Dbol & Epistane

paraloxy

New member
Yo

Short time lurker who wants to do my first official cycle with a log. I also would love any feedback / recommendations / advice from anyone who is interested. I'm stealing my post format from @gmoneypm's cycle since it was laid out in a way that I thought was concise. I put the reasoning for each substance in parentheses - please let me know if any of it is incorrect. Since this is an oral-only cycle, Dbol will be the test base. Cycle supports are there for the increased stress on the organs.

Age: 37

Height: 5'8"

Weight: 203 lbs

Cycle (Weeks 1-6):
Dbol (Wet mass / test base)- 10/10/20/20/20/20
Epistane (dry mass / reduce water bloat) - 20/20/20/30/30/30

On Cycle Supports:
5% Organ Defender (reduce wear and tear on liver/kidney/prostate) - Daily
Tudca (helps with liver support) - 500mg daily
Fish Oil (helps with blood pressure increase from Dbol) - 3000mg daily
Carditone (Anecdotal data shows it can help with blood pressure) - daily
Aromasin (AI for gyno protection) - 0/0/25/25/25/25 EOD

PCT (Weeks 7-11):
Clomid (SERM to restart natural test production) - 50/50/25/25/25
M-Test (test-booster to restart natural test production) - 6/6/6/6/0
Reduce XT (Cortisol control. Reduce muscle-loss during PCT) - 0/0/3/3/3
Aromasin (AI for gyno protection) - 25/25/25/25/0 EOD
Tudca (continued liver support) - 500mg daily
Fish Oil (continued blood pressure control) - 3000mg daily


Diet is going to be 400-600 calories over maintenance with a 40/40/20 macro split

Training is going to be a modified version of what I've been doing for the past 7 years (5 days / week)

I will be starting the cycle next week or the following depending on shipping of some of the supplements.

Any and all feedback is appreciated!
 
How does dbol work as test base?

Based on my experience, without test it causes lethargy and libido loss.
 
Dbol aromatizes similar to test and should be able to serve the same function... Just harder on the liver and unable to blast and cruise due to shorter oral cycles.

My understanding (someone correct me if I'm wrong):

Anabolics are used to increase gains and performance (epistane and dbol). Anabolics cause your estrogen to tank due to natural testosterone production decreasing from the anabolics. Estrogen tanking == decreased libido, increased lethargy, achy joints, etc. To balance, a test base is used to aromatize and produce estrogen. Dbol aromatizes similarly to test, so... Yeah that's my reasoning for why it can be used as a test base. Test base doesn't exist to provide testosterone - it exists to aromatize and balance your estrogen when taking an anabolic. The reason it isn't popular as a test base is usually due to liver damage which forces shorter cycles than what injectable test can provide.

Let me know if that makes sense or if I'm way out in left field at the 50 yard line
 
g0hardorgohom said:
How does dbol work as test base?

Based on my experience, without test it causes lethargy and libido loss.
Click to expand...
Dbol was literally prescribed as HRT, it still is in some places. Solo you should feel pretty good but the dose is 5-10mg a day
Once you get too far past that dose, the estrogen takes over and I'm gonna guess you were running 25-50+mg a day if that happened
 
I appreciate the clarification that dbol can potentially be used as a test base... that said - how does the cycle structure and supplement stack look? Anything I should tweak / change?
 
paraloxy said:
I appreciate the clarification that dbol can potentially be used as a test base... that said - how does the cycle structure and supplement stack look? Anything I should tweak / change?
Click to expand...
ya it's fine. The basic stuff is there

10-20mg dbol
20-30mg epistane
Something for liver
Ai, serm and maybe a BP med on hand.

Everything else you got there is just add ons. Bonus stuff if you will and you have more then enough and then some

Your good to go
 
Smont said:
ya it's fine. The basic stuff is there

10-20mg dbol
20-30mg epistane
Something for liver
Ai, serm and maybe a BP med on hand.

Everything else you got there is just add ons. Bonus stuff if you will and you have more then enough and then some

Your good to go
Click to expand...
Hey bro I was looking at running something very similar to this, I was also gonna be running IF ALPHA 4 & IF ULTRA HARD as well would the 4-andro be of any benefit? I'm guessing the ultra hard will help deal with some of the dbol estrogenic issues?
 
anabolistic said:
Hey bro I was looking at running something very similar to this, I was also gonna be running IF ALPHA 4 & IF ULTRA HARD as well would the 4-andro be of any benefit? I'm guessing the ultra hard will help deal with some of the dbol estrogenic issues?
Click to expand...
Alpha 4 would add more estrogen so I wouldn't stack that with dbol. Ultra hard you can add but it is not a ai and is not going to "deal" with the estrogen.
 
The less things your taking the better. If your on 4 compounds you never uses before and something goes wrong how do you fix it? Lots of guessing
 
Smont said:
The less things your taking the better. If your on 4 compounds you never uses before and something goes wrong how do you fix it? Lots of guessing
Click to expand...
Yep, many times people add too many new things and over complicate tracking their cycle results, and a lot of times end up with more sides without much more benefits.
 
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