Keeping AP gains
- Thread starter TT1
- Start date
B5150
Legend
I guess I don't just don't believe that to be true.
You take something that force feeds your muscle with glycogen and water that gives you fuller muscle. When you discontinue using it what will now force feeds your muscle with glycogen and water.
I realize that the super saturation with glycogen will "potentiate" muscle growth while on it but I would imagine that the loss of glycogen retention and water volume will diminish muscle fullness and mass considerably once you stop taking it.
I don't see it being anything different than the gain and loss of weight and muscle volume associated with use and discontinued use of something like creatine.
You take something that force feeds your muscle with glycogen and water that gives you fuller muscle. When you discontinue using it what will now force feeds your muscle with glycogen and water.
I realize that the super saturation with glycogen will "potentiate" muscle growth while on it but I would imagine that the loss of glycogen retention and water volume will diminish muscle fullness and mass considerably once you stop taking it.
I don't see it being anything different than the gain and loss of weight and muscle volume associated with use and discontinued use of something like creatine.
jjohn
Registered User
You got a very good point. I have heard a lot of users keeping all of their gains by keeping everything in check. Well, I will as well try to answer that question at the end of my log to see what happends on my side.
RexGrandis
Member
That's what I beleive also, and the same reason I don't want to fork out $48 a month for something which is simply temporary. Don't get me wrong, it's a wonderful product, it will make you fuller and prevent fat gain. Just not cost effective, in my opinion.
TT1
New member
That's exactly what i was thinking, so i wanted to find out if anyone has "come off" AP and what "gains" they have kept.
I'm just trying to get my head around the best use of AP on a bulk. Am i right in thinking it lets you eat more because less will be stored as fat, which should equal more gains?
If so, which of the following would you recommend?
1) Higher than normal carbs
2) Higher than normal carbs+protein
3) Increase Fat, Protein and Carbs in equal amounts
I'm just trying to get my head around the best use of AP on a bulk. Am i right in thinking it lets you eat more because less will be stored as fat, which should equal more gains?
If so, which of the following would you recommend?
1) Higher than normal carbs
2) Higher than normal carbs+protein
3) Increase Fat, Protein and Carbs in equal amounts
Guest
Guest
Creatine and AP are polar opposites.
Creatine creates energy by the increase ATP.
Anabolic Pump feeds muscle with nutrients needed for growth just as insulin would. We are creating an anabolic enviroment through nutrient delivery thus hydrating the cell.
You cease use of any anabolic the muscle fullness and pump leaves thats just expected.
Guest
Guest
Being 'FULLER' is a side effect of gaining muscle and losing fat. Being 'fuller' is about driving nutrients into muscle cells.
I repect your opinion, but your perscpective of the supplements use is not correct.
saludable24
Active member
I think you are looking at only part of what happens on a supplement like this or creatine. Yes the glycogen storage and hydration are tempory effects, but what you don't seem to be considering is the effect that more glycogen and water to your muscles will have. Will these effects not facilitate more energy and strength to lift greater amounts of weight than would normally be possible? Will they also not speed and enhance recovery after such lifting? I believe they will. The greater the intensity of the workout and the enhanced recovery will indeed help build bigger, stronger muscles. These bigger stronger muscles will remain wether or not they are pumped full of glycogen and water. They are the "real gains" that you will receive permanently.
You are correct in that ceasing AP will cause a loss of the glycogen and hydration, but you just wern't looking at what those thing enable us to do, which is where the "real gains" happen.
This is just my opinion, I'm not a scientist so I could have this all bass ackwards.
B5150
Legend
Understood. I only used it to illustrate a point.
We are in agreement. As I stated I understand what it is doing:USPLabs said:
So then we must be in agreement that this statement is not exactly true:B5150 said:
You will not keep 100% of the (weight) gains associated with the administration of AP, and in there lies a downside
Guest
Guest
Understood. I only used it to illustrate a point.
We are in agreement. As I stated I understand what it is doing:So then we must be in agreement that this statement is not exactly true:You will not keep 100% of the (weight) gains associated with the administration of AP, and in there lies a downside
You will keep all strength and muscle if diet is still on course.
CHAPS
Registered User
I agree that you will keep all strength and muscle if your diet is correct, but ya expect some weightloss from the extra glycogen and water that came with it being lost. And when i say water i'm taking about the water that the glycogen pulls with it into the muscle, AP doesn't cause water retention.
BigMattTx
Active member
IMO, the only way to make solid gains that you keep 100% of is by sticking to diet/training alone.
All supplements have a temporary effect. With ephedrine/clen and other fatburners, I get rebound fat gain when I stop using them. With Creatine, I lose some size. With AAS, I lose some size. There is nothing that gives you 100% keepable gains.
All supplements have a temporary effect. With ephedrine/clen and other fatburners, I get rebound fat gain when I stop using them. With Creatine, I lose some size. With AAS, I lose some size. There is nothing that gives you 100% keepable gains.
Mulletsoldier
Binging on Pure ****ing Rage
I think what we need to differentiate in AP is the process from the effects which that process will exert. Saturating the muscles with glycogen is the process, the specific mechanism of action of which is GLUT4. By modulating GLUT4 you place your body in an anabolic state which is more than likely beyond your natural anabolic capacity. This will allow you to synthesize more lean tissue in the month of use than possible naturally. While the process of increased glucose permeability may cease once usage is stopped, any muscle you have synthesized as a result will not disappear as long as one's diet and training is on point. It is not as if AP creates massive inaccessible stores of glycogen which dissipate soon after use. It is modulating natural processes which would occur anyway, and increasing them to supraphysiological levels. IMO, if you train and eat right you should be gaining muscle in a month anyway, add something which incredibly increases the amount of fuel your body can use for protein synthesis and you have a good combo.
In terms of gain retention, that is a matter of perspective. If I gain 16lbs on an a cycle of anabolics, and I lose 6lbs which I deem to be water and keep the rest, I call that 100% gain retention. With AP, and as Ziri stated, the temporarily stored glycogen which has not been utilized will dissipate, but any new muscle gained will stay, once again, as long as training and diet are on point.
In terms of gain retention, that is a matter of perspective. If I gain 16lbs on an a cycle of anabolics, and I lose 6lbs which I deem to be water and keep the rest, I call that 100% gain retention. With AP, and as Ziri stated, the temporarily stored glycogen which has not been utilized will dissipate, but any new muscle gained will stay, once again, as long as training and diet are on point.
Mulletsoldier
Binging on Pure ****ing Rage
Thank ya sir
evan
Member
I have mentioned this over and over in slightly different terminoloy in other ap threads, as matter of fact i would recommend this be a
"stikcky. the main message(or one of them that was repeated over and over in the write up is that the feeling of fullness in the muscle bellies is not a prepetual pump(like produced by stims or no2)while it may feel similar they have next to nothing to do with each other. as usp said perfetly. nutrients are the building blocks of muslce, hormones wether in your body or in a bottle are what mediates them. the ingredints in this product mediate these nutrients on a constant and steady basis(much like insulin or an anabolic would) this is in direct opposition to things like no2 and caffien that create a short intense effet and then produe a recoil(that is why the ingestion of carbs and protein are so utterly important with ap, probably also why it is reomended to eat arbs and protein surroundin eah dosage)
"stikcky. the main message(or one of them that was repeated over and over in the write up is that the feeling of fullness in the muscle bellies is not a prepetual pump(like produced by stims or no2)while it may feel similar they have next to nothing to do with each other. as usp said perfetly. nutrients are the building blocks of muslce, hormones wether in your body or in a bottle are what mediates them. the ingredints in this product mediate these nutrients on a constant and steady basis(much like insulin or an anabolic would) this is in direct opposition to things like no2 and caffien that create a short intense effet and then produe a recoil(that is why the ingestion of carbs and protein are so utterly important with ap, probably also why it is reomended to eat arbs and protein surroundin eah dosage)