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Millenium's Cordyceps absolutely useless??

^^^(below taken from my above post in thread somewhere)
i have my opinion ...you have yours .....so you buy the better strain claim? Thats where we differ ...I think its bunk ....and im entitled to say that...but hey if u are all about it by all means spend your $ ( i will not)....


do this and i might:

you know what lets do this how about they just post the studies on their extract from a reliable reputable lab ....we can compare it to the other reputable studies...then we will know for sure....how about that? I mean they had to figure out this whole "better strain" theory *L* somehow...so let see it ...how did they discover it was better...i mean its obviously through lab testing from a credible lab source or they cant really make those claims ...so lets see the comparisons...then you know what ...i might even try it. in the mean time ....my opinion is the same...i really dont feel like im missing out ....

Thats my opinon ... and actually wasnt that abrasive in those posts ....
 
Steve I believe if I read that right that you admitted that you have not used a Cordygen product?

If that's the case then I can't see how any of your opinions on supplements can be used as viable when you are spouting off about topics that you have not had personal experiences on. How can you pose an opinion of something that is completely unknown to you?

Maybe one day you'll purchase a Cordygen product and find out for yourself why there is 100% approval from users that have USED the product. Maybe you won't...that's completely up to you. The only thing I know is i'm certain of at least one poster's opinion on supplements that I will be taking with a grain of salt from here on out.
 
*L* the consumate company rep .. how about those lab results? any chance of that? i mean think how many more customers you could win over?? We wont see them so just cast doubt on the skeptic...thatll work and people will just keep buying...nice...anyway all the best with this supp guys...
 
I think u should not attack any companies products even if u have tried them and dont work..u can inform others about the effectiveness but i always think its inappropriate to attack a company...i have personally tried many products that do not work but i have never attacked the company...if u simply would have stated that this product did not work and dont understand the efficacy of it it would have been totally fine with all of us...remember this is just a forum for learning, teaching, not attacking or verbal abuse...u might want to ask for a sample of the product to see if it works for u...and report back ur findings...some people just dont respect ur opinion when u havent used the aforementioned product...but i totally understand ur questions...as u said b4 many companies try to say that there extract is better in many different herbs (HGW, Tribulus, etc. etc)...we find out what works best by trial and error...
 
All Cordyceps products are not created equal. MST's Cordyceps products, whether as standalone (Cordygen5) or as part of a matrix (Cordygen-VO2, CitruVol-XS, CRE 02), are far and away best-in-class. Doubters should feel free to try the products, even as samples, especially Cordygen5, for the best Cordyceps experience around!
 
ctduece, i think he is just trying to bait you into giving him some free product to try. don't fall for it.
 
steveironman said:
i have my opinion ...you have yours .....so you buy the better strain claim? Thats where we differ ...I think its bunk ....and im entitled to say that...
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You're entitled to say anything you want. But when you say it, be aware we're entitled to deduct that you're a total moron. Your 'opinion' is based on...nothing, as opposed to nearly everyone responding to you who has actually tried the product, and is formulating an opinion based on first-hand experience and rooted in science.

You read a writeup, and decide the product is bunk. You don't try it, or take into account the many positive reviews here and on all other forums. You think that because other companies inflate their product description, ie Muscletech, and they suck; you decide Millenniums product description is inflated, so it must suck too? All without trying their products?

There's no excuse, go to Invalid Link Removed , click on 'Samples', and enter your info for a fat product sample packet.

I personally take Cordygen5 for its immune system boosting benefits, which are very strong, and proven in studies. The anti-aging and performance benefits are just a bonus to me. CRE-02 is the strongest performance enhancer I've ever tried, and suits my needs to a T.
 
poison said:
You're entitled to say anything you want. But when you say it, be aware we're entitled to deduct that you're a total moron. Your 'opinion' is based on...nothing, as opposed to nearly everyone responding to you who has actually tried the product, and is formulating an opinion based on first-hand experience and rooted in science.

You read a writeup, and decide the product is bunk. You don't try it, or take into account the many positive reviews here and on all other forums. You think that because other companies inflate their product description, ie Muscletech, and they suck; you decide Millenniums product description is inflated, so it must suck too? All without trying their products?

There's no excuse, go to Invalid Link Removed , click on 'Samples', and enter your info for a fat product sample packet.

I personally take Cordygen5 for its immune system boosting benefits, which are very strong, and proven in studies. The anti-aging and performance benefits are just a bonus to me. CRE-02 is the strongest performance enhancer I've ever tried, and suits my needs to a T.
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good post. try it. its free. then tell us what you think. until then I think you need to back off.
 
bottom line removing all feelings - i have seen inadequate proof re the main ingredient to warrant me spending my money to try this supplement....so my OPINION is i would never try it ...free or not. Now the claim is the studies dont apply because a "better" extract/blend has been used. I simply asked to be shown the studies to prove this (if manu makes the claim they legally must be able to prove it) so just show the results and id reconsider...that all...its simple..non confrontational..not personal. Whats the big deal???? Why is that so much to ask? Why did so many take it personally?? Immaturely calling names etc (which btw would never happen face to face thats the real funny part *L*) its silly ..this is an opinion forum ..i posted mine...if u dont like it ignore it.....anyway ...how about those labs showing your extract is more effective? you know yours extracts results vs normal results? You do have them if you claim that ...so lets see them ....simple....
 
steveironman said:
bottom line removing all feelings - i have seen inadequate proof re the main ingredient to warrant me spending my money to try this supplement....so my OPINION is i would never try it ...free or not. Now the claim is the studies dont apply because a "better" extract/blend has been used. I simply asked to be shown the studies to prove this (if manu makes the claim they legally must be able to prove it) so just show the results and id reconsider...that all...its simple..non confrontational..not personal. Whats the big deal???? Why is that so much to ask? Why did so many take it personally?? Immaturely calling names etc (which btw would never happen face to face thats the real funny part *L*) its silly ..this is an opinion forum ..i posted mine...if u dont like it ignore it.....anyway ...how about those labs showing your extract is more effective? you know yours extracts results vs normal results? You do have them if you claim that ...so lets see them ....simple....
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Wow! I can't even believe where this thread has gone.

The one thing I want to clarify is that Cordymax CS-4 should not even be used or thought of in the same context of Cordygen5 or Cordygen-VO2. I'll say this only once "NOT ALL CS-4 (or other cordyceps strains) IS CREATED EQUAL!" It all comes down to manner of culturing the strain. "CS-4" simply means Cordyceps Sinensis 4 as in "the fourth strain scientists found they could easily culture in a lab that resembled a standard wild cordyceps species in constituent profile. Now....with that being said most of the CS-4 stains on the market are cultured via the inferior liquid fermentation process where about 90% of actives are lost. All strains in Cordygen5, Cordygen-VO2, CRE-02, Citruvol-XS and Kreaceps-XS use a solid substrate or "biomass" culturing technique. This culturing process takes about 6 months to complete (compared to 1-3 weeks for liquid fermentation) and amplifies the active constituents greatly. What is going to have a superior effect on performance? A CS-4 strain cultured for 1-3 weeks and harvested prematurely or a CS-4 strain that has a full 6 month life cycle to manifest? This is the reason that studies on CS-4 Cordymax were soo poor.

Now as you will notice our products incorporate much more than CS-4 including very potent hybrid strains. The differences are large and I am saddened to see people still comparing Cordygen5 to the silly product in a few pubmed studies.

Studies???? We have plenty. Honestly I have issues with posting proprietary company info pertinent to potential patent to this thread to satisfy a non-believer who hasn't even ingested a single dose. No offense!

The thousands of athletes who continue to purchase our cordyceps products couldn't all be wrong could they? :think:

*Note* There are many positive studies on Cordyceps and the positive studies out number the negative studies by about 2:1. :thumbsup:

I also find it funny that the thread starter has a whopping 2 posts. LOL (*L*)
 
steveironman said:
bottom line removing all feelings - i have seen inadequate proof re the main ingredient to warrant me spending my money to try this supplement....so my OPINION is i would never try it ...free or not. Now the claim is the studies dont apply because a "better" extract/blend has been used. I simply asked to be shown the studies to prove this (if manu makes the claim they legally must be able to prove it) so just show the results and id reconsider...that all...its simple..non confrontational..not personal. Whats the big deal???? Why is that so much to ask? Why did so many take it personally?? Immaturely calling names etc (which btw would never happen face to face thats the real funny part *L*) its silly ..this is an opinion forum ..i posted mine...if u dont like it ignore it.....anyway ...how about those labs showing your extract is more effective? you know yours extracts results vs normal results? You do have them if you claim that ...so lets see them ....simple....
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studies show cordyceps works. millennium, and most people who use their stuff, say millennium's cordyceps is better than the cs4 already shown to work. the studies do apply, and then some.

so you only use products which are lab tested? that knocks 98% of the popular supplements on this board off the list. the smaller companies don't have money to test their stuff in a university setting.

why, of all products used here, are you choosing cordygen as your battle? it has one of the highest approval ratios of any supp by users, it is absolutely not dangerous or toxic at even high doses, and if you read this thread, it has many proven medical and health uses. meanwhile potentially dangerous and unproven supplements and steroids are used more religiously by more people solely for anabolism, and products like noxplode, shotgun, and venom have turned up with dangerous prescription drugs either added or simply present.

again, say what you like, but don't get upset when we draw conclusions. you sound like a pissy rep from a competing company.
 
If you state that your strain is superior and leads to your products effectiveness and use this as an advertising claim you must have proof of this statement. I does not require disclosure of proprietary info at all....just post the study vs other strains??? What is the big deal. Someday you may even have to legally prove it...it would help your marketing so much i dont understand the resistance..it makes no sense. Thats all ...what the big deal ..i mean publishing nfolike that could take your product sales off the charts ...what the hesitancy ???
 
Steven...i'm not sure if you've noticed through the last 3 pages...but sales are already off the charts.

I'm certain that by not selling Cordygen to the one person in the Continental United States (or parts unknown) that doesn't already use and believe in it, we will not be losing any winks come nighttime.

Thanks for your overwhelming concern...but as Matt has already stated, that is not information that is able to be posted on a forum with so many ...eager... eyes looking upon it.
 
Millennium 1 said:
Wow! I can't even believe where this thread has gone.

The one thing I want to clarify is that Cordymax CS-4 should not even be used or thought of in the same context of Cordygen5 or Cordygen-VO2. I'll say this only once "NOT ALL CS-4 (or other cordyceps strains) IS CREATED EQUAL!" It all comes down to manner of culturing the strain. "CS-4" simply means Cordyceps Sinensis 4 as in "the fourth strain scientists found they could easily culture in a lab that resembled a standard wild cordyceps species in constituent profile. Now....with that being said most of the CS-4 stains on the market are cultured via the inferior liquid fermentation process where about 90% of actives are lost. All strains in Cordygen5, Cordygen-VO2, CRE-02, Citruvol-XS and Kreaceps-XS use a solid substrate or "biomass" culturing technique. This culturing process takes about 6 months to complete (compared to 1-3 weeks for liquid fermentation) and amplifies the active constituents greatly. What is going to have a superior effect on performance? A CS-4 strain cultured for 1-3 weeks and harvested prematurely or a CS-4 strain that has a full 6 month life cycle to manifest? This is the reason that studies on CS-4 Cordymax were soo poor.

Now as you will notice our products incorporate much more than CS-4 including very potent hybrid strains. The differences are large and I am saddened to see people still comparing Cordygen5 to the silly product in a few pubmed studies.

Studies???? We have plenty. Honestly I have issues with posting proprietary company info pertinent to potential patent to this thread to satisfy a non-believer who hasn't even ingested a single dose. No offense!

The thousands of athletes who continue to purchase our cordyceps products couldn't all be wrong could they? :think:

*Note* There are many positive studies on Cordyceps and the positive studies out number the negative studies by about 2:1. :thumbsup:

I also find it funny that the thread starter has a whopping 2 posts. LOL (*L*)
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dont worry, steve is making trouble everywhere he goes, I think that instead of bashing the products is promoting them cause by now no one give him any credit
 
why not? So basically we are selling enough ...we prob dont have a comparison study ..so why bother.....thats what im hearing because there isnt a company in the world that wouldn't use factual data in their possession, that they have proof of, to increase sales ..like i said no need to reveal any proprietary info and you know it. Someday you might have to produce it ..i mean there are crackdowns on supplement companies all over the place.... why not prove claims , increase sales and corner the market? why is that bad?? it isnt ..if u have the data to back it....if not just back off your superior strain claim and sell it based on buyers experiences if thats so great...may be an advisable course of action ..all kidding aside .....
 
steveironman said:
why not? So basically we are selling enough ...we prob dont have a comparison study ..so why bother.....thats what im hearing because there isnt a company in the world that wouldn't use factual data in their possession, that they have proof of, to increase sales ..like i said no need to reveal any proprietary info and you know it. Someday you might have to produce it ..i mean there are crackdowns on supplement companies all over the place.... why not prove claims , increase sales and corner the market? why is that bad?? it isnt ..if u have the data to back it....if not just back off your superior strain claim and sell it based on buyers experiences if thats so great...may be an advisable course of action ..all kidding aside .....
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I've already posted "why" it is superior. Steve, I'd love to post more info, but; do you know what a licensing agreement is? This involves more than MST as a licensing agreement aquates to a third party interest here on a particular strain. If they say I can't disclose what they deem as "proprietary" then I respect that.
 
show the test result of your strain vs "standard" strains ...for these purposes no disclosure of proprietary harvesting method be made public at all......whats he big deal??...you say it...so you must be able to scientifically back it (right ?i mean you can right)? ...you can show it without revealing proprietary info ...but you just wont do it...... that makes no sense and would be horrible marketing ...its superior strain claims etc that open the supp industry up to scrutiny of regulating bodies....and if that happens??? WHY NOT POST PROOF IF U HAVE TO LEGALLY HAVE IT AND CAN DO SO WITH NO REVELATION OF PRPRITARY HARVESTING METHODS??? It makes no sesne guys we all know it whether we believe product works or wanna believe it does and try it ...so I for one wont try it ...im sure im not alone...bascially your attitude is we are selling enough we'll just sit on our proof *L* i dont believe that for a minute im sorry ..thats all...again it isnt personal....
 
why dont you forget the studies and actually try it....
they have offered you a free sample.....
 
^^^ so use the sample you cultured (which they surely already did ...they must have have studies to legally make the claims they do) and post the study of it (which by no means discloses cultivation method) vs the study of "normal" strains of cordyceps. It just that simple......
 
steveironman said:
^^^ so use the sample you cultured (which they surely already did ...they must have have studies to legally make the claims they do) and post the study of it (which by no means discloses cultivation method) vs the study of "normal" strains of cordyceps. It just that simple......
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....huh?
 
steveironman said:
^^^ so use the sample you cultured (which they surely already did ...they must have have studies to legally make the claims they do) and post the study of it (which by no means discloses cultivation method) vs the study of "normal" strains of cordyceps. It just that simple......
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This is why you should call me. It's not that simple. It's not just about disclosing cultivation method. It goes much, much further than that.
 
I can attest to personal benefits from the use of these. Especially during wrestling season running 6 miles a day then coming back to grapple. I don't understand why you are refusing to try a FREE sample to see for yourself? Then you will be able to make a valid claim. I am sure Matt would be glad to talk to you about it as much as he can legally discuss...he has offered you to call, so do it if you are that concerned.
 
Is anyone seriously insisting on (randomized) double-blind placebo-controlled-type studies or even clinicals to be convinced that MST's Cordyceps is best-in-class? :think:
 
Millennium 1; said:
This is why you should call me. It's not that simple. It's not just about disclosing cultivation method. It goes much, much further than that.
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Nice to see you post again, Millennium 1! :D
 
strategicmove said:
Is anyone seriously insisting on (randomized) double-blind placebo-controlled-type studies or even clinicals to be convinced that MST's Cordyceps is best-in-class? :think:
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That is not what i asked for(where the hell did u get that?). Matt and i will speak. He was very professional in his pm and I will be as well. I assure all of you i do not want free products nor do i work for a competitor. Thank You
ps - Matt im hoping it really is that simple ...or it could get very complicated. Looking forward to our conversation.
At this point there is no need for me to post until after i speak with Matt.
 
This is just my own personal experience, but I do high endurance training that taxes the VO2 system heavily, and the sample I tried of CordygenVO2 was amazing. I obliterated a previous best, and have since done the same workout without it, and scored worse. I like the stuff and wish I had more.

I have yet to try regular codyceps as a stand alone.
 
steveironman; said:
That is not what i asked for(where the hell did u get that?). Matt and i will speak. He was very professional in his pm and I will be as well. I assure all of you i do not want free products nor do i work for a competitor. Thank You
ps - Matt im hoping it really is that simple ...or it could get very complicated. Looking forward to our conversation.
At this point there is no need for me to post until after i speak with Matt.
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I asked an open and general question, and you apparently felt it was directed at you!:think:

Something else: I know Matt is professional, and trust he'll handle all this neatly. But, please stop giving the impression, overtly or covertly, as if MST's Cordyceps' fate depended, even remotely, on your opinion. MST's Cordyceps-products have a dedicated following and have been proven effective on a daily basis by non-affiliated users. Time and again. That should be enough for most objective inquirers!
 
It just seems like this whole debate would be pout to rest if the doubter would request a sample, or buy the 10$ vo2 trial size at NP.

Once youve tried it you'll become a believer, and if you go the c5 route its a very inexpensive supp too.
 
strategicmove said:
I asked an open and general question, and you apparently felt it was directed at you!:think:

Something else: I know Matt is professional, and trust he'll handle all this neatly. But, please stop giving the impression, overtly or covertly, as if MST's Cordyceps' fate depended, even remotely, on your opinion. MST's Cordyceps-products have a dedicated following and have been proven effective on a daily basis by non-affiliated users. Time and again. That should be enough for most objective inquirers!
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SM even you the coolest guy around here is under attack, believe me bro is useless, steve have a roids rage problem, i even try to lost my time with him trying to tell him that his opinion is just 1 opinion without even personal experiment but he doesn't give up before everybody believes is empty words...


steveironman you made your point now you`re wasting your and ours time with a foolish war
 
steveironman[/quote said:
ps - Matt im hoping it really is that simple ...or it could get very complicated. Looking forward to our conversation.
At this point there is no need for me to post until after i speak with Matt.
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why does that sound like a threat? you are starting to piss me off.
 
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