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Jswain's training log for powerlifting

Hyde said:
The squat is comin’ back!
Click to expand...

Might be a little early to start proclaiming that...as much as Id love to. The last two sessions have definitely been a step in the right direction, ill give ya that!
 
Did a little mini workout today. I might do a few random things as the night goes on as a study break but im on the ****ter so i figured id update now.

Hammer curls 2x15@30
SL glute bridge 2x12 per leg
Banded dead bug: 2x8 per leg
band tri pushdown: doubled mini x20x2
 
Woke up early to get the lift in before my flight to Chicago. I have another wedding to attend/crash tomorrow.

•DE spoto
185x3x8 - 45s rest

•RE/HE Sq
210x3x10

•RE SL RDL
85x12x3

Ss/

•1/2 kneeling cable row
120x12x3

&

•facepull
50x15x2

I plan on slowly waving up the squats over the course of 4 weeks then dropping back down to around the same weight that I started (maybe adding 5lbs to program in some progression but ill only go forward with that if things keep going smoothly obviously). The 4th week will be a higher % (relative...still only like 70%) set for 5 reps just to try and get a better feel for how higher relative intensity stuff is feeling so i can better predict how ready I am or how ready I am not for taking it up another notch at the end of this 12 week training cycle.
 
Woof. Been gone for a while. The wedding was great, I'm thankfully done with them for a while I think. Ive had enough of all the travel. I got back from the wedding late last Sunday night and had finals week Mon-Wed of last week then I went home to Indiana for the rest of the week and got back yesterday. I did get in a training session last Wednesday before my flight. So in the last 11 days I have worked out twice (including today). I had a fantastic time with my girlfriend, brother, and mom over break though so I wouldnt have done anything differently.

Last week's training:

DE Conv DL
310x1x9 - 30s rest

HE Bp
45/95/135/185/220x5
255x3
[email protected]
285x4@9
285x2@9

I was really pushing rest periods. I think that on top of the usual lack of tracking calories and just shoving food down my throat whenever I can during finals week just did me in for my heavy work.

Pin press - the HE was supposed to be 5x5, so i wanted to get 5 sets in.
285x2x2@8/8.5

RE SL leg press
3x15 - don't remember the weights. I borderline dogged them since I supersetted these with my bench warmups.

Seated wide grip row
120x15
130x15x2

Z bar tricep pushdown
Overhand: 120x20
Underhand: 60x20

And then I barely made my flight. So it was a good thing I rushed through this one.

Today (8/28)
Bw - 229

•DE squat
185x2x8

•HE DL
135/185/225/275/315x5
370x4
+belt
[email protected]/7.5/7.5/9
Last set I was not finishing with my glutes at all and was locking out with my erectors it felt like. Instead of grinding through the fifth set I dropped down the weight and choked a monster mini around the power rack behind me then wrapped the other end around my hips to try and externally cue my glutes to getting involved in the lockout.
370x4
These reps felt better - don't know if it was from the drop in weight or the band cueing me though.

•RE Inc DB press
75x10x3

Ss/

•Wide grip cable row
150x12x3
160x8x2

•Decline pec fly myo-set
60 per hand x17, 10, 7
 
He lives! Glad you had such a good break after slogging through the finals brochacho. Kinda resets things a bit
 
Sounds like an awesome trip, hopefully a lot of little annoying overuse issues you might have had cleared up with the rest too.
 
Hyde said:
He lives! Glad you had such a good break after slogging through the finals brochacho. Kinda resets things a bit
Click to expand...

MrKleen73 said:
Sounds like an awesome trip, hopefully a lot of little annoying overuse issues you might have had cleared up with the rest too.
Click to expand...

It was very relaxing and refreshing. Like you said, it reset my focus for school but I was starting to get a little antsy to get back into the gym and to stop feeling like a lazy arse.

It appears that the issue with my left elbow didnt clean up at all. I was hoping the rest would have done it some good too but it was really sore the day I got home and yesterday after training. When i go to get the cable handles into position for flys it really irritates the medial elbow near where the UCL is. I got a sharp pain there on one set the last time I did them prior to yesterday, yesterday it was just sore. I bought one of those freeze sleeves and have been using it nightly. Im not totally sold on the use of cryotherapy in long term treatment of msk/ligament/tendon injuries but i do think for acutely managing a flare up of inflammation they can be helpful. Long term, inflammation is necessary to drive the healing process so I typically try to avoid ice and NSAIDs if i can. Its kind of like walking a tight rope between trying to keep the inflammation at a level where it isnt hurting but still allowing some to occur to drive healing. I never really know where that happy medium lies.
 
If they don’t hurt it, very high rep band push downs will help heal and strengthen the elbows. I have always liked them 20-50 reps per set, but on the most recent Westside podcast Louie said the guys often do 100+ now for 1-2 sets a couple times a week to build and heal the tendons & ligaments.
 
I actually did 50 reps once last week and planned on doing them randomly throughout the week, aiming for at least twice. I also did 50 last night and 50 this morning. It is pretty easy to do and takes like 2 minutes cumulatively so i think this is something ill be able to hold myself to.
 
Yesterday's session:

•DE Spoto
185x3x8 -45s rest

•HE/RE Sq
220x3x10 -60s rest
First 7 beltless
8-9 loose belt
10 latched belt
Reps felt really slow (not necessarily difficult, but slow) until i put my belt on then they picked up some. This tells me im still not able to get rigid with my core beltless and therefore am leaking a lot of energy from my hips through the bar.

•RE Posterior Chain tri set - cycling through these exercises non stop.
Rope pull through: 180x12x3
GHR: BWx15x2
SL Glute Bridge: BWx10x2

I really need to gain control of my glutes. That and my lack of core rigidity is a recipe for weakness and injury.

•Facepull
50x12x2
 
You need to use your belt. I know your mindset is you have to earn it and the weights you’re doing shouldn’t demand it, and I’ve been there, but you have to stay healthy to build that base back up. Clint Darden flat said anyone who has had back issues should always be wearing a belt in training. When getting to talk with some WSM competitors, top guys in the world, they all say they wear a belt for everything. It’s not worth the setback in training if you get hurt.

As someone who has done a lot of beltless training, and been hurt a lot, it’s not worth it. 4/5 top guys in powerlifting don’t go beltless, and in strongman none of the top guys do. People say if you get stronger without a belt you will be stronger in one. But if you get stronger in a belt - YOU STILL GOT STRONGER IN A BELT, ya feel me? And you will always compete in one, so it’s not like that’s a consideration. Your core will still grow and strengthen in a belt.

Btw, keeping kicking ass man!
 
You're totally correct in saying that that has and is my mindset. The thing for me is that dont want to be reliant on my belt to be strong and capable...i feel like my reliance (that I didnt even really realize I had) on my belt over the years has led to this point where I am - weak and injured. With that said, I do understand what youre saying and definitely agree that staying healthy should be my #1 priority. But its also on my mind: what if I do start wearing my belt, then 6, 12, 18 months from now end up injured again because I never figured out how to lift without it in the first place. I do totally see what youre saying here, and it does make a lot of sense. But right now im just trying to think about the root cause of why i have ended up here in the first place and part of me cant help but to blame the belt.
 
Yeah I mean you do need to learn to brace without it - to rehab my back, I had to learn to brace for every single movement I do around the house every single day. When I bend over to pick up something off the floor, or lean forward when brushing my teeth, when I get up or roll over in bed - I brace every single time. Those are the spinal hygiene habits you must build. If you can do that, you have earned the right to use a belt in lifting. You will always be able to lift in the belt, but you will never have it for your day to day movement - so that daily healthy movement must be a priority if you’re not there yet.
 
Agreed on the belt stuff, and if truly bracing against the belt you are strengthening the core regardless. It is the people who tighten the belt too tight and rely on that tension to give them the extra support that end up hurt when not using a belt because they are relying on the belt for support and not their core. If you are used to bracing and expanding your core into the belt to create the tension you are not creating a weakness there but are instead ingraining the need to brace the core creating stability and support whether a belt is there or not.
 
Hyde said:
Yeah I mean you do need to learn to brace without it - to rehab my back, I had to learn to brace for every single movement I do around the house every single day. When I bend over to pick up something off the floor, or lean forward when brushing my teeth, when I get up or roll over in bed - I brace every single time. Those are the spinal hygiene habits you must build. If you can do that, you have earned the right to use a belt in lifting. You will always be able to lift in the belt, but you will never have it for your day to day movement - so that daily healthy movement must be a priority if you’re not there yet.
Click to expand...

I do the same exact thing with practicing bracing throughout the day, and do feel that I am able to brace without the belt in just about EVERYTHING EXCEPT a barbell back squat.

MrKleen73 said:
Agreed on the belt stuff, and if truly bracing against the belt you are strengthening the core regardless. It is the people who tighten the belt too tight and rely on that tension to give them the extra support that end up hurt when not using a belt because they are relying on the belt for support and not their core. If you are used to bracing and expanding your core into the belt to create the tension you are not creating a weakness there but are instead ingraining the need to brace the core creating stability and support whether a belt is there or not.
Click to expand...

I always went along with this same line of thought, which is why I never felt the need to take off my belt. But then I never took off my belt and I ended up getting hurt sporadically. I understand the view of why and how one should still get a stronger core while wearing the belt as long as they're bracing properly, and I do believe that it does happen. But after fcking up my back multiple times I definitely think that there is merit to dedicated core work and doing movements that may not be the most "dangerous" without a belt on. I cant explain why but I think that it does either psychology create a crutch or without that external object cueing you make it more difficult to brace without it.

With that said, I think my best bet is to listen to you guys' advice and back squat with my belt on going forward. I can do beltless work in other areas if i feel the need or desire to do so.
 
I lifted Wednesday and today this week. Spent labor day with some friends down at the river hanging out so i missed that training day.

Wed:

DE DL
320x1x9

HE Bp
45/95/135/170/205x5
240x5
270x5
295x3@8/8.5/9.5 (i hit the left pin on my 2nd rep so it made the 3rd rep a struggle, i was starting to slow down here anyway.
Rep drop
295x1x2@7/7

Second week in a row i haven't been able to complete my planned work. Was supposed to be 5x3

RE Leg Press (single leg)
120x10
140x10
Bilateral: 320x10

1/2 kneeling iso cable row (pronated)
110x12x4

Today:

DE Squat
45/95/135x5
+ Loose Belt
185x3x8 --> these all felt great. Felt like bar speed was damn close to as quick as the set with the empty bar.

HE Conv DL
135/185/225/275/315x5
365x3
405x1
435x3x4 @8/8/8/9
365x3

I was getting a good wedge until the first set with 435. Once again, once i get up over 85% i start pulling instead of pushing. My hips stay high and dont drive through. After the 2nd set I widened my base a little bit (entire lower leg is within the knurled portion of the bar) and it helped minutely but definitely wasnt great. I was supposed to do 5x3 but with the difficulty of the last set i decided to drop it down. So i wasnt able to complete this programmed work either. If I wasnt missing so much time I'd think I needed a deload with how my workouts have been going, but that cannot be the problem.

•inc db bp
80x8x4

Ss/

•Ng cable row
180x8x5

Im considering abandoning the strength progression that I programmed. I programmed it myself and i feel like it isnt working out because the two lifts going the worst are my HE bench and HE deadlift, both of which I programmed. I am toying with the idea of incorporating some of 5th set into my training (mainly just the 4x2 with last (5th) set AMRAP component and maybe the accessory work). He plans for a 9 day micro cycle which is on average about what im doing, except it is a 4 session 9 day microcycle and right now im only running 3. I do want to keep going full body though so I'll have to bastardize another program to keep that aspect how I want it.
 
Consume the meat, spit out the bone, as Swede himself says about learning from others. You take it in, decide what’s useful to you, and discard what you can’t use - this is how you grow.

5th Set, the actual 4x2 then a 5th AMRAP set, worked very well for my bench and deadlift. Jessica hit her best circus dumbbell using it, and we coincidentally applied it today for her logpress to great effect. Her first doubles at 152 were sketch, but her set of 5 could have kept going she was so in the groove.
 
Hyde said:
Consume the meat, spit out the bone, as Swede himself says about learning from others. You take it in, decide what’s useful to you, and discard what you can’t use - this is how you grow.

5th Set, the actual 4x2 then a 5th AMRAP set, worked very well for my bench and deadlift. Jessica hit her best circus dumbbell using it, and we coincidentally applied it today for her logpress to great effect. Her first doubles at 152 were sketch, but her set of 5 could have kept going she was so in the groove.
Click to expand...

It didnt really do too much for me the last time I gave it a chance. But I also didnt truly commit to it I dont think. I've had a very hard time getting back into AMRAP sets, especially for deadlifts. I feel like thats what led to my initial back flare several years ago while doing 5/3/1. I think the AMRAP would work for me on bench at that percentage range thats used in 5th set though, (edit: but then I always end up missing singles lower rep stuff and handling heavier loads like I do when I get to x1@8 top sets.)

I was also considering dropping this DE work for bench and replacing it with the technique work percentage and progression that is programmed in 5th set. I don't really feel like im gaining anything beneficial from this bench DE work. Especially since dropping the bands, which I did because i felt like it changes the pressing arc too much. I thought it was really altering my groove and that I was fighting the bands horizontally too much. I definitely think chains are the superior option for benching and I dont have access to those.
 
Todays exercise (Swede says if you arent progressing at all all you're doing is exercising/maintaining instead of training and progressing so it looks like ive just been exercising like a weekend warrior for the last 6 month lol)

•DE Spoto
185x3x8

•HE/RE Squat
45/95/135/185x5
+ loose belt
230x3x10 - 60 seconds rest

Felt great. Last 2 squat sessions have been definite steps forward.

•RE PC Tri Set - going through continuously.
1. Rope pull through
180x12x3

2. SL Glute Bridge
Bwx10x2

3. GHR
Bwx15x2

•Facepull
50x15x2

Notes:
1. I dont feel very accomplished when I leave the gym on this day. Its almost more of an active recovery type session than it is a training session where I'll accumulate any notable cns fatigue. I am questioning of im doing enough here. I oscillate my calories and nutrition based on if i train or not on a given day and here I almost feel like I should keep cals and carbs lower almost as if I didnt train. I know i can afford a bit more carbs at the least just due to whatever mild increase in insulin sensitivity that I get, but you get the point.

2. As i just mentioned to Hyde. Im questioning the DE work and am considering changing to the 5th set technique progression in its place. It still isnt heavy and would allow me to work technique better by having a little hit of heavier loads (I think its ~70% for 5 sets of 3). Here I dont feel like i can gauge technique changes because the load is light but I also dont think its truly having any carryover to my comp pressing.
 
Dynamic work only has payout beyond active recovery if using chains or bands. Swede’s template is the better option without accommodating resistance. That’s a good change if you aren’t using either.

The day you just did seems like too little to me as well. You should add some more compound work in however you see fit (RDL, GMs, slingshot bench, Military Press, whatever)
 
Hyde said:
Dynamic work only has payout beyond active recovery if using chains or bands. Swede’s template is the better option without accommodating resistance. That’s a good change if you aren’t using either.

The day you just did seems like too little to me as well. You should add some more compound work in however you see fit (RDL, GMs, slingshot bench, Military Press, whatever)
Click to expand...

I was thinking that as well, regarding the compound work. In order to keep the DE/HE/RE concept consistent through the training week the logical place for me to add some compound work is for RE PC - which i started off doing BB RDLs for then went to db SL RDLs then ive done this the last 2 weeks - i did plan to add a set or two of GHRs today but had to leave due to some personal stuff with the gf. But I do agree i need to get back to either rdls or gms. I feel rdls are a better hyper move...do you guys?

What do you think about adding a training day where I do Swede's second pressing day with the 2x25 NG Db Bp, the 4x30 tricep extensions (iirc thats the same day), that PC tri set stuff? Oooor I could just keep my training days the same, add in that extra upper work somewhere throughout the week, and add 2-3 sets of GHRs to my pre-session warmup.

So:

Option 1
Days 1-3: DE/HE/RE for each lift
Day 4: Swede pressing day 2 + extra PC hyper work (+/- some of my normal week rowing work +/- carries)

Or

Option 2:
Keep days 1-3 the same and add the other work in.

Pros for 1:
1. Dont add any time into my current sessions which is a big plus because im already topping out at about an hour and a half of total gym time.
2. I could also even cut down on time by moving some of the rowing work I do each session to this 4th session.
3. Ive been wanting to find time to work in loaded carries and I could dedicate time on this day for that.

Cons for 1:
1. Reducing competition lift training frequency by adding in a pure fluff day which is a big big drawback imo.

Pro for 2:
1. Keep training frequency up as high as i have been able to (3 lifts every 7-9 days, which is ****, I know).

Cons:
1. Potentially add time on to my sessions by adding those extras.

At this point I feel that i am recovering fine from these sessions so I could handle a little extra volume in the training day if i go that route.
 
It really comes down to whether you want more days off or you’d like to be in the gym a little more often but keep the session size from growing any.

The benefit to the 4th day is it can be an optional thing without having to rearrange anything if you have to miss it.
 
jswain34 said:
I do the same exact thing with practicing bracing throughout the day, and do feel that I am able to brace without the belt in just about EVERYTHING EXCEPT a barbell back squat.



I always went along with this same line of thought, which is why I never felt the need to take off my belt. But then I never took off my belt and I ended up getting hurt sporadically. I understand the view of why and how one should still get a stronger core while wearing the belt as long as they're bracing properly, and I do believe that it does happen. But after fcking up my back multiple times I definitely think that there is merit to dedicated core work and doing movements that may not be the most "dangerous" without a belt on. I cant explain why but I think that it does either psychology create a crutch or without that external object cueing you make it more difficult to brace without it.

With that said, I think my best bet is to listen to you guys' advice and back squat with my belt on going forward. I can do beltless work in other areas if i feel the need or desire to do so.
Click to expand...

Oh I agree there too. I often don't use a belt until I get into what I consider real work sets regardless.

Hyde said:
It really comes down to whether you want more days off or you’d like to be in the gym a little more often but keep the session size from growing any.

The benefit to the 4th day is it can be an optional thing without having to rearrange anything if you have to miss it.
Click to expand...

I do like the 3 main and 1 optional approach as well. I have used this with a good bit of my performance based stuff. Specify on the first 3 days then hit accessories with hypertrophy or pump work on that 4rth day if I felt good enough, or take it off if I was feeling a little run down. Seems to work pretty well for me.
 
Hyde said:
It really comes down to whether you want more days off or you’d like to be in the gym a little more often but keep the session size from growing any.

The benefit to the 4th day is it can be an optional thing without having to rearrange anything if you have to miss it.
Click to expand...

The way i was going to work it wouldnt really lead to any more days off as I was just going to plug it into the rotation I have going. Id still train the same # of days/week i would just have one other session variant in the cycle.

Optional thing - ill address it below.

MrKleen73 said:
Oh I agree there too. I often don't use a belt until I get into what I consider real work sets regardless.

I do like the 3 main and 1 optional approach as well. I have used this with a good bit of my performance based stuff. Specify on the first 3 days then hit accessories with hypertrophy or pump work on that 4rth day if I felt good enough, or take it off if I was feeling a little run down. Seems to work pretty well for me.
Click to expand...

And thats where I was making the mistake. Even though the weights in using have previously been warmup sets, the truth of the matter is is that they are NOW work sets for me in this setup. So using the belt makes sense once I changed my perspective a little.

I wasnt really considering it as a potential optional day that could be done based on available time that week and/or current recovery status. But I really like both of your trains of thought here. Its almost like the 4th day in Cube, but optional based on the factors above. Itd let me keep all of the 3 days i am currently rotating the same and also give me a place to plug in any missed accessory work (rowing would be the main culprit here) and also add in some of the extra hyper work as well as "functional" (eg. carries) and rehab/prehab stuff (that tri set + Donnie Hangs) id like to include. I appreciate you guys running trough this with me, I really enjoy having people to bounce ideas off of...and it helps having faith that the people that follow (at least that I know about and contribute to) my log know what they're talking about.
 
"Week" 3 training day 3

Made the switch to 5th set bench template today. I used 355 as my max which is 5lbs less than i hit on my last 2 max days. After the work though i am gonna have to nut up not to fail out of the microcycle in the first 3-4 weeks.

•DE Conv DL - every 30 seconds at work sets
135/225/275x5
275x1
315x1
330x1x9 - alternated DOH, Strong mixed, weak mixed - the sets with the left under and right over ("strong mixed" were by far the most explosive and i had the most hip drive off the floor. Its strange how the grip can change so much.

•HE BP (5th set)
45/95/135/185/215x5
245x2
270x2x4@6/6.5/6/7 - did middle finger on the ring the last set vs pinky for the others.
[email protected]

Did 2 sets of 5 dead hang pullups randomly throughout bench for no good reason at all.

•SL Leg Press - pin loaded machine
160x8x4
B/l: 340x some number - i just went until i had a decent amount of lactic acid buildup.

Ss/

•WG seated cable row
130x15x4

•Zbar cable tri extension
Overhand grip: 130x20
Underhand grip: 70x20
 
Hyde said:
Kipping pull-ups is the secret
Click to expand...

SHhhhh... don't tell anyone...

I actually want to learn the correct way to do a Kipping Pull Up, IE a gymnastics / crossfit pull up. I know how to kip when I am trying to squeeze out some extra reps on regular pull ups. However I would like to learn the correct form for kipping pull ups too. They are a good exercise that incorporate a lot of muscle and are good for strength endurance, and metabolic training as well.
 
Hyde said:
Kipping pull-ups is the secret
Click to expand...

SHhhhh... don't tell anyone...

I actually want to learn the correct way to do a Kipping Pull Up, IE a gymnastics / crossfit pull up. I know how to kip when I am trying to squeeze out some extra reps on regular pull ups. However I would like to learn the correct form for kipping pull ups too. They are a good exercise that incorporate a lot of muscle and are good for strength endurance, and metabolic training as well.
 
MrKleen73 said:
SHhhhh... don't tell anyone...

I actually want to learn the correct way to do a Kipping Pull Up, IE a gymnastics / crossfit pull up. I know how to kip when I am trying to squeeze out some extra reps on regular pull ups. However I would like to learn the correct form for kipping pull ups too. They are a good exercise that incorporate a lot of muscle and are good for strength endurance, and metabolic training as well.
Click to expand...

You really killed the joke there, Kleen
 
Hyde said:
You really killed the joke there, Kleen
Click to expand...

Haha, I know right!

The Shhhhh don't tell anyone was the response to the joke.

Then I had a real thought and it took over... BOO on me. ;)

Yesterday was TRT shot day so all my opinions must be shared regardless of value... :D
 
Lol, i will likely never buy in to kipping pull ups. They cannot do more good than harm than jerking your shoulders repetitively like that and essentially using momentum and whip from your lower half to propel yourself back up to the bar. You do you Kleen, but you wont catch me doing them!
 
Did something today. Did the 4th day because I didnt feel like heavy deads after a weekend of pretty ****ty eating (under eating for the most part). I didnt wanna leave myself that excuse if the day went poorly.

Donnie Hangs
Swede pull aparts (choked around pull up bar)
Pro light mini x30x2
Hammer curls 25x15x2

•Inc DB NG Press
40x30x2, will go up 5 lbs.

•Ng Inc bench chest supported row (45 degree angle)
60x8x3

Ss/

•Pull throughs
180x12x2

•Inc bench chest supported shrug
40x20x2 (trying to squeeze a full one count at peak retraction)

Ss/

•GHR
Bwx15x2

•Trap bar carries
135/225x70 feet each
315x 70ft x3

Did a few sets of calves to finish it off

Since i plan on lifting tomorrow most likely I cut the lower body stuff by a set or 2. And i may decide to do a little more total work on the carries.
 
I’ve been trying to get back into the habit of working in some sort of carry (front rack kb or plate loaded farmers on treadmill thing) besides my core work.

Oh, and that’s a lot of reps on your NG incline lol
 
tyga tyga said:
I’ve been trying to get back into the habit of working in some sort of carry (front rack kb or plate loaded farmers on treadmill thing) besides my core work.

Oh, and that’s a lot of reps on your NG incline lol
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I have been wanting to work it in for months but never mad an opening for it during the usual training week. So, I added this day and made a dedicated slot for it.

The NG press is from Swede's 5th set. I can hardly count that high.
 
tyga tyga said:
I’ve been trying to get back into the habit of working in some sort of carry (front rack kb or plate loaded farmers on treadmill thing) besides my core work.

Oh, and that’s a lot of reps on your NG incline lol
Click to expand...

When you get past 20 and realize you still have 10 more, it’s gonna burn. But it works.
 
jswain34 said:
Lol, i will likely never buy in to kipping pull ups. They cannot do more good than harm than jerking your shoulders repetitively like that and essentially using momentum and whip from your lower half to propel yourself back up to the bar. You do you Kleen, but you wont catch me doing them!
Click to expand...

:) You big scaredy cat!!! ;)

Kipping pullups should be done with control, they may not look controlled but there is no jerking of shoulders or anything there. The upper body does the exact same thing as normal. You just produce a little momentum from bringing your knees up quickly, but your form should still be locked in. It looks like there is a big jerk from the shoulders but it is just the speed you move when already pulling hard with your hands and then adding momentum via the leg movement. You bump up a few inches quickly.

Yes you can do the wrong too, like anything else but a kipping pull up should be the same from as a regular one you are just using the kip to generate a little assistance. Same as a cheat curl. You can do it correctly and use a little momentum during the concentric contraction, then lower under control, or you can lean slightly forward then go into triple extension using only momentum to get the weight up over and over and call it a rep. However, that doesn't benefit anything and risks injury. A cheat curl done correctly is a great tool. Same with a proper kip up with a pull up or chin.

However I totally get your reasoning for not doing them and having pull downs as options to get more volume when proper pull ups become too hard, I don't really see a need mess with them unless you want too.
 
MrKleen73 said:
:) You big scaredy cat!!! ;)

Kipping pullups should be done with control, they may not look controlled but there is no jerking of shoulders or anything there. The upper body does the exact same thing as normal. You just produce a little momentum from bringing your knees up quickly, but your form should still be locked in. It looks like there is a big jerk from the shoulders but it is just the speed you move when already pulling hard with your hands and then adding momentum via the leg movement. You bump up a few inches quickly.

Yes you can do the wrong too, like anything else but a kipping pull up should be the same from as a regular one you are just using the kip to generate a little assistance. Same as a cheat curl. You can do it correctly and use a little momentum during the concentric contraction, then lower under control, or you can lean slightly forward then go into triple extension using only momentum to get the weight up over and over and call it a rep. However, that doesn't benefit anything and risks injury. A cheat curl done correctly is a great tool. Same with a proper kip up with a pull up or chin.

However I totally get your reasoning for not doing them and having pull downs as options to get more volume when proper pull ups become too hard, I don't really see a need mess with them unless you want too.
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It took me quite a while to get the kipping pullup down. I worked out at a crossfit box that wouldnt let you do kipping pullups until you could do 10 (i think it was 10. Cant remember exactly) strict. When done properly its a great workout. It took even longer to get the butterfly pull up down. The butterfly pullup just feels so unnatural when you first do it. And you learn kipping first which makes it harder because the butterfly the motion is alot like kipping but in reverse which is weird
 
christ83189 said:
It took me quite a while to get the kipping pullup down. I worked out at a crossfit box that wouldnt let you do kipping pullups until you could do 10 (i think it was 10. Cant remember exactly) strict. When done properly its a great workout. It took even longer to get the butterfly pull up down. The butterfly pullup just feels so unnatural when you first do it. And you learn kipping first which makes it harder because the butterfly the motion is alot like kipping but in reverse which is weird
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Yes, the true gymnastic move of a kipping pull up is very technical. I understand the mechanics of it but haven't had the chance to work out in a box and get taught in person. It ain't cheap...
 
MrKleen73 said:
Yes, the true gymnastic move of a kipping pull up is very technical. I understand the mechanics of it but haven't had the chance to work out in a box and get taught in person. It ain't cheap...
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No its definitely far from cheap unless you pick up a deal for a local box thats like 10 sessions for a certain price. I hear you can find em on groupon from time to time
 
christ83189 said:
No its definitely far from cheap unless you pick up a deal for a local box thats like 10 sessions for a certain price. I hear you can find em on groupon from time to time
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Yes, I intend to give it a shot at least for a month some time. Just need this foot to heal up.
 
I am here simply to update yesterday's life and wont interject in the crossfit brocrushing going on in here right now . (Feel free to converse about whatever in here lol, it at least keeps the log moving along).

Yesterday:

•DE Squat (mid bar) - 45 seconds rest
185x3x3
185x2x5 (realized it was only supposed to be x2)

Felt good. Explosive as they should be. Didnt use the belt. These ones are light enough where i feel more than comfortable with that.

•HE Conv DL
135/225x5 (225 for 2 sets)
275x5
315x5
365x3
405x2
450x2x5@7/7.5/7/7/7

•RE incline db press
85x6x4

Ss/

•NG Cable row
180x8x5

•Fly myo-set
70x12
5s rest
x4x4 (5s rest between)
x3

Thats it. The tingling in the ulnar distribution of my left hand was pretty bad on Monday so I did use the rollflex along the medial tricep (think close to the distal attachment of the medial head) and that was exquisitely tender but after doing that the symptoms cleared up nicely. I did it again last night and also used my freeze sleeve on that elbow a few times over the last 3-4 days. It makes me happy that using the rollflex improved the symptoms because it makes me think the irritation is coming from somewhere proximal to the cubital tunnel vs where before i thought it was actually in the elbow itself.

Lower back has felt great. Need to focus on keeping my chest up on deads off the floor. I think that could be a big cue in getting me back to where I was a while back, along with thinking to spread the floor laterally vs just "pulling". Thats something ive struggled with forever and still cant seem to consistently get it down.
 
I never think about pulling - I think about wedging my hips through, bending the bar around me with lats, and legpressing back through my heels as hard as I can (for conventional).

But pulling is never a great activator like you are saying. Getting the hips moving through is the shared key.
 
Hyde said:
I never think about pulling - I think about wedging my hips through, bending the bar around me with lats, and legpressing back through my heels as hard as I can (for conventional).

But pulling is never a great activator like you are saying. Getting the hips moving through is the shared key.
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I should have worded that differently, I also never think about "pulling" its just the habit I naturally seem to fall into. What you described is exactly how I was feeling I was executing when my conv pull was at it's best and what I'm trying to get back to executing consistently.
 
Yesterday:

As you'll see, I did sub in a compound exercise for the RE posterior chain slot. I decided to work rack pulls vs bands for a while. I remember from Proj Momentum that I initially started off hating rack pulls and being pretty horrible at them, but as my dead started progressing, pretty rapidly about half way through, thats also when I started making strides in the rack pull. In a RE focus it is also doubling down for technical/positioning practice as well. It may not be as great of a pure hypertrophy move as an RDL, but I think its what will kill then most birds with a single stone at this point in time.

I also switched bench DE to the technique work from 5th set.

•DE BP (67.5% rounded down to nearest 5)
45/95/135/175/210x5
235x5x3

•"HE" Squat
45/95/135/185x5
+ belt
225x5
250x5x5

•RE Rack Pull (below the knee)
Vs doubled monster minu
185/225x10
275x10x3 -> alternating mixed grips every 5.

Ss/

•Facepull
50x15x3

Edit: i suck at rack pulls again. Breaking the bar off the pins wasn't easy...it's definitely at least partially a positioning issue. I did realize that I cant pull with as wide of a stance as I was trying to. I never realized how awkward it was on the top half of the lift until i tried starting from that position off the pins for the first set.
 
Hyde said:
How did the 5x5 squat feel?
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Ah, shoulda commented on that. Honestly, not great. Still fighting to get the bar comfortable on my upper back above the rear delts. I retract my scaps but it still feels like i dont have enough meat on my upper back to support it there, when I know I should and would think that I do. And i had that feeling of fighting myself as i was dropping into and coming out of the hole again. Definitely still need some more refining over these next 4 weeks before I try it again...but if the "heavier" work week 8 is at least a little improved from this session I'll work up to a circa max in week 12 and then plan to transition into a more stereotypical strength progression with percentages that are higher more consistently (ie. 70-85% regularly for the strength day).
 
I've still yet to ever do a true rack pull. Or floor press, for that matter.
 
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