Comprehensive PCT after Long Oral Cycle

[TKC432]

Ok Folks .... putting this out there .... any input is welcome, but rest assured this is not my first rodeo and I have done a ton of research in planning out this PCT.

A little cycle history - Again, not my first rodeo ... but this was the longest oral cycle I have ever done. Didn't plan on it being this long but I got some options at the beginning that lengthened the cycle ...

Here's how the cycle went .... total of 12 weeks on.
week 1-3 Basic Mass Stack by MindandMuscle (all andro's, non-methylated so minimal suppression and not harsh on the liver ....
week 3-11 (8 weeks total) Halo100 by Olympus Labs week 1 at 50mg, weeks 2-5 at 75mg and weeks6-8 at 100mg
week 4-9 Dermatrest (50mg daily as test base upped to 75mg last week)
week 6-12 Olympus Labs SuperEpi Elite (added this just because I had it and it seemed to fit what I was trying to accomplish)

Today was the last of it ... a lot of empty bottles

So ... moving on to PCT and trying to keep as much of the 18lbs I gained ... I had gained more but when I dropped the dermatrest a lot of that water weight dried up leaving me 18lbs up as of this morning.

PCT:
Nolva 40/20/20/20
Clomid 100/50/50/50
Exemestane 25/25/12.5/12.5/12.5 EOD
Super PCT - label dosage - 1 full bottle - 4 weeks
DermaStrength Unleashed 100 mg daily for 8 weeks
GW-501516 (Cardarine) 10/20/20/20/20

Now here is the controversial addition to this PCT .... Low dose Ostarine - 10mg ED .... seems to be equal amount of people on both sides of the fence on this one ....and I have done my research ... I am of the opinion that it IS suppressive but at a low dose the suppressing effects of the Ostarine will be negated by the other PCT drugs and the muscle retaining benefits will shine through ....

This is my first PCT with the addition of Dermastrength Unleashed .... the thought process being that this will also help retain muscle mass as well as lower cortisol while not adding to any suppression. I've run transdermal laxogenin before with surprisingly good results ... hence my decision to add it to PCT this go around.

I will also be picking up a bottle of Reduce XT to add in around the middle of the second week of PCT for additional cortisol control ...

So there ya have it .... let the comments begin .... sure to be some good arguments on this one.

All in all it was a great cycle ... and the methylated compounds were a limited part of the total package and kept at the maximum sane length of 8 weeks. Never experienced any lethargy .... been feeling great the entire time ... but I AM shut down ... no doubt there ...

I will be running bloods at the 4 week mark and comparing them to my pre-cycle levels to be sure of full recovery.

 

[flextx]

Do you have real clomid and nolva? Or some OTC stuff? If you have real Nolva and Clomid that's all you need. Cut the rest out, maybe add in some HCG if you like.

 

[TKC432]

Do you have real clomid and nolva? Or some OTC stuff? If you have real Nolva and Clomid that's all you need. Cut the rest out, maybe add in some HCG if you like.

Yes .... Pharma Nolva and RC Clomid.

I respect your opinion .... but several of the items in my PCT Protocol are not in there to get the hormones leveled / boys started again ... for example, the Dermastrength is in there as a method of retaining gains and keeping cortisol down ... I have run it solo several times and it works wonders for me ... the best natty anabolic out there imo ... I am also prone to higher E so the Aromasin (Exemestane) is added in for that reason .... and because research shows it helps increase T very nicely as well. I can see some controversy around the Cardarine and Ostarine ..... but I have done some serious research on these as well .... admittedly mixed reviews on the Cardarine .... but I got a friend in the supp biz and basically got these for free so its worth a shot ...

So .... am curious why you suggest to just go with the nolva and clomid ? Always interested in real-world experience rather than 'research'

 

[flextx]

The aromasin is a good addition, forgot about that in your post. Anything else can potentially interfere with your body recovering to natural levels. Sarms/test boosters/etc.

And also you made some pretty impressive gains for an oral cycle. That's borderline rivaling what some guys gain on real test.
I've got a degree in ex science, worked in a research lab, been a constant studier of everything ever since. Bounced around fitness and supp industry and been training non stop over 15 years

 

[TKC432]

The aromasin is a good addition, forgot about that in your post. Anything else can potentially interfere with your body recovering to natural levels. Sarms/test boosters/etc.

And also you made some pretty impressive gains for an oral cycle. That's borderline rivaling what some guys gain on real test.
I've got a degree in ex science, worked in a research lab, been a constant studier of everything ever since. Bounced around fitness and supp industry and been training non stop over 15 years

Gainz were nice on this one ... but it was a longer than usual oral cycle so that attributed to it. Also ... not my first rodeo so I know how to eat while on cycle for clean gainz. In all honesty I would estimate that out of the 18lbs gained about 4-5 lbs was fat gain. Although my waste size didn't change during the cycle I am looking more puffy than usual ... So at the end of all this I will be happy if I retain 12lbs or so .... not bad for a long oral cycle.

As for the additions to PCT .... with the exception of Dermastrength ... I will toss the others if I notice any issues along the way.
I have used OLY Labs Super PCT in all of my PCT's in the past and it has worked nicely as an OTC addition .... that being said this is a new formula so I am unsure how it will go this time .... we shall see .... starting PCT tomorrow morning.

Dosing the Aromasin and Clomid in the morning and the Nolva in the evening ....

 

[adobepot]

There is no point in PCT if you're going to continue taking a suppressive drug. Unfortunately, you have to pick one or the other.

 

[TKC432]

There is no point in PCT if you're going to continue taking a suppressive drug. Unfortunately, you have to pick one or the other.

I assume you are referring to the Ostarine .... I expected very mixed opinions on this one .... and frankly if you do the research you'll find it doesn't help solve the question any ..... just as many on the pro side as on the con side of this one .... guess it all depends on the person and how you react to the substance

 

[adobepot]

I assume you are referring to the Ostarine .... I expected very mixed opinions on this one .... and frankly if you do the research you'll find it doesn't help solve the question any ..... just as many on the pro side as on the con side of this one .... guess it all depends on the person and how you react to the substance

Sounds like you already have your mind made up.

 

[Dma378]

If the Clomd is legit, it will be more responsible for maintaining your gains than 10mg of Osta.

 

[TKC432]

So far so good ..... started this on Thursday and here we are at the end of the day Sunday. Definitely can feel that all the exogenous hormones have left my system .... libido is shot. The epiandrosterone was masking my shutdown libido wise .... never had any dip in libido the entire cycle .... now that I am a few days into PCT my libido is gone. No worries .... that was what I expected .... I think next time I am gonna go with pharma grade on all the pct stuff .... the RC Clomid tastes nasty as all the other RC's ..... and I can handle that no problem ..... but for some reason the Clomid taste stays with me for hours after dosing and makes everything else taste nasty. Other than that minor insignificant gripe everything is going along nicely .... too soon to really tell but no problems to speak of at this point.

 

[Woody]

So far so good ..... started this on Thursday and here we are at the end of the day Sunday. Definitely can feel that all the exogenous hormones have left my system .... libido is shot. The epiandrosterone was masking my shutdown libido wise .... never had any dip in libido the entire cycle .... now that I am a few days into PCT my libido is gone. No worries .... that was what I expected .... I think next time I am gonna go with pharma grade on all the pct stuff .... the RC Clomid tastes nasty as all the other RC's ..... and I can handle that no problem ..... but for some reason the Clomid taste stays with me for hours after dosing and makes everything else taste nasty. Other than that minor insignificant gripe everything is going along nicely .... too soon to really tell but no problems to speak of at this point.

Put the dropper/syringe in the back of your mouth and tilt your head up. It will just slide down and you won't taste it.

 

[TKC432]

Put the dropper/syringe in the back of your mouth and tilt your head up. It will just slide down and you won't taste it.

Great minds think alike ..... did that this morning .... and it DID improve the situation considerably.

 

[warbird01]

I assume you are referring to the Ostarine .... I expected very mixed opinions on this one .... and frankly if you do the research you'll find it doesn't help solve the question any ..... just as many on the pro side as on the con side of this one .... guess it all depends on the person and how you react to the substance

Please show me a recent (last 6 months) thread that was not started by a shill that says it's ok to take Ostarine in your PCT.

There aren't "just as many on the pro side as on the con side of this one."

Anyone who recommends Ostarine in PCT is s certified moron.

 

[TKC432]

Please show me a recent (last 6 months) thread that was not started by a shill that says it's ok to take Ostarine in your PCT.

There aren't "just as many on the pro side as on the con side of this one."

Anyone who recommends Ostarine in PCT is s certified moron.

Ok .... this is just the kind of honest and to the point info I hoped to generate in this discussion post.
I have been continuing my research since starting PCT last week (Thurs) and I am beginning to lean towards your camp .... Osta may not be a good addition to PCT at any dose .... and for those few who swear by it and say it works for them every time I wonder if they just felt recovered or actually had the blood work to prove it ..... then of course there those genetic anomalies that manage to recover in spite of having Osta in the bloodstream ... so for real scientific analysis their results get tossed out ..... long story short I think I am going to drop the 10mg/ED of Osta from my PCT protocol. Its been a week as of tomorrow and I am feeling a bit better each day .... still not feeling much in the libido dept but it is only 6 days in after a long cycle.

 

[warbird01]

Ok .... this is just the kind of honest and to the point info I hoped to generate in this discussion post.
I have been continuing my research since starting PCT last week (Thurs) and I am beginning to lean towards your camp .... Osta may not be a good addition to PCT at any dose .... and for those few who swear by it and say it works for them every time I wonder if they just felt recovered or actually had the blood work to prove it ..... then of course there those genetic anomalies that manage to recover in spite of having Osta in the bloodstream ... so for real scientific analysis their results get tossed out ..... long story short I think I am going to drop the 10mg/ED of Osta from my PCT protocol. Its been a week as of tomorrow and I am feeling a bit better each day .... still not feeling much in the libido dept but it is only 6 days in after a long cycle.

No worries man. Didn't mean to come off as harsh but it is frustrating when noobs read posts (not talking about you) where people recomment Ostarine then go run it in their PCTs and seriously inhibit their recovery. Then it just perpetuates.

I am sure people have run osta in PCT and been fine, but I am sure there are also people who have played Russian roulette and been fine too

No reason to risk it.

Libido usually takes 2+ weeks to recover (for me).