Increasing dopamine

[Zoolander]

I'd be cautious about tinkering with your dopamine levels. It;'s hard to get an objective measure of your neurotransmitter concentration. Keep in mind that most neurotransmitters work in synergy with other neurotransmitters. If you upset the balance all sort of stuff can and will happen. For example, excess dopamine has been implicated with schizophrenia.

I would just stick with phenylalanine or tyrosine but not both. These amino acids are large neural amino acids (LNAA) that compete for entry across the blood brain barrier (BBB). Phenylalanine has the higher affinity so go with that first

 

[WannaBeHulk]

Celebrated my birthday Say Night away from Home. Family went up to my brothers college to be together as a family on Easter Sunday. My Biorthdat was Friday. Have some friends at my bros college went out with. Did 200-300 grams Pea and 50 hord. Nice and clean. Gave my friend some. He didnt comment on it just said he enjoyed himself. Yes there were Girls, took some pics=) went to sleep , just up ate a banana...Isnt Trysomething in a banana a mood booster? would it work with Pea or hord or both? anyways Easter Sunday us family went out to eat ..then took about 100 pea on the drive back home. Hord wasnt needed because it was still in my system from the night before. Noticable mood enhancement.

i do know bananas are a natural sourse of serotonin and can enhance mood through that mechanism since serotonin is a mood regulator. i havent looked into it but maybe it has a decent concentration of tryptophan unlike most other foods. then again, high serotonin can lower libido. i wouldnt think it would have any added benefit to the PEA.

I'd be cautious about tinkering with your dopamine levels. It;'s hard to get an objective measure of your neurotransmitter concentration. Keep in mind that most neurotransmitters work in synergy with other neurotransmitters. If you upset the balance all sort of stuff can and will happen. For example, excess dopamine has been implicated with schizophrenia.

I'd be cautious about tinkering with your dopamine levels. It;'s hard to get an objective measure of your neurotransmitter concentration. Keep in mind that most neurotransmitters work in synergy with other neurotransmitters. If you upset the balance all sort of stuff can and will happen. For example, excess dopamine has been implicated with schizophrenia.

I would just stick with phenylalanine or tyrosine but not both. These amino acids are large neural amino acids (LNAA) that compete for entry across the blood brain barrier (BBB). Phenylalanine has the higher affinity so go with that first.

this is the point ive been trying to make in a couple posts. balance is definately key. ive always supplemented tyrosine as oppose to phenylalanine to be more cost effective. wouldnt you achieve the same end result? days i dont take caffeine or stims, i start my day with 2-3g tyrosine upon awakening and take a similar dose later in the day on an empty stomach. ive noticed SAM-e has awesome effects as well and would work synergisticly(is that even a word?) with these free form aminos to increase brain activity. i am very impressed with all the research behind SAM-e but its so damn expensive

with phenylalanine, isnt there a major difference between L-phenylalanine and D-phenylalanine? does one cross the BBB at a higher rate? (my guess would be the D since it has pharmacologic activity and doesnt participate in protein synthesis) i cant find pure D-phenylalanine but there are DL sources with a 50/50 ratio. i just cant see any benefits it would have over tyrosine since it converts to tyrosine.

 

[Zoolander]

for now I would just stick to the tyrosine. 3-4 grams is an awesome dose. You must be buzzing dude

 

[WannaBeHulk]

for now I would just stick to the tyrosine. 3-4 grams is an awesome dose. You must be buzzing dude

i dont get that typical dopamine stimulation feeling with tyrosine. i use it to prevent withdrawal from past caffeine abuse. it also helps upregulate the adrenals i believe. for me, tyrosine helps me avoid the burnout feeling and helps combat lethargy if im running on little or bad sleep.

 

[John Smeton]

i do know bananas are a natural sourse of serotonin and can enhance mood through that mechanism since serotonin is a mood regulator. i havent looked into it but maybe it has a decent concentration of tryptophan unlike most other foods. then again, high serotonin can lower libido. i wouldnt think it would have any added benefit to the PEA.

I'd be cautious about tinkering with your dopamine levels. It;'s hard to get an objective measure of your neurotransmitter concentration. Keep in mind that most neurotransmitters work in synergy with other neurotransmitters. If you upset the balance all sort of stuff can and will happen. For example, excess dopamine has been implicated with schizophrenia.



this is the point ive been trying to make in a couple posts. balance is definately key. ive always supplemented tyrosine as oppose to phenylalanine to be more cost effective. wouldnt you achieve the same end result? days i dont take caffeine or stims, i start my day with 2-3g tyrosine upon awakening and take a similar dose later in the day on an empty stomach. ive noticed SAM-e has awesome effects as well and would work synergisticly(is that even a word?) with these free form aminos to increase brain activity. i am very impressed with all the research behind SAM-e but its so damn expensive

with phenylalanine, isnt there a major difference between L-phenylalanine and D-phenylalanine? does one cross the BBB at a higher rate? (my guess would be the D since it has pharmacologic activity and doesnt participate in protein synthesis) i cant find pure D-phenylalanine but there are DL sources with a 50/50 ratio. i just cant see any benefits it would have over tyrosine since it converts to tyrosine.

Yes Balance is Key. My friend took Sam-E , gave a good review of it. Thats not to say you cant take pea and a mao everyday for a while , just make sure you cycle off of it. or take it every so often. Once every week or two I think is safe.
Adrendals do seem to feel burnt out after prolonged Caffiene use. Thats why a break is recommended. Dsade's Clear Edge formula has L-Tryosine in it , thats next on the Stim break.

This might answer more Invalid Link Removed

 

[John Smeton]

I'd be cautious about tinkering with your dopamine levels. It;'s hard to get an objective measure of your neurotransmitter concentration. Keep in mind that most neurotransmitters work in synergy with other neurotransmitters. If you upset the balance all sort of stuff can and will happen. For example, excess dopamine has been implicated with schizophrenia.

This study indicates that schizo's should exercise caution in using PEA. So it is people that have Schizophrenia, which is a genetic trait btw, that shouldnt use this. Any person that isnt mentally healthy it is not avised to use this. I have not found anything in my countless hours researching Pea/Hord , Dopamine, D1 receptors, Dopamine Anatagonitist(sp),Mao-I's both A and B, that says Dopamine causes Schizo. In fact yesterday I came across thisresearch study stating that people that have Schizoph,(or any other mental disorder) are not advised to raise dopamine. Did you get your facts mixed up? If not do you have the research? Thanks for your time Zoo. Im glad you said this information because This researched has been heavily researched by I.


QUOTE
1: Pharmacol Biochem Behav. 2005 Nov;82(3):488-94. Epub 2005 Nov 18. Related Articles, Links


2-Phenylethylamine in combination with l-deprenyl lowers the striatal level of dopamine and prolongs the duration of the stereotypy in mice.

Kitanaka J, Kitanaka N, Tatsuta T, Takemura M.

Department of Pharmacology, Hyogo College of Medicine, 1-1 Mukogawa-cho, Nishinomiya, Hyogo 663-8501, Japan. [email protected]

2-Phenylethylamine (PEA)-induced stereotypy in rodents is suggested to model psychotic symptoms of schizophrenia. It is reported that PEA induces dopamine release in the striatum in vivo and in vitro. The present study analyzed the PEA-induced stereotypy and possible associated brain dopamine metabolism in mice. Using male ICR mice treated with a combination of PEA (100 mg/kg, i.p.) and increasing doses of l-deprenyl (0-10 mg/kg, s.c.), we examined (1) the behavioral profile of stereotypy (rating the scores), and (2) the tissue levels of dopamine and its metabolites by high-performance liquid chromatography. The stereotypic scores reached a plateau level at 10 min which lasted until 30 min after a single administration of 100 mg/kg PEA. The stereotyped behavior completely disappeared 45 min after PEA administration. Pretreatment with l-deprenyl (0.1, 1, and 10 mg/kg, s.c.) dose-dependently prolonged the duration of PEA-induced stereotypy. Notably, pretreatment with l-deprenyl dose-dependently increased the continuous sniffing. Treatment with PEA in combination of l-deprenyl (1 and 10 mg/kg) significantly reduced the level of dopamine in the region of the striatum and nucleus accumbens, compared with control animals. These results suggest that PEA in combination with l-deprenyl prolonged the duration of the stereotypy (particularly, continuous sniffing) while reducing the striatal level of dopamine.

PMID: 16298423

 

[TRDE59]

wait.... I'm confused.... that study said PEA reduced dopamine....?? I thought PEA raised it. It elevates mood and concentration, both of which are symptoms of increased dopamine...

Anyway, about schitzo's, you're right, it is a dopamine overabundance/oversensitivity in the brain (although that may be oversimplifying it). Think about it, most people with schitzophrenia (sp?) concentrate VERY well, almost too well in many cases. Anyone seen "A Beautiful Mind"? Notice how he can't concentrate when he's on his meds, but he also has no symptoms of schitzo.

On the flip side, ADD, I think, is the clinical opposite of schitzo. ADD is an underabundance/undersensitivity in the brain, leaving one with a reduced ability to concentrate. Now, whatever is causing this disorder I don't know, probably genes, but one of its effects are dopamine imbalances.

I think both these disorders are a bigger problem than just dopamine imbalances, however. For example, I take dopaminergics for my ADD, however it does nothing for the slow processing speed which I am cursed with. Dopamine helps me concentrate, but doesn't speed up the connections in my brain.

It's really weird. I have an IQ of 140, but even on ADD meds, I take about 3 times as long to do work as a normal person. It's like there are a bunch of road blocks in my thoughts and information takes a long time to process. Makes it very difficult to do simple mental math quickly, win an argument verbally, or be consistently witty. Hell, my showers are 30 minutes long. You can imagine how frustrating all this is. Anyone have any similar problems to what I'm living through?

 

[John Smeton]

LMaoooooo!!I'm laughing with you my friend. I beleive Add and Adhd are only symtops of SP people. Sp's are heavy sensation seekers. Reference the Myers-briggs for more info. IN, and SJ, possibly IF's but think the IN's catagorized this natural behavior trait, and made up a name for it because are not Sp's themselves,cannot comprehend what it is like to be "SP" excitable, so someone, or a group of people made up a name to put people of this normal personality type into a group so they can try to better understand it, Does that make sense? You have to really know the MBTI well to know what Im saying. It takes a lot of time, but well worth it if you want to know how to interact and do well with people,Which is fine if it helps others understand another better. To break it down no person is ever a like, no personality type is ever al like, people with the same personality type may have common patterns. The Myers-briggs, or the Keirsey, or Ennamagram is not a secret lock into someons world but it does provide benifits of understanding people. Cheers People=):woohoo:

 

[yeahright]

LMaoooooo!!I'm laughing with you my friend. I beleive Add and Adhd are only symtops of SP people. Sp's are heavy sensation seekers. Reference the Myers-briggs for more info. IN, and SJ, possibly IF's but think the IN's catagorized this natural behavior trait, and made up a name for it because are not Sp's themselves,cannot comprehend what it is like to be "SP" excitable, so someone, or a group of people made up a name to put people of this normal personality type into a group so they can try to better understand it, Does that make sense? You have to really know the MBTI well to know what Im saying. It takes a lot of time, but well worth it if you want to know how to interact and do well with people,Which is fine if it helps others understand another better. To break it down no person is ever a like, no personality type is ever al like, people with the same personality type may have common patterns. The Myers-briggs, or the Keirsey, or Ennamagram is not a secret lock into someons world but it does provide benifits of understanding people. Cheers People=):woohoo:

LOL, this is a rant like someone with ADHD.

In all seriousness, although ADD and ADHD might be overdiagnosed, it's not a joke for the person who really has it. They have great difficulty concentrating on a specific task and their attention will flit from thing to thing. This makes it very difficult for them to do well in school/work and other environments that require a person to concentrate and complete one task at a time.

ADD/ADHD is unrelated to intelligence. In the past, such people were either treated as having a form of retardation or as disciplinary problems. Now we know enough about neuroscience to see what is going wrong in the brain and compensate so the person can do better at whatever tasks they tackle.

 

[TRDE59]

LMaoooooo!!I'm laughing with you my friend. I beleive Add and Adhd are only symtops of SP people. Sp's are heavy sensation seekers. Reference the Myers-briggs for more info. IN, and SJ, possibly IF's but think the IN's catagorized this natural behavior trait, and made up a name for it because are not Sp's themselves,cannot comprehend what it is like to be "SP" excitable, so someone, or a group of people made up a name to put people of this normal personality type into a group so they can try to better understand it, Does that make sense? You have to really know the MBTI well to know what Im saying. It takes a lot of time, but well worth it if you want to know how to interact and do well with people,Which is fine if it helps others understand another better. To break it down no person is ever a like, no personality type is ever al like, people with the same personality type may have common patterns. The Myers-briggs, or the Keirsey, or Ennamagram is not a secret lock into someons world but it does provide benifits of understanding people. Cheers People=):woohoo:

lol. wow.... uh... I honestly have no idea what you just said....

LOL, this is a rant like someone with ADHD.

In all seriousness, although ADD and ADHD might be overdiagnosed, it's not a joke for the person who really has it. They have great difficulty concentrating on a specific task and their attention will flit from thing to thing. This makes it very difficult for them to do well in school/work and other environments that require a person to concentrate and complete one task at a time.

ADD/ADHD is unrelated to intelligence. In the past, such people were either treated as having a form of retardation or as disciplinary problems. Now we know enough about neuroscience to see what is going wrong in the brain and compensate so the person can do better at whatever tasks they tackle.

Yeah... I've come to realize that I may not even HAVE ADHD. People like me are diagnosed with a subtype of ADHD, called ADHD/I, which means primarily inattentive without hyperactivity. I've read a few studies and articles which postulate that ADHD/I is a completely different disorder entirely, and should be treated as such.

One of the common traits of people with this disorder is "sluggish cognitive tempo" (SCT). We are generally sluggish, both physically and mentally, lack processing speed, and lack physical coordination. The exact OPPOSITE of hyperactive people! And yet we're prescribed the same medication, expecting the same results.

For example, someone who is hyperactive and on a medication such as adderall will notice nearly a complete erasing of their symptoms. They are very focused and can now, generally, take tests and do tasks just as quickly as normal people.

People like me, on the other hand, do not respond well at all to traditional ADD medication. While it does improve focus, these medications do not improve the speed of memory recall and information processing. Which is ironic, really, cause they are stimulants. All these medications do is give me anxiety.

The thing that irritates me the most, however, is that I am lumped into this category of hyperactive kids, and am diagnosed as such. Furthermore, because of this misclassification, there are no effective treatments for my disorder, as it has not been researched separately. At least there are no effective treatments that I know of. Just because it helps ADD kids doesn't mean it helps me. In fact, that means it probably won't, cause mine is an entirely different disorder.


Oh, and yeahright..... THAT is a rant^^^

 

[John Smeton]

lol. wow.... uh... I honestly have no idea what you just said....

The myers-briggs personality type indictor has to be very understood to get what Im saying. If you dont have time right now don't because it takes some real focus to get it down; however when you do I recommend everyone do the MBTI and really get into it. I thought I was an ESFJ for a few weeks after taking the test intill i relized Im a ESTP. Many triats you think you naturally have are socially programed in. again you have to study this type of thing to understand. I spent ten months, three hours per day, every day, researching , studying, and coming to conclusions on it. and it is still studied sometimes when learnings are meant to be.

 

[Neuron]

Yeah- you hit it on the head- PEA is a L-phenylalanine precursor, and phenylalanine and L-tyrosine are both dopamine precursors (L-tyr is one step away; L-phen. is two).
PS Hordenine- I am not real familiar to this one.

Phenylethylamine is produced from L-Phenylalanine.

Invalid Link Removed

 

[Neuron]

Bru, This is from Pub Med.

Deamination of hordenine by monoamine oxidase and its action on vasa deferentia of the rat.Barwell CJ, Basma AN, Lafi MA, Leake LD.
School of Pharmacy, Portsmouth Polytechnic, Hampshire, UK.

The selectivity of the naturally occurring amine, N,N-dimethyltyramine (hordenine) for monoamine oxidase (MAO) and its action upon isolated vasa deferentia of the rat was investigated. Hordenine was deaminated by rat liver MAO with a Michaelis constant of 479 microM and maximum velocity of 128 nmol (mg protein)-1 h-1 compared with 144 microM and 482 nmol (mg protein)-1 h-1 for tyramine. Studies, with selective irreversible inhibitors of MAO, showed that hordenine was a highly selective substrate for MAO-B of liver and that it was not deaminated by the MAO-A of intestinal epithelium. In contrast to tyramine, hordenine did not produce contractions of isolated vasa deferentia. However, 25 microM hordenine potentiated contractile responses of vasa, from control animals, to submaximal doses of noradrenaline and inhibited responses to tyramine. It did not alter responses, to noradrenaline, of vasa denervated by chronic pretreatment of rats with guanethidine. Therefore, it appears that hordenine acted as an inhibitor of noradrenaline uptake, in isolated vasa deferentia. These results indicate that dietary-hordenine is unlikely to be deaminated by intestinal MAO as this is predominantly MAO-A. Consequently, it is likely to be absorbed and could affect the sympathetic nervous system, by virtue of its action as an inhibitor of noradrenaline uptake.

PMID: 2570842 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

So from this understanding do Dep and Hordenine both prolonging Pea? Answer Yes

You say Dep is healthier safer than Hord. From what I see Hord looks relatively safe. This is where confusion sets in. Hord works on Mao , or mao -a , or mao-b...or did this article say both? these mao thingies prolong the Pea correct?

Dep works on which one?

so my analyses is if both work on the same Mao then how could one be safer. This is where it is forgein.izza: pizza anyone?=)

Hordenine is a substrate for MAO-B not an inhibitor. There is a massive difference. PEA is a substrate for MAO-B as well.

 

[thebigt]

The old version works nicely, I still have ~10 bottles of it that I look forward to using before going onto the new version. I'm not sure I'd say it's as good as the new version but I haven't tried the new yet.

i have tried all the versions of powerful, going back more than 2 years. this new version is my favorite by far. definately most 'powerful'.:woohoo: