constantly very high CK levels - issues? opinions?

[ManuR]

Hey guys,

I am getting routine bloodwork done every 4-8 weeks since i had my rhabdo. (rhabdo was not training induced!)
one thing that is always out of range is the ck value. Everything else is always in range (creatinine between 0,98 and 1,16 every time for example, electrolytes fine, chol ok (good one a bit low but total is below 100, triglycerides very good,...).
However, my ck is always elevated quite a lot.
It has its peak on monday after 3 training days in a row.
This value is typically around 4000. (4 thousand)
on a friday morning, it is at its lowest around 1000-1200 after tue/wed training and thursday off. One time i took 4 days off before the test and it was in range.
Right now i am training 5 days and on the 2 off days i do optional cardio (LISS). additionally, 2-3 days HIIT.
I am currently cutting and my carb intake is quite low on 6 days of the week (below 100).
now my question:
according to docs, its normal that ck is elevated after training sessions. I also know that.
But is there any long time risk of damage to anything if it is elevated?
will it cause scaring of any organ?
is this a sign of overtraining? Sign to deload/reduce training days?
thanks for your opinion guys!

 

[HIT4ME]

Hey guys,

I am getting routine bloodwork done every 4-8 weeks since i had my rhabdo. (rhabdo was not training induced!)
one thing that is always out of range is the ck value. Everything else is always in range (creatinine between 0,98 and 1,16 every time for example, electrolytes fine, chol ok (good one a bit low but total is below 100, triglycerides very good,...).
However, my ck is always elevated quite a lot.
It has its peak on monday after 3 training days in a row.
This value is typically around 4000. (4 thousand)
on a friday morning, it is at its lowest around 1000-1200 after tue/wed training and thursday off. One time i took 4 days off before the test and it was in range.
Right now i am training 5 days and on the 2 off days i do optional cardio (LISS). additionally, 2-3 days HIIT.
I am currently cutting and my carb intake is quite low on 6 days of the week (below 100).
now my question:
according to docs, its normal that ck is elevated after training sessions. I also know that.
But is there any long time risk of damage to anything if it is elevated?
will it cause scaring of any organ?
is this a sign of overtraining? Sign to deload/reduce training days?
thanks for your opinion guys!

So - how much protein do you eat each day? What supplements do you take? What is your training regimen like? Are they doing a urinalysis also?

I'm not a doctor, but I've read enough blood work for family members that, at least for the doctors I've been around, most of them seem to not really understand blood work nearly as well as they should. They often go by the lab ranges and don't even understand how certain things work and interlink.

It's hard to take a single factor on a blood test and REALLY get an idea of what is going on. Having said that, if you had Rhabdo then you had some issues. A urinalysis would give an idea, along with the blood work, of how your kidneys are clearing creatinine and if there is a build up because of kidney issues. I'm not sure what you mean by creatinine levels of 4000? What scale are they using?

Exercise does increase creatinine levels, but if it is way out of range I would try to be sure that's it. The issue is that when tissue is damaged, the creatinine in the tissue gets released into the blood stream and thus elevates. This is why doctors often use it as an indicator of heart failure, muscle damage, etc. and it is why exercise/muscle damage increases levels. The other issue is that your kidneys have to process and filter the creatinine - and if the kidneys are not doing this, then you will have elevation in your blood.

Rhabdo is basically when you've done muscular damage and created a lot of these products to eliminate and overburden your kidneys from it and cause kidney damage, so it MAY be that you just need time to recover and it could take a while.

Or it could be an indicator that you need to back off on training. You should be training yourself, not killing yourself.

Are you getting stronger between every workout?

What is your training like? How many sets, reps per exercise, how many exercises per bodypart, how many bodyparts per workout? How many workouts per week? What is your intensity like?

 

[ManuR]

Hey bro,
i am cutting right now and keeping intensity high. Volume is moderate i would say
i feel fine and i dont lose strength. Im natty and dont take any special supps apart frpm 7 keto, fish oil, curcumin, vit d and
some others.
my creatinine is fine (1,18 ,in range)
its only my creatinine kinase.
i am very good with interpreting blood work but i just want to make sure i dont miss sometihng.
EVERYTHING is in range apart from ck

 

[heavylifter33]

Hey bro,
i am cutting right now and keeping intensity high. Volume is moderate i would say
i feel fine and i dont lose strength. Im natty and dont take any special supps apart frpm 7 keto, fish oil, curcumin, vit d and
some others.
my creatinine is fine (1,18 ,in range)
its only my creatinine kinase. i am very good with interpreting blood work but i just want to make sure i dont miss sometihng.
EVERYTHING is in range apart from ck

You're fine.

 

[HIT4ME]

Hey bro,
i am cutting right now and keeping intensity high. Volume is moderate i would say
i feel fine and i dont lose strength. Im natty and dont take any special supps apart frpm 7 keto, fish oil, curcumin, vit d and
some others.
my creatinine is fine (1,18 ,in range)
its only my creatinine kinase.
i am very good with interpreting blood work but i just want to make sure i dont miss sometihng.
EVERYTHING is in range apart from ck

Oh, crap, geez. Can't believe I missed that.

 

[ManuR]

so i can keep going guys without worrying to much?
ive lowered my volume by some sets lately - intensity still high

 

[Mixelflick]

so i can keep going guys without worrying to much?
ive lowered my volume by some sets lately - intensity still high

Rhabdo is dangerous business, I've been hospitalized multiple times for such. You can't "feel" rhabdo. You MAY notice your urine is darker, brown is a real bad sign. But I've also been in rhabdo without cola colored unrine. You want to work with your Dr here, primary risk is to the kidneys but death has occurred when they didn't catch it fast enough..

 

[ManuR]

Rhabdo is dangerous business, I've been hospitalized multiple times for such. You can't "feel" rhabdo. You MAY notice your urine is darker, brown is a real bad sign. But I've also been in rhabdo without cola colored unrine. You want to work with your Dr here, primary risk is to the kidneys but death has occurred when they didn't catch it fast enough..

i know rhabdo, i had it once due to emotional stress..
the muscle pain was unbelievable..

 

[HIT4ME]

so i can keep going guys without worrying to much?
ive lowered my volume by some sets lately - intensity still high

Well, it does seem like you may have a heavy training load. Hard to say if you are overtraining or not . But I think the majority of people overtrain. You should be training and having steady improvents.

CPK can elevate for a while after training. If you are concerned, the best thing is to take a coup,e weeks off from training before your next blood work appointment. If your levels fall back to normal it would be an indicator in my eyes that you are functioning as expected. If they don't go back to normal then you know something else is up because you have eliminated the training variable. It would be the safest option... but I also wouldn't worry until I knew there was a problem to worry about. You are likely fine, but how do we really know without more tests?

i know rhabdo, i had it once due to emotional stress..
the muscle pain was unbelievable..

From emotional stress? I believe that is fairly rare. I could be wrong. Do you have other underlying issues..like genetic differences from the general population?

Keep in mind you can have rhabdo with and without certain symptoms. Just because you had muscle pain one time doesn't mean it will be the same a second time. This is obviously true of a lot of things. Just be safe.

 

[ManuR]

Well, it does seem like you may have a heavy training load. Hard to say if you are overtraining or not . But I think the majority of people overtrain. You should be training and having steady improvents.

CPK can elevate for a while after training. If you are concerned, the best thing is to take a coup,e weeks off from training before your next blood work appointment. If your levels fall back to normal it would be an indicator in my eyes that you are functioning as expected. If they don't go back to normal then you know something else is up because you have eliminated the training variable. It would be the safest option... but I also wouldn't worry until I knew there was a problem to worry about. You are likely fine, but how do we really know without more tests?



From emotional stress? I believe that is fairly rare. I could be wrong. Do you have other underlying issues..like genetic differences from the general population?

Keep in mind you can have rhabdo with and without certain symptoms. Just because you had muscle pain one time doesn't mean it will be the same a second time. This is obviously true of a lot of things. Just be safe.

i have next bloodwork in the first feb week, then i wont train for a week before.
well, emotional stress was the root of the case imo. my long term girlfriend with whom i lived together and planned ahead left me for an online gaming freak who she just knew for 6 weeks without ever seeing in real life.
I gave up with my life, didnt eat or drink for days and cried my soul out..
my resting heart rate was 118 during those 3 days, blood pressure was through the roof too.. and ive sweated through a dozen of shirts at night..
and this without even training, dropped a good amount of weight xD

 

[HIT4ME]

i have next bloodwork in the first feb week, then i wont train for a week before.
well, emotional stress was the root of the case imo. my long term girlfriend with whom i lived together and planned ahead left me for an online gaming freak who she just knew for 6 weeks without ever seeing in real life.
I gave up with my life, didnt eat or drink for days and cried my soul out..
my resting heart rate was 118 during those 3 days, blood pressure was through the roof too.. and ive sweated through a dozen of shirts at night..
and this without even training, dropped a good amount of weight xD

Sorry if I came across as doubting your assessment...I am not. Just saying it is fairly rare and I would wonder if something else was contributing like a genetic anomolly, etc.

That's a rough break up, but you are better off getting on with your life and not having someone that would do that to you around. I am sure you know that...but I habe needed to be reminded of that a few times in my life.

 

[ManuR]

Sorry if I came across as doubting your assessment...I am not. Just saying it is fairly rare and I would wonder if something else was contributing like a genetic anomolly, etc.

That's a rough break up, but you are better off getting on with your life and not having someone that would do that to you around. I am sure you know that...but I habe needed to be reminded of that a few times in my life.

the crazy thing is that right now, just 8 weeks after the rough breakup another girl wants me to meet with her and get each other known..
and the thing is that im ****en scared and avoid visits from her in my appartement..
shes 7 years younger and im afraid that shes just looking for a short fun-thing.. something i dont want..
well, seems we are getting to a much more complex topic right now xD

 

[HIT4ME]

the crazy thing is that right now, just 8 weeks after the rough breakup another girl wants me to meet with her and get each other known..
and the thing is that im ****en scared and avoid visits from her in my appartement..
shes 7 years younger and im afraid that shes just looking for a short fun-thing.. something i dont want..
well, seems we are getting to a much more complex topic right now xD

Sometimes short and fun is the best way to get over something long and painful. It is good to realize you have options. Options change everything.

 

[ManuR]

Sometimes short and fun is the best way to get over something long and painful. It is good to realize you have options. Options change everything.

yeah but im not the kind of guy for short and fun.. :| well lets see..