.
 

DrChicken

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I would have an AI on hand, for any hormonal cycle. Chances are you wouldn't need it for something that doesn't aromatize heavily, but better safe than sorry.

A couple of good over the counter options would be SNS Inhibit E or Iron Legion Virtus. With that being said, I like to keep a bottle of aromasin on hand.
I have the original formula of erase laying around does that count
 

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Stay away from Clomid. That is way too much. Research clomid and you will find it is highly estrogenic because of the Zuclomiphene isomer. I felt like death, gained fat and gyno on Clomid and was only doing 1/4 tab (12.5mg) doses.
Get Nolvadex (Tamoxifen) instead and do 10mg EOD. Fareston (Toremifene) is the best SERM, but difficult for most people to acquire.
 

timberx

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Stay away from Clomid. That is way too much. Research clomid and you will find it is highly estrogenic because of the Zuclomiphene isomer. I felt like death, gained fat and gyno on Clomid and was only doing 1/4 tab (12.5mg) doses.
Get Nolvadex (Tamoxifen) instead and do 10mg EOD. Fareston (Toremifene) is the best SERM, but difficult for most people to acquire.
I had completely opposite experience with Clomid, I felt great and my test shot higher than pre-cycle in just 3 weeks: https://anabolicminds.com/community/threads/hexadrone-lgd-dermacrine-cycle-monthly-blood-tests.311216/
 
2manyprojects

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Stay away from Clomid. That is way too much. Research clomid and you will find it is highly estrogenic because of the Zuclomiphene isomer. I felt like death, gained fat and gyno on Clomid and was only doing 1/4 tab (12.5mg) doses.
Get Nolvadex (Tamoxifen) instead and do 10mg EOD. Fareston (Toremifene) is the best SERM, but difficult for most people to acquire.
10mg of tamoxifen every other day after dmz. Are you retarded?
 
2manyprojects

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Stay away from Clomid. That is way too much. Research clomid and you will find it is highly estrogenic because of the Zuclomiphene isomer. I felt like death, gained fat and gyno on Clomid and was only doing 1/4 tab (12.5mg) doses.
Get Nolvadex (Tamoxifen) instead and do 10mg EOD. Fareston (Toremifene) is the best SERM, but difficult for most people to acquire.
10mg of tamoxifen every other day after dmz. Are you retarded?
 

DrChicken

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10mg of tamoxifen every other day after dmz. Are you retarded?
I thought that sounded a little low from what I’ve researched but I’ve also read crazy ****.

Guys on the BB.com running DMZ and only taking OTC **** for pct 🤷‍♂️
 

DrChicken

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No OTC PTC. NO.

Use a SERM. Clomid or Nolva is fine. I prefer Nolva, but some people prefer Clomid.

Be careful who you take advice from.
Hey man I appreciate it

Trust me I wasn’t planning that at all
It’s just what i was saying I’ve read a ton of stupid **** such as that
 

DrChicken

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Ran Dermacrine alongside two sarms and had no estro sides from it...Definitely recommend.

(Another vote for Serms a must)
A serm is going to happen that is without. Doubt

Still unsure of the dermacrine but I’m between nolva and clomid

Apparently nolva has a few extra advantages so I’m leaning toward that
 
Rad83

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A serm is going to happen that is without. Doubt

Still unsure of the dermacrine but I’m between nolva and clomid

Apparently nolva has a few extra advantages so I’m leaning toward that
I like to run both.

It doesn’t hurt to have a stash of everything on hand before you start.
 

DrChicken

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I like to run both.

It doesn’t hurt to have a stash of everything on hand before you start.
Yeah nothing will be started until I have everything in hand and have pre loaded cycle support

I might run cycle assist for a bottle before hand
 
The Express 42

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Yeah Vicious Labs is the tits for DMZ/MSTEN. I would consider adding in some CEL Stano Plex though for libido and energy. Both of which can take a big dip week 3-4. Otherwise cycle looks good!
 

DrChicken

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So I’m realizing that my current tabs are dosed at 10mg

If I wanted to run 30 should I just tAke 3 by built then when those run out switch to VL 2 tabs? Or do two x10= 20 plus one VL = 35?

Assuming both compounds are exactly what they say they are I’m thinking option one would be better
 
Renew1

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So I’m realizing that my current tabs are dosed at 10mg

If I wanted to run 30 should I just tAke 3 by built then when those run out switch to VL 2 tabs? Or do two x10= 20 plus one VL = 35?

Assuming both compounds are exactly what they say they are I’m thinking option one would be better
Personally, I'd take them separately, because I'd want to know if the Built was legitimate.
 

DrChicken

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Personally, I'd take them separately, because I'd want to know if the Built was legitimate.
So essentially I should start with 2-3 caps of the built / day

From the logs I’ve read i believe I should know within 3-5 days tops if the built is legit ?
 
Renew1

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So essentially I should start with 2-3 caps of the built / day

From the logs I’ve read i believe I should know within 3-5 days tops if the built is legit ?
That's what I would do.
Well, I'd say definitely within a week, you'd know. Some people take longer to notice effects than others.
 
Project223

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In my limited experience there was no light switch moment with DMZ where you know it’s working. It might take a couple weeks before you know without a doubt it’s working beyond the placebo effect.
 

DrChicken

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That's what I would do.
Well, I'd say definitely within a week, you'd know. Some people take longer to notice effects than others.
Thanks again for the feedback. I feel like my training and nutrition is up to snuff enough that I should notice it quickly
 

DrChicken

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In my limited experience there was no light switch moment with DMZ where you know it’s working. It might take a couple weeks before you know without a doubt it’s working beyond the placebo effect.
People are reporting +5lbs in a week and major strength increases.
I’m training at the limit 6 days a week shouldn’t I know immediately if I have a surge in strength?
 
Project223

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The mind is a powerful thing. At clinical trials over 30% of patients typically react to a placebo thinking it’s the real drug.

Give a high school gym goer a sugar pill and tell him it’s “steroids” and he’ll be in beast mode putting up PBs all day. Not saying your inexperienced or week minded or anything. Some things you just KNOW it’s working instantly. DMZ tends to keep tapering up pretty evenly and getting better throughout the cycle.

Either way you’ll know for sure by the time you get done with that first bottle if it’s legit or not.
 
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DrChicken

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The mind is a powerful thing. At clinical trials over 30% of patients typically react to a placebo thinking it’s the real drug.

Give a high school gym goer a sugar pill and tell him it’s “steroids” and he’ll be in beast mode putting up PBs all day. Not saying your inexperienced or week minded or anything. Some things you just KNOW it’s working instantly. DMZ tends to keep tapering up pretty evenly and getting better throughout the cycle.

Either way you’ll know for sure by the time you get done with that first bottle if it’s legit or not.
Yeah and that’s the problem is half the DMZ logs are from high schoolers with little to no training experience

No offense taken brother but I’ve been training seriously for 15 years

Although I only have one experience with Anabolics and that was tren xtreme back in 2008 after about 3-4 years training so it’s been quite some time

But I haven’t forgotten how that made me feel lmao
 
Renew1

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Yeah and that’s the problem is half the DMZ logs are from high schoolers with little to no training experience

No offense taken brother but I’ve been training seriously for 15 years

Although I only have one experience with Anabolics and that was tren xtreme back in 2008 after about 3-4 years training so it’s been quite some time

But I haven’t forgotten how that made me feel lmao
Not all anabolics have the same feel. Some have no feel at all.
 

DrChicken

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I guess by “feel” I wasn’t necessarily meaning the whole alpha feeling I just meant in terms of weight / strength gain
 
blynch1

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When you start getting literally painful pumps and consistently put more and more weight on the bar, that’s how you’ll know it’s kicking in. You won’t be “feeling” **** at first except for when you’re in the gym. As stated by others, I’d run one brand then the next to assess if the other brand is any good because we all know VL is.
Oh and the “alpha” feeling will come, just give it some time. I didn’t experience any aggression unless need be but I felt like I was walking around with my chest out and lats spread constantly lol. Confidence was way up
 

DrChicken

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When you start getting literally painful pumps and consistently put more and more weight on the bar, that’s how you’ll know it’s kicking in. You won’t be “feeling” **** at first except for when you’re in the gym. As stated by others, I’d run one brand then the next to assess if the other brand is any good because we all know VL is.
Oh and the “alpha” feeling will come, just give it some time. I didn’t experience any aggression unless need be but I felt like I was walking around with my chest out and lats spread constantly lol. Confidence was way up
Appreciate the input

Even if I run it at 30 I’m going to have to buy the VL brand

And then I’d have half a bottle of VL left over

So I’m wondering if I should just get a bottle of VL and just run that lol

It seems that even at 2 pills / day x 4 weeks = 56 pills and it’s a 90 pill bottle so technically you could run it for 5 weeks and have one week at 45
 
blynch1

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Just get your SERM, I’ve given you advice on that, and get er done already! Start at 30mg and up it if you feel it’s necessary but I didn’t feel it to be. Let’s get it
 

DrChicken

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Just get your SERM, I’ve given you advice on that, and get er done already! Start at 30mg and up it if you feel it’s necessary but I didn’t feel it to be. Let’s get it
Yeah I’m def not going above 30

I was debating 20 bc of the BUILT brand but everyone has suggested 30 and when running. VL that’s the only dose you can use


And thanks again man

I just need to order my serm, possibly cialis in case I get shut down (not gonna disappoint my lady)

Then prob dermacrine for the base or 4ad
 
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