Since the previous thread about Cenegenics has some members recommending Dr. Shippen and Dr. Crisler, I'm throwing in my two cents about my experience with both of them, both have some serious issues with how they run their practices, perhaps you would like to come on board as an Office Manager? LOL and anyone considering seeing either of them should be aware of what to expect. ...other than the absolute cutting edge of medicine, that is--doctors who regularly and routinely solve the cases no one else can.
I started with Dr. Shippen, and while I found him to be a nice guy and compassionate Doctor, the fact of the matter is he's in the twilight of his career, there didn't seem to be any type of succession plan as far as care after his eventual retirement, his wife who is the office manager made me feel like an inconvenience whenever I would have to call. Dr. Shippen's wife is known to be a real sweetheart to all the gentlemen who call. He's only in the office about 3 days a week, when I was seeing him it took 3 months to get an office visit and 2 months for a phone appointment. Try getting into an Endo, and waiting three months to do so, just to hear a Total Testosterone of 251 is "normal". LOL He charges $575 for the 1st appointment and doesn't seem to take any insurance for TRT patients. I would normally have to wait about 3 hours after my scheduled time to see him because he would be running very late with his normal general practice (usually Medicare) patients for which he probably gets paid $40 to see. How dare he take care of people who need him? LOL I kind of resented paying first-class prices for coach service. The "service" is in receiving cutting edge medicine, BTW. Perhaps you would do better with one of the Internet drug dealers. LOL
He gave me a script and told me to copy it, go in monthly for labs and then to call the office to get adjustments to my protocol. He wanted the lab to mail him the results, the labs don't seem to be set up for that and as a result Shippen's office would never get them. I finally persuaded the lab tech to fax them to me so I could send them to his office myself. Then I'd call Shippen's office every month to ask how I should adjust my protocol. I'd normally call at 10am and then they'd tell me to call back an hour later, and an hour later when I'd call, they tell me to call another hour later. This would hapen all day and sometimes into the next day as well. I finally got tired of this and the experimental protocol he was trying on me that didn't work and decided that I was going to try Dr. Crisler, based upon forum comments, or Cenegenics.
I placed an inquiry on the Cenegenics website and Dr. Raymond Ishman, an affiliate Dr. from Atlantic City called me. He was nice and spent about 45 minutes taking with me about my problems and his approach. I liked the idea of having more access to the Dr. and the complete medical overview done at the beginning, but the costs seemed a bit high even though I can afford them, I don't understand why they don't let you get covered labs done through your insurance when possible. The 6-7 hour drive to get to Atlantic City was also a negative for me. I needed to go to Michigan for business so I decided to see Dr. Crisler instead.
I called Crisler's office and was happy to find out that I could get an appointment the following week. Before my appointment I faxed overall all of my previous lab results & history. During my appointment, Dr. Crisler spent about the first 45 minutes talking about himself I hope by now you realize what was actually going on during the time we were visiting it seemed very difficult to get him focused on me, fooled another LOL he acted like he had reviewed previous labs but it was obvious that hadn't and made it worse by acting like he had. i I never "act like" I have previously reviewed labs, because I do not. I have to see far too many patients each day, and need to have them fresh in my mind in order to make the instant clinical decisions I do I had brought a list of questions and it was a struggle to get him to answer them, anything he didn't seem to know the answer for, he just blew off. I think at this point you have lost everyone who actually knows me. (Hey Dr. Crisler, I don't give a **** that you get your shirts custom-made, It's true--like many men who train, it's really hard to find dress shirts that fit properly. So I have them made by this racket in New York. They cost me all of $49 per shirt--less than off the rack back home. I regularly recommend them to my patients, so they can both look better, and save some money that you were mentioned in a Playboy article, many of my guys think it's neat to take home a copy of the article, to show who their new doctor is; or at least, they say it'll be the first article from that magazine they read or that you're drinking Scotch with Shippen at the A4M meeting likewise, often guys like to hear the inside stuff, and are amused by a couple of docs sneaking up to my room like little boys for a cigar and a drink, where we can kick around the latest stuff we have figured out, without being interupted constantly for a "curbside consult"--blah, blah, blah) I basically ended up with the standard protocol that he seemingly gives everybody, Your assessment of my medical therapies is about as ridiculous as the rest of this tripe. was told I needed to get new labs in 6 weeks and they would contact me about them. I left the appointment feeling like he was an egotistical jerk, but I was willing to put up with it in hopes of finding a protocol that would make me feel better. That's funny, the guys who come to me almost always report back to us what a good time they had at The Man Cave, and how much they appreciate our efforts.
But it's true, if I sense an individual is suffering some emotional problems, I often spend more time with him, trying to get a better feel for how he ticks. He may think I am just shooting the breeze, but as I am talking I am watching how he reacts, his facial expressions, body language, etc. It's not a waste of time--it's trying to gain empathy for what his life is like.
6 weeks came, and no lab script. About 2 weeks later I emailed his assistant Kim and asked about the script. I got a pissy email from Dr. Crisler saying that they had a system in place and I was short circuiting it by asking about my lab script. Finally 4 months later I called his office as his "system" was obviously not working and I wasn't feeling any better on his cookie-cutter protocol. I finally got a script went the next day for the draw, and then it was 6 weeks until they called to schedule a follow-up call for the labs. As soon as labs FULLY come back (often the lab techs mess things up, and my staff has to spend a long time making sure the assays I have ordered for my patients are completed properly. It is a tremendous burden on us, as well as hours I have to pay my staff every week Dr. Crisler doesn't like for you to have a copy of your labs until after he talks with you, all pertinent results are discussed with the patient, and we are happy to then forward a copy to you. After all, all medical information belongs to the patient. I'll let you in on a little secret: most patients can get their labs back prior to our office visit--but not ones who want to take a bunch of time expecting me to sit and listen to THEIR interpretation of them. Get it? so as he rattles through so the physician's analysis of your results is now "rattling" on, eh? LOL the results you don't have anything to reference and ask questions about. When I asked him about a varicocele repair or vasectomy his response was a robotic "ask your family doctor", gee I thought anything pertaining to my nuts would be relative to TRT. I'm wondering what exactly you were expecting me to do for that? Reach my hand through the phone to feel them? LOL. Every day I direct my patients to follow up with their local doctor--this has resulted in the early diagnosis of potentially dangerous medical conditions more times than I could list.Every set of labs happens months instead of weeks after they are supposed to. You, sir, are simply not one who values truth. Phone appointments happen anywhere from 1 to 3 hours after you're scheduled time-if he's running 3 hours behind on phone appointments. I don't understand why his assistants Kim or Patricia can't call to let you know they are 3 hours behind, Well now, he's got me on this one. It is more difficult to provide what I do over the phone than I can begin to describe. I do get burned out during the day sometimes, and get behind. You were always welcome to travel back to my office, and spend that time on the road instead they also schedule phone appointment on days that Dr. Crisler isn't even in. Yes, we do that because we think it's funny. Sometimes we schedule them for 2AM on Christmas Eve. Any meds I ordered through his office usually took about 3 weeks to get. As long as I live, I will never fully understand what would make a man so little value his own word.
Considering that both Shippen and Crisler operate in a true cash-for-service private medicine realm, it's shocking how unprofessional they are in handling their patients. I'm thinking the "shocking" thing has nothing to do with our practices here. LOL
I realize that some of you have had success with these Doctors, I haven't and have wasted more than 2 years of my life in the attempt to feel better with them.
