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New KSM-66 Study

kisaj said:
Gaia Stress Response has rhodiola, ashwagandha, holy basil, and schisandra. It's damn good stuff.
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What's the lowest effective dose of ashwaghanda? The last study i saw was like 300mg i thought. That'd put a big dent in that bottom prop blend.
 
jswain34 said:
What's the lowest effective dose of ashwaghanda? The last study i saw was like 300mg i thought. That'd put a big dent in that bottom prop blend.
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There is no established lowest effective dose and the extraction method that Gaia uses is a bit different as it all oil based, so it would be difficult to compare even if so.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
All great ingredients, but I don't like prop blends or unstandardized extracts (ashwagandha and schisandra).
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Understood, but that is geared more towards dry herb and not the process that is used to extract oil based supplements as this is done to ensure the full spectrum is in place- similar to KSM66. Plus, you get the lab reports that show the amount of active ingredients with each bottle and how/where/when it was processed. I have no association with Gaia, but they are one of the most transparent and complete supplement companies you could deal with.
 
If it means anything, I think doses as low as 200mg can be effective. I used BPS Adrenosurge before which only had 200mg I believe of Ashwagandha. Yes, it had other stuff in it, but I don't think it'll be ineffective otherwise.

Also, for awhile, before I saw the KSM-66 study, I took 500mg every day at once in the morning and still noticed great effects on relaxation/stress/sleep.
 
So 600mg of ksm677 is needed for it to be the most effective or would 300mg suffice?

If one was to stack ksm677 with ashwaganda, they could get away with using lower doses no? Due to the synergy of the two.
 
anab0lix said:
So 600mg of ksm677 is needed for it to be the most effective or would 300mg suffice?

If one was to stack ksm677 with ashwaganda, they could get away with using lower doses no? Due to the synergy of the two.
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As said above, 2 caps of BPS Adrenosurge was awesome, and that's 200mg of every popular adaptogen out there. (Bacopa, Ashwagandha, Rhodiola, etc). It'll probably be fine. Also, KSM-66 is Ashwagandha.
 
kisaj said:
Understood, but that is geared more towards dry herb and not the process that is used to extract oil based supplements as this is done to ensure the full spectrum is in place- similar to KSM66. Plus, you get the lab reports that show the amount of active ingredients with each bottle and how/where/when it was processed. I have no association with Gaia, but they are one of the most transparent and complete supplement companies you could deal with.
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One study I read recently estimated that KSM-66 is about a 10:1 extract. I haven't seen anything specific or definitive, as I don't think that's something they list on their spec/info sheets; I'm not sure how potent of an extract Gaia's is. I was not aware that they provide lab reports of actives with each bottle; would you happen to know the withanolide and/or schizandrin content of that product?
 
anab0lix said:
So 600mg of ksm677 is needed for it to be the most effective or would 300mg suffice?

If one was to stack ksm677 with ashwaganda, they could get away with using lower doses no? Due to the synergy of the two.
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I mean 600mg would give you stronger effect than 300mg and new study show how effective KSM66 is at 600mg daily.

If you run KSM66, I really see no reason to add other Ashwagandha extracts
 
Danes said:
I mean 600mg would give you stronger effect than 300mg and new study show how effective KSM66 is at 600mg daily.

If you run KSM66, I really see no reason to add other Ashwagandha extracts
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There are a handful of what I think are new studies that showed benefits with 600mg/day, including physical and cognitive benefits. There's a nice PDF with brief summaries/abstracts of a bunch of studies using that dose.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
One study I read recently estimated that KSM-66 is about a 10:1 extract. I haven't seen anything specific or definitive, as I don't think that's something they list on their spec/info sheets; I'm not sure how potent of an extract Gaia's is. I was not aware that they provide lab reports of actives with each bottle; would you happen to know the withanolide and/or schizandrin content of that product?
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It is specific to each batch and they will tell you the range that it tested within, but it is dialed in with very little variance. I don't have any in my stash right now or I would tell you.
 
For an example of the information provided by Gaia for all the ingredients in the Stress Response (or Adrenal) blend, just go to the following site - Invalid Link Removed and insert the number 3234500 (pulled the "meet your herb" number from a product picture online).
 
jarrellt67 said:
For an example of the information provided by Gaia for all the ingredients in the Stress Response (or Adrenal) blend, just go to the following site - Invalid Link Removed and insert the number 3234500 (pulled the "meet your herb" number from a product picture online).
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That's pretty cool, haha. Too bad it only lists the % actives for the extracts that list the standardization on the label. Granted, it's still really nice to know that they meet the label claims and the exact %, but it doesn't mention the standardization or potency for the ashwagandha or schisandra.
 
That Gaia site is nice. Never heard of them before, thanks for the info. Are they direct, or can you find them cheaper elsewhere?
 
muscleupcrohn said:
That's pretty cool, haha. Too bad it only lists the % actives for the extracts that list the standardization on the label. Granted, it's still really nice to know that they meet the label claims and the exact %, but it doesn't mention the standardization or potency for the ashwagandha or schisandra.
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Yeah, that info would be nice. The best I could find (about a year ago...when I once tried that product) was a breakdown of the quantities in the proprietary blend (a European site had an old picture of the product with all the quantities listed).
 
The_Old_Guy said:
That Gaia site is nice. Never heard of them before, thanks for the info. Are they direct, or can you find them cheaper elsewhere?
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Definitely cheaper elsewhere. Also, their adrenal formula is the same as the stress response formula but it's a little cheaper since you can buy it in larger serving bottles.
 
I was just reading through some of the KSM-66 info pages, and they claim that most manufacturers calculate withanolide content by gravimetry, which they say can overestimate withanolide content by a factor of 2.5-3; and that their KSM-66, which is 5% HPLC shows 8-15% using graviometry. After reading this, I checked the COA for two of the ashwagandha extracts I have (1.5% and 2.5% from different sources), and both tested using gravimetry. With that said, KSM-66 is an even better deal than I had thought, since these other bulk extract powders may not be as potent as I believed. I've heard similar cases of manufacturers overestimating the % actives using UV instead of HPLC, so I'm ensuring that the extracts I use are standardized according to HPLC (ashwagandha, rhodiola, and bacopa).
 
The_Old_Guy said:
Yeah, just looked around and found some good deals, thanks.
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That adrenal (or stress response) product by Gaia is pretty good. Unfortunately for me, the more calming herbs in it were too strong. They seemed to completely overpower the rhodiola. The Gaia rhodiola by itself is really good though. It seems to provide me with more energy and has a very good anti-depressant effect. It's great for eliminating the brain fog I experience when getting too little sleep.
 
muscleupcrohn said:
I was just reading through some of the KSM-66 info pages, and they claim that most manufacturers calculate withanolide content by gravimetry, which they say can overestimate withanolide content by a factor of 2.5-3; and that their KSM-66, which is 5% HPLC shows 8-15% using graviometry. After reading this, I checked the COA for two of the ashwagandha extracts I have (1.5% and 2.5% from different sources), and both tested using gravimetry. With that said, KSM-66 is an even better deal than I had thought, since these other bulk extract powders may not be as potent as I believed. I've heard similar cases of manufacturers overestimating the % actives using UV instead of HPLC, so I'm ensuring that the extracts I use are standardized according to HPLC (ashwagandha, rhodiola, and bacopa).
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Yea is like testing ecdysteroids with UV and HPLC. With UV it can show 90% or more while HPLC test show 20-40%. It is huge difference
 
Danes said:
Yea is like testing ecdysteroids with UV and HPLC. With UV it can show 90% or more while HPLC test show 20-40%. It is huge difference
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Yeah. When I was looking to source various extracts from China, a 90% UV extract would only cost a fraction of what a 90% HPLC extract cost, even from the same manufacture. That should say enough, haha.
 
jarrellt67 said:
That adrenal (or stress response) product by Gaia is pretty good. Unfortunately for me, the more calming herbs in it were too strong. They seemed to completely overpower the rhodiola. The Gaia rhodiola by itself is really good though. It seems to provide me with more energy and has a very good anti-depressant effect. It's great for eliminating the brain fog I experience when getting too little sleep.
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Totally agree. It is strong and made me pretty lazy.
 
anab0lix said:
I understand that. I'm saying I just've known Jarrow to be a good brand that I've trusted for a while. Just personal preference.
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Swanson KSM-66 and Swanson Rhodiola are definitely g2g. I have been using both for awhile now.
 
ELROCK said:
Swanson KSM-66 and Swanson Rhodiola are definitely g2g. I have been using both for awhile now.
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If the difference is $1-4 for a bottle I'll go with Jarrows every time. Trust them significantly more than any other brand when it comes to vitamins etc
 
Jarrow is legit. What I use.
 
OK, read through most of the thread, but hoping someone can make a cliff notes version here by correcting the below and/or answer the questions within...

KSM-66: Good for stress relief, energy boost, best to be taken during the day or at night? Will help sleep or will create insomnia? etc., etc.
--Recommended Brands: Jarrow? Giai?
--Dosage: ?
--Best time to take: ??

Rhodiola Good for stress relief, etc., etc...
--Recommended Brands: Jarrow? Giai?
--Dosage: ?
--Best time to take: ??
 
KSM66:
--Recommended Brands: Jarrow? Giai?
Brand does not mean anything when you pick KSM66. KSM66 is KSM66 no matter who sell it. The only difference is the price and maybe the dose in each cap.
I use swanson.
--Dosage: ?
500-1000mg each day. 500-750mg is enough
--Best time to take: ??
This may vary from person to person.
I prefer ti take 750mg prior bed.
 
Danes said:
KSM66:
--Recommended Brands: Jarrow? Giai?
Brand does not mean anything when you pick KSM66. KSM66 is KSM66 no matter who sell it. The only difference is the price and maybe the dose in each cap.
I use swanson.
--Dosage: ?
500-1000mg each day. 500-750mg is enough
--Best time to take: ??
This may vary from person to person.
I prefer ti take 750mg prior bed.
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Cheers, mate! Does it impact or help your sleep? I'm high energy without supps, so sleeps hard for me. Looking for something that won't hurt the sleep. What's been your experience; I've seen it mixed for guys in this thread.
 
JYD said:
Cheers, mate! Does it impact or help your sleep? I'm high energy without supps, so sleeps hard for me. Looking for something that won't hurt the sleep. What's been your experience; I've seen it mixed for guys in this thread.
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This is my experience:

When I took KSM66 in the middle of the day, I got so tired. Seriously. Wasted! Strong sedative effect. But after 3-5 days it got better. So I took it 1 hour pre bed! And I really slept MUCH better.
I felt better on KSM66. Even libido was better and it is no joke!
 
Danes said:
This is my experience:

When I took KSM66 in the middle of the day, I got so tired. Seriously. Wasted! Strong sedative effect. But after 3-5 days it got better. So I took it 1 hour pre bed! And I really slept MUCH better.
I felt better on KSM66. Even libido was better and it is no joke!
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Brilliant. Thanks!
 
john.patterson said:
I second the KSM-66 pre bed. I tried taking it in the morning a few times and had an awful timing staying awake and alert at work. I really feel that it helps improve sleep quality when used pre bed too
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Cool. What brand and dosage were you taking pre-bed? Finding capsule dosage varies quite a bit. Thanks!
 
Re up this topic, for more information for me
I have used ksm66 and now foods, i can compare the effect that the same for me, but i use jarrow nowadays,,,,calming, sleeping better
I have used rhodiola now foods, and i dont know if the dosage is correct, feel more nervous, 2 caps a day, perhaps too for me
How to use rhodiola to have better results. Thanks
 
boulon said:
Re up this topic, for more information for me
I have used ksm66 and now foods, i can compare the effect that the same for me, but i use jarrow nowadays,,,,calming, sleeping better
I have used rhodiola now foods, and i dont know if the dosage is correct, feel more nervous, 2 caps a day, perhaps too for me
How to use rhodiola to have better results. Thanks
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It looks like NOW's rhodiola is 500mg of a 3% rosavin and 1% salidroside extract, which is a good extract. I'd go with one capsule and see how it treats you; two may not be necessary.
 
boulon said:
Re up this topic, for more information for me
I have used ksm66 and now foods, i can compare the effect that the same for me, but i use jarrow nowadays,,,,calming, sleeping better
I have used rhodiola now foods, and i dont know if the dosage is correct, feel more nervous, 2 caps a day, perhaps too for me
How to use rhodiola to have better results. Thanks
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I've used tons of different rhodiola, and the best is Gaia's. I highly suggest it. Many do nothing at all and the higher dosage doesn't mean it works better.
 
Gaia is definitely quality, but I only take 3% salidroside now. Luckily several companies are starting to produce it now, so people must be catching on.
 
kisaj said:
Gaia is definitely quality, but I only take 3% salidroside now. Luckily several companies are starting to produce it now, so people must be catching on.
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Are you talking about bigger companies capped, or bulk powders? I've seen 3% salidroside from bulk powders for a while now. Are the ones you're talking about also standardized for rosavin content?
 
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