Hello fellow AM members!
I'm excited to say that we will finally be getting some real, tangible, trustworthy blood tests to help summarize the effectiveness of a few different compounds in PCT. Hopefully, we will learn more about these particular areas of PCT approach:
1) Effectiveness of Triptorelin at kickstarting HPTA in PCT
2) Effectiveness of UDCA in liver protection
3) The conclusive evidence of running a low dose oral AAS in PCT w/ Triptorelin, SERM and AI in regards to total T, LH, FSH and liver values.
Before I go any further - I think it is important to note that, while most reference ranges for blood tests are similar, they do vary from lab to lab and doctor to doctor. We're only looking for evidence of "problems" within these reference ranges and there should be an understood standard deviation when analyzing such results. I am looking for alarmingly high/low results that could indicate problems. So, as I go thru each of these different blood test results, I intend to give everyone a "breakdown" of information so that we can understand what is really taking place in my body.
The tested client - is myself
The previous AAS cycle - Consisted of:
Test-P @ 400/400/400/400/700/700/400
M-Drol @ 20/20/20
Trenazone @ 0/0/150/150/150/150/100
H-Drol @ 0/0/0/0/50/50/50
UDCA @ 0/0/0/0/250/250/250/250
As you can see, this is a fairly harsh cycle with tons of potential "problems" that could have occurred throughout the cycle and during PCT. Nonetheless, I'm very satisfied with the results and as of right now the current blood tests, which were drawn 5 days after my last injection, show promising results for a clean, healthy recovery in PCT.
The first set of blood tests were drawn on Friday 10/21/11 @ 11:33 AM - just 5 days after my last injection of Test Prop and only 2 full days after I stopped taking Trenazone and H-Drol. Here are the results:
As you can see with these results, my blood counts are in no way alarming. Considering this is only 2 days after discontinuing all AAS, I cannot complain at all! I had a nurse look over these numbers for me just to make sure and she even said they are not anything to worry about and that these values are within an acceptable range. For instance, my monocytes are a little high but nothing high enough to indicate a serious infection or illness. At 15, it could have been something as minor as a sinus infection. She said that typical illnesses like strept and flu will raise these values to 25+ on a ref range from 4-13..
And here is the second half of my blood reports which indicate my liver and HPTA function:
And looking at these we can tell that for the most part, my liver function is completely normal. This is after being beaten down by M-Drol, H-Drol and Trenazone (even tho Trenazone isn't known for liver damage). So, what can we conclude? I suppose that 250mg/ED of UDCA is sufficient on-cycle to protect the liver. Even more encouraging is that I decided to take this liver support AFTER I finished the M-Drol/SD! Also, I'd like to add that my source for this UDCA happens to be a source that is available to everyone on this board that lives in the U.S. So no more concerns for liver function if you ask me! I wouldn't abuse oral steroids - methylated ones - but I can't imagine running less than 6 weeks of any methylated compound should be an issue with udca AND milk thistle.
Addressing the issue of HPTA:
From the second posted blood results you can see that I was totally shutdown. Now when I say "shutdown", I'm not referring to serum T levels. Obviously, the Test Prop had not completely cleared my system yet as my T levels still read a decent number (albeit low). I'm referring to the LH and FSH activity. However, this is the most opportune time to start PCT IMO. We don't want serum T levels to crash down to < 100 before trying to kick start the pituitary system. No, we want the exogenous T levels to be "on it's way out the door" when we start up our HPTA function again. This ensures that we never go thru a period, however brief it may be, of no or extremely low T levels. This avoids that "crashing" feeling that many of us are familiar with when coming of AAS cycles.
The LH and FSH
Understanding how the LH and FSH work are essential to manipulating them into producing high T levels. Whenever T levels are approaching normality, the LH and FSH activity are decreasing. Thus, you have a indirectly proportional or (inversely proportional) relationship between LH/FSH and total T levels. So whenever your body is consuming your testosterone levels, the LH and FSH will "pulsate" to produce a little more. This is an ongoing process that occurs in order to keep your T levels constant and steady. Now when exogenous testosterone comes into play, our pituitary notices a ridiculously high T level and thus avoids stimulating the LH and FSH to activate the testes. This is why we experience testicular atrophy. Our testicles are never being turned on to produce more test and sperm. It simply does not feel the need to. This is also why many AAS users consider hCG (a GnRH) while on cycle to keep the LH working alittle. This helps with recovery in PCT.
Now, we need to revisit this idea of GnRH stimulating the LH and FSH to "work". For some time now, hCG has been the main player here and it is well understood how to administer hCG on cycle, and if one chooses, during the beginning of PCT as well. hCG works well, but is particularly known for stimulating only the LH side of the pituitary system. After all, hCG is an LH analog so this would make sense.
Triptorelin on the other hand is a synthetic gonadotropin, unlike the naturally found hCG. And what do we know about "synthetic" stuff? As usual, Triptorelin is stronger and more effective per dose. Even moreso, it is called a GnRH agonist which means it "brings out" or elicits the biological response of the LH and FSH in the pituitary. Now, Triptorelin is so strong that if continued to be taken it eventually desensitizes the pituitary and may cause chemical castration!
So obviously, the need to get the dosing just right is paramount for the bodybuilder! It is said that 100mcg is the adequate amount of Triptorelin to take in at the beginning of PCT. Fortunately for us, we'll know tomorrow if this dosing scheme of Trip has done anything in the way of kickstarting my HPTA back into production. The idea here is not to have a single shot PCT, but rather a single-shot GUARANTEE that my pituitary (which as seen above is so awfully shutdown) experiences a rather quick and smooth comeback. Hence, the reason I am also going to start administering a low dose Clomid and Exemestane therapy TONIGHT (Day 7 of PCT). The intention here is to kickstart and give steady rise to total T levels over the next 3-4 weeks WHILE using a low dose AAS (Pheraplex in my case). I'm not at all convinced that you can't have alittle AAS in your PCT diet while still making a solid recovery.
Well that's enough talk for the day. Enjoy the results. I shall be back tomorrow night to post the final blood results for the Triptorelin effectiveness.
Day 10 of PCT
Trip Results:
As you can see the Trip didn't do much for my test after 7 days out. Test was still low yet you do see some LH and FSH activity. Perhaps the Trip got them started but never continued to follow thru..who knows. Bottom line, don't bother! You can easily blast with 3-5k iu's of hCG and get the same or better effect if you need to kickstart your HPTA. Honestly, with that in mind, the absolute best option is to run hCG @ 500iu's weekly to prevent total LH and FSH shutdown. That way when you start your SERM and t-booster in PCT you can have a smooth recovery.
Conclusion:
Trip might be effective in first 3 days of PCT w/ 100mcg/shot however it is conclusive that Trip would be no better than hCG or just a standard Clomid/Nolva/Torem + TBooster PCT. It is possible that the Triptorelin that I got was underdosed. This wouldn't be the first time someone got bunk stuff @ a research chem site. Either way, I did notice an immediate effect on my testicles the first 2 days after taking the shot which leads me to believe that it does do something in way of waking up LH and FSH.
As for the elevated AST ALT levels - two reasons...one, I had muscle damage from the previous day (muscle damage makes these levels read high), and two, I had 2-3 heavy beers the night before which were the first I had taken in several weeks. Anyways, the rest of my liver function looks golden so I know that the two bottom numbers probably indicate something other than liver disease/damage/stress.
Better alternatives (IMO)
Use hCG on cycle and have a SERM like Torem or Clomid in PCT with a T-Booster (DAA) and an AI (Like Aromasin). Run all of it 4-6 weeeks and be done with it.
Personally, starting in week 3, I'm going to run Phera @ 10mg/day as planned for 3 weeks and extend PCT an additional week. After PCT is finished I'll be getting bloodwork done to make sure everything looks good.
Thanks guys!
I'm excited to say that we will finally be getting some real, tangible, trustworthy blood tests to help summarize the effectiveness of a few different compounds in PCT. Hopefully, we will learn more about these particular areas of PCT approach:
1) Effectiveness of Triptorelin at kickstarting HPTA in PCT
2) Effectiveness of UDCA in liver protection
3) The conclusive evidence of running a low dose oral AAS in PCT w/ Triptorelin, SERM and AI in regards to total T, LH, FSH and liver values.
Before I go any further - I think it is important to note that, while most reference ranges for blood tests are similar, they do vary from lab to lab and doctor to doctor. We're only looking for evidence of "problems" within these reference ranges and there should be an understood standard deviation when analyzing such results. I am looking for alarmingly high/low results that could indicate problems. So, as I go thru each of these different blood test results, I intend to give everyone a "breakdown" of information so that we can understand what is really taking place in my body.
The tested client - is myself
The previous AAS cycle - Consisted of:
Test-P @ 400/400/400/400/700/700/400
M-Drol @ 20/20/20
Trenazone @ 0/0/150/150/150/150/100
H-Drol @ 0/0/0/0/50/50/50
UDCA @ 0/0/0/0/250/250/250/250
As you can see, this is a fairly harsh cycle with tons of potential "problems" that could have occurred throughout the cycle and during PCT. Nonetheless, I'm very satisfied with the results and as of right now the current blood tests, which were drawn 5 days after my last injection, show promising results for a clean, healthy recovery in PCT.
The first set of blood tests were drawn on Friday 10/21/11 @ 11:33 AM - just 5 days after my last injection of Test Prop and only 2 full days after I stopped taking Trenazone and H-Drol. Here are the results:
As you can see with these results, my blood counts are in no way alarming. Considering this is only 2 days after discontinuing all AAS, I cannot complain at all! I had a nurse look over these numbers for me just to make sure and she even said they are not anything to worry about and that these values are within an acceptable range. For instance, my monocytes are a little high but nothing high enough to indicate a serious infection or illness. At 15, it could have been something as minor as a sinus infection. She said that typical illnesses like strept and flu will raise these values to 25+ on a ref range from 4-13..
And here is the second half of my blood reports which indicate my liver and HPTA function:
And looking at these we can tell that for the most part, my liver function is completely normal. This is after being beaten down by M-Drol, H-Drol and Trenazone (even tho Trenazone isn't known for liver damage). So, what can we conclude? I suppose that 250mg/ED of UDCA is sufficient on-cycle to protect the liver. Even more encouraging is that I decided to take this liver support AFTER I finished the M-Drol/SD! Also, I'd like to add that my source for this UDCA happens to be a source that is available to everyone on this board that lives in the U.S. So no more concerns for liver function if you ask me! I wouldn't abuse oral steroids - methylated ones - but I can't imagine running less than 6 weeks of any methylated compound should be an issue with udca AND milk thistle.
Addressing the issue of HPTA:
From the second posted blood results you can see that I was totally shutdown. Now when I say "shutdown", I'm not referring to serum T levels. Obviously, the Test Prop had not completely cleared my system yet as my T levels still read a decent number (albeit low). I'm referring to the LH and FSH activity. However, this is the most opportune time to start PCT IMO. We don't want serum T levels to crash down to < 100 before trying to kick start the pituitary system. No, we want the exogenous T levels to be "on it's way out the door" when we start up our HPTA function again. This ensures that we never go thru a period, however brief it may be, of no or extremely low T levels. This avoids that "crashing" feeling that many of us are familiar with when coming of AAS cycles.
The LH and FSH
Understanding how the LH and FSH work are essential to manipulating them into producing high T levels. Whenever T levels are approaching normality, the LH and FSH activity are decreasing. Thus, you have a indirectly proportional or (inversely proportional) relationship between LH/FSH and total T levels. So whenever your body is consuming your testosterone levels, the LH and FSH will "pulsate" to produce a little more. This is an ongoing process that occurs in order to keep your T levels constant and steady. Now when exogenous testosterone comes into play, our pituitary notices a ridiculously high T level and thus avoids stimulating the LH and FSH to activate the testes. This is why we experience testicular atrophy. Our testicles are never being turned on to produce more test and sperm. It simply does not feel the need to. This is also why many AAS users consider hCG (a GnRH) while on cycle to keep the LH working alittle. This helps with recovery in PCT.
Now, we need to revisit this idea of GnRH stimulating the LH and FSH to "work". For some time now, hCG has been the main player here and it is well understood how to administer hCG on cycle, and if one chooses, during the beginning of PCT as well. hCG works well, but is particularly known for stimulating only the LH side of the pituitary system. After all, hCG is an LH analog so this would make sense.
Triptorelin on the other hand is a synthetic gonadotropin, unlike the naturally found hCG. And what do we know about "synthetic" stuff? As usual, Triptorelin is stronger and more effective per dose. Even moreso, it is called a GnRH agonist which means it "brings out" or elicits the biological response of the LH and FSH in the pituitary. Now, Triptorelin is so strong that if continued to be taken it eventually desensitizes the pituitary and may cause chemical castration!
So obviously, the need to get the dosing just right is paramount for the bodybuilder! It is said that 100mcg is the adequate amount of Triptorelin to take in at the beginning of PCT. Fortunately for us, we'll know tomorrow if this dosing scheme of Trip has done anything in the way of kickstarting my HPTA back into production. The idea here is not to have a single shot PCT, but rather a single-shot GUARANTEE that my pituitary (which as seen above is so awfully shutdown) experiences a rather quick and smooth comeback. Hence, the reason I am also going to start administering a low dose Clomid and Exemestane therapy TONIGHT (Day 7 of PCT). The intention here is to kickstart and give steady rise to total T levels over the next 3-4 weeks WHILE using a low dose AAS (Pheraplex in my case). I'm not at all convinced that you can't have alittle AAS in your PCT diet while still making a solid recovery.
Well that's enough talk for the day. Enjoy the results. I shall be back tomorrow night to post the final blood results for the Triptorelin effectiveness.
Day 10 of PCT
Trip Results:
As you can see the Trip didn't do much for my test after 7 days out. Test was still low yet you do see some LH and FSH activity. Perhaps the Trip got them started but never continued to follow thru..who knows. Bottom line, don't bother! You can easily blast with 3-5k iu's of hCG and get the same or better effect if you need to kickstart your HPTA. Honestly, with that in mind, the absolute best option is to run hCG @ 500iu's weekly to prevent total LH and FSH shutdown. That way when you start your SERM and t-booster in PCT you can have a smooth recovery.
Conclusion:
Trip might be effective in first 3 days of PCT w/ 100mcg/shot however it is conclusive that Trip would be no better than hCG or just a standard Clomid/Nolva/Torem + TBooster PCT. It is possible that the Triptorelin that I got was underdosed. This wouldn't be the first time someone got bunk stuff @ a research chem site. Either way, I did notice an immediate effect on my testicles the first 2 days after taking the shot which leads me to believe that it does do something in way of waking up LH and FSH.
As for the elevated AST ALT levels - two reasons...one, I had muscle damage from the previous day (muscle damage makes these levels read high), and two, I had 2-3 heavy beers the night before which were the first I had taken in several weeks. Anyways, the rest of my liver function looks golden so I know that the two bottom numbers probably indicate something other than liver disease/damage/stress.
Better alternatives (IMO)
Use hCG on cycle and have a SERM like Torem or Clomid in PCT with a T-Booster (DAA) and an AI (Like Aromasin). Run all of it 4-6 weeeks and be done with it.
Personally, starting in week 3, I'm going to run Phera @ 10mg/day as planned for 3 weeks and extend PCT an additional week. After PCT is finished I'll be getting bloodwork done to make sure everything looks good.
Thanks guys!