BPS' What's improved with the upcoming DHEA transdermal

[MrKleen73]

There are some questions regarding what type of improvements will be coming with our upcoming new and improved DHEA Transdermal Product. I wanted to post up a thread where we could ask questions to BPS himself. Perhaps make suggestions and or even have some guessing games that MAY even end up with some type of fun contest if BPS wants to do something like that.

Lets keep this thread positive and only about the new and upcoming product.

BPS since even us reps are excited and anticipating what the new improvements are going to be. I would love to make a suggestion if the new formulation is not set in stone. I would love to see some DIM or IC3 added into the product for estrogen modulation. We all know DHEA converts at a pretty high rate and chrysine is a decent AI but often times can not keep the excess water off. I don't see a need to crush Estro with a high dose of AI but something like DIM or IC3 would be a great addition to combat any negative estrogen sides while enforcing some of the positive effects of estrogen. It could also help aid in preventing shut down at higher doses, which we all know everyone runs DHEA product higher than the recommended doses.

[Resolve]

Great idea

[MrKleen73]

Yeah, I think it would be great in there or did you mean the thread?

[Ape McGrapes]

Maybe a low dose Epiandrosterone. That would increase it's anabolic potential, fat loss properties, it's neurotransmitter stimulation, and prevent all estrogen concerns.

DHT is a powerfull A.I.

Anyone know the oral to transdermal dose equivalency?

Lastly, don't drop the pregnenolone. It is pivitol to the formula.

[MrKleen73]

Maybe a low dose Epiandrosterone. That would increase it's anabolic potential, fat loss properties, it's neurotransmitter stimulation, and prevent all estrogen concerns.

DHT is a powerfull A.I.

Anyone know the oral to transdermal dose equivalency?

Lastly, don't drop the pregnenolone. It is pivitol to the formula.

I agree that pregnenolone is a good part of the formula. However I have to disagree with the statement that DHT is a powerfull A.I.

DHT is not an AI at all. It can counteract some of the effects of Estrogen especially in breast tissue but it is a product of the aromatase process. The acronym AI means Aromatase Inhibitor naturally occuring DHT is one of the 2 hormones created when testosterone or DHEA is aromatized some is converted to DHT and some of it converted to Estrogen.

Part of the reason steroidial DHT is beneficial at minimizing or reducing gyno is that when you begin to shut down from the higher DHT levels there is less testosterone and therefor less estrogen due to less aromatization. An estrogen starved mammary gland will shrink, and if starved of estrogen long enough some of the cells can even die.

[BulkPerf]

Love the discussion. Fun to see the speculation on what's in it.

[antknee02]

Maybe a low dose Epiandrosterone. That would increase it's anabolic potential, fat loss properties, it's neurotransmitter stimulation, and prevent all estrogen concerns.

DHT is a strong AI Anyone know the oral to transdermal dose equivalency?

Lastly, don't drop the pregnenolone. It is pivitol to the formula.

this sounds good re: more anabolic if possible..


- had to edit 'strong' due to post count not being high enough for links

[Austinmck17]

I've read before that the metabolites of DHT can act on the aromatase enzyme and inhibit it.
It also acts on the hypothalamus and decreases the secretion of gonadotropins which are needed for estrogen production.

I would opt for a pro to DHT than an AI since it acts similar and has added benefits.What about another ingredient that is ergogenic + an AI?

I definitely like the idea of DIM or resveratol.

[Ape McGrapes]

MrKleen,

I'm not here to argue. I would like to see this thread flourish as it should. However, DHT is a steroidal A.I. known to have direct antagonistic effects at the estrogen receptor, while also having anti-aromatase properties to block estrogen conversion from testosterone.

[mattikus]

I like dhea + Pregnenolone, and if possible in the same formula some
Estrogen modulation (DIM or I3C was a great suggestion by Kleen) am a huge fan of formestane
Cortisol modulation (11-keto would be awesome) or 11-oxo, 7-oxo
hmmm...
and anything else that can contribute to health. Maybe something in the cognitive dept?

[andrew732]

I also feel androsterone would be a nice additive to the Derma formula as they have synergestic effects when combined.

[Resolve]

I like dhea + Pregnenolone, and if possible in the same formula some
Estrogen modulation (DIM or I3C was a great suggestion by Kleen) am a huge fan of formestane
Cortisol modulation (11-keto would be awesome) or 11-oxo, 7-oxo
hmmm...
and anything else that can contribute to health. Maybe something in the cognitive dept?

As a huge fan of formestane, have you checked out formasurge yet? http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/b...-servings.html

[jwa254]

As a huge fan of formestane, have you checked out formasurge yet? http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/b...-servings.html

I finally got my hands on my own bottle. Loving it.

[MrKleen73]

I've read before that the metabolites of DHT can act on the aromatase enzyme and inhibit it.
It also acts on the hypothalamus and decreases the secretion of gonadotropins which are needed for estrogen production.

I would opt for a pro to DHT than an AI since it acts similar and has added benefits.What about another ingredient that is ergogenic + an AI?

I definitely like the idea of DIM or resveratol.

I wonder if this is part of a part of the negative feedback loop. Since DHT is a product of the aromatization process perhaps a high count of DHT signals the body too much aromatization is gong on thereby lowering the production of the enzyme itself? Can you refer me to a specific study or something so I can look at what you have been reading?

DHT / Andro would be a sexy addition just not sure how cost effective it would be considering the low cost of the new product that has been mentioned.

[MrKleen73]

MrKleen,

I'm not here to argue. I would like to see this thread flourish as it should. However, DHT is a steroidal A.I. known to have direct antagonistic effects at the estrogen receptor, while also having anti-aromatase properties to block estrogen conversion from testosterone.

Damn It Ape How dare you disagree with me!

Actually if find this level of conversation very interesting, and don't consider it argument at all. I am not that guy...

I may have to do a little more research on the subject. I knew that DHT was an AE, or anti-estrogen via competition at the receptor as I mentioned in my post. I was I more refering to it not being a suicide inhibitor. However I need to look at little more into the method in which it inhibits the aromatization process. Like I asked Austin above can you provide some of the studies you are getting your information from so I can go do a little more research? I mean I could sift through tons of studies but if you have read one and know about where you found it that would be more helpful.

[Resolve]

DHT has a very low affinity for the estrogen receptor, it's specifically used in research for that reason. A classic paper demonstrating this is Kuiper et al, Endocrinology 1997. Because other androgens do interact with the AR and ER at appreciable affinities, DHT was used (in part) to identify AR-specific downstream effects. I'm using it in some nuclear receptor experiments right now for just that reason too.

As for it being an aromatase inhibitor, I've only given it a cursory look at this point, but can only find secondary and tertiary sources on that claim. Given it's poor binding to the ER, there are other compounds that would be far more efficient as an AI. As yet no actual research that I have come across supports that claim. If such research exists, please post it, as I'm not seeing it.

[mattikus]

Ape, Resolve, Kleen, I agree with all of yas.
And Resolve, yep on Formasurge at this very moment. It is a key part of my current plan and I would be in a different situation without it. Awesome and stronger than others I have used.

[Austinmck17]

I wonder if this is part of a part of the negative feedback loop. Since DHT is a product of the aromatization process perhaps a high count of DHT signals the body too much aromatization is gong on thereby lowering the production of the enzyme itself? Can you refer me to a specific study or something so I can look at what you have been reading?

DHT / Andro would be a sexy addition just not sure how cost effective it would be considering the low cost of the new product that has been mentioned.

I can't right now since I am on my phone and it isn't very easy. I like your thinking because that makes perfect sense to me.

It could be cost effective if the skin gives good conversion rates.

I can't wait to see what ingredients will be used

[MrKleen73]

I can't right now since I am on my phone and it isn't very easy. I like your thinking because that makes perfect sense to me.

It could be cost effective if the skin gives good conversion rates.

I can't wait to see what ingredients will be used

Cool thanks will look forward to when you have a chance to post some thing up.
Resolve thanks for the input. I am definitely curious if there is some science I am unaware of. I like to think a have a little knowledge about stuff but don't consider myself a scholar by any means. Those of us who know you know that you are.

[Ape McGrapes]

I'm no expert either, and can't make heads or tails of most studies. My opinion on the epiandrosterone, cones from what I've been told by more knowledgeable heads. People who know their **** like Matt Porter.

I try to avoid bro science at all cost.