DS Craze Lawsuit and FDA Action

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    the first two are pretty much inactive. although the first gives a numbing sensation
    PA: Any theories as to why someone would (allegedly) spike their PWO supplement with an analogue of methamphetamine as well as N-Benzyl-2-PEA?

    I experienced the drug-like feelings/ dirty-stim. feelings as well as the numbing sensation (which I guess is caused by N-Benzyl-2-PEA).


  2. are starkk and southpaw the same guy?
    Anabolicminds.com Featured Author
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  3. What I do not get is why everyone is jumping to defend somebody who has been involved in shady/scandalous issues in the past. Among other things, these are the same people who swore up and down that superdrol was not liver toxic... Add that to the accumulating evidence with the whole craze issue in addition to hundreds of anecdotal reports of people having all kinds of crazy (no pun intended) experiences and side effects that no other non amphetamine ingredient that I am aware of delivers and it should not be too hard to figure out in my opinion.

  4. I think people who love the product want to believe it is fine. This happens all the time in the world.
    Training Log
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/271254-what-aw-hell.html
    "Jackie Treehorn treats objects like woman man."

  5. I think its hilarious that theres a bunch of bodybuilding methheads running around all of the sudden. DS should come out with a new flavor of craze called "bath salts".
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  6. I loved OG Craze, tasted like pure chemical ass, but gave us that insane focus we all came to love. I can definitely say that at some point DS definitely altered craze for the worse. I found with OG Craze I could only take a max of two scoops, I would normally take 1.5 scoops, and it would completely knock my socks off, stimmed of my face, I would also have a rather large crash aftermath. With the newer craze I could take 4 scoops and not feel as psyched as the originals 2 scoops. Also I noticed the craze crash basically went away for me with the newer versions. But that's just me.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by rob112 View Post
    I think people who love the product want to believe it is fine. This happens all the time in the world.
    Indeed... It takes place in all walks of life and all the time.

    I was like that with Craze at first. Then I started to experience more and more nasty sides. I built up a tolerance, which happens rather quickly with amphetamines and stimulants, drug and non-drug alike.

    Even at the time I felt it contained something that was drug-like and wasn't on the label, but I buried my head in the sand because I enjoyed the euphoria and insane workouts I got from it. Eventually the increased number of scoops and re-dosing caused too many sides and I pitched a lot of it.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by Ceredumbellum

    Indeed... It takes place in all walks of life and all the time.

    I was like that with Craze at first. Then I started to experience more and more nasty sides. I built up a tolerance, which happens rather quickly with amphetamines and stimulants, drug and non-drug alike.

    Even at the time I felt it contained something that was drug-like and wasn't on the label, but I buried my head in the sand because I enjoyed the euphoria and insane workouts I got from it. Eventually the increased number of scoops and re-dosing caused too many sides and I pitched a lot of it.
    Man that is some weak sauce. Fortunately/unfortunately I never tried the OG craze. I bought a tub and it was just mediocre to me. I was expecting a lot from the hype.
    Training Log
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/271254-what-aw-hell.html
    "Jackie Treehorn treats objects like woman man."

  9. Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold
    are starkk and southpaw the same guy?
    I don't think so. I've seen Starkk post a lot and the styles just seem different to me.
    Training Log
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/271254-what-aw-hell.html
    "Jackie Treehorn treats objects like woman man."

  10. Quote Originally Posted by rob112 View Post
    I don't think so. I've seen Starkk post a lot and the styles just seem different to me.
    someone suggested privated to me that it was. would be f'ed up
    Anabolicminds.com Featured Author

  11. Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    someone suggested privated to me that it was. would be f'ed up
    All I know is stark is an arrogant loser with obviously no life and a very low iq
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  12. Pat, what else would you suggest for a "natural" amphetamine extract since Craze doesn't work for me and I want to have fun, too? Acacia rigidula (supposedly contains amphetamine)?

  13. Quote Originally Posted by Afi140 View Post
    All I know is stark is an arrogant loser with obviously no life and a very low iq
    well i never

  14. Quote Originally Posted by SpicedCider View Post
    Pat, what else would you suggest for a "natural" amphetamine extract since Craze doesn't work for me and I want to have fun, too? Acacia rigidula (supposedly contains amphetamine)?
    The studies that demonstrated Acacia rigidula to possess amphetamine analogues were undoubtedly methodologically flawed, as Shulgin pointed out.

    The phenylethylamine-like compounds in this plant are para-hydroxylated, which removes BBB penetration, and most of any biological significance.

  15. Quote Originally Posted by starkkkk View Post

    well i never
    Actually made me lol. Glad you could grace is with your presence, knowledge, and positive attitude
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  16. Quote Originally Posted by Afi140 View Post
    Actually made me lol. Glad you could grace is with your presence, knowledge, and positive attitude
    while i may agree with your comments regarding my arrogance, i'll have you know sociopaths like myself are often highly intelligent individuals, though we are utterly without empathy and are incapable of experiencing emotions or what most people perceive as love.

    i am inclined to disagree with that assessment on the grounds that i once had a boa constrictor named jinxy that i deeply cared for and felt a profound sense of regret when he suffocated in a tragic accident with my neighbor's dog that wouldn't stop barking.

  17. Quote Originally Posted by rob112 View Post
    Man that is some weak sauce. Fortunately/unfortunately I never tried the OG craze. I bought a tub and it was just mediocre to me. I was expecting a lot from the hype.
    Weak sauce?

  18. Quote Originally Posted by Ceredumbellum

    Weak sauce?
    It's just a way of saying "that is beat." It was in reference to the sides. Basically I was trying to say that sucks you got the side effects. My bad lol
    Training Log
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/271254-what-aw-hell.html
    "Jackie Treehorn treats objects like woman man."

  19. Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold
    would be f'ed up

    Agreed
    Training Log
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/271254-what-aw-hell.html
    "Jackie Treehorn treats objects like woman man."

  20. Quote Originally Posted by lronFist View Post
    The studies that demonstrated Acacia rigidula to possess amphetamine analogues were undoubtedly methodologically flawed, as Shulgin pointed out.

    The phenylethylamine-like compounds in this plant are para-hydroxylated, which removes BBB penetration, and most of any biological significance.
    That sucks. Are there any other plants out there that act as natural amphetamines?

  21. Quote Originally Posted by starkkkk View Post

    while i may agree with your comments regarding my arrogance, i'll have you know sociopaths like myself are often highly intelligent individuals, though we are utterly without empathy and are incapable of experiencing emotions or what most people perceive as love.

    i am inclined to disagree with that assessment on the grounds that i once had a boa constrictor named jinxy that i deeply cared for and felt a profound sense of regret when he suffocated in a tragic accident with my neighbor's dog that wouldn't stop barking.
    Back to the unfolding story you refuse to believe in. Do you belong to the flat earth society by chance?
    *strong supplement shop rep*

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  22. Quote Originally Posted by rob112 View Post
    It's just a way of saying "that is beat." It was in reference to the sides. Basically I was trying to say that sucks you got the side effects. My bad lol
    Nah, it's cool, lol.... Yeah, the sides sucked, but I'm kinda glad I got them as bad as I did. If I hadn't there's no telling how long I would've abused that sh!t.

  23. Quote Originally Posted by Afi140 View Post
    Back to the unfolding story you refuse to believe in. Do you belong to the flat earth society by chance?
    Maybe he's the elusive, dastardly counterfeit schemer that's behind this whole thing.... But more likely he's just refusing to accept what's unfolding in front of him.

    He probably thought OJ was innocent.

  24. I came here to stir the pot!
    I can't think of anything to say though...brb
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  25. While it appears this hasn't been raised yet...

    Is it completely out of the question that an individual/company, not saying a competitor, made fake craze and included an amph. analog while using legitimate lot numbers they found on other tubs?

    Seems like a good way to make a lot of money rather quickly..

    Everyone seems to be throwing out anti-DS conspiracy theories, what about that scenario?

    inb4 this is considered "too convenient"
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  26. Quote Originally Posted by Daycrawler View Post
    While it appears this hasn't been raised yet...

    Is it completely out of the question that an individual/company, not saying a competitor, made fake craze and included an amph. analog while using legitimate lot numbers they found on other tubs?

    Seems like a good way to make a lot of money rather quickly..

    Everyone seems to be throwing out anti-DS conspiracy theories, what about that scenario?

    inb4 this is considered "too convenient"
    I brought that scenario up a while back and here's the problem I see: You had so many people all over this country (and now apparently other countries) that had similar amphetamine-like occurances/ symptoms and side-effects after taking this product. Hundreds of people on forums like this have posted about their Craze experiences and most of them tell a very similar story. I don't think it's that far fetched to assume the number of people that never said a word is in the thousands.

    I can tell you that a major online retailer of sports supplements was selling the Craze that produced these effects. I ordered several tubs of it. While what is coming out now about the methamphetamine analogue is news, the stories and anecdotal evidence have been around for a very long time now... Well over a year. If large retailers were selling this for an extended period of time (and at least one and probably more were), then it shouldn't be that difficult to trace back to the source. With that said I'm not a detective and I could be wrong. But it doesn't seem like it'd be that tough a nut to crack... Not with the financial resources some of these retailers possess.

  27. a new batch was tested in sweden too recently, positive for a amphetamine like substance..
    DS claims its a pirate batch,
    Gymgrossisten.com , one of the biggest supplement shops/ scandinavia`s bodybuilding.com , says it came right from DS.
    News do not mention if the police just tested a box they got from some dude, or from a proper store.
    Been alot of counterfeit DS craze in europe due to it was hard to get for a while...

    and naturally . newspapers are all over it warning against it being narctoctics...

    it`s probably gonna be pulled, but in response customers are hording in case of a future ban..
    I`ve tried to versions of craze, one was insane during training, and gave me the worst stim dick and crash ever...
    The other box, did nothing (which is one I believe was fake) So I`m a bit sceptical to the legit version, it`s just so much mroe powerful than jack3d(the original)

    I`m sticking to hemavol, jack3d micro and Neurocore. Just enough power for a good workout, and it makes me feel good(and even horny) instead of wiped out after training

  28. Quote Originally Posted by Daycrawler View Post
    inb4 this is considered "too convenient"

    Hahaha... You're in WAAAYYYY too late for that my man. The second the "counterfeit Craze" notion was tossed out there it was considered too convenient and that was before the discovery of the meth analogue. I happen to agree that it's too convenient. If it's too good to be true (like OG Grape Craze) or sounds too good to be true then it usually is.

    I'm assuming you're a fan of Craze? That's cool and all, just don't kid yourself (I don't mean that disrespectfully). It's easy to talk yourself into believing something is pure gold (or just pure in this case) when you love it. But in this case the deck looks to be pretty stacked against DS and Craze.

  29. Quote Originally Posted by Ceredumbellum View Post
    PA: Any theories as to why someone would (allegedly) spike their PWO supplement with an analogue of methamphetamine as well as N-Benzyl-2-PEA?

    I experienced the drug-like feelings/ dirty-stim. feelings as well as the numbing sensation (which I guess is caused by N-Benzyl-2-PEA).

    theoretically if you put a amphetamine like compound in with a numbing agent it might remind people of cocaine. i dunno
    Anabolicminds.com Featured Author

  30. Quote Originally Posted by SpicedCider View Post
    That sucks. Are there any other plants out there that act as natural amphetamines?

    come on man. if someone knew and they were not controlled then someone would be selling them already
    Anabolicminds.com Featured Author
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