Creatine HCL
Betaine
Peak02
PA
Rhodiola
propionyl l carnitine
DCP Choline
Betaine
Peak02
PA
Rhodiola
propionyl l carnitine
DCP Choline
I absolutely agree. I think a big part of the problem with it not selling better for them is the average person doesn't know what the word ergogenic meant.Enhance XT
Revitalize XT
A bit tough not knowing the exact product and trying to be simple since I feel Ergonine had trouble because that’s super clever but at the same time people were like huh?
Thank you for just thinking of a great name for a multi-vitamin if we do oneDaily XT
Since this is an ergo based product you want to take it daily to reap the benefits
Ya it was a cool play in ergogenic and nine ingredients but people don’t generally know what ergogens are and then that they had trouble connecting.I absolutely agree. I think a big part of the problem with it not selling better for them is the average person doesn't know what the word ergogenic meant.
@sns8778 quoted my post last page that Daily XT will be their multi (if they make one)Daily-Gen
Ritual
Daily-XT
Staples-XT
Ergogenix
Ergoday
EDIT: Ritual XT as my final pick.
Okay, then Basics XT. | |||
That was my first suggestion I posted, probably not very marketable to the masses thoughNot sure if anyone posted this yet, but what about Ergo XT
What's that?Not sure if anyone posted this yet, but what about Ergo XT
@poisonWhat's that?
Yea I figured bro lolThat was my first suggestion I posted, probably not very marketable to the masses though
Results are never too expensive, to me.the problem with that is that I'm a perfectionist and if that formula were to become reality, it would be too expensive if done in a 30 serving tub.
Rather have 20 scoops of a clinically dosed product than a 30 scoop product that is not fully dosed.
My 2 cents.
Most people (Think mass market here and average consumer who just buys a pre-workout based off taste or what a GNC employee tells them) has no clue what an ergogenic is. They also have no clue about clinically dosed ingredients or what they do. They base their decisions off cheap deals or whatever they are suckered into. A majority of the posters on here have far more knowledge than the average consumer who knows I need X amount of Betaine or Y amount of Citrulline for it to be adequate.
My 2 cents
Thank you both for the opinions.Results are never too expensive, to me.
The way I see it, I’d rather spend $50 a month and get results than $20-30 for nothing.
Flavoring cost penniesThank you both for the opinions.
The challenge for us because we are so all about quality and delivering the best is finding the balance between doing so on a product like this without pricing ourselves out of the market. Because unfortunately, like you said, the average general consumer doesn't know much about effective dosages or even many branded or clinically studied ingredients. They know fancy labels and how great something tastes. And if they can get something that tastes like Kool Aid for 30 dollars, they may not spend 40.00 on something because even if its a great product, they probably won't realize it. That's where my thought of the 20 serving (2 scoop) but taking 1 scoop on non-workout days came in was so that that we could appeal to the 'it has to be a month supply' consumer. In the past, we've always been science over marketing but we do have to start thinking more marketing wise too - because ultimately if you make the greatest thing in the world but its not profitable, that doesn't allow you to stay in business and make other great and exciting products.
Unfortunately marketing is usually based around key terms and hype; that's what makes it difficult. When you offer a truly comprehensively formulated product at a cost effective price, it doesn't allow for the profit margins to reinvest into the marketing. Many people criticize many of the large companies for excessive profit margins but really after you figure in their advertising budgets, their actual profits aren't as crazy as they seem; its just that they are building in a lot of room into their markup for their huge advertising budgets. For us, that's just not our style. If it were, we'd probably be a lot bigger than we are but we just can't make ourselves do that. I'm never going to be okay with formulating an inferior product but I'm also never going to be okay charging so much for one that people can't afford to use it. So it leaves us in that weird spot of being the company trying to offer the best products but also great prices; which in turn doesn't translate into enough profit margin to run the big time fancy ads.20 scoops of a perfectly formulated product.
Marketing/advertising would need to be perfect to get mass market appeal
No worries there, we won't.Flavoring cost pennies
Raw Materials and Raw Actives cost money
Don't go the cheap route. I get it from a business perspective you could make a non-clinically dosed item and make it taste better (that is for granted)
We have seen other companies water down their formulas in favor of flavoring. Please DO NOT go that route.
Excited to see this new Lean Edge formula. Sounds like it’s going to be a winnerNo worries there, we won't.
I was just expressing that that's the challenge we are faced with is being a company that tries to deliver the absolute best but at a cost effective price and because of that, not having the marketing budget that some companies do.
In the coming days when people see the new Lean Edge formula, that's going to show a lot about the route that we are going in terms of clinically researched ingredients, dosages, and absolutely loaded formulas. There has absolutely never been (that I've seen) a stimulant free fat burner that comes anywhere even close to that amount of active ingredients in one product before - 15 active ingredients, 5 branded ingredients, fully transparent dosages. Will be doing a thread tomorrow with more info on it.
That’s what I was trying to say. You just said it better!I look at it like this - if a product costs 40/50.00 and delivers great results and then there's one for 30 but the results are negligible or non-existent, I didn't save 10 to 20.00, I just wasted 30 to begin with. I hope that makes sense.
I actually already kind of hyped the stress and anxiety product to a friend. We were texting back and forth about how stressed she is over her ex husband doing all sort of crazy crap, and I saw the thread about its release while talking to her.That's why I really hope that people will take the time to really help and spread the word on the new releases; not just on the forums but in day to day life. For example, the Stress & Anxiety Support product - there's probably not a single one of us that doesn't know at least 5 people that couldn't benefit from a product like that; but without everyone's help, I doubt most will ever see it or hear about it to know how much it could truly help them.
Thanks. We appreciate that. The more people help spread the word on our products, the more products that we can offer. The Health Series is a passion of mine - I love making products that help people in ways like that and we want to be able to offer as many as possible.That’s what I was trying to say. You just said it better!
I actually already kind of hyped the stress and anxiety product to a friend. We were texting back and forth about how stressed she is over her ex husband doing all sort of crazy crap, and I saw the thread about its release while talking to her.
I think that may be the happy medium for a product like this especially.I’d prefer fully loaded 20 scooper.
I do think the 20/40 scoop/serving trend isn’t a bad way to go.
I love MCC and if we were to put Creatine in there, I think MCC would definitely be included. The issue with MCC and the required dosage being so low is that so many people in the general public want to see a 5 gram dose of Creatine; that's why I had asked for opinions on Anhydrous in case we were to use another type to add more. Due to the magnesium content of MCC, run the risk of upsetting people's stomachs if were to go too high on it.I think if you include creatine, MCC would be an awesome choice. Plus it provides a decent amount of magnesium which a fair amount of people are probably deficient in.
But from a cost per unit perspective, definitely understand it may not be the best choice
MCC at a decent dose to get some magnesium then fill in the rest with Anahydrous is a cool way to go that I think would work.I love MCC and if we were to put Creatine in there, I think MCC would definitely be included. The issue with MCC and the required dosage being so low is that so many people in the general public want to see a 5 gram dose of Creatine; that's why I had asked for opinions on Anhydrous in case we were to use another type to add more. Due to the magnesium content of MCC, run the risk of upsetting people's stomachs if were to go too high on it.
Thank you. That's what I was thinking as well.MCC at a decent dose to get some magnesium then fill in the rest with Anahydrous is a cool way to go that I think would work.
I don't think there is a way to cover that taste up. I think that's one reason not many companies use it + it upsets a lot of people's stomachs at high dosages.I would pay a large sum of money for a sodium bicarbonate product. It a great ergogenic but taking a clinical dose (200-500 mg/kg) is awful. If anybody can cover up that taste you have a great ergo on your hands.
I have also always been interested in sodium lacate/sodium butyrate however I have never seen them in products.
Thank you for the suggestion. I think that both Body Octane and Clout are/were solid products. We had been considering doing an endurance product that would be different from this. The reason is that there are some ingredients that are great for endurance that aren't as good for actual building muscle and vice versa. We make a straight IP6 powder and I think it's hugely underrated and I also think that Orotic acid is underrated as well.Long time lurker and reader of the site and rarely post. Best ergogenic combo I’ve ever taken, OG Body Octane and Clout. You literally could train forever and you can watch your lifts go up. Body Octane is still available but sharing Clout since details for it are a little more obscure:
Funny because old MAN products just came up in another thread.Long time lurker and reader of the site and rarely post. Best ergogenic combo I’ve ever taken, OG Body Octane and Clout. You literally could train forever and you can watch your lifts go up. Body Octane is still available but sharing Clout since details for it are a little more obscure:
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I saw the IP6 while snooping around today I need to pick some up....Thank you for the suggestion. I think that both Body Octane and Clout are/were solid products. We had been considering doing an endurance product that would be different from this. The reason is that there are some ingredients that are great for endurance that aren't as good for actual building muscle and vice versa. We make a straight IP6 powder and I think it's hugely underrated and I also think that Orotic acid is underrated as well.
Where do you get HICA?Peak02
Betaine
Synerglut
LCLT
Creatine
HICA
I wasn't sure if you were asking him for an actual source of HICA or asking why he would want HICA in there? Just curious.Where do you get HICA?
I’m looking for a pure HICA source but the only one I know of is the chews that has other ingredients I don’t want. Do you know of one?I wasn't sure if you were asking him for an actual source of HICA or asking why he would want HICA in there? Just curious.
I'm a fan of HICA personally so that's what was making me wonder.
I do not. It's an ingredient that we've thought about offering several times, we just weren't sure if the demand was there for it.I’m looking for a pure HICA source but the only one I know of is the chews that has other ingredients I don’t want. Do you know of one?
The issue is the average consumer has no clue what HICA does , or its benefits.I do not. It's an ingredient that we've thought about offering several times, we just weren't sure if the demand was there for it.
Well, I demand it!I do not. It's an ingredient that we've thought about offering several times, we just weren't sure if the demand was there for it.
I've used more clout than anyone, I think, 20-30 tubs. The og jrod version was the absolute best performance enhancing supp ever.Long time lurker and reader of the site and rarely post. Best ergogenic combo I’ve ever taken, OG Body Octane and Clout. You literally could train forever and you can watch your lifts go up. Body Octane is still available but sharing Clout since details for it are a little more obscure:
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I bet they will know about deer antler velvet lolThe issue is the average consumer has no clue what HICA does , or its benefits.
Go into a gym and ask a normal trainee what HICA is and how it can benefit them
*Insert Deer in Headlights look*