Holy Cow... Aegeline No More

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kissdadookie

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In the article it would appear that USPLabs is not even going to bother to fight the FDA on aegeline. Apparently they've informed the FDA that they are reformulating all aegeline containing products and they have destroyed all products containing aegeline.

Could it possibly be that the aegeline did cause the acute hepatitis? I'm not saying that aegeline is the culprit or not but this is kind of telling...
 
I seriously doubt it's aegeline causing these issues, USP has learned that they can't win with the FDA so it really wouldn't be worth the time and effort (or money for that matter) to fight them.

Because, just like with DMAA, ultimately the FDA makes them destroy everything with it anyway.



They just shutdown PAs New clearshot as well.
 
kissdadookie said:
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In the article it would appear that USPLabs is not even going to bother to fight the FDA on aegeline. Apparently they've informed the FDA that they are reformulating all aegeline containing products and they have destroyed all products containing aegeline.

Could it possibly be that the aegeline did cause the acute hepatitis? I'm not saying that aegeline is the culprit or not but this is kind of telling...
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I don't think this compound is going to give anyone hep virus, unless it was somehow contaminated within a few days to a week before being packaged, shipped, and into the hands of the consumer.
 
jbryand101b said:
I don't think this compound is going to give anyone hep virus, unless it was somehow contaminated within a few days to a week before being packaged, shipped, and into the hands of the consumer.
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The acute hepatitis was supposedly non-viral. That's why the suspected the supplements. I personally haven't used the new OEPs but did run a bottle of Versa-1 a long while back and currently still have like 1/4 of a tub left of Enhanced. Making me kind of wary to use Enhanced any further...
 
Do any supplements containing this label it on the ingredients? I have the intl version of alphamine but the label doesn't include it. However it's meant to be included?
 
Wilsy7 said:
Do any supplements containing this label it on the ingredients? I have the intl version of alphamine but the label doesn't include it. However it's meant to be included?
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They use the chemical name, but if you googled the compound's chemical name, you will notice that it's aegeline (N-[2-hydroxy-2(4-methoxyphenyl) ethyl]-3-phenyl-2-propenamide).
 
Oh Christ now I am paranoid. Is there a rep that could PM me I have a question best kept private.
 
Wilsy7 said:
Got it! Thanks!!

To the bin! Lol
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I doubled and triple checked the label on Alphamine, yup, no aegeline that I know of in that product :D

Sad that I had to dump the Enhanced though :(

EatMoar said:
That compound isn't in the alpha mine tubs I have
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Wilsy was asking how to identify aegeline in supplements (not a specific supplement). Alphamine as far as I know for the US version, does not contain aegeline.
 
kissdadookie said:
I doubled and triple checked the label on Alphamine, yup, no aegeline that I know of in that product :D

Sad that I had to dump the Enhanced though :(



Wilsy was asking how to identify aegeline in supplements (not a specific supplement). Alphamine as far as I know for the US version, does not contain aegeline.
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I have the intl version. Which is being discontinued. It has something version similar to what you posted above.

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Wilsy7 said:
I have the intl version. Which is being discontinued. It has something version similar to what you posted above.
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You're ok I think (and I hope, for my own sake, lulz). N-(2-hydroxy-2-p-methoxyphenylethyl)benzamide is tembamide and from what I can tell, is different from aegeline. Supposedly from a different plant as well(?). Aegeline is from bael and tembamide is from zanthoxylum f-a-gara(?).
 
kissdadookie said:
You're ok I think (and I hope, for my own sake, lulz). N-(2-hydroxy-2-p-methoxyphenylethyl)benzamide is tembamide and from what I can tell, is different from aegeline. Supposedly from a different plant as well(?). Aegeline is from bael and tembamide is from zanthoxylum f-a-gara(?).
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It is being discontinued all the same?
 
^How do you know the international version is being discontinued dude?

I'm in the UK too, wondering if my alphamine is safe or not? :s
 
Wilsy7 said:
It is being discontinued all the same?
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Looks like it's still good to go here in the US. They did remove Enhanced off the PES US website's homepage though. It's not even a product that is listed on their front page anymore where they have all the products laid out. The product page for Enhanced on the US site also says that it's discontinued.

Interestingly enough though and I don't know if this has any impact on discontinuation of products or not, both tembamide and aegeline shares p-Methoxyoctopamine as a product of hydrolysis. I think p-Methoxyoctopamine might be what the end goal and purpose of using aegeline and tembamide would be.
 
At some point the tembamide in UK Alphamine was replaced with aegeline.

I have old tubs with tembamide and new tubs with aegeline.

Could a PES rep chime in and say if both needs to be binned or if the tembamide tubs is fine?
 
There's no reason to believe that Aegeline would cause severe hepatitis or death.

It's a significant constituent of Baal Fruit and I wasn't aware that acute debilitating non-vital hepatitis was widespread in India where it is consumed in the diet in probably higher doses than is contained in any of USPLabs supplements regularly.

--

Regarding the pesticide hype that has gone around.

Yes, essential oil of aegle marmelos leaves is used as a pesticide.

You would also know if it was in the products because being high in limonene they would smell strongly of citrus, and it is a skin and respiratory irritant.

--

USPLabs should have just skipped the aegeline name and the chemical nomenclature on Versa-1 and gone with 'Aegle Marmelos extract' and probablyt nothing would have ever been pointed towards aegline as a cause of this...
 
so a group of people took ol aegeline in hawaii and got sick; filthy-ass, parasite-ridden hawaii, the same place where tourists go to puke their guts out for 7 days after drinking the water and the FDA points to a supplement? please
 
Aegeline is not being pulled because people are getting sick and is not the cause, has not been confirmed that it is the cause. The FDA is pulling it because it doesn't comply with DSHEA.
 
They say it's not Angeline that's being recalled. Email this morning



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Afi140 said:
They say it's not Angeline that's being recalled. Email this morning

<img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=92363"/>
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They dont have to do an actual recall for using a non dshea compliant ingred
 
T-Bone said:
Aegeline is not being pulled because people are getting sick and is not the cause, has not been confirmed that it is the cause. The FDA is pulling it because it doesn't comply with DSHEA.
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yeah, i was referring to this:"Hawaii officials are investigating 36 illnesses associated with OxyElite Pro, Sarah Park, M.D., State Epidemiologist with the Hawaii State Department of Health, said yesterday in an interview with Natural Products INSIDER. At least two illnesses required liver transplants and officials have reported one death.Although other cases have been reported linking supplements to hepatitis, Park said the decision was made this week not to investigate those other products because officials could not find commonalities. She said 36 cases, or 82 percent of the total illnesses, WERE linked to OxyElite Pro. Park did not name the other supplements that have been linked to hepatitis. " "the FDA is taking the lead role in identifying the relationship between OxyElite Pro and the reported illnesses." "A spokesperson for FDA said the "investigation is ongoing" "Health officials urged consumers to discontinue use of the product."
 
i saw this interview about a woman who grew sprouts and she was accused. they tested five times and couldnt find contamination, which i guess is insanely difficult to pull off for a little operation like hers. anyway, she was pressured to do a recall anyway (which didnt make sense to her, i guess some bigger corporations wanted her to be the one to go down instead). she cracked under the pressure. later, she said giving in was her biggest regret, as the recall is PUBLICALLY VIEWED as an admission of guilt
 
36 people contracted non-viral hepatitis with Oxyelite Pro as the common factor and you're saying the country is at fault? Tourists get sick because they arn't used to the water.

The comparison makes zero sense.
 
Jiigzz said:
36 people contracted non-viral hepatitis with Oxyelite Pro as the common factor and you're saying the country is at fault? Tourists get sick because they arn't used to the water. The comparison makes zero sense.
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38 isnt alot of people for an entire area that has filthy, disease-contaminated water. my sister went there and got really sick; oxy elite wasnt involved. conversely, i can drink water anywhere on the globe, as long as it isnt disease-ridden. none of that makes sense to you? areas that have crappy water that tourists arent used to are areas that have disease problems
 
thescience said:
38 isnt alot of people for an entire area that has filthy, disease-contaminated water. my sister went there and got really sick; oxy elite wasnt involved. conversely, i can drink water anywhere on the globe, as long as it isnt disease-ridden. none of that makes sense to you?
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What the heck?

Locals don't get sick most likely due to a form of immunity to it, you get sick because you don't; I have no idea where you are going with this? 36 is alot of people to contract non-viral hepatitis (I think you need to google what this is), especially when all of them consumed Oxyelite pro.

I dont deny your sister got sick, but what has that got to do with non-viral hepatitis?
 
Jiigzz said:
What the heck? Locals don't get sick most likely due to a form of immunity to it, you get sick because you don't; I have no idea where you are going with this? 36 is alot of people to contract non-viral hepatitis (I think you need to google what this is), especially when all of them consumed Oxyelite pro. I dont deny your sister got sick, but what has that got to do with non-viral hepatitis?
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areas with poor hygeine are areas with poor hygeine. they dump toilet water/ drugs all that crap into their water. god knows whats in there. this hasnt been determined, so you could give me more credit than "zero sense" considering the FDA spokesperson said "Meanwhile, Park acknowledged she would like to determine what actually caused the illnesses in Hawaii, but such conclusive findings may be elusive."Sometimes, the best I can do is find the strongest association,"
 
thescience said:
areas with poor hygeine are areas with poor hygeine. they dump toilet water, drugs all that crap into their water. god knows whats in there
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I understand that.

But where are the people who also contracted the same illness who did not consume Oxyelite pro? Surely not all of tourists in Hawaii use Oxyelite pro? if it was the water, then more cases would have occured.
 
Jiigzz said:
I understand that.

But where are the people who also contracted the same illness who did not consume Oxyelite pro? Surely not all of tourists in Hawaii use Oxyelite pro? if it was the water, then more cases would have occured.
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There were cases of it without OEP in Hawaii.

They've said that in almost all the articles, it's just that the majority used OEP (80% or so), they've left the other supps used unnamed for those who didn't use OEP.
 
jimbuick said:
There were cases of it without OEP in Hawaii.

They've said that in almost all the articles, it's just that the majority used OEP (80% or so), they've left the other supps used unnamed for those who didn't use OEP.
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Really?

This is news to me. Because the same illness was contracted in NZ by someone who was also using Oxyelite pro. Seems far too coincidental.
 
From the article
Hawaii officials are investigating 36 illnesses associated with OxyElite Pro, Sarah Park, M.D., State Epidemiologist with the Hawaii State Department of Health, said yesterday in an interview with Natural Products INSIDER. At least two illnesses required liver transplants and officials have reported one death.

Although other cases have been reported linking supplements to hepatitis, Park said the decision was made this week not to investigate those other products because officials could not find commonalities. She said 36 cases, or 82 percent of the total illnesses, were linked to OxyElite Pro. Park did not name the other supplements that have been linked to hepatitis.
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Jiigzz said:
I understand that. But where are the people who also contracted the same illness who did not consume Oxyelite pro? Surely not all of tourists in Hawaii use Oxyelite pro? if it was the water, then more cases would have occured.
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yeah, there's 18% who just plum got it. but then i dont know what to make of this: "USPlabs believes counterfeit versions of OxyElite Pro are being marketed in the United States
 
jimbuick said:
From the article
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Thanks Jim. Interesting they wouldn't follow up on it.. But all cases were using supplements? Seems more like contamination on Hawaii's end if thats the case..
 
thescience said:
yeah, there's 18% who just plum got it. but then i dont know what to make of this: "USPlabs believes counterfeit versions of OxyElite Pro are being marketed in the United States
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Well that seems plauisble to me now.
 
jimbuick said:
I've only seen an article on the one in Connecticut.
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I only care so much because a friend on mine is sitting on four tubs of the stuff; I don't want them consuming something that has the potential to make them very sick.
 
jimbuick said:
I've only seen an article on the one in Connecticut.
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It was like 5+.. it may have been on the CDC report but I cant remember at the moment. I think consumers should be happy that the CDC is investigating cause they will do a MUCH more thorough job investigating that the FDA ever could
 
Jiigzz said:
I only care so much because a friend on mine is sitting on four tubs of the stuff; I don't want them consuming something that has the potential to make them very sick.
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I, personally, have been skeptical of this whole situation since the start. Hell, the original news article clearly stated that there were cases of the same illness, in the same area, that were not related to OEP.

I don't pretend to know why other possibilities aren't being examined, but I also wouldn't advise people to use the products in question until there's more information available.
 
mw1 said:
It was like 5+.. it may have been on the CDC report but I cant remember at the moment. I think consumers should be happy that the CDC is investigating cause they will do a MUCH more thorough job investigating that the FDA ever could
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Jeez.

I tried to get him to toss them but he paid a fortune for them lol
 
Wilsy7 said:
Possibly mixing the OEP with the dirty water amplified the effects of both?
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Wait, what?


Did you read that before posting it? Or any of this thread for that matter?

Cliffs:

Not all of the cases involve OEP.
Not all of the cases were isolated to Hawaii.
Not all of the cases are even in the US.
 
thescience said:
38 isnt alot of people for an entire area that has filthy, disease-contaminated water. my sister went there and got really sick; oxy elite wasnt involved. conversely, i can drink water anywhere on the globe, as long as it isnt disease-ridden. none of that makes sense to you? areas that have crappy water that tourists arent used to are areas that have disease problems
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You do realize that this was non-viral non-contagious acute hepatitis we are talking about here right? It's the kind of hepatitis that is brought on usually from heavy alcohol use or drugs uses.

So this theory of yours about the environmental contamination in the water and such doesn't make sense because 1) there would probably need to be actual toxicity in the water 2) water apart from well water is tested and treated for toxicity and carcinogens (since Hawaii is part if the US, I'm guessing EPA does regulate their drinking water systems) 3) contamination of the water supply will lead to far more than 30 something cases of illness.
 
jimbuick said:
I've only seen an article on the one in Connecticut.
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Why do you keep mis-citing facts and statistics to downplay these issues. I am sure your Google still works so it would be easy to see that as of the end of October they tied 56 cases to OEP and there have been recent reported cases in Ohio, California,Connecticut and someone on here reported New Zealand which I know you saw in another thread. You can be skeptical, blame the FDA and etc. all you want, but at least use accurate data and information when trying assure others everything is a okay or just a misunderstanding by the mean ole FDA.
 
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