2016 NFL Thread

rugger48 said:
I don't think that at all, media pushes Pittsburgh as a defensive team all the time but it isn't true the past couple years haven't been good for the defense. We have missed on a lot of draft pics on that side of the ball. Offensively we are better than average, but Ben is McNair/mcnabb 2.0. He is/ was great as extending the play problem is just like the other 2 he takes to many hits. It's going to be hard for Ben to play into his late 30's. Like s Brady, Bree's, manning because of that.


The steelers need to think about the n cut guy to take over from Ben, but historically the steelers don't do that well.
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Steelers are not ready for next generation. Pass first league and they will rely on the run when Ben is gone. He is the only qb there to get the ball to brown. And he is not afraid in that pocket. Much respect for him
 
jswain34 said:
I dont think ive seen any pitt fan saying they have the best D this year. And "TB = GOAT" here we go again.
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Without a doubt in mind TB is the GOAT. BB is GOAT coach as well. Eli is TB daddy tho so it all balances out
 
The Solution said:
Chicago vs SF
Chicago dismantles the 49'ers and they continue to struggle with only 1 win on the year. Looks like Cleveland and 49'ers will be picking ealry

Baltimore vs Miami:
Flacco explodes, and put up a ton of points on Miami who was hot for 7 games in a row. Baltimore rolls in every aspect of this game. Was a blow out.

Cincy vs Philly:
Philly continues to go in a downward spiral. Cincy showed up and domianted from start to finish. Wentz is struggling, but that defense is giving up way too many points to be competitive.

GB vs Houston:
Both teams struggled on offense, but that is to be expected in the snow on Lambeau Field in the winter. Both QB's had 0 picks, and only 1 fumble each way. Close game with GB coming out victorious.

Denver vs Jax
Even with Lynch in, Denver takes care of business 20-10 on the road vs JAX.

New England vs LA:
Brady is too much for LA, and NE's defense is looking good. Even without Gronk they can carry the team into the playoffs and still be deadly on offense.

Detroit vs NO:
Detroit's defense crushed NO at home. Brees had trouble in the pocket all day long. Detroit is looking good as the playoffs are looming, they should be able to make a late surge and get themselves in.

KC VS ATL
Upset of the day IMO. KC came into Atlanta and walks away with the win. Berry had a huge interception down the line which set up the 2 point conversion for the W. What a hell of a finish.

Tampa Bay Vs San Diego:
San Diego has too many turnovers and lets the Bucs escape with a win on the road. Winston played ok, but really the Chargers made too many mistakes and turnovers.

Pittsburgh vs New York Giants:

Pittsburgh goes up early 14-0 in the first half. Lots of bell, lots of AB, but the Steeler Defense was the star of the show today. The steelers controlled the clock and won the battle up front. Eli & The Giants go 0-3 on 4th down which really helped the Steelers.

Washington vs Arizona:
Palmer throws for 300 and 3 TD's. They get the edge and get away with a W. Washington slides, but Zona needed that win big Time with the playoffs coming.

Oakland vs Buffalo:
Oakland just way too much firepower on offense for Buffalo to keep up. Oakland is looking very good this year, and should be a force by how many points they continue to put up each and every week.
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The Lions are 2 games ahead of the next best team in the NFC North. At this point, it isn't them "squeezing" into the postseason.
Bmac63095 said:
Yes Brady is the best. And will be. Makes people better .wins rings. Hot wife. Like smoking hot.
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Except for how Peyton Manning still owns all of the relevant QB records. Teams win games, not individual players. Manning has better positional numbers in every category.

Colts without Manning? 2-14. Pats without Brady? 11-5. I think we all know which QB was making a bigger difference for their team.
 
America's Team update. Dallas first team to lock up playoff spot. Highest rated TNF game in history last week. Thanksgiving highest rated regular season game in history for fox. With that being said Tampa game will be flexed to prime time so 4 primetime games in a row. How bout dem cowboys. Steelers game moved to non prime time.
 
rugger48 said:
I don't think that at all, media pushes Pittsburgh as a defensive team all the time but it isn't true the past couple years haven't been good for the defense. We have missed on a lot of draft pics on that side of the ball. Offensively we are better than average, but Ben is McNair/mcnabb 2.0. He is/ was great as extending the play problem is just like the other 2 he takes to many hits. It's going to be hard for Ben to play into his late 30's. Like s Brady, Bree's, manning because of that.


The steelers need to think about the next guy to take over from Ben, but historically the steelers don't do that well.
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I have been saying this for the last 2-3 years.
When are the steelers going to invest in a franchise QB to back up Ben???
He won't last forever, hes been in the league 10+ Years and has been hit so many damn times. Consistent injuries he battles every year... The Steelers need to look at a QB this draft and give that guy time behind ben to develop.

While I think our defense is good, our offense is better. We need to get some better Secondary picks, LB's are good, D-Line is good.
Offensive wise we got weapons, but we can always use another O-Lineman or two, they are always beat up (just like every team) to get back to playing true Steeler Football which is ringing the bell and running the ball and controlling the clock. Its been a bit different seeing Ben air it out and our passing game dominate the offense. Pittsburgh is known for running between the tackles and wearing down defenses.
 
rugger48 said:
And yet Brady has more Super Bowl wins?
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That's weird, I could've sworn I said something about that up there. Perhaps you should try reading?

You Brady fanboys are funny. It's like you think he was the only player in a Patriots jersey during those games. I could've sworn there were more players than him when I watched those games. There were even coaches out there too! Weird. My memory must be going.
 
The Solution said:
I have been saying this for the last 2-3 years.
When are the steelers going to invest in a franchise QB to back up Ben???
He won't last forever, hes been in the league 10+ Years and has been hit so many damn times. Consistent injuries he battles every year... The Steelers need to look at a QB this draft and give that guy time behind ben to develop.

While I think our defense is good, our offense is better. We need to get some better Secondary picks, LB's are good, D-Line is good.
Offensive wise we got weapons, but we can always use another O-Lineman or two, they are always beat up (just like every team) to get back to playing true Steeler Football which is ringing the bell and running the ball and controlling the clock. Its been a bit different seeing Ben air it out and our passing game dominate the offense. Pittsburgh is known for running between the tackles and wearing down defenses.
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I get your point but I'll take a 10+ year injury prone Ben and Landry jones over Tyrod/ej combo any day if the week
 
jimbuick said:
That's weird, I could've sworn I said something about that up there. Perhaps you should try reading?

You Brady fanboys are funny. It's like you think he was the only player in a Patriots jersey during those games. I could've sworn there were more players than him when I watched those games. There were even coaches out there too! Weird. My memory must be going.
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Well how many did brew bledseo win?!? And who did he play for with whom as a coach? Oh wait? That's what I thought when Brady took over they become champs. Don't get me wrong he has had some amazing coaching and talent around him. However, he has made nobodys into somebodys. Before you go back to the numbers thing, everyone that actually knows football knows numbers lie.
 
Numbers lie...as in number of wins making him the "GOAT"?
 
jswain34 said:
Numbers lie...as in number of wins making him the "GOAT"?
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Ill agree on that. I have not said he's GOAT(maybe I did but I would have been a while ago). But he's top 5

For me
1 Steve young
2 Joe Montana
3 Dan Moreno
4 tom Brady
5 Peyton Manning

With John elway being an insanely close 6th
 
rtmilburn said:
Well how many did brew bledseo win?!? And who did he play for with whom as a coach? Oh wait? That's what I thought when Brady took over they become champs. Don't get me wrong he has had some amazing coaching and talent around him. However, he has made nobodys into somebodys. Before you go back to the numbers thing, everyone that actually knows football knows numbers lie.
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Didn't Bledsoe take them to 4 playoff berths in 7 seasons? He also didn't have Belichek coaching (who may actually be a GOAT coach) since he didn't show up until 2000.

Even then, I don't know who is arguing that Bledsoe is better than Brady (which appears to be the crux of your argument?). This is simple. Before Manning the Colts were the worst team in the NFL. Manning made that team Superbowl contenders with his presence. When he left, they were the worst team in the NFL.

Brady took over the reigns of a playoff team and made them better. When he was out for a season they did not play to the same level (because he is better than Cassel), but they still went 11-5.

Manning put up better QB numbers and made a larger impact on his team's success. Brady has guided a playoff caliber team to the Superbowl. It is a lot easier to carry an 11-5 team to the Superbowl than it is to carry a 2-14 team.
 
jimbuick said:
That's weird, I could've sworn I said something about that up there. Perhaps you should try reading?

You Brady fanboys are funny. It's like you think he was the only player in a Patriots jersey during those games. I could've sworn there were more players than him when I watched those games. There were even coaches out there too! Weird. My memory must be going.
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You were comparing Brady and manning had had much more to work with than Brady did. Not a fanboy but the reality is Brady is a better Qb.
 
rugger48 said:
You were comparing Brady and manning had had much more to work with than Brady did. Not a fanboy but the reality is Brady is a better Qb.
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Colts before Manning: 3-13. Colts with Manning out for season: 2-14.

Pats before Brady: 5-11 Pats with Brady injured: 11-5

Those numbers right there do not support your assertion that Manning was on a better team.
 
jimbuick said:
Didn't Bledsoe take them to 4 playoff berths in 7 seasons? He also didn't have Belichek coaching (who may actually be a GOAT coach) since he didn't show up until 2000.

Even then, I don't know who is arguing that Bledsoe is better than Brady (which appears to be the crux of your argument?). This is simple. Before Manning the Colts were the worst team in the NFL. Manning made that team Superbowl contenders with his presence. When he left, they were the worst team in the NFL.

Brady took over the reigns of a playoff team and made them better. When he was out for a season they did not play to the same level (because he is better than Cassel), but they still went 11-5.

Manning put up better QB numbers and made a larger impact on his team's success. Brady has guided a playoff caliber team to the Superbowl. It is a lot easier to carry an 11-5 team to the Superbowl than it is to carry a 2-14 team.
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Playoff caliber team for 17 seasons? When manning was not playing that team was on it's last legs, Harrison gone, Clark, wayne, Saturday all at the end if their careers.
 
jimbuick said:
Colts before Manning: 3-13. Colts with Manning out for season: 2-14.

Pats before Brady: 5-11 Pats with Brady injured: 11-5

Those numbers right there do not support your assertion that Manning was on a better team.
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Who were Brady receivers ? Who were manning s?
 
rugger48 said:
You were comparing Brady and manning had had much more to work with than Brady did. Not a fanboy but the reality is Brady is a better Qb.
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You are right about one thing though, I was comparing Brady and Manning. What I was not doing was comparing the Patriots and Colts. Which is what all of you are trying to do when you use wins to compare individual players.

Wins are a great tool for comparing teams to each other, they are not a great tool when you are trying to compare individual players on those teams.
 
jimbuick said:
You are right about one thing though, I was comparing Brady and Manning. What I was not doing was comparing the Patriots and Colts. Which is what all of you are trying to do when you use wins to compare individual players.

Wins are a great tool for comparing teams to each other, they are not a great tool when you are trying to compare individual players on those teams.
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Not what I was doing first off, all those super bowl appearances have 2 things in common for the patriots brady and BB.
 
rugger48 said:
You were comparing Brady and manning had had much more to work with than Brady did. Not a fanboy but the reality is Brady is a better Qb.
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Brady had more to work with? Other than Marvin Harrison, maybe Dallas Clark, and Reggie Wayne (who Payton arguably MADE what they were) WHO or what did he have? Bottom 5 rushing attack year in year out (PLEASE don't start the Joseph Addai argument). Edgerrin James was okay. Below average offensive line. Below average defense.

Deion Branch, RANDY MOSS, wes welker were all good receivers at times in their careers other than when they were with Brady. Can you say the same for the guys Manning played alongside?
 
Also the reason manning has those stats were because he was surrounded by much better talent than Brady and manning he much more control if the offense.
 
jswain34 said:
Brady had more to work with? Other than Marvin Harrison, maybe Dallas Clark, and Reggie Wayne (who Payton arguably MADE what they were) WHO or what did he have? Bottom 5 rushing attack year in year out (PLEASE don't start the Joseph Addai argument). Edgerrin James was okay. Below average offensive line. Below average defense.

Deion Branch, RANDY MOSS, wes welker were all good receivers at times in their careers other than when they were with Brady. Can you say the same for the guys Manning played alongside?
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Branch? Welker?

Please child
 
rugger48 said:
Branch? Walker?

Please child
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Lol...great response. Shows your mental capacity for a debate. What is it about older people where they feel the need to try to degrade younger people by calling them "child" or "boy" when they have no rebuttal to their arguments?
 
jswain34 said:
Lol...great response. Shows your mental capacity for a debate. What is it about older people where they feel the need to try to degrade younger people by calling them "child" or "boy" when they have no rebuttal to their arguments?
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Umm I have no idea how old you are, but seriously trying to bring up welker and branch as good WRs and trying to tell me manning made his receivers who they were is ridiculous .
 
rugger48 said:
Playoff caliber team for 17 seasons? When manning was not playing that team was on it's last legs, Harrison gone, Clark, wayne, Saturday all at the end if their careers.
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There were only two times that I can recall the Manning colts missing the playoffs; his rookie season and his 3rd season (4th?). Outside of that he had that team in the playoffs every year.

The season before his injury they went 10-6 with that same roster. With his surgery they went 2-14.

The Pats had the 16-0 season before Brady's injury. The went 11-5 with him gone. The next season he came back and they went 10-6, with Moss/Welker at receiver by the way.
 
jimbuick said:
There were only two times that I can recall the Manning colts missing the playoffs; his rookie season and his 3rd season (4th?). Outside of that he had that team in the playoffs every year.

The season before his injury they went 10-6 with that same roster. With his surgery they went 2-14.

The Pats had the 16-0 season before Brady's injury. The went 11-5 with him gone. The next season he came back and they went 10-6, with Moss/Welker at receiver by the way.
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Moss was "at the end of his career", doesnt count.
 
Oh and Welker is a nobody right?

"As a Patriot, Welker led the league in receptions in*2007,*2009, and*2011. Welker holds the four highest single-season reception totals in Patriots' history, as well as four of the top 10 receiving yardage totals, including the franchise record. He also holds the franchise records for most receptions in a single game, most receiving yards in a single game, longest reception, and career receptions. Welker, who had three consecutive 110-reception seasons (and has five total), is the first receiver in NFL history with at least three 110-reception seasons, and the first with five 100-reception seasons"

And lest you say he was only good because of Tom here is this:

"Only one player in*NFL history,*Gale Sayers, had more all-purpose yards in his first three NFL seasons than Welker did with the Dolphins; Welker holds the Dolphins' all-time records for total kickoff returns, kickoff return yardage, and total punt returns. Welker also holds the record for most receptions by any undrafted player in NFL history, passing*Rod Smith*in 2014"
 
And let's not forget Gronkowski who may very well go down as the greatest tight end to ever play.

This isnt really arguable. The numbers show that Manning was a better QB. The team records without the two players in question show that Brady had a better supporting cast and Manning had less to work with on the Colts.
 
jimbuick said:
Oh and Welker is a nobody right?

"As a Patriot, Welker led the league in receptions in*2007,*2009, and*2011. Welker holds the four highest single-season reception totals in Patriots' history, as well as four of the top 10 receiving yardage totals, including the franchise record. He also holds the franchise records for most receptions in a single game, most receiving yards in a single game, longest reception, and career receptions. Welker, who had three consecutive 110-reception seasons (and has five total), is the first receiver in NFL history with at least three 110-reception seasons, and the first with five 100-reception seasons"

And lest you say he was only good because of Tom here is this:

"Only one player in*NFL history,*Gale Sayers, had more all-purpose yards in his first three NFL seasons than Welker did with the Dolphins; Welker holds the Dolphins' all-time records for total kickoff returns, kickoff return yardage, and total punt returns. Welker also holds the record for most receptions by any undrafted player in NFL history, passing*Rod Smith*in 2014"
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Devon Hester was s great special teams player too. Your also kind of paying homage to Brady with of that little quote that you went out and found on the internet .
 
jimbuick said:
And let's not forget Gronkowski who may very well go down as the greatest tight end to ever play.

This isnt really arguable. The numbers show that Manning was a better QB. The team records without the two players in question show that Brady had a better supporting cast and Manning had less to work with on the Colts.
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Ya it kind of is arguable, when you control the offense and call your own plays you gonna have better individual stats.


The idea that you even tried to compare branch and welker to Harrison and Wayne is freaking ridiculous.
 
IF Green Bay can get a win out of their Seattle Matchup we could very well be witnessing 2011 all over again.
 
rugger48 said:
Also the reason manning has those stats were because he was surrounded by much better talent than Brady and manning he much more control if the offense.
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jswain34 said:
Brady had more to work with? Other than Marvin Harrison, maybe Dallas Clark, and Reggie Wayne (who Payton arguably MADE what they were) WHO or what did he have? Bottom 5 rushing attack year in year out (PLEASE don't start the Joseph Addai argument). Edgerrin James was okay. Below average offensive line. Below average defense.

Deion Branch, RANDY MOSS, wes welker were all good receivers at times in their careers other than when they were with Brady. Can you say the same for the guys Manning played alongside?
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rugger48 said:
And yet Brady has more Super Bowl wins?
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Matt Cassel comes in and he goes 11-5. Cassel, Deion Branch, Woodhead, etc. They go to other teams and do jacksh!t. Manning rarely played with the defense that the patriots had. The year they got solid play and a healthy Bob Sanders, they won a superbowl. But the most important thing to note is that Belichick is the mastermind. He takes no name players and turn them into greatness because they fit his scheme. Look at Blount. He was cut from two different teams, now he is the starter. As much as I respect Tony Dungy, he is NOT Bill Belichick. Its Belichick system, NOT TOM BRADY.

In defense of Peyton........2-14 without him. Takes a year off and comes back and sets records. There really isnt a discussion to be had really. Peyton > Brady
 
rugger48 said:
Devon Hester was s great special teams player too. Your also kind of paying homage to Brady with of that little quote that you went out and found on the internet .
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Except for the fact that Welker had another 1000+ yard season when Matt Cassel started 16 games because of Brady's ACL tear.

I guess that must have been all Cassel because according to you Welker is a bum.
rugger48 said:
Ya it kind of is arguable, when you control the offense and call your own plays you gonna have better individual stats.


The idea that you even tried to compare branch and welker to Harrison and Wayne is freaking ridiculous.
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That's even more reason for Manning being the better QB. He showed his coaching staff that he had the ability to control the offense from the line when Brady did not have that ability.


And again you miss the most important part of my statements. It isn't just about the better stats. It's about Manning having the better positional numbers and being on a team that was significantly less successful without him than the Patriots were without Brady.

The Colts were a 2-14 team without Manning. The Pats were an 11-5 team without Brady.

In case you still don't get it.

11-5 > 2-14.
 
rugger48 said:
The idea that you even tried to compare branch and welker to Harrison and Wayne is freaking ridiculous.
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You seem to consistently be forgetting that Randy Moss guy i mentioned...or gronk. Or hernandez before he went to prison. Let me put it to you this way:

1. Randy moss > harrison or wayne
2. Gronk >>> dallas clark
3. Welker >>> Austin Collie (who if you remember was the colts' slot receiver - played a lot like Welker)
4. So then you have Harrison or Wayne > Branch.
5. Corey Dillon or Kevin Faulk roughly = Joseph Addai
6 Edgerrin James roughly = to Blount (i dont think hes bad - just a knucklehead which is why he has been cut from the last 2 places. Notice he is never a FA for long).

Additionally you have Julian Edelman (who is probably even better than Welker) & Aaron Hernandez....but, to be fair ill say Hernandez is roughly equal to Jacob Tamme so there's another wash.

Manning's teams were dismal without him under center. Like Jim is clearly presenting to you, the records show the caliber of the team and or system that Manning played alongside vs Brady. There are multiple data points illustrating how much better every area of the patriots (defense, special teams, skill players, HC) was better than what Peyton had to work with year in and year out.
 
-Jets cut RB CJ Spiller....the journeyman.
-Broncos acquire RB Justin Forsett...who Kubiak says 'will split' carries with Booker.(placed Kapri Bibbs on IR to make room)
-It's being reported that Browns QB Robert Griffin will start Sunday vs Cincy
-TB promoted former Eagles WR Josh Huff to the roster
-As expected, Seattle placed Earl Thomas on IR
-Bears placed QB Jay Cutler on IR....probably ending his career in Chicago
-Colts LB D'Qwell Jackson is suspended 4gms for violation of policy regarding performance enhancing substances
-FB Marcel Reese (former Raider) to sign with Seattle
-Bills Percy Harvin to nonfootball injury list with the migraines.
-Chiefs WR Jeremy Maclin to play tonight vs Oak
-Jets C Nick Mangold to visit a specialist regarding his ankle....been an issue all year. Id shut him down personally. Not much going positively in the Jets club right now.
-Jets have also decided to go with QB Bric PEtty for the remainder of the yr. Apparently Fitzpatrick didnt know until it hit the media. I'd normally say 'thats wrong' but he has been a lil ******* since FA. He's a jerk.
-Packers LB Nick Perry had surgery to repair several fingers. He wont play Sunday but hopes to return with a cast.
-Panthers LB Luke Kuechely was at practice yesterday....progressing in the concussion protocol. Great news.
-Vikings S Harrison Smith, who was on crutches after last Thursday's game, has a grade 3 high ankle sprain. Terrible.
 
My picks:
Pitt>Buff
Den>Tenn
Wash>Phi
Ari>Mia
SD > Car
Cin>Cle
Ind>Hou (this might be pretty good...if Osweiler can be half decent, houston can take this...gtd that Luck will take a hit or 2)
Minn>Jax
SF & NYJ (Mangold to IR and Petty starts...this one is a toss up tbh....I can see Forte having a great game tho) No clue on this one.
NO > TB
Atl > LA (Julio may be out)
Sea >GB
Dal >NYG

MNF:
NE > Bal
 
Buffalo will get smoked by ab this week book it. Neither of our corners can cover him. Ben does struggle on road but we r brutal on d this year. Rex will take a moral victory by shutting bell down, which means he'll only get 110 ap yards. Hopefully tyrod can hit Sammy deep a few times otherwise this one will b over at half time
 
bloodnthunder said:
Buffalo will get smoked by ab this week book it. Neither of our corners can cover him. Ben does struggle on road but we r brutal on d this year. Rex will take a moral victory by shutting bell down, which means he'll only get 110 ap yards. Hopefully tyrod can hit Sammy deep a few times otherwise this one will b over at half time
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Im a bills fan myself .. i hate rex .. hated him to begin with .. he did brought shady and some other FA's

we need a solid wr .. tyrod & mccoy are the only bright spot .. sammie is nice but cant stay healthy for a full season

#firerex
 
GQdaLEGEND said:
Im a bills fan myself .. i hate rex .. hated him to begin with .. he did brought shady and some other FA's

we need a solid wr .. tyrod & mccoy are the only bright spot .. sammie is nice but cant stay healthy for a full season

#firerex
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So agree I think rex is a piss poor coach
 
GQdaLEGEND said:
Im a bills fan myself .. i hate rex .. hated him to begin with .. he did brought shady and some other FA's

we need a solid wr .. tyrod & mccoy are the only bright spot .. sammie is nice but cant stay healthy for a full season

#firerex
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I like tyrod too but not for 18 a year. He's just not good enough. He can't hit wide open targets in middle of the field ever. He overthrows wide open receivers all the time and takes way too damn long to release the ball. He needs the sickest d ever if he's gonna win. Let's b honest. We just have to scrap it all. I say fire Doug and Rex, don't pick up tyrod option and let Gilmore go. From there to d get best offensive minded head coaching candidate out there, either draft a qb in second round and try to get romo. Idk just super tired of this sh1t every year
 
bloodnthunder said:
I like tyrod too but not for 18 a year. He's just not good enough. He can't hit wide open targets in middle of the field ever. He overthrows wide open receivers all the time and takes way too damn long to release the ball. He needs the sickest d ever if he's gonna win. Let's b honest. We just have to scrap it all. I say fire Doug and Rex, don't pick up tyrod option and let Gilmore go. From there to d get best offensive minded head coaching candidate out there, either draft a qb in second round and try to get romo. Idk just super tired of this sh1t every year
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Getting Romo probably not smart.
He has been injured over and over. He takes another hit on his collarbone he may be done for good and have to retire. There is only so much a human body can take and how easy that collarbone may break again with one minor fall.
Back issues, collarbone etc.. Hes like RG3. Just so damn injury prone.

Rather see you guys invest in Lamar Jackson from Louisville or Watson from Clemson in the draft as a QB who can run and throw and be a huge playmaker.
 
The Solution said:
Getting Romo probably not smart.
He has been injured over and over. He takes another hit on his collarbone he may be done for good and have to retire. There is only so much a human body can take and how easy that collarbone may break again with one minor fall.
Back issues, collarbone etc.. Hes like RG3. Just so damn injury prone.

Rather see you guys invest in Lamar Jackson from Louisville or Watson from Clemson in the draft as a QB who can run and throw and be a huge playmaker.
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Yeah I agree on the rookies but just don't see them falling to us. Maybe one of the other guys might get fall tho
 
Honestly I don't see Lamar or watson panning out in the nfl, if one does it will be Lamar. Could be wrong I just feel they are not very smart and in the nfl as a QB you need to be smart.
 
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