if you are still eating grains, read this

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    Quote Originally Posted by Torobestia View Post
    This is total crap. It's a problem that affects a small but I guess significant proportion of white people, who are a minority among all living humans, and suddenly gluten is labeled bad for everyone. Jokes.
    Is this too above your head?

    J Physiol Biochem. 2010 Jun;66(2):153-9. Epub 2010 Jun 1.
    Gliadins induce TNFalpha production through cAMP-dependent protein kinase A activation in intestinal cells (Caco-2).

    Laparra Llopis JM, Sanz Herranz Y.

    Microbial Ecophysiology and Nutrition Group, Instituto de Agroquímica y Tecnología de Alimentos (CSIC), Apartado 73, 46100 Burjassot, Valencia, Spain. mlaparra@iata.csic.es
    Abstract

    Celiac disease is an autoimmune enteropathy caused by a permanent intolerance to gliadins. In this study the effects of two gliadin-derived peptides (PA2, PQPQLPYPQPQLP and PA9, QLQPFPQPQLPY) on TNFalpha production by intestinal epithelial cells (Caco-2) and whether these effects were related to protein kinase A (PKA) and/or -C (PKC) activities have been evaluated. Caco-2 cell cultures were challenged with several sets of gliadin peptides solutions (0.25 mg/mL), with/without different activators of PKA or PKC, bradykinin (Brdkn) and pyrrolidine dithiocarbamate (PDTC). The gliadin-derived peptides assayed represent the two major immunodominant epitopes of the peptide 33-mer of alpha-gliadin (56-88) (LQLQPFPQPQLPYPQPQLPYPQPQLPYPQ PQPF). Both peptides induced the TNFalpha production triggering the inflammatory cell responses, the PA2 being more effective. The addition of the peptides in the presence of dibutyril cyclic AMP (cAMP), Brdkn or PDTC, inhibited the TNFalpha production. The PKC-activator phorbol 12-myristate 13-diacetate additionally increased the PA2- and PA9-induced TNFalpha production. These results link the gliadin-derived peptides induced TNFalpha production through cAMP-dependent PKA activation, where ion channels controlling calcium influx into cells could play a protective role, and requires NF-kappaB activation.

    PMID: 20514534


    Regardless of your feelings, gluten is inherently inflammatory and should be avoided as much as possible.
    M.Ed. Ex Phys

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    Quote Originally Posted by Torobestia View Post
    This is total crap. It's a problem that affects a small but I guess significant proportion of white people, who are a minority among all living humans, and suddenly gluten is labeled bad for everyone. Jokes.

    what does being white have to do with it? lol.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Do NOT assume that people that adhere to Paleo support CrossFit. I, for one, loathe and abhor their whole philosophy. I learned about Paleo via my BJJ coach ~5 years ago before CF really exploded.
    The Gracies have a similar diet.

    Paleo is not ground breaking everyone should be eating fruits, veggies, good protein and eliminating processed food.

    If you understand food, you find a food that fits you but we've been programmed to eat like robots starting in kindergarden...

    My issue is the blind following and the cult like attitude towards food.

    poor kids don't even know what a Cucumber looks like these days....

    Everyone and mean everyone should understand the basic concept of food. the scary part is those that are teaching nutrition in gyms and such are quaks.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MakaveliThaDon View Post
    what does being white have to do with it? lol.
    Because crackers are high in gluten?

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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Oh yeah, use plum or roma tomatos too (cause they cook nice), and some jalapeno peppers and red onions. Really don't need any other seasonings then.

    I need to find another place around me that sells ground bison. Was near a butcher shop at the last house that had it but none of the ones near me now have it.
    They sell Bison at all the supermarkets here.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperNew View Post
    The Gracies have a similar diet.

    Paleo is not ground breaking everyone should be eating fruits, veggies, good protein and eliminating processed food.

    If you understand food, you find a food that fits you but we've been programmed to eat like robots starting in kindergarden...

    My issue is the blind following and the cult like attitude towards food.

    poor kids don't even know what a Cucumber looks like these days....

    Everyone and mean everyone should understand the basic concept of food. the scary part is those that are teaching nutrition in gyms and such are quaks.
    Contemporary nutrition is awful. Look at how many fat nutritionists there are in the world. That is all you need to know. Part of the problem is the conflict of interest between companies such as Monsanto and the USDA.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torobestia View Post
    This is total crap. It's a problem that affects a small but I guess significant proportion of white people, who are a minority among all living humans, and suddenly gluten is labeled bad for everyone. Jokes.
    White people are Human? Get out of here...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
    My mom is glucose intolerant....messes her up big time.

    I wonder if this is hereditary?

    Off to read the article.

    So she can't tolerate Sugar?.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Contemporary nutrition is awful. Look at how many fat nutritionists there are in the world. That is all you need to know. Part of the problem is the conflict of interest between companies such as Monsanto and the USDA.
    To even call today's diet nutrition is a stretch...its let's feed them to get sick so they can buy our medicine...

    The other day I was at the airport and the head of some government department for the education for obesity was a fat chick....
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    Quote Originally Posted by StakedCop View Post
    I started eating 8-12 eggs a day maybe 2 months ago and believe I've added some muscle while gaining no extra fat. Eggs Are indeed a wonderful BBing food. I will never go back to egg whites as my only source for egg protein
    Nothing wrong with eggs.
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    I've always had a problem with carbs. Every time I eat any type of carb I have to be near a bathroom. I follow the Metabolic Diet now and feel much better on low carb days. I still do the carb ups because I enjoy carbs but not the "side effects" they give me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperNew View Post
    To even call today's diet nutrition is a stretch...its let's feed them to get sick so they can buy our medicine...

    The other day I was at the airport and the head of some government department for the education for obesity was a fat chick....
    Guess what the major nutritional guidelines are? Towards a carb-rcih diet based on whole grains. FYI, corn is a whole-grain. Sadly, most people still think corn is a vegetable (along with potatoes).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Guess what the major nutritional guidelines are? Towards a carb-rcih diet based on whole grains. FYI, corn is a whole-grain. Sadly, most people still think corn is a vegetable (along with potatoes).
    School food or the general american diet doesn't follow any guidelines, Highly processed and high fat/carbs ****ty protein, no fiber and sugar it up....

    Posion and not the band...

    In this same section someone posted a diet from a IFBB pro....gross.

    Now the skinny kid in the classroom is laughed at...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Guess what the major nutritional guidelines are? Towards a carb-rcih diet based on whole grains. FYI, corn is a whole-grain. Sadly, most people still think corn is a vegetable (along with potatoes).
    I would eat potatoes and corn just wouldnt lather it with butter, sour cream, bacon and chives....
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    Potatoes, yes, but corn, absolutely not. It is a highly GE and practically devoid of any source of nutrition or alkalinity.
    M.Ed. Ex Phys
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    I'm not sure how gluten containing prducts make me feel since I eat them every day.

    But a few of my cousins have extreme gluten intolerance. If they even consume the slightest bit of gluten the start swelling and their airway becomes restricted and have to be rushed to the hospital.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperNew View Post
    School food doesn't follow any guidelines
    What? Where are you getting this information?
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperNew View Post

    The other day I was at the airport and the head of some government department for the education for obesity was a fat chick....

    Well now everything makes sense. You saw a female which you thought was fat who was the "head of some government for the education for obesity". I guess you think because the person may be slightly overweight in your eyes they can not teach or learn a certain subject. Yeah, that makes sense. So when you go to a restaurant, do check to make sure the cook is fat?. Because really if the cook isn't fat, he must not know enough about food to prepare your meal right?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Is this too above your head?

    Regardless of your feelings, gluten is inherently inflammatory and should be avoided as much as possible.
    Yeah, strawberries are also inherently inflammatory ... if you have an allergy to it. That is all this paper says. Next.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MakaveliThaDon View Post
    what does being white have to do with it? lol.
    Caucasians (or at least Americans) are predisposed to having an allergy to gluten. I forget the number, but anywhere between 10-25% I think may have an allergy to gluten. Such a high prevalence of a gluten allergy is not found amongst other races.
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    Quote Originally Posted by T-Bone View Post
    Well now everything makes sense. You saw a female which you thought was fat who was the "head of some government for the education for obesity". I guess you think because the person may be slightly overweight in your eyes they can not teach or learn a certain subject. Yeah, that makes sense. So when you go to a restaurant, do check to make sure the cook is fat?. Because really if the cook isn't fat, he must not know enough about food to prepare your meal right?
    I'm really trying to make sense of this....
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Potatoes, yes, but corn, absolutely not. It is a highly GE and practically devoid of any source of nutrition or alkalinity.
    the good corn particulary from Mexico where I get my avocados... not the corn used for corn syrup or any other government project...
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    Quote Originally Posted by T-Bone View Post
    What? Where are you getting this information?
    It's obvious..

    There are some proactive school districts (always the wealthy educated districts) on the east coast particulary Washington DC and the wealthier Cities in Virgina surrounding DC.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntonG42O View Post
    oh god dont start another "show me the clinical study!" discussion
    But why would I believe some random person's opinion on T-Nation? Calling someting poison seems a bit harsh without actual data backing it up. I will give them credit for being one of the few articles that isn't a commercial for some problem that they just happen to make a product for.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksandar37 View Post
    But why would I believe some random person's opinion on T-Nation? Calling someting poison seems a bit harsh without actual data backing it up. I will give them credit for being one of the few articles that isn't a commercial for some problem that they just happen to make a product for.
    What's your take on it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    How is that too many eggs? Eggs are natures perfect protein and if your gripe is the cholesterol content, then you need to do some major research regarding serum cholesterol.

    I have been one of the larger Paleo/Primal proponents on this board for a long time and most simply are too ingrained (no pun intended) with the "BB'ing norms" regarding nutrition to even give it a chance.
    My post had nothing to do with cholesterol... and I agree with what you're saying about eggs being the perfect protien. Maybe I mis-worded what i was thinking...

    Imo, more meat should/could be in his diet.

    Eggs are great, I just dont recommend the majority of your meals consisting of them.
    Quote Originally Posted by alwaysgaining View Post
    I've also done fasting and doseing and felt grealt anabolicness , deffint hunger but I'm stronger than that keep full and vascular and strength gose up
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/cycle-info/177245-swollen87s-training-log.html
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    I've actually noticed a lot of things while going on Paleo style/non grain, gluten, diary.

    I'm not bloated anymore
    I don't have crackling joints
    I'm more vascular
    I'm eating WAY more
    I feel "cleaner", oddly seeing i'm eating like 180g fat, 260g protein..
    I do a modified IF. I eat lunch, then a HUGE dinner. Imagine, 120g fat, and 200g protein.
    I've lost weight
    I also have a umbilical hernia. when I eat too much my intestines swell and it usually feels like it's coming out. Since eating full on fat/meat i've not had this problem.
    I noticed when I ate curry, which has cornstarch and sugar in it I noticed sharp pain near my intestinal entrance. like side pain. About 1hr after eating it. And I felt flush.
    After going home and eating about 200g of almonds I felt better.


    Paleo is REALLY hard if you live in Japan and your future wife is Japanese, who believes in eating white rice as a meal...her breakfast is usually a donut (well I call it a donut, usually bread with chocolate filling, custard filing, or sugar coating.. or all...).
    She's not "fat" but definitely skinny fat. She'll kill me if she read this.. haha.

    But yea, all you ppl who are hating the paleo diet just give it a try for 30 days then see how you feel. You don't have to give up your carbs, just scale up your fats/protein. Or replace all your grains with yams/sweet potatoes, or fruits.

    I'm no preacher, what you do is really up to you, but yea to me, if you eating the grains, sugars, whatever and feeling and looking great, then just keep doing it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntonG42O View Post
    sure:

    8am) 4-5 eggs with 1 whole avocado 1 whole tomato

    11am) 5-6 hardboiled eggs, 1 cup raw broccoli, 1 cup baby carrots

    1pm) 1 can wild alaskan salmon (7.5 oz), 2 servings spinach, 1 cup raw broccoli, 1 cup baby carrots

    4pm) 4 hardboiled eggs, fresh fruit salad

    preworkout and postworkout ill have a little fruit

    workout

    9pm) 1 pound ground bison scrambled with 1 whole avocado, 1 whole tomato, 3-4 eggs.

    throughout the day i snack on raw almonds

    And all the arachadonic acid fond in the egg yolk is not inflammatory?

    And, unless you are getting these from local free range farmers, all the omega-6 fatty acid content in the eggs is very inflammatory too.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    How is that too many eggs? Eggs are natures perfect protein and if your gripe is the cholesterol content, then you need to do some major research regarding serum cholesterol.
    I'm in agreement on the cholesterol issue. We can all thank Dr. Keys and his fraudulent study back in the 50's for some of the health problems and many of the perceptions in nutrition we now face and are trying to correct today.
    You (as in the majority of AM, not you rodja personally) may not know this, but Dr. Keys suggestions about limiting fats and cholesterol were actually turned down by the FDA 5 years in a row. The FDA only adopted them when Keys himself joined the board.

    Now, onto the topic of eggs.

    The SOURCE is just as important as the food. Eggs bought in the supermarket are much different from eggs bought from a local cage free farmer.

    Supermarket eggs can be left standing up to 60 days.
    Mass produced eggs are from chickens fed a CORN diet. And we all know how harmful corn oil is.
    Even your typical "free range/cage free" eggs are not cage free. All it takes to be called "cage free" is a 6" door opening in the cage and a small (about 3 square foot - if memory serves me) area of pen space per 100 chickens.
    That's hardly cage free.

    My family raised chickens when I was a child for the eggs. We had about 6 and they roamed the yard freely. There is a HUGE difference between the taste and consistency of those eggs vs. the ones in the store labeled "cage free".

    Summary:
    Locally grown cage free eggs - eat all you want.
    Mass produced and supermarket cage free eggs - be wary.

    Br
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiR RED View Post
    I'm in agreement on the cholesterol issue. We can all thank Dr. Keys and his fraudulent study back in the 50's for some of the health problems and many of the perceptions in nutrition we now face and are trying to correct today.
    You (as in the majority of AM, not you rodja personally) may not know this, but Dr. Keys suggestions about limiting fats and cholesterol were actually turned down by the FDA 5 years in a row. The FDA only adopted them when Keys himself joined the board.

    Now, onto the topic of eggs.

    The SOURCE is just as important as the food. Eggs bought in the supermarket are much different from eggs bought from a local cage free farmer.

    Supermarket eggs can be left standing up to 60 days.
    Mass produced eggs are from chickens fed a CORN diet. And we all know how harmful corn oil is.
    Even your typical "free range/cage free" eggs are not cage free. All it takes to be called "cage free" is a 6" door opening in the cage and a small (about 3 square foot - if memory serves me) area of pen space per 100 chickens.
    That's hardly cage free.

    My family raised chickens when I was a child for the eggs. We had about 6 and they roamed the yard freely. There is a HUGE difference between the taste and consistency of those eggs vs. the ones in the store labeled "cage free".

    Summary:
    Locally grown cage free eggs - eat all you want.
    Mass produced and supermarket cage free eggs - be wary.

    Br
    YES! Reps (as soon as I can do it again)
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    This thread has actually gotten me wondering about something. This is just me thinking out loud. But it's entirely possible when so many people complain about being "carb sensitive" and that they can't lose weight unless they really really restrict their carb intake. IMO it's entirely possible (not in ALL cases) that really it has nothing to do with them being "carb sensitive" it's the fact that they are sensitive to gluten not carbs. Because in my observation 99 percent of the time when guys add clean carbs into their diet, it's something with gluten in it like oatmeal.

    I would be willing to bet if they kept their carb intake the same, but changed those carbs from something non wheat/gluten that they would be very surprised how many carbs they eat and still maintain their leanness.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MakaveliThaDon View Post
    This thread has actually gotten me wondering about something. This is just me thinking out loud. But it's entirely possible when so many people complain about being "carb sensitive" and that they can't lose weight unless they really really restrict their carb intake. IMO it's entirely possible (not in ALL cases) that really it has nothing to do with them being "carb sensitive" it's the fact that they are sensitive to gluten not carbs. Because in my observation 99 percent of the time when guys add clean carbs into their diet, it's something with gluten in it like oatmeal.

    I would be willing to bet if they kept their carb intake the same, but changed those carbs from something non wheat/gluten that they would be very surprised how many carbs they eat and still maintain their leanness.
    I'm thinking somewhat of the same. So i'm testing it out. 12 week cut first (summer, my wedding). Then i'm going to try to add in some non gluten, grain carbs. Sweet potatoes and some fruit then see how I do.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    So even in that opinion article, it doesn't hazard a guess as to what % of people have a gluten allergy, much less show any actual studies with numbers. Why do you think it actually affects any significant % of people?
    well think of all the people who are "carb sensitive" and bloat and feel ****ty after most carb meals, and gain a ton of weight throughout the day with huge fluctuations.

    I would say thos are the people who are gluten intolerant... to an extent but not fully celiac.

    when i eat carbs i always keep them gluten free, and high fiber. no stomach issues here.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ssbackwards View Post
    well think of all the people who are "carb sensitive" and bloat and feel ****ty after most carb meals, and gain a ton of weight throughout the day with huge fluctuations.

    I would say thos are the people who are gluten intolerant... to an extent but not fully celiac.

    .
    Perhaps...or maybe they have poor digestive health from years of eating processed foods, lack of fiber, and lack of activity.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiR RED View Post
    Perhaps...or maybe they have poor digestive health from years of eating processed foods, lack of fiber, and lack of activity.
    ... yep that too. lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiR RED View Post
    Perhaps...or maybe they have poor digestive health from years of eating processed foods, lack of fiber, and lack of activity.
    Bingo Amigo!

    A good cleanse (not some commercial package but using fruits and veggies) with a good probiotic can get someone up and running quickly.

    Probiotics are welll over-looked. I would buy a probiotic before any other supplement on the market as a begginer.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torobestia View Post
    Yeah, strawberries are also inherently inflammatory ... if you have an allergy to it. That is all this paper says. Next.
    Did you read more than the first sentence? This was not done in Celiac patients.
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    Quote Originally Posted by StakedCop View Post
    What's your take on it?
    My take is if somebody suspects they may have celiac disease or even just a gluten allergy, they should find a physician and get tested. All of those foods listed don't apply to me, and probably a lot of people on a bodybuilding website, since the only grain I consume is oatmeal. It's like writing an article on a bodybuilding website about how eating pizza, smothered with ice cream and nacho cheese sauce, is bad for you.

    That said, using vague terms like inflammatory and poison without data to back it up is in my opinion wrong. Lifting weights is inflammatory. Am I going to stop? Not likely. Gluten allergy is a very real and serious issue, but, again in my opinion, has been taken too far. Many foods that contain gluten have been the staple food of civilizations for centuries. It just seems to me to be an article that belongs more on a website that promotes veganism and cleanses. All of that is just my two cents though and as always, if it works for you, then it works for you and I'm not going to tell somebody not to do something.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksandar37 View Post
    My take is if somebody suspects they may have celiac disease or even just a gluten allergy, they should find a physician and get tested. All of those foods listed don't apply to me, and probably a lot of people on a bodybuilding website, since the only grain I consume is oatmeal. It's like writing an article on a bodybuilding website about how eating pizza, smothered with ice cream and nacho cheese sauce, is bad for you.

    That said, using vague terms like inflammatory and poison without data to back it up is in my opinion wrong. Lifting weights is inflammatory. Am I going to stop? Not likely. Gluten allergy is a very real and serious issue, but, again in my opinion, has been taken too far. Many foods that contain gluten have been the staple food of civilizations for centuries. It just seems to me to be an article that belongs more on a website that promotes veganism and cleanses. All of that is just my two cents though and as always, if it works for you, then it works for you and I'm not going to tell somebody not to do something.
    Systemic inflammation from foods and local inflammation from training are two different processes and should not be used interchangeably. Although it seems like Celiac/gluten intolerance is the new hot button, you cannot use the fact that many of these foods have been staple foods to support your cause. Evolution is a slow process and centuries is not nearly long enough for the body to adapt. Hell, even a few millennia is just a mere blip on a large scale.
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