Looks like some good advice here.

Originally Posted by hartmann_gr

Dr. D, thanks for your reply! a couple of more questions

1) Consider the folowing. Coming off a 12-14 week steroid test cylce, where arimidex is used as a non-sterodial AI, i am definately using HCG in my post cycle therapy. So I believe, having the estrogen already "controlled" and using Nolva at PCT, I would like the ADT mainly to control the estrogen rush caused by HCG administartion. The greater affinity to aromatase enzyme that the ADT has over the RR, I believe is better suited for this purpose. So, I would only use it for the HCG administartion period 3-4weeks (similar to the use of aromasin in Antony Roberts PCT artile) and would not inverse taper it. what do you think on this?.

2) For cortisol control what would you suggest as your favourite-best.? beside vit C which is a must and DHEA which I like, which of the following would you use?
LXT, Retain, remeron, kynoselen, clenbuterol

3) Do tribulus and/or fenugreek act synergistically to the SERM and make a PCT more "complete"? what way would you use them?


I would really appriciate an answer!

Thank you!!!

OK...
1) Yes, that sounds perfect. Any steroidal AI will do. 25-50mg RXT is perfect for estro control w/ the hCG. No taper is needed and it keeps the effects fresh from the tropin.
2) DHEA will likely help a lot on it's own so 1 Retain in addition w/ that should get it done and about 7.5-15mg Remeron at night helps too, unless you're on a diet and then the munchies are quite pronounced with Rem!
3) Oh yes, big time. Trib and/or Fen w/ SERM is synergistic no doubt. Clomid/fen and Toremifene/trib are particularly good combos.

Dr D.

I've been off for quite a while now, and i was thinking about giving it a run in another 2-3 weeks or so. My gyno seems to be getting better, i started tore at the begining of last week and it seems to have helped. I get slight itching on some days, barely noticable, slight puffyness in the pm, and the lumps have gotten smaller. The lumps are probably like the size of an m&m.

i was thinking about doing a 6 week
prop ED 100mg
NPP M W F 100mg
sdrol 1-4 20mg

do you think i should wait on the npp and just use the prop, and sdrol? would you recomend using hcg?

Hey ABiLiTY, that's good to hear. I'm glad you're getting back to norm. The NPP is cool IMO but make sure you're using an AI all the way from the start. 0.25mg letro ED just to be safe in your case. I'd leave the hCG alone. You are just way too gyno prone.

yup i'll be using an AI.

thanks Dr D

Dr. D, if you could take a min to ansnwer my PCT question, i would appreicate it.

I have been running the following oral for for the last five weeks of a six week cycle.

AX PP: 20, 30, 30, 20
AX SD: 10, 20, 20

I have been taking AI's cycle support, ax liver, flax seed, etc the entire time.

Here is my planned PCT:

wk1: Nolva 60mg/d, nutraplanet ATD 25mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 75mg/d, FEN 3 caps
wk2: Nolva 40mg/d, ATD 25mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 50mg/d, FEN 4 caps
wk3: Nolva 40mg/d, ATD 50mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 25mg/d, FEN 5 caps
wk4: Nolva 20mg/d, ATD 50mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d, FEN 6 caps
wk5: Nolva 20mg/d, ATD 75mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d
wk6: ATD 75mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d

I have done a dbol 30day (no pct) standalone 4 week SD and five week SD/PP cycle's before without a SERM in the PCT. I have only used DS RXT, LX, DHEA, FEN.

Currently 5-6", 202lbs, 13% bf. I am not gyno sensitive at all, but would like run a great closing PCT (this will be my last cycle for quite sometime). The 13th will be my first day of the PCT

Do you think this is too much (particularly the Nolva length for a oral cycle)? Plus i plan on running a generic Tamoxifen Citrate. Any suggestions and/or modifications? I appreicate it D!

Hey JZ7757, how 'shrunken' are you down there? I mean, what is your subjective feel of the degree of suppession after this cycle? Also, how did you recover from the previous post cycle therapy with no SERM (good, fair or bad)?

All other things being equal, concider changing to this:

wk1: Nolva 40mg/d, ATD 25mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 75mg/d, FEN 3 caps
wk2: Nolva 40mg/d, ATD 25mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 50mg/d, FEN 4 caps
wk3: Nolva 20mg/d, ATD 25mg/d, DHEA 200mg/d, LX 25mg/d, FEN 5 caps
wk4: Nolva 20mg/d, ATD 50mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d, FEN 6 caps
wk5: ATD 50mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d
wk6: ATD 50mg/d, DHEA 100mg/d

But, it all depends on libido. If libido is good you could cut the DHEA after 4wks with no probs and if you responded well to PCT w/ no SERM before you could start the Nolva at 40 instead of 60. Know what I mean? I reduced the ATD doses too because I'm starting to see that 75mg just isn't usually needed unless hCG is being used or only in certain other situations.

Currently, i am at 20% reduced from normal size (i actually just went and checked, lol). However, Libido is only OK (6 out of 10). That is most likely due to having a cold last week, though.

The last two weeks (first two sd weeks) i was probably 50% reduced with noticably less libido than throught my PP weeks. My best gains have been wks 1-3 on PP with great libido and wks 1-2 on SD with allot less libido. All make sense.

Overall, my last two cycles I recovered qutie well. Everything was up, including libido even two months post pct. That is exactly why i chose not to run a serm the second time around, everyhting was fine and no gyno symptoms.

I will make the adjustments you noted. If libido is good, then ill drop the DHEA at week five.

Thanks again! Greatly appreicated!

DR D.
little update.

im almost 3 weeks into my cycle. its actually been 3 weeks since i began my front load.

I started with 10mg of superdrol for the first 4 days.
200mg of prop for the first 5 days
100mg of npp first 2 days.

since then its beem
prop 100 ed
drol 20ed
npp 100mg 3xa week.

.50 letro ed
2 atd ed
cab .250 2x's week

I think today is going to be my last day of superdrol. Ive been nausuous since i started the cycle and im thinking sdrol is the problem. Ive also been very tired, unmotivated, and at times depressed which i think is also from the sdrol.

as far as gyno, since i started the cycle my pecs have bothered me less then they have in the past 5-6 monthes.
I dont kno if it is because of fat gain, but my one nipple seems to be pionting out and foward more. This is unnoticible tho to anyone besides me. Im not sure if damage is being done now, or if the damage was already done and fat gain is making it appear worse.
both of my pecs are solid throughout flexed. Im not to sure but i think there may be a mass behind my one nipp that has never been there before. On the same nipple however the initial lump (to the inside) that ive had for some time seems to be decreasing in size. My pec seems to get worse as the day goes on, but always looks perfect after i lift and am pumped. In the pm it starts feeling a little elastic, and hangs over a bit if im sitting or leaning. usually looks pretty good if im standing.

so right now im contemplating what i should do reguarding the rest of the cycle which was planned for 3 more weeks.

Im dropping the drol and am thinking about dropping the npp to lower estrogen a bit.

let me know what you think.

thank you for your time.

ABiLiTY,

Man, I can believe that you're still having issues with 0.5mg of letro/day and a good dose of test! NPP should not cause a problem with the test stacked and all that letro, not to mention the ATD! Some people get nauseated with drol, it's a fact, but the rest I can't understand. Maybe go back to 10mg and see if that helps or else drop it totally. Your estrogen should be at 10% of baseline or less these days. I'd keep going if I were you and see what happens. If you get the itch, just drop everything but the anti-e's.

Ability your still alive? lol have your read the studies on parkinsons patients dosing cab at 3mg's a day. 29% developed leaky heart valves, prolly no biggie but was enought to scare me away from my unopened bottle of cab.

Dr D

yea, something is up with me, i can't explain why my body acts certain ways. I think im going to up the letro to a gyno reversal dose, eventually geting to an ml per day. I took 1 sdrol today, i might take 1 a per day util sunday then discontinue. I dont feel like doing anything im incredibly fatigued and my appetite is non existant.
When you say drop evertying except the anti E's are you considering test an anti E?
Because i was thinking aboutjust doing the test for the next 3 weeks.
I usually get an itch 1 time a day or so for a few seconds.



Somewhat gifted, no i havent read that study, but ive read many showing positive results. Leaky heart valves can't be good, thats a pretty high dose though.

thanks again

Dr D

yea, something is up with me, i can't explain why my body acts certain ways. I think im going to up the letro to a gyno reversal dose, eventually geting to an ml per day. I took 1 sdrol today, i might take 1 a per day util sunday then discontinue. I dont feel like doing anything im incredibly fatigued and my appetite is non existant.
When you say drop evertying except the anti E's are you considering test an anti E?
Because i was thinking aboutjust doing the test for the next 3 weeks.
I usually get an itch 1 time a day or so for a few seconds.



Somewhat gifted, no i havent read that study, but ive read many showing positive results. Leaky heart valves can't be good, thats a pretty high dose though.

thanks again

Originally Posted by somewhatgifted

Ability your still alive? lol have your read the studies on parkinsons patients dosing cab at 3mg's a day. 29% developed leaky heart valves, prolly no biggie but was enought to scare me away from my unopened bottle of cab.

No! But that's a huge dose! You got a link?

Originally Posted by ABiLiTY

Dr D

yea, something is up with me, i can't explain why my body acts certain ways. I think im going to up the letro to a gyno reversal dose, eventually geting to an ml per day. I took 1 sdrol today, i might take 1 a per day util sunday then discontinue. I dont feel like doing anything im incredibly fatigued and my appetite is non existant.
When you say drop evertying except the anti E's are you considering test an anti E?
Because i was thinking aboutjust doing the test for the next 3 weeks.
I usually get an itch 1 time a day or so for a few seconds.



Somewhat gifted, no i havent read that study, but ive read many showing positive results. Leaky heart valves can't be good, thats a pretty high dose though.

thanks again

It must be the test doing it. I know you suspect the SD but I just don't think so. I would end everything except the anti-e's.

Originally Posted by DR.D

No! But that's a huge dose! You got a link?

Dostinex aka cabergoline linked to heart valve problems

Originally Posted by yeahright

Dostinex aka cabergoline linked to heart valve problems

Man, the two best ones! I'm thinking occasional use is probably still not that risky, just not chronic, daily use for anything not really necessary

thanx dr D.

I took 1 sdrol yesterday, and none so far today. I'm already feeling better.

I'll make my decision on what im doing tomarow.

Do you suspect the test is causing the fatigue and things like that? or the gyno?

Originally Posted by ABiLiTY

thanx dr D.

I took 1 sdrol yesterday, and none so far today. I'm already feeling better.

I'll make my decision on what im doing tomarow.

Do you suspect the test is causing the fatigue and things like that? or the gyno?

You must be an addictive personality, with a passion for thrill seeking. youve been on the longest emotional/ hormonal rollercoaster i have yet to witness. Give yourself a year off of anything hormonal and give your body a chance to adjust/nomalize. youve been throwing curve balls then speed balls change up how can you feel normal with this behavior. doning AAS and PH can be done correctly but im thinkin 2-3 a year max is acceptable, the rest of the time should be free of any hormonal substance to allow for homeostasis. there is life outside of the gym.

Originally Posted by ABiLiTY

thanx dr D.

I took 1 sdrol yesterday, and none so far today. I'm already feeling better.

I'll make my decision on what im doing tomarow.

Do you suspect the test is causing the fatigue and things like that? or the gyno?

probably, not sure though

can rebound reloaded now replace rxt in this dr. d stack?

if so, at what doses? i have seen most people don't like reloaded as much as the original rebound xt.

also, how can lean xtreme be taken at 25mg and 75mg when the caps are 50mg?

Originally Posted by Tom 185

can rebound reloaded now replace rxt in this dr. d stack?

if so, at what doses? i have seen most people don't like reloaded as much as the original rebound xt.

also, how can lean xtreme be taken at 25mg and 75mg when the caps are 50mg?

Yes, you can sub Reload for the original Rebound pill for pill basically. They both have favorable gyno benefits and raise test well in PCT.

The LX recommendation was based on 25mg increments. If in doubt, just round up. I basically suggest 3,2,1 solo or 2,1,1 in PCT if DHEA is in the mix also.

Originally Posted by DR.D

Yes, you can sub Reload for the original Rebound pill for pill basically. They both have favorable gyno benefits and raise test well in post cycle therapy.

The LX recommendation was based on 25mg increments. If in doubt, just round up. I basically suggest 3,2,1 solo or 2,1,1 in PCT if DHEA is in the mix also.

This is what i was thinking...let me know what you think?

cycle:
1-6 dbol @ 40mg
1-14 test enanthate @ 840mg

wk16: Activate 2caps

wk17: Clomiphene 150mg, RR 25mg, DHEA 200mg, Lean Xtreme 100mg, Activate 4caps

wk18: Clomiphene 100mg, RR 25mg, DHEA 200mg, Lean Xtreme 50mg, Activate 4caps

wk19: Tamoxifen 60mg, RR 50mg, DHEA 200mg, Lean Xtreme 50mg, Activate 4caps

wk20: Tamoxifen 40mg, RR 50mg, DHEA 100mg, Activate 4caps

wk21: Tamoxifen 20mg, RR 75mg, DHEA 100mg, Activate 2caps

wk22: RR 75mg, DHEA 100mg


*Also going to run IGF-1 weeks 17-20
*Thinking of adding Anabolic Pump

What about Retain instead of Lean Xtreme? Have we determined which one is ultimately better yet?

Also, what are other options to Rebound Reloaded...I don't like the reviews...but i want an ATD....

OK, these are the changes I would suggest then Tom:

Cycle
wk 1-6 Dbol (20,30,30,40,40)
wk 1-14 Test enanthate @ 840mg (divided into 2 equal depos/wk)

post cycle therapy
wk 16-21 Activate (2,4,4,4,4,2)
wk 17 Clom 150mg, Rebound 25mg, DHEA 200mg, Retain 2 caps
wk 18 Clom 100mg, Rebound 25mg, DHEA 150mg, Retain 1 cap
wk 19 Tam 60mg, Rebound 25mg, DHEA 100mg, Retain 1 cap
wk 20 Tam 40mg, Rebound 50mg, DHEA 50mg
wk 21 Tam 20mg, Rebound 50mg
wk 22 Rebound 50mg

This allows you to incorporate Rebound and Retain instead of RR and LX. It also smoothes out the edges on some of your transition phases. Also, the other addition like the AP and IGF sound fine, but I'd also include an AI like letro at about 0.1mg/day or 0.25mg EOD with anything over 600mg on the TE. 840mg/wk with no AI would have me itching in 2 wks or less!

Originally Posted by DR.D

OK, these are the changes I would suggest then Tom:

Cycle
wk 1-6 Dbol (20,30,30,40,40)
wk 1-14 Test enanthate @ 840mg (divided into 2 equal depos/wk)

post cycle therapy
wk 16-21 Activate (2,4,4,4,4,2)
wk 17 Clom 150mg, Rebound 25mg, DHEA 200mg, Retain 2 caps
wk 18 Clom 100mg, Rebound 25mg, DHEA 150mg, Retain 1 cap
wk 19 Tam 60mg, Rebound 25mg, DHEA 100mg, Retain 1 cap
wk 20 Tam 40mg, Rebound 50mg, DHEA 50mg
wk 21 Tam 20mg, Rebound 50mg
wk 22 Rebound 50mg

This allows you to incorporate Rebound and Retain instead of RR and LX. It also smoothes out the edges on some of your transition phases. Also, the other addition like the AP and IGF sound fine, but I'd also include an AI like letro at about 0.1mg/day or 0.25mg EOD with anything over 600mg on the TE. 840mg/wk with no AI would have me itching in 2 wks or less!

Ok..a few comments...

Why are u suggesting to taper the dbol? i already started at 40mg this week

What is the difference between rebound and RR? I can't get the original rxt...all i can get is the reloaded version. That's what i was talking about in my previous post.

I can use LX but i was wondering which you would suggest? Have you used both?

I am also already running letrozole at .5 EOD...i have run 720mg of test without it and i was fine, but the dbol kinda scares me hah

just wanted to chime into the so-far success of PCT including Raloxifene and ATD with occaisional Tribulus/Vitex.

the funnest part is my refractory period. Not only do i beat my own records every time in the mile run, my refractory period is down to 10 minutes or less, and im ready to ejaculate again!! (tmi)

seems my libido is back in raging motion

just wanted to chime into the so-far success of PCT including Raloxifene and ATD with occaisional Tribulus/Vitex.

the funnest part is my refractory period. Not only do i beat my own records every time in the mile run, my refractory period is down to 10 minutes or less, and im ready to ejaculate again!! (tmi)

seems my libido is back in raging motion

Update: 4 days into 100mg of DHEA/day while "on" has ramped my libido up alot

Originally Posted by Tom 185

Ok..a few comments...

Why are u suggesting to taper the dbol? i already started at 40mg this week

What is the difference between rebound and RR? I can't get the original rxt...all i can get is the reloaded version. That's what i was talking about in my previous post.

I can use LX but i was wondering which you would suggest? Have you used both?

I am also already running letrozole at .5 EOD...i have run 720mg of test without it and i was fine, but the dbol kinda scares me hah

No, I know for a fact AX still sells Rebound, but they may be out so if not any ATD based product of 25mg equivalence is fine. I designed the RR to have less negative impact on libido while still raising test just as well as ATD. To be honest, AX makes another product called PCT that may work just as well as ATD though.

Retain is certainly stronger that LX. LX is a dinosaur now and there are about to be several great alternatives out there that blow it away. Go with the Retain if you want the most bang for buck though as for what's available right now.

I suggested the dbol taper because 40mg is not needed to generate a gain right off the bat. You should always start with the minimum effective dose and bump it up every 2 wks, but it's OK if you started at 40. May just have to go even higher before you're done with it. It may stall out at about wk 4.

The letro dose is a bit excessive, but not so much so that it will inspire a rebound so that looks fine.

Originally Posted by DukeBergers

just wanted to chime into the so-far success of post cycle therapy including Raloxifene and ATD with occaisional Tribulus/Vitex.

the funnest part is my refractory period. Not only do i beat my own records every time in the mile run, my refractory period is down to 10 minutes or less, and im ready to ejaculate again!! (tmi)

seems my libido is back in raging motion

Favorable refraction using ATD? Wow, I would not have guessed!