IF for endomorphs

[johno86]

Hi all was thinking of giving intermitted fasting a go but since I have a slow matabolism....would it be any benefit from it I am currently goin the low Carb route I have had a lot of success I was 333 last year and now at about 220 so I wondering if it would be messing up my body goin low carb for so long!

 

[JudoJosh]

How low are you considering? Keto low or like 100g or so low?

 

[AdonisBelt]

Intermittent fasting along with a low carb diet is beneficial to the body as it increases insulin sensitivity. There is no harm, just benefits! Eat after you train and shoot for eating your carbs predominately after you workout- if one meal/day ain't your thing, save the fats and protein for later. I'm an endo that's 6'4" and I love fasting and have noticed a difference.

Ps: also allows for more accurate weight readings. I think you can think about why without me needing to explain it

Cheers!

 

[backbaycopley]

FYI ecto, endo, meso is outdated science.

 

[braxbrah]

FYI ecto, endo, meso is outdated science.

I don't agree with that. My friend is a typical mesomorph, he trains hard but eats absolute JUNK constantly and his bodyfat doesn't go above 12% - he's got a mens health body. On the other hand as soon as I start eating high carbs without doing cardio x2 a day I bloat out and the BF% piles on, its going to be incredibly hard to even clean bulk for me without putting on a lot of fat. I am 100% more disciplined in what I eat and how much cardio I do compared to my buddy and we follow the same lifting schedule.... yet he is in far,far better shape. Im not saying somatotypes are 100% accurate but people have different genetics and some of these are pretty similar to the three common somatotypes.

I'm almost definitely an endo, my legs shame most of the guys in my gym and I have a stocky physique, I wont ever be skinny but however no matter how much I carb cycle, eat under 100g carbs a day, factor in over 7 hours of cardio a week in both HIIT/LIIS it is DAMN hard to drop BF% even eating well under maintenance.

 

[AdonisBelt]

I don't agree with that. My friend is a typical mesomorph, he trains hard but eats absolute JUNK constantly and his bodyfat doesn't go above 12% - he's got a mens health body. On the other hand as soon as I start eating high carbs without doing cardio x2 a day I bloat out and the BF% piles on, its going to be incredibly hard to even clean bulk for me without putting on a lot of fat. I am 100% more disciplined in what I eat and how much cardio I do compared to my buddy and we follow the same lifting schedule.... yet he is in far,far better shape. Im not saying somatotypes are 100% accurate but people have different genetics and some of these are pretty similar to the three common somatotypes.

I'm almost definitely an endo, my legs shame most of the guys in my gym and I have a stocky physique, I wont ever be skinny but however no matter how much I carb cycle, eat under 100g carbs a day, factor in over 7 hours of cardio a week in both HIIT/LIIS it is DAMN hard to drop BF% even eating well under maintenance.

Maybe you shouldn't be doing low carb then. Everybodies bodies oxidize fats at different levels. Regarding your buddy, he's probably just more active overall, someways eating more some less but eating less on average, and your surpluses are probably too high. It's not magic, there are no exceptions. You thinking you have a genetic predisposition just allows you to accept your physique. Seriously, this is what you need to hear.

 

[braxbrah]

I tried moderate carb as well which wasn't was less effective. The current method is working, but slowly. I'm busting my ass off cardio and lifting wise and progress is slow, plenty of other bros in there are clueless about diet and still shed quicker doing less. Im not complaining its how it is. Genetics 100% makes a difference. Look at how huge most African males are compared to say Indian/Asian for instance. I know black guys who don't even work out who are huge, how do you explain that?

 

[AdonisBelt]

Look at how huge most African males are compared to say Indian/Asian for instance. I know black guys who don't even work out who are huge, how do you explain that?

Racism?

Matt Ogus, Bruce Lee... two different styles of mastery over one's physique accomplished both by asians. If your gunna put me on the spot, I'd say that lots of black kids I know personally that are shredded actually have bad diets that are lacking in calories, and BF%=Aesthetics... But I'd highly suggest looking at native Africans who hadn't been bread like horses during slavery... say, in africa. Yoiu'll actually see that their physiques are standard. Your perpetuating lack of results due to inferior genetics because of one circumstance due to a strange social oddity from artificial selection due to slavery. Regarding pro athletes, they are all on gear as well, and the explanation is more of a socioeconomical issue that physiological. These guys may have slighter higher baseline levels of test, but its exacerbated when they are on gear. There's also the common theory that these people grow up in communities that can't afford school, and athleticism is their only method of succeeding, so there is more motivation; additionally they may as well feed into the placebo minset of BBC genetics... Also thinner skin aids in showing muscle... but growing up in neighborhoods predominately black and working out at the rec I can say that this whole genetic superiority thing is pretty much a racist fallacy. Don't be judgmental.


Honestly, you have no idea what those people (gym goers with better bodies) you see in the gym do out of the gym, how they live their life, or how active they are. Am i saying genetics don't matter? No, but they do not make "all the difference". If your don't beleive me you can look at the ranges of testosterone levels in humans... It's hardly variable enough to make any real world difference.

If you want to accept being a dough boy that was born that way- than fine. But the fact is that everyone in good shape puts forth the effort, whether they know it or not. If they are elite status, they definitely work for it. Maybe your problem is you are comparing yourself to unrealistic standards due to seeing fitness models and bodybuilders that are top athletes and users of PEDs. You know people that say this kind of crap never get to an elite level because they accept mediocrity. People that say this kind of crap are betas, and it reflects into a Beta physique.

If everyone could just bust their ass for 2 years and get shredded, the world would be completely different. It takes years.

 

[backbaycopley]

I don't agree with that. My friend is a typical mesomorph, he trains hard but eats absolute JUNK constantly and his bodyfat doesn't go above 12% - he's got a mens health body. On the other hand as soon as I start eating high carbs without doing cardio x2 a day I bloat out and the BF% piles on, its going to be incredibly hard to even clean bulk for me without putting on a lot of fat. I am 100% more disciplined in what I eat and how much cardio I do compared to my buddy and we follow the same lifting schedule.... yet he is in far,far better shape. Im not saying somatotypes are 100% accurate but people have different genetics and some of these are pretty similar to the three common somatotypes.

I'm almost definitely an endo, my legs shame most of the guys in my gym and I have a stocky physique, I wont ever be skinny but however no matter how much I carb cycle, eat under 100g carbs a day, factor in over 7 hours of cardio a week in both HIIT/LIIS it is DAMN hard to drop BF% even eating well under maintenance.

Then you don't agree with the top scientists and behavioral psychologists of the modern world.

"Sheldon's theories enjoyed a vogue as the "pop-psych flavor of the month" through the 1950s.[2] Modern scientists, however, generally (with occasional exceptions[3][4]) dismiss his claims as outdated, if not outright quackery.[5]"

What you (and most uninformed people citing his somatypes) don't understand is that most of the broscientists that refer to it nowadays are only referring to a fraction of what Sheldon preached. His "system" also involved stereotypical personalities and disposition as much, if not more than, those 3 body categories. The way you categorize yourself and your "buddy" in some set-in-stone values is as ignorant as saying all skinny ectos are introverted and geeky (to vastly simplify Sheldon's quackery).

It only makes sense in the 80's Nintendo Blades of Steel, where you have on your team, a skinny guy who is fast as hell but weak, a fat guy who is slow but strong, boring "normal" guy who's average across the board, etc. Bottomline, somatypes are considered to have zero scientific basis. Think I just showed my age with that reference...

 

[braxbrah]

Racism?

Matt Ogus, Bruce Lee... two different styles of mastery over one's physique accomplished both by asians. If your gunna put me on the spot, I'd say that lots of black kids I know personally that are shredded actually have bad diets that are lacking in calories, and BF%=Aesthetics... But I'd highly suggest looking at native Africans who hadn't been bread like horses during slavery... say, in africa. Yoiu'll actually see that their physiques are standard. Your perpetuating lack of results due to inferior genetics because of one circumstance due to a strange social oddity from artificial selection due to slavery. Regarding pro athletes, they are all on gear as well, and the explanation is more of a socioeconomical issue that physiological. These guys may have slighter higher baseline levels of test, but its exacerbated when they are on gear. There's also the common theory that these people grow up in communities that can't afford school, and athleticism is their only method of succeeding, so there is more motivation; additionally they may as well feed into the placebo minset of BBC genetics... Also thinner skin aids in showing muscle... but growing up in neighborhoods predominately black and working out at the rec I can say that this whole genetic superiority thing is pretty much a racist fallacy. Don't be judgmental.


Honestly, you have no idea what those people (gym goers with better bodies) you see in the gym do out of the gym, how they live their life, or how active they are. Am i saying genetics don't matter? No, but they do not make "all the difference". If your don't beleive me you can look at the ranges of testosterone levels in humans... It's hardly variable enough to make any real world difference.

If you want to accept being a dough boy that was born that way- than fine. But the fact is that everyone in good shape puts forth the effort, whether they know it or not. If they are elite status, they definitely work for it. Maybe your problem is you are comparing yourself to unrealistic standards due to seeing fitness models and bodybuilders that are top athletes and users of PEDs. You know people that say this kind of crap never get to an elite level because they accept mediocrity. People that say this kind of crap are betas, and it reflects into a Beta physique.

If everyone could just bust their ass for 2 years and get shredded, the world would be completely different. It takes years.

You make some good points, but some wild assumptions of my state of mind too. Im not remotely close to being a dough boy never mind settling for that status. I just am not as shredded as I want to be and have been lifting/recomping for over 2 years. Ive also never said genetics makes " all the difference" so im not sure where thats been pulled from. I wont take the racism part seriously scientists have categorically stated that genetics are responsible for the average heights/weights of different races around the world. Its just how it is - of course anyone can become shredded but factors like the speed of peoples metabolisms and how easily they put on muscle has to be taken into account. I agree with another of your points though that maybe I am comparing myself to people who are elite status, several people have commented they can't understand how I want to lose more BF%...but these people are of the civilian mindset and don't work out, I don't judge myself against these people nevermind listen to what their idea of " shredded" is.

 

[braxbrah]

Then you don't agree with the top scientists and behavioral psychologists of the modern world.

"Sheldon's theories enjoyed a vogue as the "pop-psych flavor of the month" through the 1950s.[2] Modern scientists, however, generally (with occasional exceptions[3][4]) dismiss his claims as outdated, if not outright quackery.[5]"

What you (and most uninformed people citing his somatypes) don't understand is that most of the broscientists that refer to it nowadays are only referring to a fraction of what Sheldon preached. His "system" also involved stereotypical personalities and disposition as much, if not more than, those 3 body categories. The way you categorize yourself and your "buddy" in some set-in-stone values is as ignorant as saying all skinny ectos are introverted and geeky (to vastly simplify Sheldon's quackery).

It only makes sense in the 80's Nintendo Blades of Steel, where you have on your team, a skinny guy who is fast as hell but weak, a fat guy who is slow but strong, boring "normal" guy who's average across the board, etc. Bottomline, somatypes are considered to have zero scientific basis. Think I just showed my age with that reference...

Say somatotypes were completely all BS( and I am willing to be educated into thinking this), how can you explain that some guys with 8% bodyfat have a much rounder stocky physique and some have a way more athletic and straighter physique, both looking ripped but completely different shapes. I guess my argument is more aimed at genetics rather than somatotypes, categorising yourself into one of three types is probably wrong but its where I believe my genetics are more similar to an endo compared to anything else if I had to pick one. If you guys are saying genetics dont play any part i'll disagree until I die, if you are saying they do play a part but simply defining yourself as one of three options is bad...then ok, i'll accept that from both of you.

 

[Captn_the]

I'm meso, but sensitive to carbs - cycling works wonders for me bulking or cutting but I always need cardio to stay lean.

 

[toddmuelheim]

Say somatotypes were completely all BS( and I am willing to be educated into thinking this), how can you explain that some guys with 8% bodyfat have a much rounder stocky physique and some have a way more athletic and straighter physique, both looking ripped but completely different shapes. I guess my argument is more aimed at genetics rather than somatotypes, categorising yourself into one of three types is probably wrong but its where I believe my genetics are more similar to an endo compared to anything else if I had to pick one. If you guys are saying genetics dont play any part i'll disagree until I die, if you are saying they do play a part but simply defining yourself as one of three options is bad...then ok, i'll accept that from both of you.

This makes a good deal of sense.

 

[AdonisBelt]

Genetics 100% makes a difference. Look at how huge most African males are compared to say Indian/Asian for instance. I know black guys who don't even work out who are huge, how do you explain that?

...

 

[AdonisBelt]

Ive also never said genetics makes " all the difference" so im not sure where thats been pulled from.

... I need to learn how to multi quote.

 

[AdonisBelt]

Say somatotypes were completely all BS( and I am willing to be educated into thinking this), how can you explain that some guys with 8% bodyfat have a much rounder stocky physique and some have a way more athletic and straighter physique, both looking ripped but completely different shapes. I guess my argument is more aimed at genetics rather than somatotypes, categorising yourself into one of three types is probably wrong but its where I believe my genetics are more similar to an endo compared to anything else if I had to pick one. If you guys are saying genetics dont play any part i'll disagree until I die, if you are saying they do play a part but simply defining yourself as one of three options is bad...then ok, i'll accept that from both of you.

I dont see how one's skeletal frame relates to their metabolism, fat oxidation levels, or hormone profile... if it did, wouldn't it actually go in the direction contrary to your argument? The larger the frame, the more ones metabolism is and overall skinnier they would be? ... I mean, its pretty recognized that the taller you are (longer bones) the more you have to eat... so why would someone with a "stockier" or wider physique be naturally fatter than someone with a smaller frame at the same height? I don't buy it.

Genes are very particular, and I find the idea that height, width, skin color, geographical location, hormone profile, etc. being all tied together being too simplistic. NOTE: I am in no way trying to imply any criticism upon you Brax, I am not saying your dumb or simplistic or anything like that, just that its an easy connection to make that I think is to basic of a concept. The body is incredibly intricate and we are still trying to understand it.

However- there is new research supporting the idea of epigenetics- the claim that your parents, or even great grandparents' lifestyles will effect your genetic makeup- notably metabolism if, for example, the mother ate littlle and suffered metabolic damage. This would explain why several Asian societies are typically smaller due to previous poor conditions of living in the past 100 years or so. In fact, if you look at the trend of heights in countries such as China you will find that they are getting taller at a faster rate than US citizens are, which can be closely correlated to recent economic growth and development of an upper and middle class...

 

[braxbrah]

That was my way of saying they do make a difference rather than "genetics alone" is the only reason for a persons makeup. Worded like complete **** I will give you that. I believe genetics play a part but without training and nutrition they don't matter. I believe it's easier for some people than others.