christ83189
Well-known member
Yeah i was pretty surprised really when i got the results lol
First Cycle - DMZ Solo
- Thread starter blongo804
- Start date
Brienn8989
Active member
23 g for both, nice and slow and no pip.
blongo804
Active member
Small Update:
Just wanted to throw out a small update for now. Yesterday marked week 5 on DMZ, and weight seems to be hanging around 206-207lbs. My diet mostly sucked this weekend being that I was barely home since we were mostly out wedding venue browsing almost all weekend. By the end of the day yesterday I was so bloated from garbage that I lost feeling of my abdomen area, couldn't even flex it LOL. I'm hoping we found the right venue so these weekend trips can finally end. Needless to say, I've been bloated all morning but finally sent some of it down the sewer when I got to work.
Anyway, my diet is generally still around 230-240p, 105-110f, 340-350c. Strength gains have been real still. I'm really happy with where my lifts stand at the moment, but hoping to get them climbing further soon.
I'm also debating slowly dropping carbs and adding more fat to my diet as my cycle comes to an end. I'm wondering if I can lose a bit of water/glycogen while packing on more lean gains and strength gains. Maybe even also go to 60mg DMZ ed. Decisions, decisions..
Just wanted to throw out a small update for now. Yesterday marked week 5 on DMZ, and weight seems to be hanging around 206-207lbs. My diet mostly sucked this weekend being that I was barely home since we were mostly out wedding venue browsing almost all weekend. By the end of the day yesterday I was so bloated from garbage that I lost feeling of my abdomen area, couldn't even flex it LOL. I'm hoping we found the right venue so these weekend trips can finally end. Needless to say, I've been bloated all morning but finally sent some of it down the sewer when I got to work.
Anyway, my diet is generally still around 230-240p, 105-110f, 340-350c. Strength gains have been real still. I'm really happy with where my lifts stand at the moment, but hoping to get them climbing further soon.
I'm also debating slowly dropping carbs and adding more fat to my diet as my cycle comes to an end. I'm wondering if I can lose a bit of water/glycogen while packing on more lean gains and strength gains. Maybe even also go to 60mg DMZ ed. Decisions, decisions..
blongo804
Active member
Small Update:
Another quick update for everyone!
I'm definitely deflating after this weekend's shenanigans, so that's nice. Going to weigh in and measure tomorrow.
Woke up late today for the 2nd time since starting pre-work training this year.. Just been insanely busy and the little lethargy I've been getting isn't helping lol. Still got some training in though, just went into work a bit late since they don't care here.
Since bench was on the schedule, and I was short on time, I decided to focus a good bit of the session on bench. With that said, even with my hurt hand, as long as I use my 24" wrist wrap, I'm totally fine benching. It's crazy how much it helps as long as you know how to wrap right.
Anyway, I didn't go for crazy volume because I was feeling a pretty good potential to PR. I started the day with decline dumbbell bench because I've been liking this lately as a warm up. Never really did decline, but I've been happy with how I feel afterward from it. I did around 40 reps total with 60's just fine. Did some incline chest press to further warm up, then moved to bench. Did a quick 10 at 100lb, 6 at 140, 6 at 170, 4 at 190, a 205 single, 215 single, 220 single. My last bench PR was 210 clean, missed 215 the same day with a butt lift off the bench. Haven't really gone too close to it since (about 2 months ago). Had no gear on besides my left wrist wrap. Super happy with this. So close to a two plate bench finally!
Since I was late to the gym, I also bumped into my fiance since she gets there after me due to her work schedule. She doesn't normally see me in "pump" mode and commented on how wide I was looking. Yesssss.
Another quick update for everyone!
I'm definitely deflating after this weekend's shenanigans, so that's nice. Going to weigh in and measure tomorrow.
Woke up late today for the 2nd time since starting pre-work training this year.. Just been insanely busy and the little lethargy I've been getting isn't helping lol. Still got some training in though, just went into work a bit late since they don't care here.
Since bench was on the schedule, and I was short on time, I decided to focus a good bit of the session on bench. With that said, even with my hurt hand, as long as I use my 24" wrist wrap, I'm totally fine benching. It's crazy how much it helps as long as you know how to wrap right.
Anyway, I didn't go for crazy volume because I was feeling a pretty good potential to PR. I started the day with decline dumbbell bench because I've been liking this lately as a warm up. Never really did decline, but I've been happy with how I feel afterward from it. I did around 40 reps total with 60's just fine. Did some incline chest press to further warm up, then moved to bench. Did a quick 10 at 100lb, 6 at 140, 6 at 170, 4 at 190, a 205 single, 215 single, 220 single. My last bench PR was 210 clean, missed 215 the same day with a butt lift off the bench. Haven't really gone too close to it since (about 2 months ago). Had no gear on besides my left wrist wrap. Super happy with this. So close to a two plate bench finally!
Since I was late to the gym, I also bumped into my fiance since she gets there after me due to her work schedule. She doesn't normally see me in "pump" mode and commented on how wide I was looking. Yesssss.
KingAnt
Member
What would you guys use for a test base on a cycle like this if stabbing wasn't an option ?
blongo804
Active member
Good question that I'd also like opinions on. I imagine nothing beats the tried and true pinned test, so I'm not sure there's any other legitimate options. Some claim Dermacrine works well, but others claim it does nothing for them.
An update coming in next post!
blongo804
Active member
Update:
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I believe this is my all time highest weigh in between this cycle, and, well, quite possibly ever lol. Miraculously, my waist has remained the same! I'm pretty relieved by this because this past weekend had me slightly worried.
With that said, I did finally add some more fat to my diet like I planned. Yesterday I added two slices of low calorie bread with 32g peanut butter per slice for 64g total, so my end of day macros yesterday were: 250p, 355c, 132f.
Rather than an off day today, I wanted to have a deadlift focused session because it's been about 1.5-2 months since I've deadlifted. I've done rack and block pulls in the meantime, but no true DL's. Using only a wrist wrap on my left hand, I started with 135 to make sure form was spot on and it was good. Moved to 225x5, felt good. 275x5, felt good. 325x5, felt good. With how 325 felt, I decided to do singles with mixed grip from there (all other sets were double overhand). 375 moved a little slow off the ground, but once it was off, it moved good. With a bench PR yesterday, I thought it was worth trying to continue the trend with DL's. My PR prior to today was 415 with straps only (2 months ago) after doing a strength program that had me doing DL's, of some form, weekly. Today I decided to attempt 425. I failed the first attempt trying to be a little greedy and use no straps, mixed grip only. The bar came off the ground but grip failed almost instantly in my hurt left hand thus right hand dropped it too. The DMZ gym aggression fired me up after that so I killed the 425 attempt with straps soon after the failed attempt. Real hype!!
Really wish I could back squat without my hand/wrist hurting, but any time my wrist is bent with weight in it is a bad time. I'm still happy with my front squat progress so there's that at least.
Those are the main updates for today. Weight, waist, macros, deadlift PR. Still tempted to move to 60mg/day DMZ..
Invalid Link Removed
I believe this is my all time highest weigh in between this cycle, and, well, quite possibly ever lol. Miraculously, my waist has remained the same! I'm pretty relieved by this because this past weekend had me slightly worried.
With that said, I did finally add some more fat to my diet like I planned. Yesterday I added two slices of low calorie bread with 32g peanut butter per slice for 64g total, so my end of day macros yesterday were: 250p, 355c, 132f.
Rather than an off day today, I wanted to have a deadlift focused session because it's been about 1.5-2 months since I've deadlifted. I've done rack and block pulls in the meantime, but no true DL's. Using only a wrist wrap on my left hand, I started with 135 to make sure form was spot on and it was good. Moved to 225x5, felt good. 275x5, felt good. 325x5, felt good. With how 325 felt, I decided to do singles with mixed grip from there (all other sets were double overhand). 375 moved a little slow off the ground, but once it was off, it moved good. With a bench PR yesterday, I thought it was worth trying to continue the trend with DL's. My PR prior to today was 415 with straps only (2 months ago) after doing a strength program that had me doing DL's, of some form, weekly. Today I decided to attempt 425. I failed the first attempt trying to be a little greedy and use no straps, mixed grip only. The bar came off the ground but grip failed almost instantly in my hurt left hand thus right hand dropped it too. The DMZ gym aggression fired me up after that so I killed the 425 attempt with straps soon after the failed attempt. Real hype!!
Really wish I could back squat without my hand/wrist hurting, but any time my wrist is bent with weight in it is a bad time. I'm still happy with my front squat progress so there's that at least.
Those are the main updates for today. Weight, waist, macros, deadlift PR. Still tempted to move to 60mg/day DMZ..
KingAnt
Member
I'd wait till some experienced guys chime in on raising dmz to 60mg.
I don't know anything about it really. But I upped my andros ( cuz more is always better right?) lol no. And I think that upping it is what started to give me bad sides. But honestly I'm not sure.
KingAnt
Member
Well hey man sounds like a great cycle! I'm definetly going to try DMZ for my second cycle and pretty much follow exactly in your foot steps for it.
blongo804
Active member
Upping the dose will definitely up the potential for sides with DMZ. I've seen others use 60mg and be happy with the results, but others also recommend against going that high. I'm just wanting more and more, but i'm also trying to keep patience.
It sure has been great so far! Best of luck with your DMZ cycle. It's been a great time and i'm happy to have made a path for you to follow. Be sure to stick around for PCT.
Brienn8989
Active member
I use 4ad. Others prefer dermacrine or trest. But trest is some nasty ****.
Brienn8989
Active member
KingAnt
Member
Man I'm kinda scared of 4 andro after my first cycle giving me some nipple puffiness.
I don't know anything about dermacrine or trest.
Dermacrine comes in a topical cream right? Does that stuff actually work decent?
Brienn8989
Active member
Some love it. I’ve never used it.
KingAnt
Member
How often and what dosages would one want to take the test base?
If not often then maybe it would be worth learning how to properly pin?
**** kinda freaks me out though.
KingAnt
Member
Small Update:
Just wanted to throw out a small update for now. Yesterday marked week 5 on DMZ, and weight seems to be hanging around 206-207lbs. My diet mostly sucked this weekend being that I was barely home since we were mostly out wedding venue browsing almost all weekend. By the end of the day yesterday I was so bloated from garbage that I lost feeling of my abdomen area, couldn't even flex it LOL. I'm hoping we found the right venue so these weekend trips can finally end. Needless to say, I've been bloated all morning but finally sent some of it down the sewer when I got to work.
Anyway, my diet is generally still around 230-240p, 105-110f, 340-350c. Strength gains have been real still. I'm really happy with where my lifts stand at the moment, but hoping to get them climbing further soon.
I'm also debating slowly dropping carbs and adding more fat to my diet as my cycle comes to an end. I'm wondering if I can lose a bit of water/glycogen while packing on more lean gains and strength gains. Maybe even also go to 60mg DMZ ed. Decisions, decisions..
You planning on doing bloodwork pre and/or post pct?
blongo804
Active member
Bloodwork will be post PCT. I'm too cheap/poor to do it pre and post PCT.. :crying:
blongo804
Active member
That's actually what I've been using and it works fantastic!
I'm still a cheapskate though and if I had to choose one bloodwork, I think post PCT is most important.
KingAnt
Member
That's actually what I've been using and it works fantastic!
I'm still a cheapskate though and if I had to choose one bloodwork, I think post PCT is most important.
Yeah I would agree.
Old Witch
Well-known member
My first choice would be scoring some 4AD from the UK and running that with an esterified 4 andro like CnP and IML offer. In lieu of that the esterified 4 andro would do. I personally wouldn't use dermacrine, as others do, because if I wanted plain Jane dhea I would just buy it from Walmart for cheap.
You can use Deca type bases but if you're scared of gyno that's going to be the absolute worst thing for it.
You would want to think of the 4AD as test suspension and the esterified 4 andro as enth or decanoate. So 150mg daily of the esterified and 100mg 3x daily of the unesterified.
If you can find English esterified 4AD Cyp like they used to have around in the US then get that and also hip me to it. I can't find it.
KingAnt
Member
Thanks, I'll have to do some more research on that. How often and what quantities would be sufficient for a test base? And what are some precautionary steps to avoid gyno before it starts? I hear inhibit P, nolva on cycle, ralox on cycle, etc.
Old Witch
Well-known member
To prevent gyno something as simple as L dopa 150mg 2x daily can do the job. Otherwise prami, ralox, caber... Tends to work good. Though, DMZ should still have the estrogen and progesterone receptor blocking capabilities of its father and grandfather hormones Superdrol and Masteron. Largely gyno won't be expected til pct.
If you can find 6-oxo or ATD get that. Or both.
See my first reply about test base dosing with 4AD and 4 andro.
If you can find 6-oxo or ATD get that. Or both.
See my first reply about test base dosing with 4AD and 4 andro.
KingAnt
Member
Ah my bad I must have missed that somehow lol? Hey thanks for the tips man. I think I speak for everyone when I say it's much appreciated.
blongo804
Active member
So would you say something like below, roughly twice a day, should help during PCT? Want to make sure I have all my bases covered and would really like to prevent gyno during PCT.
Invalid Link Removed
Would something like prami, ralox, caber be best to try and kill gyno if it does manage to come up? From what you're saying, it seems L Dopa may be best to prevent it from happening in the first place.
Still learning more and more, so your thoughts are greatly appreciated!
Old Witch
Well-known member
It's just cheaper than cabergoline and it's a dopamine agonist, to prevent prolactin release. Your body might fight harder than that, so just be aware. If the dopa doesn't work, caber likely wouldn't have worked either. If that's the case then it's ralox or prami. Never heard of prami not working but I have heard ralox can be a miss too. I personally have never (knock wood) had a gyno flare up in 15 years of doing this kind of thing. I like to think that's because of prevention. I doubt there will be an issue with the DMZ pct. take your serms, and the dopa, if the nips start to itch, then add prami or ralox. You should be fine.
blongo804
Active member
Fantastic info again. Greatly appreciated!
Brienn8989
Active member
If I remember correct you’ll only need prami/caber if you’re on a 19-nor i.e. tren/deca. And I think it’s prami that has nasty sides with it as well. Could be wrong
Old Witch
Well-known member
On cycle, yes, generally only needed for 19 nor. During pct for ANYTHING if you're getting the onset of gyno you're going to need the prami or ralox.
Basically what I'm getting at here is that I would rather take dopa than caber if I can help it, when it's not entirely necessary per se. And that IF gyno symptoms start, the proper treatment of ralox or prami should apply.
Brienn8989
Active member
Roger that. I’ll keep that in mind if puffy nips pop up in my future.
boooosted
Member
Prami seems to be hit or miss with the sides. I get no nausea at all just painfully hard wood.
Old Witch
Well-known member
If you're talking Arimistane I've tried it, doesn't help estrogen at all seems like but for a cortisol blocker it's good. Abieta triene is better for an actual aromatase blocker. Still no exemestane or Arimadex but it's something.
I like Ar1macare pro for OTC cycle support. it's got tudca, NAC, red yeast rice, coq10, dopa, arimistane, Abieta triene, and a few other choice naturals which are actually worth a damn. That way I know I've got at least the bare minimum covered for blood pressure, cholesterol, estrogen, prolactin. Sometimes all it takes is the minimum. I wouldn't go "this is all you need" but it's a great start.
blongo804
Active member
Small Update:
Just a small update for now, mostly all related to this cycle.
1) PR today AGAIN on bench!! I hit 230lb for a single.. At last, 2 plates and then some! That's 10lbs up on bench over last week. I'm still a bit in shock, especially because I was not feeling the gym this morning. Not a good amount of sleep this weekend, ran an OCR (obstacle course) on Saturday (more on that below..), but kept up on eating pretty well at least. I wasn't expecting to PR on bench again, but I'll take it for sure. To note, when I go for singles, I always make sure they're similar to "competition" standard - no bar bouncing, no butt lift, heels down, 1-2 second pause at the bottom.
2) Speaking of obstacle course race.. I really only did this because a few guys at work were begging me to, and my fiance also was down - figured what the heck, might as well. I found out really quickly this was a BAD idea lol. I don't really do cardio, especially outdoors. Literally about a half mile into the race, didn't even hit the first obstacle, I was in immense pain from shin pumps. Holy crap this pump is no joke. I couldn't lift my feet properly to run and was forced to limp the rest of the 2.5 or so miles, barely able to do obstacles, especially ones that required any sort of balance. Man that sucked. It was pretty fun in the end, but the shin pumps are real. I've been feeling this feeling come on, on occasion, so I should've seen this coming. Walking up flights of stairs, even driving now with my foot on the accelerator for a while I start to cramp/shin pump.. All DMZ's fault I'm assuming because this is very new/different for me. EDIT: Also worth noting, the race was early in the day. I managed to get in about 40-50oz water as well as 5g taurine pre-race, but clearly that wasn't enough.
I'll be weighing in and measuring waist on Wednesday!
Just a small update for now, mostly all related to this cycle.
1) PR today AGAIN on bench!! I hit 230lb for a single.. At last, 2 plates and then some! That's 10lbs up on bench over last week. I'm still a bit in shock, especially because I was not feeling the gym this morning. Not a good amount of sleep this weekend, ran an OCR (obstacle course) on Saturday (more on that below..), but kept up on eating pretty well at least. I wasn't expecting to PR on bench again, but I'll take it for sure. To note, when I go for singles, I always make sure they're similar to "competition" standard - no bar bouncing, no butt lift, heels down, 1-2 second pause at the bottom.
2) Speaking of obstacle course race.. I really only did this because a few guys at work were begging me to, and my fiance also was down - figured what the heck, might as well. I found out really quickly this was a BAD idea lol. I don't really do cardio, especially outdoors. Literally about a half mile into the race, didn't even hit the first obstacle, I was in immense pain from shin pumps. Holy crap this pump is no joke. I couldn't lift my feet properly to run and was forced to limp the rest of the 2.5 or so miles, barely able to do obstacles, especially ones that required any sort of balance. Man that sucked. It was pretty fun in the end, but the shin pumps are real. I've been feeling this feeling come on, on occasion, so I should've seen this coming. Walking up flights of stairs, even driving now with my foot on the accelerator for a while I start to cramp/shin pump.. All DMZ's fault I'm assuming because this is very new/different for me. EDIT: Also worth noting, the race was early in the day. I managed to get in about 40-50oz water as well as 5g taurine pre-race, but clearly that wasn't enough.
I'll be weighing in and measuring waist on Wednesday!
blongo804
Active member
Update:
Back with another update for everyone! Some good news and bad news..
Good news is, got my hand/wrist checked today and nothing is broken! The doctor does think there's some tennis elbow going on though. After I explained to him what I was feeling, he immediately pressed on a part of my forearm that not only hurt there, but sent pain down to my hand too. I'm just happy no surgery will be needed. He does want me on, what I feel is, a pretty hefty NSAID "cycle" though. 10-14 days of 600mg ibuprofen doses, four times a day. What do you guys think of this? Seems like an awful lot, but I'm no doctor!
Bad news is, the past two days have been utter hell. I think the suppression has kicked in full force because I feel like I can't get enough sleep to kill this lethargy. Pre-workout is doing nothing (C4 Ultimate yesterday, RE1GN today), no caffeine is helping otherwise - I'm shocked I even hit a huge bench PR yesterday. I get spurts of energy, but when I'm down, I'm DOWN. I even took an hour nap after work yesterday which I never do, and can't think of anything else at the moment besides sleeping lol. I'm thinking I might kick-start PCT to start getting nolva in my system, and I'm debating ending DMZ at the end of this weekend (my bottle might be almost out anyway). I'll miss the gains, but I'm really happy with how this cycle went and hope I can hang on to most of this.
Back with another update for everyone! Some good news and bad news..
Good news is, got my hand/wrist checked today and nothing is broken! The doctor does think there's some tennis elbow going on though. After I explained to him what I was feeling, he immediately pressed on a part of my forearm that not only hurt there, but sent pain down to my hand too. I'm just happy no surgery will be needed. He does want me on, what I feel is, a pretty hefty NSAID "cycle" though. 10-14 days of 600mg ibuprofen doses, four times a day. What do you guys think of this? Seems like an awful lot, but I'm no doctor!
Bad news is, the past two days have been utter hell. I think the suppression has kicked in full force because I feel like I can't get enough sleep to kill this lethargy. Pre-workout is doing nothing (C4 Ultimate yesterday, RE1GN today), no caffeine is helping otherwise - I'm shocked I even hit a huge bench PR yesterday. I get spurts of energy, but when I'm down, I'm DOWN. I even took an hour nap after work yesterday which I never do, and can't think of anything else at the moment besides sleeping lol. I'm thinking I might kick-start PCT to start getting nolva in my system, and I'm debating ending DMZ at the end of this weekend (my bottle might be almost out anyway). I'll miss the gains, but I'm really happy with how this cycle went and hope I can hang on to most of this.
christ83189
Well-known member
Yeah that lethargy can be a b1tch. Congrats on the PR. Over 2 plates now. Next stop 3 plates