Would you consider this cycle a failure?

[Davy25]

Just coming off my tbol + test + anavar cycle. I gained 10 lbs lean muscle and had amazing strength gains, but honestly dont feel like the mirror has changed much. I see some physiques on here that look like greek gods, and its like jeez where are you getting your gear from???

My diet was in check, tracked macros and ate at a 300-800 calorie surplus *assuming maintenance ok workout days is 2200 calories.

I drank alcohol 2 times a week on the weekends but obstained entirely during the week. I gained about 70 lbs now on deadlift max, 55 on bench max, and instead of doing squat 335x 1 i now do 335 x 10 prettt easily.

Invalid Link Removed

 

[Davy25]

Also, just as a side note: i calculated it out and the pinning supplies, gear, pct, and cycle support cost me about $550 in total.

 

[RickyBlobby]

10lbs of muscle plus a decrease in body fat= successful cycle IMO

 

[Rostam]

To be honest based on your before pic I would not have started any cycle. It looks like you haven't reached your natural growth potential and need a lot of right food and workout before moving to any cycle. You could gain these 10 lbs naturally and save $550.

 

[Whisky]

To be fair I get where you are coming from as before my first cycle I thought 10lbs I’d lean mass would suddenly make me look amazing......it’s probably more like 30-40lbs lean mass that’s needed. With cutting cycles (or more recomps) inbetween.

Basically saying that one cycle was never going to do what it sounds like you want but sensible cycling over 2-4 years probably will bro.....

Obviously with the increased strength you should be able to shift more weight off cycle and keep progress (albeit much slower) going......

 

[Davy25]

I would say starting *on left* i was at my genetic potential as hard to believe that is. Ive been lifting for 8 years now and started lifting at 125 lbs and maxed at 180-185 in college then got chubbier and only lifted about 3 times a week prior to last september.

Start of cycle i was back down to a relatively lean 180 lbs and then at the end i am now 191-192 with water weight and calculated at 9.5% BF *just clocked the other day*

 

[mikeymike85]

There is a difference, I'd say it was a good run. You're not lean enough for Var...u should have ran TBol solo. You look better, but you are nowhere near 9% BF. Try double, not to be rude, but I'd want honest criticism if it were me. You should run something like DMZ to gain more mass, then do a cut with Var after.

 

[Davy25]

There is a difference, I'd say it was a good run. You're not lean enough for Var...u should have ran TBol solo. You look better, but you are nowhere near 9% BF. Try double, not to be rude, but I'd want honest criticism if it were me. You should run something like DMZ to gain more mass, then do a cut with Var after.

My next run is going to be a pure bulk over winter to get up above 200. Shooting for 210 then leaning out come late spring. I used one of the handheld body fat monitors and i got 9.5% at 5’11” so im not sure how that could be wrong? It was post workout if that makes any difference but i thought those were the most accurate readers? My initial guess was 13-14% but i wasnt going to argue with something that actually analyzes instead of going by eye.

And yes, honest criticism is always appreciated.

 

[mikeymike85]

Those handheld ones are trash... I used to PT and we used them, they blow.

 

[AnabolicGuru]

I wouldn’t consider it a failure. Your strength went up a lot, and you got to learn how your body responds to those compounds. Everyone has different genetics, so not everyone will get similar results. Some people might blow up, others might only grow a bit; but comparing yourself to others wont change your genetics. Also, I agree with mikey on the bodyfat. Those handheld monitors are awful lol. I’d guess your bodyfat to be 14-17%, but it’s hard to know without a dexa scan.

 

[BloodManor]

You don’t need to be lean when running var. I ran it at 18%bf at the end of my cycle and gained some solid lean mass and strength
Var is great anytime in a cycle and very mild

 

[Codybenz]

I would say succes, and if I had to guess by how your deadlift and squat went up, the majority of that 10 lbs was probably in your legs and this the reason you didn't see much change in mirror from waste up. Focus on upper body next time if you want to see that aesthetic difference in your arms, chest, etc

 

[KingAnt]

There is a difference, I'd say it was a good run. You're not lean enough for Var...u should have ran TBol solo. You look better, but you are nowhere near 9% BF. Try double, not to be rude, but I'd want honest criticism if it were me. You should run something like DMZ to gain more mass, then do a cut with Var after.

What would you consider to be the most practical and accurate device to measure body fat from home? I bought some calipers and my body composition is similar to OP and I'm getting about the same 9.5

 

[Whisky]

What would you consider to be the most practical and accurate device to measure body fat from home? I bought some calipers and my body composition is similar to OP and I'm getting about the same 9.5

Honestly nothing bio impedance based is realisable at all.

Calipers can work well if you really know what you are doing with them but that’s hard to learn.

My view is not to Sweat the actual percentage and go by the mirror, you cares if your 8% or 12% if you look how you want then it’s all good.

OP isn’t below 10% imo at all - probably 13-15% just from eye balling

 

[Rostam]

What would you consider to be the most practical and accurate device to measure body fat from home? I bought some calipers and my body composition is similar to OP and I'm getting about the same 9.5

I use Skulpt chisel and warrior electronic caliper. I believe both give roughly accurate measures. Skulpt gives higher values (2-3%) and Warrior is faster and easier to use and also cheaper. I think both work better for low body fat percentages than higher percentages.

Another easy but actually kind of accurate way of estimating body fat is to use one of these body fat percentage pics you can find every where on the internet. But you need to be honest when looking at you in the miroir and comparing with pics

 

[YoungThor]

I’d have used those compounds to cut it recomp, but even so, I wouldn’t call your cycle a failure. You added 10 lbs and your bf looks about the same. The strength increase was probably worth the money alone. Hopefully you keep a good chunk of that.

 

[mikeymike85]

You don’t need to be lean when running var. I ran it at 18%bf at the end of my cycle and gained some solid lean mass and strength
Var is great anytime in a cycle and very mild

It doesnt shine at high BF percentages. I bet physically you maybe looked a little fuller, maybe. IME, if you are lower to start, it shines and shows new cuts you never had. No offense but 18% BF you dont really have "cuts"

 

[mikeymike85]

What would you consider to be the most practical and accurate device to measure body fat from home? I bought some calipers and my body composition is similar to OP and I'm getting about the same 9.5

Not sure bro, I just know those handhelds blow from first hand experience. I personally could care less about BF, as long as I look lean and mean...that's it

 

[Slapoyjoe]

Alcohol on cycle is not a good strategy and suggests, to me at least, that you weren’t as committed as you could have been.

Failure? No? Did you maximise your potential for this cycle? Probably not

 

[mikeymike85]

Alcohol on cycle is not a good strategy and suggests, to me at least, that you weren’t as committed as you could have been.

Failure? No? Did you maximise your potential for this cycle? Probably not

Ditto- I must have missed that part. I used to drink on cycle, and if you want to look like Rambo, you cannot drink. It makes you look fluffed up and not hard. Not to mention hitting McD's latenight when you're loopy. Depends how bad you want it.

 

[YoungThor]

Ditto- I must have missed that part. I used to drink on cycle, and if you want to look like Rambo, you cannot drink. It makes you look fluffed up and not hard. Not to mention hitting McD's latenight when you're loopy. Depends how bad you want it.

I see you’re point but I think it’s still ultimately about calories in vs out. You can still look hardened and cut up if your overall calories don’t exceed maintenance. Of course this is hard to do if you’re drinking lots of beer.

 

[Davy25]

Yeah its all about calories in/ out but its hard to hot your protein levels if you are consuming alcohol and still stay below or at maintenance. I think my diet was the problem with this cycle because i was so focused on getting leaner but i also wanted to get stronger so i was eating just at maintenance or slightly above instead of eating like crazy to get bigger or eating at a cut and dry deficit to actually lean out a considerable amount. Honestly i woukd oay $500 again in a heartbeat to get the bench press gains, leaning out, and overall sense of well being again any day of the week.

 

[Davy25]

Also, i went through a very bad break up with my girlfriend of 3 years essentially right when i started the cycle *just prior* and i attribute the test to getting me through it and still having a good sense of well being and avoiding severe depression. Obviously any breakup will leave you under the weather but test managed to get me out and still get hot girls to get my mind off thw breakup.

 

[Renew1]

Just coming off my tbol + test + anavar cycle. I gained 10 lbs lean muscle and had amazing strength gains, but honestly dont feel like the mirror has changed much. I see some physiques on here that look like greek gods, and its like jeez where are you getting your gear from???

My diet was in check, tracked macros and ate at a 300-800 calorie surplus *assuming maintenance ok workout days is 2200 calories.

I drank alcohol 2 times a week on the weekends but obstained entirely during the week. I gained about 70 lbs now on deadlift max, 55 on bench max, and instead of doing squat 335x 1 i now do 335 x 10 prettt easily.

Invalid Link Removed

Nah bro....not a failure.

You gained good strength, ...and i gotta tell ya....look at the difference in your midsection!!!

NO HOMO HOMIE!!!
LOL

 

[BloodManor]

It doesnt shine at high BF percentages. I bet physically you maybe looked a little fuller, maybe. IME, if you are lower to start, it shines and shows new cuts you never had. No offense but 18% BF you dont really have "cuts"

I said gain lean muscle and strength who said anything about “cuts”
Plus this dude is 18%bf and has “cuts”
Invalid Link Removed

 

[AntM1564]

Nah bro....not a failure.

You gained good strength, ...and i gotta tell ya....look at the difference in your midsection!!!

NO HOMO HOMIE!!!
LOL

This. Mid section is tighter and delts look more rounded.

 

[edsd]

Just coming off my tbol + test + anavar cycle. I gained 10 lbs lean muscle and had amazing strength gains, but honestly dont feel like the mirror has changed much. I see some physiques on here that look like greek gods, and its like jeez where are you getting your gear from???

My diet was in check, tracked macros and ate at a 300-800 calorie surplus *assuming maintenance ok workout days is 2200 calories.

I drank alcohol 2 times a week on the weekends but obstained entirely during the week. I gained about 70 lbs now on deadlift max, 55 on bench max, and instead of doing squat 335x 1 i now do 335 x 10 prettt easily.

Invalid Link Removed

Sounds like a good cycle to me. I’ll take 10 clean pounds any day. Run that cycle twice a year and 20 pounds a year is really impressive.

 

[mikeymike85]

I said gain lean muscle and strength who said anything about “cuts”
Plus this dude is 18%bf and has “cuts”
Invalid Link Removed

Yes, we all strive to look like that mongoloid. That Venice beach 80s look is disgusting IMO. Just saying, I have friends that run var at 20% bf and I can't tell any different when they finish.

 

[mikeymike85]

I see you’re point but I think it’s still ultimately about calories in vs out. You can still look hardened and cut up if your overall calories don’t exceed maintenance. Of course this is hard to do if you’re drinking lots of beer.

Lol bro, you're comparing something that is catabolic vs.... a cheeseburger? I dont think cheeseburgers make you look fluffed up from estrogen

 

[BloodManor]

Yes, we all strive to look like that mongoloid. That Venice beach 80s look is disgusting IMO. Just saying, I have friends that run var at 20% bf and I can't tell any different when they finish.

And I have a friend that run var at 50mg daily for 4-6 month cycles that are sitting at 280 at 10-12% bf (my boy is my height 6’4) but his diet and training are on point. Many people run steroids and look the same because
A. Their diet sucks
B. Their training sucks
C. Both

Var is great anytime, don’t know why people parrot info all the time. Want to gain lean mass and lose some bf easily then run var. being shredded is all about diet

 

[YoungThor]

Lol bro, you're comparing something that is catabolic vs.... a cheeseburger? I dont think cheeseburgers make you look fluffed up from estrogen

That estrogen increase is insignificant. Some foods do the same thing. Heating up you’re food in the microwave while it’s in a Tupperware container realeases estrogen that you could then digest. But it won’t change your physique. I’ve said it before but I work with guys who drink beer every single night and they literally look like they’re running anavar and winstrol year round, that’s how vascular and how low their body fat is. All throughout history there’s been brick layers, miners, roofers, etc. that have six pack abs, while drinking every night. This is because they burn more calories then they consume. I, on the other hand, do have high bf and look soft in the midsection, in spite of the fact that I lay pavers, but that’s because I don’t just drink beer, I eat several meals a day. But I just got back to work after a six month layoff, and I started out around 20% bf, and if I work consistently until the end of the year then I will be around 15% or a little lower, while continuing to live the same lifestyle. But I’m pretty sure we’ve had this argument before and I doubt you’ll change you’re mind about beer just being empty calories. But I see it on construction sites everyday. The guys who work the hardest jobs, where they’re just constantly moving and lifting heavy shiit, often are as low as 10% bf and they drink beer when they want. The foremans who barely lift a finger but still drink a lot of beer, they look fat, bloated, and like you’re typically chubby drunkard.