Guest viewing is limited

IGF-1 LR3 pin

pushpull24

New member
This may be a dumb question but i need a quick answer....

I am just doing some research and was wondering if you use the same needle to pin with that you used to draw the liquid into the syringe?

Will the needle be dull after pulling from the IGF and Bac water or is it small enough to use the same needle.

I know for ass you draw with a large needle and pin with a smaller one so I am just wondering if it is the same protocol.
 
This may be a dumb question but i need a quick answer....

I am just doing some research and was wondering if you use the same needle to pin with that you used to draw the liquid into the syringe?

Will the needle be dull after pulling from the IGF and Bac water or is it small enough to use the same needle.

I know for ass you draw with a large needle and pin with a smaller one so I am just wondering if it is the same protocol.


Yes same pin. They are insulin pins so you can't change needles.

Yes the needle is dulled a bit.
 
yes as Xodus says. dont worry about dulling as with such a fine small needle it isnt really that bad. sometimes PWO ive pinned 2 muscle groups bilaterally(4 sites) from the same slin pin and it doesn really hurt.
 
yes as Xodus says. dont worry about dulling as with such a fine small needle it isnt really that bad. sometimes PWO ive pinned 2 muscle groups bilaterally(4 sites) from the same slin pin and it doesn really hurt.

Pumb, is it recommended to change pins after each injection? I'm thinking that is the safest method. Yes, I'm ignoring cost over safety here.
 
Pumb, is it recommended to change pins after each injection? I'm thinking that is the safest method. Yes, I'm ignoring cost over safety here.

Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. Either pull 2 pins for your bi-lateral injects or one. I think the risk of infection is pretty low with 2 quick pokes if you are sterile about it (alcohol swabs!).
 
How on earth do you guys change the pins on insulin syringes anyway? The point is moot, you can't change the needle.
 
How on earth do you guys change the pins on insulin syringes anyway? The point is moot, you can't change the needle.

i think they mean to draw it into 2 different syringes? i would say not only is it a waste of time but you may be wasting some of the igf-1. there is some small amount of binding of the igf molecules to the plastic of the syringe. why increase this by using 2 syringes?

yes its minimal but like when i chew on the end of the syringe after shooting AAS, waste not want not. ;)

@papapumpsd its perfectly safe to use same pin to inject twice. you are not going to get an infection from yourself if you swab the skin.
 
i think they mean to draw it into 2 different syringes? i would say not only is it a waste of time but you may be wasting some of the igf-1. there is some small amount of binding of the igf molecules to the plastic of the syringe. why increase this by using 2 syringes?

yes its minimal but like when i chew on the end of the syringe after shooting AAS, waste not want not. ;)

@papapumpsd its perfectly safe to use same pin to inject twice. you are not going to get an infection from yourself if you swab the skin.

Ok, thanks man. While infection may be be the real issue, I wasn't sure if maybe the needle would dull significantly, or you risk possibly pushing foreign material into the 2nd site, etc. Just wanted to be clear on that.

And Grunt, as Pumb said, I was asking if changing syringes was necessary, not putting a new needle on a slinpin. ;D Need some coffee dood? Well I do! Off to brew some rocket fuel! :woohoo:
 
Needle nose pliers you silly :D

Pun intended? haha

Just make sure you always swab the top of the vial too. I know sometimes i hear alotof guys dont do that. And when it just sits around uncovered it can pick up dust easy.
But i know you guys know what.
 
i think they mean to draw it into 2 different syringes? i would say not only is it a waste of time but you may be wasting some of the igf-1. there is some small amount of binding of the igf molecules to the plastic of the syringe. why increase this by using 2 syringes?

yes its minimal but like when i chew on the end of the syringe after shooting AAS, waste not want not. ;)

@papapumpsd its perfectly safe to use same pin to inject twice. you are not going to get an infection from yourself if you swab the skin.


I agree Pumbertot. I know we all want to be as cautious as possible but look at how you would possibly get an infection from using reusing the same syringe immediately.
You pin one muscle group and remove the pin to get ready to pin the second group. Well, you have your own biological material coating the pin after removal right? Well do you know how long that pin would need to be out exposed to air till it would culture any possible pathogens? Definitely not in 10 seconds thats for sure...

My 2 cents...

As far as loss of Pepide do to adsorbtion, yes this is in fact a major issue with peptides and delivery systems, as described in a pdf DBT posted. Interesting excerpt for those who may have fallen asleep trying to read it. :D
Shows a significant loss of peptide in some cases. See the bold related to insulin which shares a similar peptide chain with IGF:

5.5.5.3 Adsorption

Peptide and proteins have a tendency to adsorb to surfaces, and this can pose a significant problem in their delivery. This is especially true with an intravenous infusion because the administration set provides a huge surface area on which adsorption may take place. Furthermore, most biotechnology-
derived proteins are very potent, so doses are very low. Thus, even small amounts of adsorption may lead to a significant loss of drug. Adsorption may also occur on an in-line filter in an administration set. When an in-line filter was added to an IV administration set for the delivery of IL-2, almost all the drug was lost. Adsorption of insulin to glass and other materials has been investigated in several studies.(124–126)
Adsorption depends on the concentration of insulin, contact time with the surface, and the formulation. If insulin is administered from a syringe as a concentrated solution, the loss because of adsorption may not be significant. However, at low concentrations, the loss caused by adsorption can
be significant. Such low concentrations will often be encountered with infusions. In this case, the flow rate of the infusion will also influence the extent of adsorption. When infused from Viaflex containers, as much as 23% of insulin was found to be adsorbed during the first 30 min of infusion.(127) Petty and Cunningham(128) found that when they added 30 units of insulin to 1.0 L Ringer’s lactate solution, the patient received only 6.36 units of insulin because of losses by adsorption. More than 50% of insulin was adsorbed by glass and polyvinylchloride containers within 15 sec of injection. Of the remaining amount, another 50% was lost by adsorption to the intravenous infusion set. Adsorption of insulin to glass was reduced but not eliminated by the addition of albumin. In practice, therefore, addition of albumin may or may not be effective because insulin may quickly adsorb to the infusion set and reach an equilibrium. Also, it should be realized that the rate of insulin infusion may be
adjusted to the blood glucose response, and thus insulin lost through binding may become less important. Colony stimulating factors filgrastim (G-CSF) and sargramostim (GM-CSF) are also known to bind to infusion containers. It has been reported that if the final concentration of filgrastim is between 2 and 15 mg/ml, 0.2% human serum albumin must be added to prevent adsorption to the infusion container. Because these colony-stimulating factors are very expensive, the cost of albumin in comparison is justified.(129) IL-1b has also been reported to adsorb to plastics at low (100 ng/ml)
concentrations. The addition of 1% human serum albumin was found to prevent such adsorption. However, at higher concentrations (1 mg/ml), IL-1b could be stored and delivered from either polypropylene-based syringe pump delivery systems or polyvinyl chloride (PVC) infusion bags for up to
24 h.130 Adsorption of D-Nal (2)6 luteinizing hormone-releasing hormne
Chapter Five: Lyophilization, Pharmaceutical Processing 167
(LHRH) on glass, plastic, tubings, syringes, and filters was found to reach a steady state within 2 h. Prevention of this adsorption by ionic compounds, inert proteins, or amino acids was investigated. Of these, phosphate and acetate ions were found to be most effective.131 Plasma proteins are also
known to adsorb to polymeric surfaces,132–135 and this may have relevance to the use of PVC and silastic surfaces in vivo or in any situation when a polymer is in contact with blood. Other aspects of adsorption, such as principles and mechanisms, are discussed in Chapter 3; adsorption to the filter during pharmaceutical processing is discussed in Section 5.2.1.

Take Care.
 
I agree Pumbertot. I know we all want to be as cautious as possible but look at how you would possibly get an infection from using reusing the same syringe immediately.
You pin one muscle group and remove the pin to get ready to pin the second group. Well, you have your own biological material coating the pin after removal right? Well do you know how long that pin would need to be out exposed to air till it would culture any possible pathogens? Definitely not in 10 seconds thats for sure...

My 2 cents...

I've heard of people pinning two different places IM and getting an infection by not switching needles(more likely from aspiration). Like anti-bodies are in one area (glute) but not in another (delt). Perhaps it was poor injection technique, just coincidence, or purely BS/internet lore. I am not a doctor, but you would think that if your body is prepared to fight off infection in one area, it should be able to fight it off everywhere regardless.

I think my BW vial stopper dulls the needle more than the actual injection.
 
I've heard of people pinning two different places IM and getting an infection by not switching needles(more likely from aspiration). Like anti-bodies are in one area (glute) but not in another (delt). Perhaps it was poor injection technique, just coincidence, or purely BS/internet lore. I am not a doctor, but you would think that if your body is prepared to fight off infection in one area, it should be able to fight it off everywhere regardless.

I think my BW vial stopper dulls the needle more than the actual injection.

I can see getting an infection from reusing a syringe when giving bilat pokes IF one site wasn't swabbed well enough (with isopropyl alcohol). If, for example, there was hair there and it was harboring some bacteria from the -OH. Or if the user was talking or sneezed or something and ejected spit somehow onto the syringe. I suggest keeping yer mouths SHUT in that case ;-D

Then again, ambient air is not sterile, so the longer you have a needle exposed, the greater the chance of infectious agents landing on it are. I recommend injecting away from HVAC ducts and fans.
 
I've heard of people pinning two different places IM and getting an infection by not switching needles(more likely from aspiration). Like anti-bodies are in one area (glute) but not in another (delt). Perhaps it was poor injection technique, just coincidence, or purely BS/internet lore. I am not a doctor, but you would think that if your body is prepared to fight off infection in one area, it should be able to fight it off everywhere regardless.

I think my BW vial stopper dulls the needle more than the actual injection.

no that is definitely internet lore. however if you did not swab and were colonised by bacteria thats a different thing. many of the population in 'the west' are colonised by organisms such as Staphylococcus aureus or even multi resistant versions (MRSA). in that instance you could in theory infect yourself, however swabbing negates this as alcohol kills these bugs. however that would apply to single injection as well as pinnin twice.

this is a problem I encounter at work on a regular basis.
 
what if you were to wipe the pin between injections?
Swab, pin, swab pin, swab, pin?
Just throwin it out there

I would not touch the pin after the 1st injection. You might risk getting something up in the top or even getting some alcohol on the tip that could migrate up or mix with IGF-1/AA/BW soln. at the tip. Likely? No, but I think it's just best to leave it alone and just make sure the your sites are swabbed very well and you don't set the syringe down such that the needle touches ANYTHING.

I used to be a microbiologist and I'm used to sterile technique. It takes a conscious effort to make sure EVERYTHING is clean and that nothing unclean touches the clean. This is even harder in your make-shift lab (basement or where ever you're "experimenting").

Thank you for your input Exodus. This section of the AA. com forum is basically 3-5 people. Need the convo in here! :D
 
I do see what you mean with the cross contamination of the alcohol and BW/AA mix. hmmm.
well, i guess yea just swab good.


Ive leanred so much on peptides here on AM in the past month thani ever thought i could.
 
I do see what you mean with the cross contamination of the alcohol and BW/AA mix. hmmm.
well, i guess yea just swab good.


Ive leanred so much on peptides here on AM in the past month thani ever thought i could.

:goodpost: HELL YES! So have I! Bobas and Pumbert are peptide/injection knowledge whores...I'm always whistlin' for some help.

Not only do they give advice/support, it's supported with research data. I love that since I'm a science dork. Much love!
 
:goodpost: HELL YES! So have I! Bobas and Pumbert are peptide/injection knowledge whores...I'm always whistlin' for some help.

Not only do they give advice/support, it's supported with research data. I love that since I'm a science dork. Much love!

Me too. Im hoping to get a B. in Biology and Clinical Lab Studies/science
 
Are you guys THAT stupid-o?! You need a fesh chewed piece of bubblegum to seal it! :D
:-P

:hammer:

Sh!t, why didn't I think of that? a'la MacGuyver!
 
Oh, I know this is the wrong section/thread to put this, but oh well. I took a couple cell phone photos of lil ole me this morning. I will post tonight. Then I can post "after" photos when IGF-1 is done. I'm thinking a mini log will be helpful for others.

Oh, and after seeing this dude's photos (5'10 and 233 lbs., 5.7% BF), I feel and look like a total *****. So thanks for making me feel like I barely exist, ya BASTARD! :P

Invalid Link Removed
 
Oh, I know this is the wrong section/thread to put this, but oh well. I took a couple cell phone photos of lil ole me this morning. I will post tonight. Then I can post "after" photos when IGF-1 is done. I'm thinking a mini log will be helpful for others.

Oh, and after seeing this dude's photos (5'10 and 233 lbs., 5.7% BF), I feel and look like a total *****. So thanks for making me feel like I barely exist, ya BASTARD! :P

Invalid Link Removed

Yeah that guy is in great shape for sure.
 
If your injecting bi-laterally and you draw up say 80mcg of IGF and then draw up some BA to dilute, do you just shake up the needle so that when you use the same pin to inject 40mcg into each delt you get a fairly even distribution of IGF into each delt or are you guys talking about something else when discussing 'using the same pin'?

Are you talking about drawing up the dose for one delt and BA to dilute, then inject. Then use that same pin to draw for the other delt?

I assumed everyone used 2 pins to inject bi-laterally.
 
If your injecting bi-laterally and you draw up say 80mcg of IGF and then draw up some BA to dilute, do you just shake up the needle so that when you use the same pin to inject 40mcg into each delt you get a fairly even distribution of IGF into each delt or are you guys talking about something else when discussing 'using the same pin'?

Are you talking about drawing up the dose for one delt and BA to dilute, then inject. Then use that same pin to draw for the other delt?

I assumed everyone used 2 pins to inject bi-laterally.

Draw up required amount of IGF, Draw BW, give it a gentle swirl, shoot half, shoot other half on the other side.
 
If your injecting bi-laterally and you draw up say 80mcg of IGF and then draw up some BA to dilute, do you just shake up the needle so that when you use the same pin to inject 40mcg into each delt you get a fairly even distribution of IGF into each delt or are you guys talking about something else when discussing 'using the same pin'?

Are you talking about drawing up the dose for one delt and BA to dilute, then inject. Then use that same pin to draw for the other delt?

I assumed everyone used 2 pins to inject bi-laterally.

First off, 80mcg of IGF is a bit excessive of a dose IMO.

Second, NEVER EVER pin a sterile vial with a used pin, unless you want to risk culturing bacteria in it...

Some use 2 pins, one for each muscle. Some use one pin as the chance of infecion is pretty slim doing 2 injections back to back as long as you swab properly before each injection.

If you do use one pin for both injects, draw up the IGF/AA solution, then backload the dilutant (BW or NaCL) at the desired amount.
I like to leave an air bubble, tip the pin upside down and flick it to get the buble to traverse the barrel and back to the top, before expelling the air This will mix up the solution.
 
Thanks for the helpful replies guys! I appreciate it. I'm getting set to order this research chem today or tomorrow. I feel awkward about using the same pin though, can you really get an fairly even distribution or is the latest prevailing wisdom that with lr3 it doesn't even really matter?
 
Thanks for the helpful replies guys! I appreciate it. I'm getting set to order this research chem today or tomorrow. I feel awkward about using the same pin though, can you really get an fairly even distribution or is the latest prevailing wisdom that with lr3 it doesn't even really matter?

For peace of mind just use 2 pins... It's not like they are that expensive, so really not woth all the stressing... :)
 
How on earth do you guys change the pins on insulin syringes anyway? The point is moot, you can't change the needle.

Here's a story about the happiest moment of my life.

About a month ago I was using a slin pin for measurement of some Clomid ...it was in a vial and the solution was thick...but I didn't know it was thick because this was the first time I'd used Clomid from this Research Chem company.

I took off the plunger and poured some clomid into the slin pin for measurement (I only wanted a little) then like a dumb-ass I decied to put the plunger back on and squirt the clomid into my mouth through the needle.

I'm standing in front of the mirror...mouth open...pushing the plunger and I see the needle shoot off of the syringe into my mouth! I reach in to grab it but I just pushed it to the back of my throat.

Now I'm in a panic and my throat is uncontrolably trying to swallow all the salavia that has built up. I just start spitting into my hand and immediately felt my throat swallow.

I knew I had swallowed a pin... I guess I'm f@cked I thought! I just happen to look down into my spit soaked hand and oh my gawd...there was the needle! Happiest moment of my life!
 
:jaw:


Good Gawd man.
 
Here's a story about the happiest moment of my life.

About a month ago I was using a slin pin for measurement of some Clomid ...it was in a vial and the solution was thick...but I didn't know it was thick because this was the first time I'd used Clomid from this Research Chem company.

I took off the plunger and poured some clomid into the slin pin for measurement (I only wanted a little) then like a dumb-ass I decied to put the plunger back on and squirt the clomid into my mouth through the needle.

I'm standing in front of the mirror...mouth open...pushing the plunger and I see the needle shoot off of the syringe into my mouth! I reach in to grab it but I just pushed it to the back of my throat.

Now I'm in a panic and my throat is uncontrolably trying to swallow all the salavia that has built up. I just start spitting into my hand and immediately felt my throat swallow.

I knew I had swallowed a pin... I guess I'm f@cked I thought! I just happen to look down into my spit soaked hand and oh my gawd...there was the needle! Happiest moment of my life!


So, what he's telling us here guys is that he's a spitter, not a swallower. TMI dood! :trout:

Dat, you really need to just use a pinless syringe for that Clomid administration man! LOL, u r damn lucky!
 
Here's a story about the happiest moment of my life.

About a month ago I was using a slin pin for measurement of some Clomid ...it was in a vial and the solution was thick...but I didn't know it was thick because this was the first time I'd used Clomid from this Research Chem company.

I took off the plunger and poured some clomid into the slin pin for measurement (I only wanted a little) then like a dumb-ass I decied to put the plunger back on and squirt the clomid into my mouth through the needle.

I'm standing in front of the mirror...mouth open...pushing the plunger and I see the needle shoot off of the syringe into my mouth! I reach in to grab it but I just pushed it to the back of my throat.

Now I'm in a panic and my throat is uncontrolably trying to swallow all the salavia that has built up. I just start spitting into my hand and immediately felt my throat swallow.

I knew I had swallowed a pin... I guess I'm f@cked I thought! I just happen to look down into my spit soaked hand and oh my gawd...there was the needle! Happiest moment of my life!


Holy Good Golly!!! I had a panic attack just reading this!
That would have freaked the crap outta me!

Well, anyhow, I knew all along that you are no "pin head" Dat! :D


On a similar note, it is always wise when pinning NEVER to insert the pin all the way in. I always leave a bit of pin just in case of a freak breakage or what not. Just enough for it not to "disappear under the skin", enough to pull it back out...
 
So, what he's telling us here guys is that he's a spitter, not a swallower. TMI dood! :trout:

Dat, you really need to just use a pinless syringe for that Clomid administration man! LOL, u r damn lucky!

Yep. But if you know the place I got the Clomid from (good place) you'll know it is a syrup solution & it comes in a sealed vial.

I had never seen it this way before...

Bob I did feel VERY lucky. The point you make about needles breaking is most approprate for pinning glutes w/ a big needle. It is an awkward turnaround and it is easy to bend the pin. If it breaks off there is noway you can remove it by yourself.

So most-def follow Bobs advice especially when you pin glutes.
 
Back
Top