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ispymalik said:
i cannot imagine what it would be like if this stood to pass.
i am only fearful for the future. it would only take one shot, respectivily, for this all to colapse on there laps.
one death in defence of our foundation against those whos job it was given. would start the offical "end" per the responses on pg 1.
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I wish someone would take action like that..... i wanted to say something like that but i was afraid everyone would freak out.
 
proudly and tragicly, i know many.
thankfully they have enough sence and education to not take this action of face value.
although, what would come next time i know not and can only think of the outcome.
starting such a calamity would be, to my sevear greivence, a day that would live in epiphany. Erasing the entire free worlds past. Turning our backs on the heros and scapegoats of the lifes to those that got us here today. Rewritting history for our own "protection" and truley our brave new world -reborn.

please, for pride and glory know where these words have came. and rember.
"...Foregin or domestic."
 
Rogue Drone said:
Smart man. Truecrypt files and the app installed in traveller mode onto a flashdrive that's hidden away somewhere that they won't think to search at.

One can virtual one's browser, cache, etc. if you set it up on on a partion of the C: and have sufficent RAM, but it's easier to just use Cybereraser, the truer form of EE on your machine and a few other apps.

THE OS is relatively easy to clean, the registry is where one has to focus on to sweep the traces.

I personally boot to a form of BSD on a CD when I'm doing black, it's geek **** but not hard to work, safe and leaves no traces on my M$ Windoze.
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Rogue I remember reading somewhere a long time ago about something called magnetic flux overflow(IIRC). A property where a charge on a disk leaks on the edges and between the files. This can be used by forensics to recover data no matter the erasure. It said you must physically destroy the disk to prevent it. Can`t find it now. Ever hear of this?

Going to check out Cybereraser.

Guess you could boot to any Live CD then. Or even a thumb drive.
 
anabolicrhino said:
I get a lot of comfort from reading the works of the early patriots. Thomas Paine, Ben Franklin,Thomas Jefferson, Andrew Jackson. It is amazing to me how pertinate these writtings are 200 plus years later. This country was founded by some of the strongest willed people ever to live. They overcame the own prejiduces to form the greatest government ever known to man. The first to be by the people for the people and of the people...

..but just like the hard drive on your computer the older it gets the more likely there is to be corruption, right now it is just running slow and we can get by with a few tweeks..hopefully it won't crash.

I am not as rich and powerful as the US government but even I can snoop on what people are searching..I'll let you guys in on it..It's called " most popular searches "..I use it every day so be warned! I know what you did last summer!( or at least what most people searched for last summer) Even with cookies,browser tags and chip set IDs. It would be tough to prove you were the person at the keyboard during the alleged search. Now hard drives are another story.

The Google protest is about having an obligation to report to the government.

This would be an obligation that only companies that deal in goverment securities have been in compliance.

It would set a dangerous precident for a simple (multibillion dollar) search engine to have to report its day to day operations for governmental review
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That is something I`ve wanted to do for awhile... Read TJ. Life, Liberty and Property. No. No. Scratch that... Life, Liberty and The Pursuit of Happiness
 
EEmain said:
That is something I`ve wanted to do for awhile... Read TJ. Life, Liberty and Property. No. No. Scratch that... Life, Liberty and The Pursuit of Happiness
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How about AnabolicRhinos version of " Life , liberty and the pursuit of an Eagles SuperBowl championship? "
 
If im not mistaken, the reason why the Feds want the records, is to investigate child porn, but if in the process they catch terrorists, then thats great.
Also, since were on the subject of wiretapping. Im All for it. They are only wiretapping people with known connections to terrorists or terror org, they are not wiretapping everyday citizens.
 
anabolicrhino said:
How about AnabolicRhinos version of " Life , liberty and the pursuit of an Eagles SuperBowl championship? "
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Ummm... No. Half of Philly AND 1 NYer would be deprived of Liberty by Judge Seamus*.
So we`ll just take the SUPERBOWL!:rofl:


Edit: And 1 Floridian convicted in abstenia.(Well maybe 2. Where are you Dutchman?)




*The Eagles have thier own Judge on gameday who has moved his courtroom from the VET to the Linc. Honestly, I not kidding people:blink:
 
lifter2005 said:
If im not mistaken, the reason why the Feds want the records, is to investigate child porn, but if in the process they catch terrorists, then thats great.
Also, since were on the subject of wiretapping. Im All for it. They are only wiretapping people with known connections to terrorists or terror org, they are not wiretapping everyday citizens.
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I am not sure how much the government really cares about kiddie porn, but it makes a nice cover. They really just want to get control of the terrorists. The only threat to the country is terrorism. Child pornography, while extremely exploitive and unattractive does not threaten the powers that be. If fact porn in general drives internet technology.

The problem is when the government broadens its definition of " terrorist " to include you or me. It may seem far fetched, but the reason the second ammendment grants you the right to bear arms is in case the government gets in the " wrong " hands. The citizenship can organize a militia and take back control for the american people.

The Declaration of Independence, which is the document which actually gives you all your granted freedoms. " We hold these truths to be self evident..." The Constitution only documents that which is not covered by Life,Liberty and the persuit of Happiness. The Declaration of Independence clearly states that if the government ever becomes anything but by the people for the people and of the people that, not only do citizens have the right but, the obligation to overthrow it in its present form and return it to the people. So we are all potential terrorists!!!
 
EEmain said:
Rogue Drone got some posts on going anonymous. Invalid Link RemovedReally good info. Check it.
But not for the faint of heart. TCP/IP was not writen with privacy in mind.

I am not sure the Gov. could convince
our troops to fire on the population as a whole, maybe some but not all
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.

It`s not like this is the first time... Defintely time to trim the Tree of the Gov.. Get involved, email every Congressman and Senator, send them letters what ever! It does work but only when enough people push them then they think thier cushy jobs are on the line and get out and VOTE!

Look at the way PA legislature snuck in thier raise. Only after the Public went nutz did they recind it but some still refuse to repay the money. But there is a list of them and when elections come we will see...
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I served 5 yrs in the Marine Corp,and I know myself and most of my buddies who are still in, would not turn and shoot on the population. We "fight to defend the population" (I think we are protecting other things right now though:run: ). Sure there are some sick gun ho fu**s that would do it, but why would most of us turn and shoot at our own families and loved ones?! It's messed up what is going on right now, and I don't think things are headed in the right way. Too much deception and toher messed crap. Gov't is corrupt, I don't care who says what, I think it is! Well shoot, I would hope not, but it is like someone stated above earlier, history repeats itself, and every great nation,every great empire there has ever been, has fallen! Crazy stuff! By the way, Good info by BV and others on that computer privacy stuff:thumbsup: ! Especailly for people like me who are computer challenged, LOL. Very intersting stuf here, I wil keep posted!
 
Rogue Drone said:
Where's my "ugh, thanks , I guess, good **** to know" positive rep points?! :sad: :p

Friday night spent with you muscleheads, damn how did I get so old and boring?
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That's what happens when you go to Micigan and play under Lloyd Carr :D
 
swole210 said:
I served 5 yrs in the Marine Corp,and I know myself and most of my buddies who are still in, would not turn and shoot on the population. We "fight to defend the population" (I think we are protecting other things right now though:run: ). Sure there are some sick gun ho fu**s that would do it, but why would most of us turn and shoot at our own families and loved ones?! It's messed up what is going on right now, and I don't think things are headed in the right way. Too much deception and toher messed crap. Gov't is corrupt, I don't care who says what, I think it is! Well shoot, I would hope not, but it is like someone stated above earlier, history repeats itself, and every great nation,every great empire there has ever been, has fallen! Crazy stuff! By the way, Good info by BV and others on that computer privacy stuff:thumbsup: ! Especailly for people like me who are computer challenged, LOL. Very intersting stuf here, I wil keep posted!
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Black Gold, Texas Tea. Well the first thing you know old Jed`s... you know the rest.
 
TheUnlikelyToad said:
God Bless EEmain and Rogue Drone's hearts, but does anyone know what in Sam Hill they are talking about? :)
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Don`t sweat it.

If you were to spray paint letters on a cinder block wall then clean them off some of the paint would be left behind in the cracks and crevices.

Your hard disk is the wall, the spray paint is where you go and what you do on the internet. Erasing your disk is cleaning the wall.

Don`t worry only the supergeeks with
with the most expensive toys can see what you left behind.

Trust me the rest you don`t need to know... not being condecending just want to make sure you get it.

Now somebody hit Rogue he may have kept one of you from sleeping with the infamous Bubba.
 
BigVrunga said:
Wow - is that all he got taken down for or were there other charges involved?
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Yep, was there for the entire investigation. That was all there was, those 6 mistakes. It wouldn't have been so bad, but mandatory sentencing guide lines were in place so they judges hands were tied. Its a pretty sad affair.

The only way to assure you are clear is a low level format. Even long deleted files can be dug up off a harddrive with the right tools.
 
anabolicrhino said:
I am not sure how much the government really cares about kiddie porn, but it makes a nice cover. They really just want to get control of the terrorists. The only threat to the country is terrorism.
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There are no terrorists out side of the US.
The only enemies we have are the ones that we have elected..... or "elected" :rolleyes:

anabolicrhino said:
The problem is when the government broadens its definition of " terrorist " to include you or me. It may seem far fetched, but the reason the second ammendment grants you the right to bear arms is in case the government gets in the " wrong " hands. The citizenship can organize a militia and take back control for the american people.

The Declaration of Independence, which is the document which actually gives you all your granted freedoms. " We hold these truths to be self evident..." The Constitution only documents that which is not covered by Life,Liberty and the persuit of Happiness. The Declaration of Independence clearly states that if the government ever becomes anything but by the people for the people and of the people that, not only do citizens have the right but, the obligation to overthrow it in its present form and return it to the people. So we are all potential terrorists!!!
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that i agree with
 
Using "Public Proxies"(misconfigured private servers) is a crime in itself, one where the victim, wether it's the proxy and/or the website you visited to do whatever, has your IPA logged at the proxy for evidence. Not Anonymous.

Chances of pursuit from just using a proxy without a crime done on the receiving end? Minimal, but it's weak and insecure versus better and easily avaliable alternatives.
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True, but for the average user who is pursuing a legal activity but doesnt want his IP logged, public proxies offer at least some level of anonymity. There's some really good info on this site:

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Also, another good idea is to try and use a proxy that is located out of the US...

Evidence Eliminator? Get a copy of Encase, the most often used by law enforcement computer forensic tool, avaliable on the binaries and P2P, and you'll see if EE really does overwrite one's file slack and swap file, the biggest problem areas on a PC, as is claimed, it does not.
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Thanks for the info on Encase, Ill look into that. The advice above to have a dedicated machine browsing on DVD-based Linux is the best idea...nothing gets stored on your machine.
 
Yep, was there for the entire investigation. That was all there was, those 6 mistakes. It wouldn't have been so bad, but mandatory sentencing guide lines were in place so they judges hands were tied. Its a pretty sad affair.

The only way to assure you are clear is a low level format. Even long deleted files can be dug up off a harddrive with the right tools.
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Wow, that really, really sucks. And the pics were just pop ups and spam?? That's totally fucked.

If you really are worried about data on the HD, just smash the **** out of it, burn it, and get a new one:)

BV
 
BigVrunga said:
Wow, that really, really sucks. And the pics were just pop ups and spam?? That's totally fucked.

If you really are worried about data on the HD, just smash the **** out of it, burn it, and get a new one:)

BV
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They tracked him down through Kazaa, and the best any of us can speculate is that the pics were obtained by a trojan in another file. Bleh.

I talk to him every week now. What just caps it all off, the food there sucks and you can only do cardio. They don't allow strength training anymore in an attempt to lower the danger. We used to train together.

Strong guy though that can let it go and joke about the food.
 
I talk to him every week now. What just caps it all off, the food there sucks and you can only do cardio. They don't allow strength training anymore in an attempt to lower the danger. We used to train together.

Strong guy though that can let it go and joke about the food.
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Dude, that is so terrible! Best of luck to your friend, that sucks.
 
swole210 said:
.... Sure there are some sick gun ho fu**s that would do it, but why would most of us turn and shoot at our own families and loved ones?!... !
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look up douglas macarthur and what he did to the WW1 veterans who marched on washington.
 
tiggermoon said:
look up douglas macarthur and what he did to the WW1 veterans who marched on washington.
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That is some F**ked up ****!!! Those were guys he probably fought with! Like I said, there are some sick gun ho F**kers that would do whatever they are told!
 
Whiskey Steve said:
There are no terrorists out side of the US.
The only enemies we have are the ones that we have elected..... or "elected" :rolleyes:


Yeah....Our elected officials bombed the U.S.S Cole, they bombed our Embassy in Kenya, they kidnapped out officials in Iran during the '70s, the hijacked planes and flew them into building, and they are the ones killing our soldiers and innocent people with suicide bombers.

Im hoping you were just kidding, if not, you are extremely delusional.
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lifter2005 said:
Whiskey Steve said:
There are no terrorists out side of the US.
The only enemies we have are the ones that we have elected..... or "elected" :rolleyes:


Yeah....Our elected officials bombed the U.S.S Cole, they bombed our Embassy in Kenya, they kidnapped out officials in Iran during the '70s, the hijacked planes and flew them into building, and they are the ones killing our soldiers and innocent people with suicide bombers.

Im hoping you were just kidding, if not, you are extremely delusional.
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This is for another debate, but there is SIGNIFICANT evidence about the 9/11 attacks you might find disturbing to say the least. And I'm not talking about conspiracy theory bullshit either. Our elected officials may not have physically flown the planes, but they damn sure knew about it and let it happen. That's just the tip of the berg'.
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I was refering to our current situation.

And notice that all of the attacks you reffered to happened outside the US.

With the exception of 911..... which was not a true terrorist attack.
as for the others....no comment at this time
 
With the porn thing....what if you dont open the emails containing such things.
I get email titled with that kind of **** all the time. I dont look at them though. They know whether or not you opened it right? Couldn't i just say that i must have glanced over it?
 
I dont even know how to go about that....
and all of them where deleated before opened....

I dont surf porn sites of anykind so I dont think im "on the radar".... i just wont worry about it.
It was mostly on my home computer from my little bro looking for cheats for playstation. Those site will give you virus' and **** up the ass.
 
FBI's site has an anonymous report thing. If something did happen, IP logs could be drawn and you''d be cleared, I'd hope.
 
That site that was mentioned earlier I`ve been there and read most of it.
It seemed to be an extention of Farenhiet 9/11 to me. I know there are seriously unscrupulous people in the world but even I find some of the stuff well let`s say wacko:blink:


What struck me about the alleged, is it confirmed I haven`t heard yet, Benni Louden( just a name we sometimes use in converstaions:twisted: ) tape was the mention of a conditional surrender. Might not be the first time but when does a Zealot go from DIE-DIE-DIE to ok stop and we will... Hmmm...
 
EEmain said:
That site that was mentioned earlier I`ve been there and read most of it.
It seemed to be an extention of Farenhiet 9/11 to me. I know there are seriously unscrupulous people in the world but even I find some of the stuff well let`s say wacko:blink:


What struck me about the alleged, is it confirmed I haven`t heard yet, Benni Louden( just a name we sometimes use in converstaions:twisted: ) tape was the mention of a conditional surrender. Might not be the first time but when does a Zealot go from DIE-DIE-DIE to ok stop and we will... Hmmm...
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That must be part of his new program.
He is also dropping authors names and "pimping" books. The guys book sales have gone threw the roof ( # 30 on amazon best seller up over 200 places since the tape was released ) There is no bad publicity!
 
Rogue Drone said:
2 - Al-Queda has, as far a I know, only struck domestically twice, WTC '93 and '01, in the last 12/13 years. If this is the dedicated and sophisticated terror organization that's it's portrayed to be, why not more often? Is it difficult to enter the US covertly?,no. Is it difficult to manufacture, buy or steal the necessary equipment, not really. Again, why not more often?
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I have often wondered that... hell the IRA in Northern Ireland and the PLO in the West Bank made live hell on daily for the residents in their respective areas. Hell, Red Brigard did the same thing in two countries, Germany and Italy.
 
Matthew D said:
I have often wondered that... hell the IRA in Northern Ireland and the PLO in the West Bank made live hell on daily for the residents in their respective areas. Hell, Red Brigard did the same thing in two countries, Germany and Italy.
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You can add El Sendero Luminosos (The Shining Path) in Peru to that list. They wreaked havoc on Peruvian society for about a decade.
.
 
lifter2005 said:
No need to get so paranoid. The gov. is trying to figure out what people are searching for, not WHO is the doing the searching.
That is why AOL, MSN, and Yahoo were so willing to hand over the info.
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Name one step towards government power that's ever been turned back over time. If they have a power, it will be expanded and abused plain and simple. For our own good of course.
 
ispymalik said:
what is this "its all over now" crap?
we the people, own this goverment this entire nation!
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That's arguable. It comes down, as do many things, to economics. Marginal choices. No one wants to spend their time revolting, even if it is bloodless. Until the government crushes the citizenry so much that other choices become unattractive or impossible compared to a revolution of some kind, things will keep on their current course.
 
Whiskey Steve said:
im getting used to seeing that come up.
you are the **** CDB!!
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It's late and I'm still a bit drunk from all the wine today, and I just spent a half hour looking to this user "Pop Up" before I figured this out.

Christ, I have to work tomorrow.:sick:
 
i read it but why does bush care about if you can find porn online? i remember being in 5th grade when i looked up my first porn site, i wonder if he is just saying thats why he wants all the records, so he can really see if anyone is trying to do a 911 or something, its just fucking stupid, at least google is fighting them though
 
texas said:
i read it but why does bush care about if you can find porn online? i remember being in 5th grade when i looked up my first porn site, i wonder if he is just saying thats why he wants all the records, so he can really see if anyone is trying to do a 911 or something, its just fucking stupid, at least google is fighting them though
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It'll be like anything else the government sticks its toe into. They may somehow use it to fight terrorism, though I don't see how. However, the next time some nimrod comes out and tries to censor the internet, the data from these finds will most certainly be used to scare certain groups, like parents, to gain support for censorship.
 
Damn..

Just watched "Enemy of the State" this weekend - scary how a piece of fiction from 1997 is turning into reality almost 10 yrs later.. :jaw:
 
Y2Jversion1 said:
Damn..

Just watched "Enemy of the State" this weekend - scary how a piece of fiction from 1997 is turning into reality almost 10 yrs later.. :jaw:
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What sucks (though i have not seen the movie) is that movies like that destroy the reality of the situation for a lot of people (unintelligent/niave people from my observation). They call us "crazy" and say we have an overactive imagination. I say you are the "crazy" one if you cant see the reasoning behind others thinking....no matter how true or false it may be. (when one cant see the reasoning behind anothers thoughts it is because they are not a logical person. They let emotions and habitual thinking get in the way of their understanding of anothers thoughts.) hope that made sense

people that are unintelligent throw out the simple "your crazy" defense when they dont have sufficient mental capacity to have an intelligent conversation with you.
 
Whiskey Steve said:
What sucks (though i have not seen the movie) is that movies like that destroy the reality of the situation for a lot of people (unintelligent/niave people from my observation). They call us "crazy" and say we have an overactive imagination. I say you are the "crazy" one if you cant see the reasoning behind others thinking....no matter how true or false it may be. (when one cant see the reasoning behind anothers thoughts it is because they are not a logical person. They let emotions and habitual thinking get in the way of their understanding of anothers thoughts.) hope that made sense

people that are unintelligent throw out the simple "your crazy" defense when they dont have sufficient mental capacity to have an intelligent conversation with you.
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Very true..

Now I just hope that Harper doesn't become PM here in Canada - especially after learning that he's associated with the Bilderbergers & G Dubbya..

I don't want us to become the 51st state...

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Very true..

Now I just hope that Harper doesn't become PM here in Canada - especially after learning that he's associated with the Bilderbergers & G Dubbya..

I don't want us to become the 51st state...
__________________
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You know, ever since I was a kid my old man would go on and on about how the ruling elite of the United States had a secret society whose long term goal was absolute power and a return to a feudalistic system of power.

I just kind of ignored it, but as I get older and I see the way things are going, I cant help but think he is right to some degree.

The role of government in our lives becomes larger, and our own personal choices become less significant as time goes on.
 
BigVrunga said:
You know, ever since I was a kid my old man would go on and on about how the ruling elite of the United States had a secret society whose long term goal was absolute power and a return to a feudalistic system of power.

I just kind of ignored it, but as I get older and I see the way things are going, I cant help but think he is right to some degree.

The role of government in our lives becomes larger, and our own personal choices become less significant as time goes on.
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My dad taught me the same thing.....
and i am so thankful
 
I think the only people that need to worry are terrorist and terrorist supporters, and child porn collectors. This whole google thing is an attempt by the DOJ to find out what keywords people are using. The indentity of the person doing the search is not revealed. Hence the reason why MSN, AOL, and yahoo handed over their data without saying a word.

If we had a president in the '90s who was actively pursuing terrorists, wiretapping suspected terrorist, and hunting them down, then 911 may not have happend. I dont blame Clinton, however, there were numerous terror attacks while he was President, and his only response was to fire a cruise missile at bin ladens tent.

I think this whole discussion is vey interesting. I hope it continues.
Take Care.
 
Rogue Drone said:
Two questions that I have pondered about this "War on Terror" are

1 -Historically, small groups within Goverments have orchestated events to gain power and further their agendas, could this have happened here? and if this is so, very plausible possibility I think, why have'nt they struck again domestically to continue and/or add changes/ gain power when the tide of popular, legislative and judicial opinion appers to be turning against what I'll term the "hawks" agenda?

2 - Al-Queda has, as far a I know, only struck domestically twice, WTC '93 and '01, in the last 12/13 years. If this is the dedicated and sophisticated terror organization that's it's portrayed to be, why not more often? Is it difficult to enter the US covertly?,no. Is it difficult to manufacture, buy or steal the necessary equipment, not really. Again, why not more often?

One possible explanation is that before '01 they were'nt up to speed, and after '01 we are, we have done a great job of prevention. Another is that this is the modern equivelent of the 17th Century European Witch Hunts, a very dubious threat that's being prosecuted to gain power over the people.

I'm inclined to more believe the latter, my association to goverment makes me highly skeptical of their ethics and competence.

That's not me saying that's there's not a terrorist threat, but I'm not willing to sign on to restructuring of our way of life based on the evidence of threat I'm seeing.

I have more questions than answers. I'm not on the inside of counterterrorism, and that process is so compartmentalized that many people who supposedly are don't have a true understanding of the big picture.

I do believe two things. One is that Thomas Jefferson, Paine, Franklin, etc. would probably say that we as a free people have much more to fear from an encroaching government than from a terrorist organization and two that all this emphasis on counterterrrorism has seriously diminished capacity in countercrime work within law enforcement, they've been bleeding the latter to pay the former.


More questions than answers, stay alert, stay critical.
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In response to your second question. Just remember, you only hear about the governments failures. Like 911, WTC in 93, USS cole, etc. We rarely, if ever, hear about the governments successes. We have no idea how many terror attacks the gov. has prevented. Occasionally we here something, like a few years ago, the feds caught a middle eastern man with explosives in his car enroute to LAX airport.
There have been sucesses. Ony we probably wont here about them.
 
lifter2005 said:
I think the only people that need to worry are terrorist and terrorist supporters, and child porn collectors.
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If thier identies are hidden then no one needs to worry more because of this new thing. The child porn collectors already needed to worry as someone already explained but that is irrelevant.

There is not need PEROID for the government to know what anonymous people are looking at. This is a distraction. That is the ONLY explanation.
 
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