11-oxo

Could be dehydration, I've been on 6 caps a day of 11-Oxo for 4 days, the only "side" effect I've noticed is that my flabs are starting to resemble abs :jaw:
 
lol, there are 4 count them 4 logs allready out from the testers, 2 here and 2 on AX forums, not to mention 1 more log being ran by a contest winner from one of the various boards on AX .com and hes over a week in and hadnt complained of any oddities as these folks have. SO its not a speculation, edit: Chill.
 
My wife and I are both on 11-OXO and we have had no problems like that.

And wondering out loud if "Ergo got something wrong" is speculation and attempting to start rumours to damage another company.

Imagine that.
 
Ok, so I have 7 bottles of 11-OXO in transit...got a great price, so I jumped on it. My question is this. In regard to stacking, what would you guys do if you had these compounds available:

4-AD transdermal, 19 caps left from the original Ergomax LMG from ALRI, a pretty good amount of M-dien, a good amount of MDHT, original batch Halodrol-50.

If my understanding is correct, the 4-AD and Ergomax are both very wet, while the remaining compounds are pretty dry.

I'm wondering if it'd be more advisable to pulse cycle the 19 caps of Ergomax alongside the 11-OXO or just to a 1 cap per day run alongside the 11-OXO at the beginning or maybe the end.

Also, might be fun to run the 4-AD straight through AND pulse the Ergomax or run it 19 days, as i mentioned. Since I'm technically recomping, it's tempting to go w/ the M-dien w/ 11-OXO, too.

Just looking for a few opinions as to what you guys would do if you had these things in your stash. Thanks in advance for the help.
 
nightfly71 said:
Ok, so I have 7 bottles of 11-OXO in transit...got a great price, so I jumped on it. My question is this. In regard to stacking, what would you guys do if you had these compounds available:

4-AD transdermal, 19 caps left from the original Ergomax LMG from ALRI, a pretty good amount of M-dien, a good amount of MDHT, original batch Halodrol-50.

If my understanding is correct, the 4-AD and Ergomax are both very wet, while the remaining compounds are pretty dry.

I'm wondering if it'd be more advisable to pulse cycle the 19 caps of Ergomax alongside the 11-OXO or just to a 1 cap per day run alongside the 11-OXO at the beginning or maybe the end.

Also, might be fun to run the 4-AD straight through AND pulse the Ergomax or run it 19 days, as i mentioned. Since I'm technically recomping, it's tempting to go w/ the M-dien w/ 11-OXO, too.

Just looking for a few opinions as to what you guys would do if you had these things in your stash. Thanks in advance for the help.
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Interesting about the 4AD trans. I'm wondering whether 4ad/11-OXO would be a good stack also. The thing that bothers me about 4AD is the SUPER BLOAT!. I love it though, I'm wondering if 11-OXO might help in that respect.
 
T-Bone said:
Interesting about the 4AD trans. I'm wondering whether 4ad/11-OXO would be a good stack also. The thing that bothers me about 4AD is the SUPER BLOAT!. I love it though, I'm wondering if 11-OXO might help in that respect.
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Yeah, I was thinking the 4-AD bloat might kind of mask the leaning out from the 11-OXO, but on second thought, I would expect the water would subside and the results of the 11-OXO would remain, so you'd end up looking great.

Any thoughts on doing the Ergomax WITH those 2 things? Pulse..straight through..?
 
nightfly71 said:
Yeah, I was thinking the 4-AD bloat might kind of mask the leaning out from the 11-OXO, but on second thought, I would expect the water would subside and the results of the 11-OXO would remain, so you'd end up looking great.

Any thoughts on doing the Ergomax WITH those 2 things? Pulse..straight through..?
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Never have used Ergomax and have never done a pulse cycle, so I have no idea about that. Hopefully others will answer that and also give us both more of a heads up on the 4AD Trans/11-OXO questions...
 
T-Bone said:
Never have used Ergomax and have never done a pulse cycle, so I have no idea about that. Hopefully others will answer that and also give us both more of a heads up on the 4AD Trans/11-OXO questions...
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I've never done a pulse yet...not sure how effective or ineffective they are. Did Ergomax w/ 4-AD and 1-Test trans last fall and had very nice strength and mass gains, but a bit more fat than I like to add when bulking.

Maybe Rushi or someone else w/ some good knowledge and experience can chime in on these possible combos...
 
i think the effectiveness of a pulse depends on the strength of the compound used.. it has to be strong enough to elicit effects with only periodic use and not too strong that even with periodic use it will cause shut down... Epi fits right in this key hole... ive seen TRN used recently as well as its very strong at low doses (superdrol as well) BUT im still not sure its not causing any shut down..... the only real way to know wich ones will work is to try it out and report back with blood... its been done for Epi (thanks to D) but no others i know of yet.

edit i guess this only goes for a stand alone pulse cycle... just realized that if your going to be running something else continuously along it all any how that the only factor to consider is, is it strong enough to be only periodically and elicit an effect.
 
Yeah, that's why I'm thinking I may just run 19 days of Ergomax stacked alongside of the 11-OXO and possibly even 4-AD.

I just don't wanna overkill it and waste supplies, though. That's why i'm looking for opinions on how you guys might do things if you had these compounds available to you.
 
Yagman said:
Wow, three days on this and my pooh is green.
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Its from the caps....because they are black, when they dissolve in your stomach it would dye things green. My best friend is on it, said the same thing, then we went out drinking on saturday night (i know dumb, but its life) and he puked, it was green!>.haha....so my expert conclusion is that its from the cap colour
 
nightfly71 said:
Ok, so I have 7 bottles of 11-OXO in transit...got a great price, so I jumped on it. My question is this. In regard to stacking, what would you guys do if you had these compounds available:

4-AD transdermal, 19 caps left from the original Ergomax LMG from ALRI, a pretty good amount of M-dien, a good amount of MDHT, original batch Halodrol-50.

If my understanding is correct, the 4-AD and Ergomax are both very wet, while the remaining compounds are pretty dry.

I'm wondering if it'd be more advisable to pulse cycle the 19 caps of Ergomax alongside the 11-OXO or just to a 1 cap per day run alongside the 11-OXO at the beginning or maybe the end.

Also, might be fun to run the 4-AD straight through AND pulse the Ergomax or run it 19 days, as i mentioned. Since I'm technically recomping, it's tempting to go w/ the M-dien w/ 11-OXO, too.

Just looking for a few opinions as to what you guys would do if you had these things in your stash. Thanks in advance for the help.
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since you are recomping i would probably stay away from the aromatizing stuff due to estrogen mediated fat deposition/retention
 
Rushi said:
since you are recomping i would probably stay away from the aromatizing stuff due to estrogen mediated fat deposition/retention
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I had read that 11-OXO was best to run w/ a wet compound since it would compliment it well. Not the case? I also have a few dry compunds available to me, such as the original h-50, m-dien, and mdht. Would you say any of those would stack well or would it be best to just run it alone?
 
nightfly71 said:
I had read that 11-OXO was best to run w/ a wet compound since it would compliment it well. Not the case? I also have a few dry compunds available to me, such as the original h-50, m-dien, and mdht. Would you say any of those would stack well or would it be best to just run it alone?
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aromatizing compounds should only be used on a bulk imo. the only exception is when estrogen is needed to mitigate sides

you could throw in some MDHT pre-wo. stacking with h50 or mdien would also provide some additive effect

i suggest that you either run the 11-OXO alone, or stack with one of the aforementioned three
 
Very interested in trying this compound specifically in a cutting cycle situation. I think it would be amazing stacked with Havoc (or Epistane). This type of application is where it REALLY shines I think. Some of Tren's most notable effects on overall body recomp are because of the way it effects cortisol (aside from also being highly androgenic).

Fortunately, AX was kind enough to get me a bottle of 3-AD. I am definately looking forward to checking out what all the hype around Adrenosterone is about. I will post my thoughts in a review/mini-log.

Props to Ergo for getting this out so quick. They deserve some recognition. I'm sure its top notch quality. Interestingly, AX looks like they are undercutting them pretty good in price per dose. That deserves props too. :thumbsup: I see a third brand has also entered into the Adrenosterone arena. As a consumer, you have to love competition. It is going to be interesting to see how things shake out.
 
Alpine said:
Very interested in trying this compound specifically in a cutting cycle situation. I think it would be amazing stacked with Havoc (or Epistane). This type of application is where it REALLY shines I think. Some of Tren's most notable effects on overall body recomp are because of the way it effects cortisol (aside from also being highly androgenic).

Fortunately, AX was kind enough to get me a bottle of 3-AD. I am definately looking forward to checking out what all the hype around Adrenosterone is about. I will post my thoughts in a review/mini-log.

Props to Ergo for getting this out so quick. They deserve some recognition. I'm sure its top notch quality. Interestingly, AX looks like they are undercutting them pretty good in price per dose. That deserves props too. :thumbsup: I see a third brand has also entered into the Adrenosterone arena. As a consumer, you have to love competition. It is going to be interesting to see how things shake out.
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Any idea on that release date and can you tell us who the third brand in the mix is and when their product will be out, etc? I agree competition is a great thing.
 
Could be 11-oxo similar to 4-OHT???

I still got 25 grms left so I was thinking about stacking either 11-oxo or 4oht with mohn at 36 mg for 7 weeks...

If not similar, would be ok to stack mohn + 11oxo + 4oht(trans) ??
 
nightfly71 said:
It's considered a prohormone, too, so I don't think you could use it as part of post cycle therapy.
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Only at high doses. At the lower recommended dose (3 caps) very very few people are going to notice any appreciable amount of androgenic effects.
 
Dagron said:
Only at high doses. At the lower recommended dose (3 caps) very very few people are going to notice any appreciable amount of androgenic effects.
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You could still be suppressed, however. I don't know this for sure, but I wouldn't want to take a chance when I was looking to recover from a cycle.
 
Rushi said:
aromatizing compounds should only be used on a bulk imo. the only exception is when estrogen is needed to mitigate sides

you could throw in some MDHT pre-wo. stacking with h50 or mdien would also provide some additive effect

i suggest that you either run the 11-OXO alone, or stack with one of the aforementioned three
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So, I can't seem to find this anywhere. Does 11-oxo or any of it's metabolites aromatize? I see Pat's said he has no evidence of it being an AI, but I haven't seen anything saying it doesn't aromatize.

I am taking one cap twice daily. Why such a low dose? My strength is up, my mood is up, I get hot after eating carbs and to boot I have yet to shut down. That's the key there. Anything I can do to positively modulate my physiology without going hypogonadal is my main interest.
 
discohornet said:
So, I can't seem to find this anywhere. Does 11-oxo or any of it's metabolites aromatize? I see Pat's said he has no evidence of it being an AI, but I haven't seen anything saying it doesn't aromatize.

I am taking one cap twice daily. Why such a low dose? My strength is up, my mood is up, I get hot after eating carbs and to boot I have yet to shut down. That's the key there. Anything I can do to positively modulate my physiology without going hypogonadal is my main interest.
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11-OXO and its metabolites do not aromatize
 
I'm on day 5 now, having run 3 caps per day, so far. I'm using it w/ Incarnate, fat burners, Blaze, and albuterol. I haven't been on long enough to notice a whole lot, but was feeling pretty hot and sweaty yesterday.

I had a very nice chest/tri workout, and will be bumping up the dose soon. Is it advisable to go up to 6 right away, or is it better to go through 4 and 5 caps per day gradually before doing 6?

After I'm on Blaze for or 3 weeks, I'll be getting on Thermogenic Thyrotabs. I'm thinking this may work very nicely w/ 11-OXO.

I also considered running a ph stacked w/ it, but decided to wait and see how things go w/o any ph's added in, at 1st. When I start my second month, I'll most likely add m-dien at 9-18 mg. per day, probably doing the 1st week or so at 9, then 18 per day for the last 2 weeks.

I may, instead go w/ mdht or the original h-50. I've got some time to decide, though.
 
nightfly71 said:
I'm on day 5 now, having run 3 caps per day, so far. I'm using it w/ Incarnate, fat burners, Blaze, and albuterol. I haven't been on long enough to notice a whole lot, but was feeling pretty hot and sweaty yesterday.

I had a very nice chest/tri workout, and will be bumping up the dose soon. Is it advisable to go up to 6 right away, or is it better to go through 4 and 5 caps per day gradually before doing 6?

After I'm on Blaze for or 3 weeks, I'll be getting on Thermogenic Thyrotabs. I'm thinking this may work very nicely w/ 11-OXO.

I also considered running a ph stacked w/ it, but decided to wait and see how things go w/o any ph's added in, at 1st. When I start my second month, I'll most likely add m-dien at 9-18 mg. per day, probably doing the 1st week or so at 9, then 18 per day for the last 2 weeks.

I may, instead go w/ mdht or the original h-50. I've got some time to decide, though.
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no problem hopping straight to 6

11-OXO may be thyrotropic so keep that in mind
 
Rushi said:
no problem hopping straight to 6

11-OXO may be thyrotropic so keep that in mind
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Thyrotropic, meaning what, exactly? That it suppresses the thyroid? Also, when you say it MAY be, is that speculation or is there enough evidence to believe it may well be?
 
nightfly71 said:
Thyrotropic, meaning what, exactly? That it suppresses the thyroid? Also, when you say it MAY be, is that speculation or is there enough evidence to believe it may well be?
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11-OXO may indirectly stimulate the thyroid gland

cortisol has been shown to reduce the release of thyroid stimulating hormone from the pituitary gland, resulting in a reduction of triiodothyronine (T3)

since 11beta-HSD1R is expressed in the pituitary gland, 11-OXO has the ability to reduce cortisol exposure to this location

this may be the reason that people are feeling hot on 11-OXO. need before/during blood tests to know for sure
 
Rushi said:
11-OXO may indirectly stimulate the thyroid gland

cortisol has been shown to reduce the release of thyroid stimulating hormone from the pituitary gland, resulting in a reduction of triiodothyronine (T3)

since 11beta-HSD1R is expressed in the pituitary gland, 11-OXO has the ability to reduce cortisol exposure to this location

this may be the reason that people are feeling hot on 11-OXO. need before/during blood tests to know for sure
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Interesting to know that. Are there any testers that have gotten the pre-cycle bloodwork, so that we'll know something about this, soon? So, your advice would be to not go on the Thyrotabs, if this is the case?
 
nightfly71 said:
I had a very nice chest/tri workout, and will be bumping up the dose soon. Is it advisable to go up to 6 right away, or is it better to go through 4 and 5 caps per day gradually before doing 6?

.
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considering 6 would be within the norm rec dosage and many people have gone above that even i dont see why not.
 
nightfly71 said:
Interesting to know that. Are there any testers that have gotten the pre-cycle bloodwork, so that we'll know something about this, soon?
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i don't know of any blood work

So, your advice would be to not go on the Thyrotabs, if this is the case?
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you could try it, just start slow

if you're going to up your 11-OXO dose, run the higher dose by itself for a week, see how you feel, and take it from there
 
Sounds good. One other question. I've read P.A. post to take doses w/ food, preferably a meal w/ a decent amount of fat, to aid absorption.

My question is whether it's ok to take your final dose of the day w/ a bed time shake containing fat (Muscle Milk), as opposed to an actual meal containing fat.

I've been on 3 caps per day for a few days and am going to bump things up, as I mentioned. I'm going to try to keep the doses at 1 or 2 pills at a time, spread as evenly throughout the day as possible. That's why I'm curious about the dosing w/ a bed time shake.

I've def. noticed an increased heat all throughout the day and even overnight. It looks like a good sign.
 
nightfly71 said:
Sounds good. One other question. I've read P.A. post to take doses w/ food, preferably a meal w/ a decent amount of fat, to aid absorption.

My question is whether it's ok to take your final dose of the day w/ a bed time shake containing fat (Muscle Milk), as opposed to an actual meal containing fat.

I've been on 3 caps per day for a few days and am going to bump things up, as I mentioned. I'm going to try to keep the doses at 1 or 2 pills at a time, spread as evenly throughout the day as possible. That's why I'm curious about the dosing w/ a bed time shake.

I've def. noticed an increased heat all throughout the day and even overnight. It looks like a good sign.
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that'll work
 
Hey Rushi or PA, if i plan on using this im gonna be using 6 a day and i box 3 days a week, do you think this would cause a problem, mainly uncontrollable pumps that would hamper my boxing? Thanks.
 
Rushi said:
since 11beta-HSD1R is expressed in the pituitary gland, 11-OXO has the ability to reduce cortisol exposure to this location
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I think this may explain my new found sexual voracity. I'm only taking one cap twice daily. According to Pat that's not much to elicit any major effects. On the contrary though I have been horny as hell. Could it be simply the androgenic potential? It almost feels different though, and it might have to do with my pituitary being free of cortisol so it can maximize it's capacity for endogenous hormone production. Any thoughts on that?
 
Kuruption said:
What's a better dosing option?

2x2x2 or 3x3?
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I would guess the 1st option, since 6 caps is the max. recommended on the bottle. 9 would be going 50% above that and would also get pretty expensive.

I want to say that in a bb.com thread PA mentioned that he'd experimented w/ higher doses and didn't notice a lot of differences.

Personally, I got very nice waistline reduction at 6 per day, divided into three doses. I lost a little over an inch in a month w/o cutting calories.
 
Not sure if this link has been previously posted, but I thought it would help shed some light on some of the benefits of 11-OXO.

Invalid Link Removed
 
What about taking taking 2 caps per day between cycles as a bridge anyone? The cortisol supression qualities will help maintain muscle and with minimal suppression to HPTA... just a theory

Ideas?
 
BJJBB said:
Has any run 11-oxo by itself and got nice results?
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There's been a couple of logs here and there. You just have to search a little bit and you should be able to pull them up. For muscle gains, most people dosed the stuff on the high end.
 
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