Whisky’s test e, tbol, liquidien and winny cycle log

MrKleen73 said:
Why are you using a diuretic? Are you suffering from edema or something? If not then drop the diuretic. No need for it, your kidneys are already working hard filtering your blood, there is no reason to increase the load on them by forcing them to produce more urea.

If you are not running low sodium then I would just try to increase your potassium intake to 4.5-5g a day. Get your electrolytes balanced and most of the water you are retaining will go back into your muscles. If your joints are drying out while you are still looking waterlogged it is far more likely that you are experiencing an electrolyte imbalance.

If you are running low sodium I would recommend increasing sodium a good bit as well as increasing potassium to balance it. Trust me this will be safer, healthier and more than likely have a better effect on your physique.

Only reason I would not do this is if you know you are sodium sensitive, and that high sodium causes real issues for you. Although you can't really know that for sure if you have never had your potassium high enough to balance out sodium levels.
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I consume relatively high sodium and typically drink around a litre of coconut water a day for the potassium......

Main reason for the dandelion and vit c was to just try and take some of the water off so I could judge progress slightly better and not carry as much water weight around. BP was sitting slightly high (not concerningly high) as well......

Whilst I know it could be a coincidence my joints and knees felt spot on today and all I changed was tripling my fish oil dose.....
 
Day 54

Only challenge today was getting to 4K Cals - busy earlier so had to fit more food in tonight, for some reason had to really force it down today.....

Everything else felt good. Either as a coincidence or directly as a result of increased fish oil my knees were spot on, no problem at all.

Training was very solid

Back squat set of 3 at 341 (pr)
Bench set of 3 at 242 (pr)
Bent over row set of 3 at 242 (pr)

Hit arms after that, great pump, starting to notice changes more and more in shoulders, arms and back. Just around the abs I look fat but fcuk it, in theory I should be leaner than I was at the start so as has been said before I just need to trust the process.

With this increased weight 4K Cals is likely nearer maintenance than surplus at this higher weight but I’m thinking I’ll keep Cals there and hopefully recomp a touch before the winny.......

Got a mad busy finish to the week though so see how we go tomorrow !!
 
Whisky said:
Day 54

Only challenge today was getting to 4K Cals - busy earlier so had to fit more food in tonight, for some reason had to really force it down today.....

Everything else felt good. Either as a coincidence or directly as a result of increased fish oil my knees were spot on, no problem at all.

Training was very solid

Back squat set of 3 at 341 (pr)
Bench set of 3 at 242 (pr)
Bent over row set of 3 at 242 (pr)

Hit arms after that, great pump, starting to notice changes more and more in shoulders, arms and back. Just around the abs I look fat but fcuk it, in theory I should be leaner than I was at the start so as has been said before I just need to trust the process.

With this increased weight 4K Cals is likely nearer maintenance than surplus at this higher weight but I’m thinking I’ll keep Cals there and hopefully recomp a touch before the winny.......

Got a mad busy finish to the week though so see how we go tomorrow !!
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Epic sesh! 3 PRs, different movements, that's one for the books mate!!!
 
Whisky said:
I consume relatively high sodium and typically drink around a litre of coconut water a day for the potassium......

Main reason for the dandelion and vit c was to just try and take some of the water off so I could judge progress slightly better and not carry as much water weight around. BP was sitting slightly high (not concerningly high) as well......

Whilst I know it could be a coincidence my joints and knees felt spot on today and all I changed was tripling my fish oil dose.....
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I challenge you to double your coconut water intake for 5 days, while taking in plenty of sodium and see what happens with your physique, and performance. Doubling your coconut water would get you to 5g a day.

I still stand by my initial mention that using a diuretic on cycle is creating a bigger challenge for your kidneys, and kidneys don't really heal... Save that for when you are trying to peak for something, or if you have edema. Otherwise it doesn't really offer the cycle any value, but increases the risk...

Whisky said:
Day 54

Only challenge today was getting to 4K Cals - busy earlier so had to fit more food in tonight, for some reason had to really force it down today.....

Everything else felt good. Either as a coincidence or directly as a result of increased fish oil my knees were spot on, no problem at all.

Training was very solid

Back squat set of 3 at 341 (pr)
Bench set of 3 at 242 (pr)
Bent over row set of 3 at 242 (pr)

Hit arms after that, great pump, starting to notice changes more and more in shoulders, arms and back. Just around the abs I look fat but fcuk it, in theory I should be leaner than I was at the start so as has been said before I just need to trust the process.

With this increased weight 4K Cals is likely nearer maintenance than surplus at this higher weight but I’m thinking I’ll keep Cals there and hopefully recomp a touch before the winny.......

Got a mad busy finish to the week though so see how we go tomorrow !!
Click to expand...

Congrats sounds like things are going very well. Got to love multiple PR's in a session.
 
MrKleen73 said:
I challenge you to double your coconut water intake for 5 days, while taking in plenty of sodium and see what happens with your physique, and performance. Doubling your coconut water would get you to 5g a day.

I still stand by my initial mention that using a diuretic on cycle is creating a bigger challenge for your kidneys, and kidneys don't really heal... Save that for when you are trying to peak for something, or if you have edema. Otherwise it doesn't really offer the cycle any value, but increases the risk...



Congrats sounds like things are going very well. Got to love multiple PR's in a session.
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Thanks bro.

So I get the logic behind potassium and that reducing water by decreasing sodium and increasing urination but why maintain a high sodium intake? I mean I wasn’t planning not to as I like to season the sh1t out of my food but just wondered what the mechanics were?
 
Day 55

Long day and long week. Really busy, lots going on, early starts etc nothing bad, just busy. Made today a bit of a grind but to honest I felt better than I would with this type of day off cycle.

Training was a shorter lighter session, just upper body hyperthophy stuff, really just keeping the blood flowing and moving a bit of weight around.

Checked BP this morning and that was back down at 121 over 77. Slightly higher than I am off cycle but obviously spot on for standard range.

Interestingly I’m recovering better this cycle than previous (and I was way better on those runs than off cycle). Literally feel like I could hit every muscle group every day.

Still hitting 4K Cals. Only debate I’ll have is what to do with that on the winny. No weight gain this week and it’s a level I’ve maintained at previously when lighter. Tempted to just stick it there until the end of the cycle and really recomp but I guess the first week of winstrol will tell me what, if any adjustments are needed.....

Have a good weekend guys
 
Day 56

So last day of the liquidien and start of 2 weeks with nothing but test (and gw from Tuesday)......

My plan was to run a td sr9009 or ar9011 as well but on the basis the only td I can find is purerawz I just not confident it’ll be worth it - if that delivery system worked surely there’d be a few sites doing td? I had been hoping MA’s injectable version would be out as well (for my pet rat of course) but alas no sign.

Gw will be 20mg a day through the remainder of the cycle and pct.

Trained arms and abs. Nothing amazing but a solid session. Veins popping out everywhere.

I’ll bang some half way pics out tomorrow so you can judge the amount of water (or fat) I’m carrying
 
hairygrandpa said:
I would attack with 1mg caber the first day, then eod 0.5 until lumps are gone. No need to up adex, IMHO.
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Sorry to circle back, but bingo... I just got off Tren Ace to NPP run. Lumps on both nips, Exemestane AI was not doing much... Two days of caber and lunps are already receding.

I guess Tren and 19-nor are more prolactin triggering?

Thanks for saving my man boobs HGP!
 
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Day 57

Big day in a few ways

First up I finally worked out how to turn off email notifications from AM everytime a new comment in the countless threads I’m in is made.....will literally save me hours of deleting lol

Second it was the first day with no oral or td- I mean that makes me basically natty right? Haha

Third up, training was sets of 5 at the weight I hit for 3 rep prs on last Thursday.

Made 5 at 341 back squat - pr

Bench 5 x 242 - pr

Bent over row 5 x 242 pr

Pretty happy with that - I mean who would have though 300mg of test in the ass twice a week plus progressive overload would be so effective haha......

When I get home in a bit I’ll get the midway pics up, want to use the same lighting for comparison.

Weight was down a bit today at 229. Probably a bit of fluctuation and maybe a bit of water coming off (took kleens advice and dropped the dandelion in favour of increased potassium)......

Would like some views on calorie intake though. Been consistent at 4K for 4 weeks now. Definitely stopped gaining weight (although getting stronger). Was planning to stay at that level for the remainder of the cycle but now thinking of increasing the next two weeks to 4,250 just to solidify the strength and lean mass before I start the winny, then bring it back down to 4K when I start the winny to recomp over the last 6 weeks......good idea or not?
 
Whisky said:
Day 57

Big day in a few ways

First up I finally worked out how to turn off email notifications from AM everytime a new comment in the countless threads I’m in is made.....will literally save me hours of deleting lol

Second it was the first day with no oral or td- I mean that makes me basically natty right? Haha

Third up, training was sets of 5 at the weight I hit for 3 rep prs on last Thursday.

Made 5 at 341 back squat - pr

Bench 5 x 242 - pr

Bent over row 5 x 242 pr

Pretty happy with that - I mean who would have though 300mg of test in the ass twice a week plus progressive overload would be so effective haha......

When I get home in a bit I’ll get the midway pics up, want to use the same lighting for comparison.

Weight was down a bit today at 229. Probably a bit of fluctuation and maybe a bit of water coming off (took kleens advice and dropped the dandelion in favour of increased potassium)......

Would like some views on calorie intake though. Been consistent at 4K for 4 weeks now. Definitely stopped gaining weight (although getting stronger). Was planning to stay at that level for the remainder of the cycle but now thinking of increasing the next two weeks to 4,250 just to solidify the strength and lean mass before I start the winny, then bring it back down to 4K when I start the winny to recomp over the last 6 weeks......good idea or not?
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I'd bring it up if you have stop growing.
 
Mid cycle pics added on the second post at start of thread for easier comparison - clearly a lot less definition but honestly I looked slightly worse about 7-10 days into the cycle (and had gained like 15 in the first week or so).

Technically I know it should just be water, I obviously have a lot of skin so I guess sub q water will always soften my appearance dramatically but it’s tough as an ex fatty when it just looks like I’ve got fatter lol.

Still gotta trust the process otherwise I’ll end up wasting cycle time not eating enough...... the water gain has definitely been an eye opener though
 
Whisky said:
Mid cycle pics added on the second post at start of thread for easier comparison - clearly a lot less definition but honestly I looked slightly worse about 7-10 days into the cycle (and had gained like 15 in the first week or so).

Technically I know it should just be water, I obviously have a lot of skin so I guess sub q water will always soften my appearance dramatically but it’s tough as an ex fatty when it just looks like I’ve got fatter lol.

Still gotta trust the process otherwise I’ll end up wasting cycle time not eating enough...... the water gain has definitely been an eye opener though
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Lol i cant believe i asked how long youre in, anyways i do see a good amount of size! Overall how has the strength been?

You still have a long ways to go! The gainz have just begun!
 
You can really see a lot more beef in your arms, shoulders and upper back in the 2nd and 3rd new pics vs starting.

Like the first guy looks quite lean, but your current form looks much more intimidating. You just look more solid.
 
Hyde said:
You can really see a lot more beef in your arms, shoulders and upper back in the 2nd and 3rd new pics vs starting.

Like the first guy looks quite lean, but your current form looks much more intimidating. You just look more solid.
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This. Looking forward to end of cycle pics!
 
Ulfhednar said:
Lol i cant believe i asked how long youre in, anyways i do see a good amount of size! Overall how has the strength been?

You still have a long ways to go! The gainz have just begun!
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Strength has been good bro, i always compare to previous maxes on cycle rather than just to the start of a cycle (cause just cycling to get back to a level from a previous cycle and losing it all inbetween feels a bit pointless).

Last cycle my best one rep back squat was a shakey 380, yesterday i hit 341 for a solid 5

Deadlift was a one rep at 495 and ive already pulled 484 for a decent double

Bench was one at 264 and yesterday hit 5 at 242.....
 
Day 58

I’ve mentioned this before but my word my libido is fcuking insane. I always had a high sex drive and it only really dropped a bit a few years before my first cycle. Probably stronger than when I was 18, I mean I’m yanking the little fella like I’m shaking the worlds lumpiest protein shake. Starting to feel sorry for him lol

Anyway, recovery from yesterday’s lifts surprisingly good, felt decent today. Hit a back pump session, nothing too heavy though as heavy dead’s tomorrow. Did try single arm inverted rows for the first time, nice exercise, had about a 30 degree angle to the floor and focused on power.

I did take advantage of a flash sale on Dexa scans in London for next week. Roughly $60 instead of the $165 it normally is. Will be interesting to see what that shows re water and bf.

Bloods same week so everything combined should give me a great view on what’s what and plans can be refined if needed.

Calories up at the 4,250 previously mentioned.

Probably the biggest difference I’m noticing pinning test to the oral/td cycles before is how good it’s feeling at over 8 weeks. Previously I’d have been ready for it to finish at this point or before, right now I feel like I could just run this indefinitely. Like night and day to oral cycles, 100% happy I made the switch, love this sh1t.

All going swimmingly over on this little island, hope all have started the week strong
 
Keep killing it Whisky, you're PR'ing like it is easy!
 
Whisky said:
Strength has been good bro, i always compare to previous maxes on cycle rather than just to the start of a cycle (cause just cycling to get back to a level from a previous cycle and losing it all inbetween feels a bit pointless).

Last cycle my best one rep back squat was a shakey 380, yesterday i hit 341 for a solid 5

Deadlift was a one rep at 495 and ive already pulled 484 for a decent double

Bench was one at 264 and yesterday hit 5 at 242.....
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Awesome! More strength and muscle to come too!
 
Whisky said:
Haha, yeah this is true. Converting everything to lbs is a pain lol

250 was my pre cycle aim but to be honest I’m aiming above that now........260 maybe
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I’m not writing that off; I just try not to blow smoke up people’s ass, so I stay on the conservative side - enough bros out there already telling people who just benched 3 plates how close they are to 4 lol.

260 would be sweet!
 
Day 59

Well doesn’t life have a fcukjng funny sense of humour. Yesterday I’m talking about wanting to really push my deadlift and today I miss my first programmed lift, supposed to be 5 at 451, felt my form started to go on the 4th rep so I dropped it. Wasn’t happy with my belt so reset and gave myself some time and had another go, same result. Just wasn’t there.

Really pissed me off as 440 last week was easy.

So the excuses I could use......

- was in the car for 6 hours today (supposed to to 3), hence was very late training.

- my caffeine intake has been way way below normal today

- I did train back yesterday but wasn’t heavy

However, I slept really well last night, I felt great today, was moving great and fully expected to make the lift.

In reality I know that just overloading for 16 weeks was never going to happen but still annoyed with myself.

Gonna see how my back feels tomorrow and might have another go. If I make it then great and will carry on as I was - miss it and i’ll deload for a week.

I don’t take failure well to be honest lol
 
Whisky said:
Day 59

Well doesn’t life have a fcukjng funny sense of humour. Yesterday I’m talking about wanting to really push my deadlift and today I miss my first programmed lift, supposed to be 5 at 451, felt my form started to go on the 4th rep so I dropped it. Wasn’t happy with my belt so reset and gave myself some time and had another go, same result. Just wasn’t there.

Really pissed me off as 440 last week was easy.

So the excuses I could use......

- was in the car for 6 hours today (supposed to to 3), hence was very late training.

- my caffeine intake has been way way below normal today

- I did train back yesterday but wasn’t heavy

However, I slept really well last night, I felt great today, was moving great and fully expected to make the lift.

In reality I know that just overloading for 16 weeks was never going to happen but still annoyed with myself.

Gonna see how my back feels tomorrow and might have another go. If I make it then great and will carry on as I was - miss it and i’ll deload for a week.

I don’t take failure well to be honest lol
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You'll get it brother. Everyone has their off days.
 
Whisky said:
Day 59

Well doesn’t life have a fcukjng funny sense of humour. Yesterday I’m talking about wanting to really push my deadlift and today I miss my first programmed lift, supposed to be 5 at 451, felt my form started to go on the 4th rep so I dropped it. Wasn’t happy with my belt so reset and gave myself some time and had another go, same result. Just wasn’t there.

Really pissed me off as 440 last week was easy.

So the excuses I could use......

- was in the car for 6 hours today (supposed to to 3), hence was very late training.

- my caffeine intake has been way way below normal today

- I did train back yesterday but wasn’t heavy

However, I slept really well last night, I felt great today, was moving great and fully expected to make the lift.

In reality I know that just overloading for 16 weeks was never going to happen but still annoyed with myself.

Gonna see how my back feels tomorrow and might have another go. If I make it then great and will carry on as I was - miss it and i’ll deload for a week.

I don’t take failure well to be honest lol
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Happens to everyone, you’ll get it next time round.
 
have you ever tried wave loading?

its a trick technique the power lifters use to break PRs on days like this..

the idea is to feed the nervous system a line of sh17.

once it decifers the data it will muster up a little extra oomph!

heres how to do it.

warm up

miss pr.

remove 10% perform lift

add 15% perform lift and miss

add 5 % perform lift and miss

remove 10% perform PR lift and win~
 
Whisky said:
Day 59

Well doesn’t life have a fcukjng funny sense of humour. Yesterday I’m talking about wanting to really push my deadlift and today I miss my first programmed lift, supposed to be 5 at 451, felt my form started to go on the 4th rep so I dropped it. Wasn’t happy with my belt so reset and gave myself some time and had another go, same result. Just wasn’t there.

Really pissed me off as 440 last week was easy.

So the excuses I could use......

- was in the car for 6 hours today (supposed to to 3), hence was very late training.

- my caffeine intake has been way way below normal today

- I did train back yesterday but wasn’t heavy

However, I slept really well last night, I felt great today, was moving great and fully expected to make the lift.

In reality I know that just overloading for 16 weeks was never going to happen but still annoyed with myself.

Gonna see how my back feels tomorrow and might have another go. If I make it then great and will carry on as I was - miss it and i’ll deload for a week.

I don’t take failure well to be honest lol
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The worse days can be the best days if you learn from them!
 
It was one day. Some days it’s not there - and you’d be naive to believe the extra 3 hours in the car and going in with lats that were worked yesterday didn’t make an impact - everything affects everything.

And on that note: do NOT go back for a repeat tomorrow. You think you didn’t have it today - wait til tomorrow, after going as far as you could today.

Getting stronger isn’t about beating your head into the wall - it’s about creating a stimulus for growth, and you got that today.
 
Hyde said:
It was one day. Some days it’s not there - and you’d be naive to believe the extra 3 hours in the car and going in with lats that were worked yesterday didn’t make an impact - everything affects everything.

And on that note: do NOT go back for a repeat tomorrow. You think you didn’t have it today - wait til tomorrow, after going as far as you could today.

Getting stronger isn’t about beating your head into the wall - it’s about creating a stimulus for growth, and you got that today.
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Yeah, we all know those sh1tty workout days...used to up volume when noting the weight suddenly felt heavy.

Putting this to a test right now by heighten the stimulus with a repeating second day.
Yesterday: shoulders/Legs-hard
Today: shoulders/legs-feeder

Felt awesome, I admit. If it brings more growth, we will see.
 
If it's any comfort ive been working out around 3 times last 8 days.. Was running today and some ab workout at home because I was too lazy to go to the gym.. Oh and I had a pizza, one from the child menu but still haha.. Tastiest thing I've had in weeks.
 
Hyde said:
It was one day. Some days it’s not there - and you’d be naive to believe the extra 3 hours in the car and going in with lats that were worked yesterday didn’t make an impact - everything affects everything.

And on that note: do NOT go back for a repeat tomorrow. You think you didn’t have it today - wait til tomorrow, after going as far as you could today.

Getting stronger isn’t about beating your head into the wall - it’s about creating a stimulus for growth, and you got that today.
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This. Except maybe do some speedwork. I find this sometimes helps especially when the issue is form feeling off.
 
Hyde said:
It was one day. Some days it’s not there - and you’d be naive to believe the extra 3 hours in the car and going in with lats that were worked yesterday didn’t make an impact - everything affects everything.

And on that note: do NOT go back for a repeat tomorrow. You think you didn’t have it today - wait til tomorrow, after going as far as you could today.

Getting stronger isn’t about beating your head into the wall - it’s about creating a stimulus for growth, and you got that today.
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The voice of reason!!!! WooHoo! I was just about to say the same thing. If you body isn't recovered enough now and you just went to failure the last thing you want to do is add more CNS stress immediately after.

You did the work, in lifting failure means you worked as hard as you could... you most definitely stimulated adaptation, now allow it to happen rather than going in and digging a bigger hole.
 
MrKleen73 said:
You did the work, in lifting failure means you worked as hard as you could..
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The most obvious yet the most inspiring and easily forgotten fact for anyone going to the gym or in any area of life really.

When have you ever heard someone say they're happy with a bad workout? If the bad workout was all you got you've done 100% regardless.
 
BennyMagoo79 said:
This. Except maybe do some speedwork. I find this sometimes helps especially when the issue is form feeling off.
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That could work if he has the itch to lift still.

The important thing is he doesn’t keep piling on real fatigue from high effort - there’s a chance he could come back today and make the lift, but it will indeed drive his fatigue debt further without a doubt. Thus perpetuating the cycle.
 
Day 60

Here’s where I make myself look like a bit of a twat........but I don’t bullsh1t in life and this forum is no different.

Despite knowing that Hyde is completely correct, hell its exactly what I would tell any of my clients, I also don’t always do what I know is right.

I did get back in and hit the same series of lifts and did make 5x451 (pr) - actually really happy with the form, felt solid.

I accept it might bite me on the ass over the next few days but on the flip side mentally not making a lift a knew I had in me might have knocked me off course. Time will tell and I’ll learn more about myself and my body for sure. I do have natural ability to recover well (that and endurance are literally my only natty strengths) and tomorrow will be a rest day for sure.

Ultimately was a naive move by me I know.....

Other than that it’s been a normal day. Eating like a champ and Keeping protein really high, loads of different sources.

Did also start the gw today and I normally start to feel the benefits of that within a few days so should be fun.
 
5x451 , with that you beat me! Awesome PR! Hell of a cycle -and all out effort!
 
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