cj1130
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i have to say that i am enjoying reading this thread because i like the honesty
Notice too how the poll here roughly reflects the poll numbers in the real world regarding his approval ratings, etc? That's interesting, as I always viewed this board as having a larger conservative presence. Maybe liberals are just lurking, I honestly expected this to be more of a 50/50 split as it progressed.i have to say that i am enjoying reading this thread because i like the honesty
No ****. Bill Maher comes up with some of the best funny photos of W I've ever seen. I'm also going to miss his butchery of the English language when he's gone.no, but i will miss laughing at all his funny faces and expressions
He is funny. I love when Letterman makes fun of him with the "Greateest Moments in Presidential History" bit. Funny as hell.I didnt vote for him the last 2 times and I surely wouldnt vote for him again. I am going to miss him though. No President has ever cracked me up the way he has. The way he smirks at the most inopportune times and his creative use of the english language are the things I'll miss the most.
Do you try to spell as bad as you do or is it sarcasm to spell terrible and say ignorant things... :icon_lol:hell fukin noo, that guy has basically run us in debt, taken our civil libertys, pretty much stands for everything i'm against, (even war aside) Cause saddem was a peace of ****, but at least he was keepin islame in check down there.
God we need a strong liberal to run up against the Neo con's but dosnt seem to matter since there all basically in bed with each other anyways, they just blind us with this whole DEMvsREP as a way to divid and concurr.
**** illect bill gates, dude already has all the money he needs so he won't get bought out. And he's done wonderful things with his Gates foundation.
Dr liftalot
I wasnt being sarcastic, he really did those things. I just happen to make that post mid sleep cycle after taking REM! I was out of it hard core, sorry about general lack of spell check and grammer.Do you try to spell as bad as you do or is it sarcasm to spell terrible and say ignorant things... :icon_lol:
OK now that Maynard provided some insight on the Debt Ill handle the civil liberties.hell fukin noo, that guy has basically run us in debt, taken our civil libertys, pretty much stands for everything i'm against, (even war aside) Cause saddem was a peace of ****, but at least he was keepin islame in check down there.
Dr liftalot
OK now that Maynard provided some insight on the Debt Ill handle the civil liberties.
What exact liberties of yours have been infringed upon? Let me here about these invisible phantom liberties you believe are gone. There is nothing that pisses me off than all these ACLU pussy freaks that think Al Quaida should be able to call people in America and not be listened to. Remember, the CIA and FBI's hands were tied by leftist idealistically ignoranst douche bags in the first place. This is the reason the Gov't was completely powerless to prevent 911. And keeping Al Qaida members awake, forcing them to listen to rap music, interrogating them with women is Torture now? Give me a ****ing break. All these childishly idealistic leftist Mooreon freaks need their parents and families killed by terrorists, then they might wake up.
wow this is a old thread. i wonder if all those people that said yes back then would say yes now?
The democrats got control of the house and the senate this year and have not done sh!t they said they would do. Many of them ran on moderate platforms and skated on the fraud and misconduct of a few righties, not to mention the war weariness.
The only thing they have done is tried to raise taxes (talk about letting Bush's tax cuts expire), make time tables for withdraw (cut n run) and talk about impeaching everyone from Alberto Gonzalez to Cheney to our damned President, who is the only one with a damned backbone left. You need to remember, he's the only one who doesn't have to worry about getting re-elected.
:afro:
Don't even get me started on freakin Nancy Pelosi, John Murtha, and the rest of those hippies...
Currently our congress has a lower approval rating than our President... How ya like them apples.they have tried to get us out of Iraq because THATS WHAT 70% of America wants!!!! thats why they were put in office. most people are sick of this war and want it over. so the "hippies" are the only ones doing their job.
i am far from a tree hugging, peace loving hippie. if it was my call we would drop some nukes on the whole middle east. i`m just sick of seeing 100+ U.S troops getting killed a month for what seems like no reason. we look like ass holes over there bc we are the biggest and strongest nation in the world and we`re getting our asses handed to us by a bunch of rag heads.Currently our congress has a lower approval rating than our President... How ya like them apples.
So, would you like it our troops packed up their stuff and left Iraq tomorrow, regardless of what would happen afterwards. As long as our military, whose job it is to protect our nation, quits fighting the terrorists who vow to kill us where ever they can and are determined to continue the chaos in Iraq and can't wait for us to leave.
To all you hippies, I would love to give PEACE a chance, but peace cannot be a one-sided concept. The Islamic fundamentalists are at WAR with us and right now Iraq is the battleground.
I am for the generals figuring out the best way to end it ASAP, but not for just leaving because people don't like war. Our generals, not our politicians.
Agreed! :thumbsup:i am far from a tree hugging, peace loving hippie. if it was my call we would drop some nukes on the whole middle east. i`m just sick of seeing 100+ U.S troops getting killed a month for what seems like no reason. we look like ass holes over there bc we are the biggest and strongest nation in the world and we`re getting our asses handed to us by a bunch of rag heads.
unless the retards in charge of this mess get it on the right track SOON, why should we let our troops get killed while the leaders sit around with their thumbs up their asses.
Honestly, the hands of the troops in the middle east are tied by the R.O.E.. When I was in Iraq, there was much that couldn't be done b/c of the bureaucracy. Every sector has its own problems and its own way of fixing them. Many of the people in charge will try to incorporate strategies that simply do not work. There are career officers trying to make their careers while in Iraq, at the expense of their troops. There also needs to be more Special Forces troops within Iraq. Conventional forces cannot adequately operate within certain sectors. The alligence of the local population can be bought and sold very easily. A friendly group of Iraqis can become terrorists over-night. The Iraqi army is a farce and will never become the stabilization force that the government would have you believe. Its never reported how often they actually desert. Their families are sometimes butchered, b/c they are in the Army. You think our Army has retention problems? Their Army is far worse. Its almost like this, have a paying job at the expense of your family and friends or simply become a terrorist and have everyone revere you for being a martyr. Bush should have listened to Colin Powell at the beginning, b/c everything he stated about OIF has come to pass(not enough troops to stabilize the region post war/sunni shia civil war). Its likely that more bad will come before this is over. The bottom line is, Bush tried to do too much too soon. He thought that Iraq would have some kind of democratic, domino effect in the region and it hasn't. Would I vote Democrat this next election? No, the military was in disarray during the Clinton administartion. We didn't even have bullets to train with. My only hope is that a politician with some nuts will enter in the race. As of right now, the future looks fairly bleak. Bush was better of two bad politicians in the last two elections and that's why he was elected. I honestly don't know who can get things right, but its likely not going to be a Democrat. If we cut and run in the middle east, the entire region will be destabilized. The war will cross borders and there will be a large scale war between the two main faiths of Islam. Its a sad state of affairs.Agreed! :thumbsup:
The rules of engagement need to be revised because this is not a conventional war and our enemies follow no rules or codes of conduct.
But just leaving will cause a much larger problem destined for a later time. I saw a program by Ted Coppel called 'Our Children's Children's War' and the title decribes it very well. It is a sad reality we live within. Our world has a lot of major propblems and running away because we can't figure it out is not a viable option. I agree that sitting there while our tropps are blown up and kidnapped is not acceptable either. Stategy must be changed and implemented swiftly to fvck them up.
Long term, things must change as well. Much more good-will and education has to be our approach, much like our military has done in parts of Africa. But, right now, more swift action is required than that in the Middle East.
Because they bother with us.I love how everyone things everything can just be simplified into "just nuke them"
Hey how about this one? How about, let's not bother with them in the first place!
"They" started it. If we just pack up and come home, we're not coming alone. They'll be following. This isn't over when we say we want it to be over.I love how everyone things everything can just be simplified into "just nuke them"
Hey how about this one? How about, let's not bother with them in the first place!
Iraq could take five, maybe ten years to build up to a way that we could leave, but smaller bases will remain, just like those set up throughout the globe.ok so tell me what would have to happen for us to " win " this war? tell me what it would take to be able to bring the troops home with out it being a mistake?
AND how long do you think it will take? just guess.
"They" started it. If we just pack up and come home, we're not coming alone. They'll be following. This isn't over when we say we want it to be over.
I don't believe the US will ever use nuclear weapons or any other WMD again, and neither do they. They aren't affraid of us any more. During the Clinton admin they kept making attacks on US property. The attacks kept getting a little bigger and a little bigger. How did the US respond? By doing nothing. Or you could say the Clinton admin did nothing. Then the 9/11 attacks came and people wanted to know, "What happened?" The average person is apparently just that dumb. Many just blame that on Bush too, since he was in office.
Some say this is another Vietnam. That isn't true for several reasons. Most of the Iraqi's are eduacated people with jobs and the country is industralized. Vietnam was just a rice paddy and still is. Vietnam never attacked us. We knew when we left Vietnam it was over. That isn't the case here. One way I believe it is the same is that there are too many polliticians involved and not enough good military men who are concerned solely with winning battles and taking care of the troops. Many of the military leaders now seem to be more concerned with how their actions in this conflict will effect their potential future political career.
I don't love George W. Bush but not fighting a war is alot easier than fighting one. I believe he's doing what he thinks is right at this point in time, weather it is or not. If he wanted the easy way out American troops would already be home. I give him credit for not taking the easy way out.
Fighting a war in Iraq is better than fighting a war in New York or any other US State as far as I'm concerned.
I agree that the unifying factor for the Iraqi insurgents is expelling Western culture.I feel uncomfortable reading all of these posts that don't seem to comprehend that the two main Islamic groups are fighting each other within Iraq. The country is in the midst of a civil war. I've been there, things that you see and hear on TV are so dilluted that if you heard the rest you'd be sick to your stomach. The only thing uniting these two warring groups is the general disdain for the West and its culture. There is no stabilization that will occur. Iran is backing the shia in Iraq and the U.S. is doing very little to stop this. To win Iraq, you'd have to go into Iran. Its already become a true quagmire.
No. "they" most certainly did not start this. WE started it. We supported the Shah of Iran. We funded Saddam Hussein. We funded Osama Bin Laden. We have had close ties to the royal family of Saudi Arabia. We have been the power that has supported everyone that has ever oppressed the people over there.
THEY most certainly did not start this. Read some history, and not just history that's 10 years old.
This is where the US has made a mistake with the middle east."WE Started it" that is absolutely nuts! Yes, we have made mistakes in the Middle East but you can't armchair quarterback your way into how everything we did was wrong. Policies and decisions are made based on the best info on hand at the time. The US foreign policy in the middle east has been a mistake as evidenced by the current "blowback" situations. Just because the US has made mistakes in previous policy agendas does not make the US an evil place full of bad men. This can be easily proven by admitting the mistakes in foreign policy and showing the world by example, how a "democratic republic" should function. The checks and balance sytem of our government has been greatly tested by the Bush administration. Our system of government was bent backwards but is now correcting itself to further prove that we as Americans have the best system of government ever conceived.
Thank you Thomas Jefferson for having the foresight to predict people like the Neo cons and building a government to counter their policies of executive control of the constitution and the United States
All of this is the same as the ridiculous "WMD" argument.
As for leaving, I don't see the U.S. ever completely leaving. There are still troops in Korea, Vietnam, Germany, and so on it is just that the people there don't feel the need to blow up anyone in a military uniform. To pack up everything and leave would be a whole new level of irresponsibility...
Not Bush, but members of his cabinet have attempted to compromise the Checks and Balance system in our constitution in the following ways;As for Thomas Jefferson and his foresight on Neo Cons, while I do think TJ was brilliant, I don't follow. It sounds like you are pointing toward the crazy notion of a "Bush Theocracy".
No, I actually think that Bush has been compromised by the people in his staff that are supposed to support him.
There is no mention of separation of church and state in the Constitution or any of the writings of the Founding Fathers. TJ's writings on the issue were all implying a need to keep government out of religion.
I would agree completely!
I bring this up because I am curious as to how Bush has tested our form of government checks and balances?
Has it been tested more than some of the previous administrations?
Not Bush, but members of his cabinet have attempted to compromise the Checks and Balance system in our constitution in the following ways;
2000 election - There was a county in Florida in which Al Gore received( -13,000 votes!) There was an immediate red flag and recounts were issued. Bush was ahead by about 600 votes when John Bolton,illegally stopped the recount! It went to the supreme court and the rest was history!
9/11/2001- NORAD, the USAF and the FAA fail to defend the US
against terrorist attack. Ultimately these departments answer to the President who ultimately is responsible "to defend America from enemies both domestic and abroad" He didn't even say he was sorry!..later blames Bill Clinton before the 2006 election!
10-26-2001- [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_act"]The Patriot Act[/URL]
Congress passed this act after any dissenters had anthrax sent to them.
a 500 page copy was received the night before the vote by congress most of which was never read by the people who signed it. The act contains many Bill of Rights denial clauses that were never discussed publicly. These denials are turned over at the state level by courts claiming they violate the constitution.
March 2003 - Iraq (incomplete) but that "yellow cake" story doesn't look so good anymore
February 2004 - torture and rendition(digital cameras)
2005 NSA wire tapping illegally spying on us citizens. Bush defends the tapping by explaining his lawyers did not think it was illegal and cites a FISA law that is irrelevant because the NSA as a civilian agency does not get a free pass on "no warrant" searches.
Bush then claims that as commander In chief he as the military leader can do what ever it takes to secure the country.
Actually military personnel cannot enact authority over any US citizens(unconstitutional), unless there is a martial law in effect, there was not
Also Bush as the president only becomes commander in chief during wartime. The congress has not declared a war since 1941!
2006The Valerie Plame case Libby libby libby!
2007 The Alberto Gonzales current activity is showing some ugliness with John Ashcroft being pressured on his sick bed to play ball with Cheney.
also Gonzales himself investigated for firing US attorneys that would not act according to "White house mandates" during alleged voter fraud investigations.
and finally Bush has chosen the "Opt out special privilege" on just about every Law he has signed. That means he does not have to follow the same laws that every other citizen must.
So much for, "by the people, of the people and for the people"
That very act alone separates him from the "checks and balance" system more than any other president!
oh and this just in!!!
Well, aren't you full of far left talking points. Exaggeration please... You you insinuating our President sent anthrax to dissenters. Do you really consider AbU Gharib 'torture' and not plain and simple humiliation? In the case of Guantanimo- waterboarding anyone? As for 9/11 Cinton missed plenty of intel, however Bush's cabinent deserves plenty of fault as well. Gonzalez, he handled it wrong, YES, but did nothing wrong; they can let any US attorney go at any time they want for any reason. The Plame case was Lame. Gimme a break. And, War was declared on us whether we have 'declared' it back or not.
I'm sure you wish out President would be impeached. MoveON.FU
Hopefully my humor does not offend you too much.
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