Yolked
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You're sooo fricken young... improved quality of life only to have repercussions later isn't exactly productive. Unique situations need unique remedies.
scherbs
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Couldn't agree more.
OP: I truly hope you are seeking the help of a counselor/psychotherapist as well. Pumping your body full of a veritable medicine cabinet of exogenous substances can only help so much (and might hurt infinitely worse in the long run)
factsmachine
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my T level was 47. I didn't have a life. being suicidal and ED at 18, I now have a life, I have motivation, my depression is lifting and my mood is becoming more stable.
unique situation, yes. So then you have a better idea? enlighten me. I quit all the other drugs. and only use the klonopin when I need it. its not all perfect, each day has its ups and downs, but I finally would rather be alive than put a bullet through my head. years of that feeling ****s with you.
**** id rather be a heroin addict than feel no will to live.
unique situation, yes. So then you have a better idea? enlighten me. I quit all the other drugs. and only use the klonopin when I need it. its not all perfect, each day has its ups and downs, but I finally would rather be alive than put a bullet through my head. years of that feeling ****s with you.
**** id rather be a heroin addict than feel no will to live.
Yolked
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The scarey part is no one really knows what's the right way to treat this... kinda unprecedented. I think you're doing only what anyone else would do to relieve their misery. I would use the lowest dose possible for the effect. 100mg a week too much. You will have e2 issues knowing how your body reacted in past with nipple sensitivity. Front load the first week or 2. Then titrate... drop to 90mg a week... for a few weeks. Then 80... I know guys using 30mg 2x a week for hrt... with no e2 problem and feel great.
Yolked
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By front load I mean use 100mg a week for 2-3 weeks to get blood levels elevated.. some guys double up the first week to get going.. You don't need 800tt.. and you don't want to be trying to figure out the sweet spot for AI.. tt I level over 500 should handle things.. if you still not feeling "right" there's possibly something else going on.. it just another mechanism to deal with. Good approach with the Klonopin. Gotta stay mentally strong.
sammpedd88
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What was the range for your Test level with the result of 47? And I assume that was total T?
factsmachine
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thanks yolked. I front loaded 100mg IM 2 days ago. then in 3 days I'll use my axiron gel for the 2 days until my next injection to prevent a trough. then I'll start dosing 50mg 2x week.
maybe I'll try to save a little extra in case pharmacy or doctor difficulties?
Sam, here's my levels and ref ranges (quest diagnostics)
total T: 47 (250-1100)
free T: 13.5 (35-155)
19 years old, I should be in the upper third quartile forsure! I've felt less bold than my peers, and it takes a lot of hard work for me to build or maintain muscle mass compared to my friends.
I'll give more details, I previously thought about delayed puberty..
standard weight for me is 130 at 5'10".
19 years old, now 150lbs 5'10, est 10% body fat. weaker than my friends and never gained strength like they did. facial hair is very fine, can grow some on chin and mustache. the rest is light blonde and thin.
maybe I'll try to save a little extra in case pharmacy or doctor difficulties?
Sam, here's my levels and ref ranges (quest diagnostics)
total T: 47 (250-1100)
free T: 13.5 (35-155)
19 years old, I should be in the upper third quartile forsure! I've felt less bold than my peers, and it takes a lot of hard work for me to build or maintain muscle mass compared to my friends.
I'll give more details, I previously thought about delayed puberty..
standard weight for me is 130 at 5'10".
19 years old, now 150lbs 5'10, est 10% body fat. weaker than my friends and never gained strength like they did. facial hair is very fine, can grow some on chin and mustache. the rest is light blonde and thin.
sammpedd88
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I see what you are saying, but as far as the total t level, an 18 year old should be around that level. Although free t is the most important he should be at the upper level of the range because of his age. His dr is old school so he's going to have to find a progressive one. At his age he really needs HCG to preserve his ability to have kids and I'm not a proponent of HCG due to the E2 issues. He's going to need an AI. There's almost no way he can go without it being on HCG. 100 mgs is a pretty standard starting point for TRT from what I've research, but I'm no Dr. I'm 41 and I take a little over 100 mgs a week. I've never heard of front loading t like you would front load dhea. This guy is truly a special case due to him being so young and needing TRT. Just my .02
sammpedd88
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I would not recommend using the axiron at all. Injecting twice a week is not going to give you a trough that will make you feel bad. Stick with the twice a week injections splitting the 100 mgs. Make sure when you go for blood work it's done the morning, not afternoon, of your injection and do not object until after the blood is drawn. That will give you the best reading and you can adjust from there. I promise you you won't feel anything like you were before with injecting twice a week and leaving the axiron alone. You are definitely very low but stick to the injections only! Trust me!
Yolked
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Start axiron now. Then as the days do by the cyp will catch you up. Then stop axiron. That's the way you do it.
Yolked
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Just because he's 19 doesn't mean he has to be in upper numbers. Not all guys that age have those levels. He needs to consider starting HRT at his age and he's ALWAYS gonna have to use something to make him feel right, for rest of his life... as an ectomorph his body wasn't meant to carry a lot of muscle and more than likely to not have upper end hormone levels and you're just gonna complicate it trying to push the limits. Take whatever gets the job done and don't be obsessed with the numbers. Whatever they end up at with you feeling right is what matters. Yeah HCG means a lower dose of test as well. Trust me. If you can have T levels at mid- upper (500-700) levels with estrogen in check and feeling good, without an AI, it's much better than getting another 100 points of tt but having to dial in and maintain an AI. As far as delayed puberty goes... I would say that's definitely possible. Or something along those lines. Between the recreational drugs, especially opiates that shutdown all sex hormones... messing with peptides, nolvadex and whatever else... I personally would've got on some PCT stuff... FULL BLOWN PCT recovery plan: HCG, clomid, SERM's, Tribulus, Zinc... no exogenous hormones.. anything that will boost your natty test.. even your workouts and diet. Low volume hi intensity to stimulate CNS and boost hormones. I think it was too easy to go this way and long term maybe not the best way
Jiigzz
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A few things; firstly, it is horrible when loved ones are afflicted with such things and I hope you see this as an opportunity to make the most of the time you have left wit her. Secondly, what exactly is this "normal" you are referring to? Have you ever seen the Testosterone ranges for "normal"?. They range from low normal to high normal - which is a very large range.
Thirdly, I advise seeking counsellor help. There is clearly a LOT going on and you being 18 messing with all kinds of hormonal and mind-altering substances is not the answer - it is a temporary solution. IS this what you really want? To be popping pills and taking injections for a lifetime just to feel "normal"? That seems like a lot of work. It also seems as though you are playing Doctor with things that are likely well beyond your understanding.
My issue with this is that people feel a certain way, have a hypothesis on what It is, then Google that issue and make the symptoms you display match the symptoms Google has outlined then attempt to self medicate an issue which you may not even be facing. Its good that you are putting things forward to a Doc, but you stating "it could be insulin resistance, it could be this, it could be that" just further outlines that you are way out of your depth.
IF you would like a real-world scenario on how this could be potentially dangerous, here is one:
I work as a strength and conditioning coach in a gym that also employs Personal Trainers. One day I was sitting in the staff room and I overheard a conversation between two Personal Trainers about a client they had who was diagnosed (recognised clinically as having a condition) with Bulimia. That made me listen in further. He told the other PT that he was teaching her how to eat without being 'scared' or 'guilty' and the principles of IIFYM. This sends red flags to me as this guy clearly does not understand what Bulimia is, but rather sees it as an easy fix. It is not. Bulimia is a recognised psychological issue that may be brought upon by atrophy of certain areas of the brain, thus affecting decision making processes (it may also be other things, but just highlighting). This isn't fixed by "coaching her what to eat to not feel guilty".
This guy was clearly well outside his depth, but because he had read a few online articles or thought he knew what the issue was, he neglected to tell her to seek professional help. This may mean that she ends up taking 10 steps backward with very real life threatening consequences. Always practice within the scope of your knowledge as you do not understand how taking one thing can cascade downstream and affect a host of others. Rarely in the body do you alter one thing without there being a hormonal cascade of other things.
I'm not just randomly saying this; you being so young and experimenting with so many different things will affect more than you realise.
Jiigzz
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Your T levels were 47 as you had cycled without PCT so of course your numbers had crashed. Had you not messed with them in the first place, this hormonal panel would have been far more accurate and a better indicator of where you were at. The levels crashed as a result of your injections and self-medication, not because they had always been 47.
RipdnTxs
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Well said Jiigzz, very solid advise !!!
scherbs
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Amen, Amen, and AMEN.
OP: PLEASE heed this advice--the happiness you seek will not come solely thorough messing with your hormones. Please talk to a qualified mental health practitioner.
factsmachine
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I have many points to address, this will be an even longer post than normal.
Guys, it is important to understand that age has nothing to do with how much somebody knows. It's a reasonable speculation, but how do you automatically assume that you know more than me, and that my doctor knows more than me, when clearly we've already disproven the doctor with his lack of knowledge reagarding these important subjects.
Yo, Yoked, he didn't put down the frequency of injections, and he said take 1ml (200mg), and i took 100mg instead because it seemed as though he just gave me the wrong starting dosage. So I can't do another injection this week because it would make me run out too soon. Next week however, it'll be splitting it up 2 times weekly at the appropriate 50mg dosage. Also yoked, I understand your statement about the Ectomorph thing. You're right also when you say better to not need an AI and just have a slightly lower T level. Ideally I'd like to be around 800, but with the HCG coming into play soon I will probably need an AI. And yes, HCG should be used by me so I will remain fertile and still have testicular function. My testicles are already hanging only slightly, and are more squishy and have lost about 40-50% of size
Yes Sam, I'm 19, and to optimize quality of life it is definitely preferrable to be in the upper ranges for free T. And Definitely need to find a progressive Doctor. This one I have is not only terrible with TRT, my dad is having troubles with them everywhere from paperwork, to them not understanding that no pharmacy here has his pain pills (hydrocodone) in stock and may not for months down the road. So they wrote him another prescription for the same ****, Hydrocodone. Then they dispute his claims that the other stuff they put him on is affecting his memory. How could they be so sure?
When I was saying "my mood has been what a normal person would probably feel, after the real possibility of my aunt dying any second" you thought I was talking about Normal testosterone levels. No, I was talking about my mood and attitude. Which has changed COMPLETELY in the last 2 weeks.
I understand you don't EXPECT a 19 year old to know these things but you must remember, FACTS are FACTS regardless of who says them. For example stating "I'm a doctor, I know that test injections should be 200mg every other week" is an obvious indication of fallacy by status..
You said that I caused all of these problems with a mild cycle of 4 weeks with proper PCT? No, sir. I felt like ****, had ED, suicidal depression, anxiety, no confidence, aggression, I could go on. But lets put 2 and 2 together.. I felt TERRIBLE before I even touched any hormonals. Then since TRT, ALL of these things have been approving to an amazing degree. Correlation does not apply causation, yes we both know this, but it is logical. But its also a FACT that i am feeling better.
First, I did a cycle of 4 weeks, epi 40mg a day, 200mg T cyp once a week.
Then, I ended the cycle, and hopped on Nolva at 40mg/day. I did a proper PCT. I did take tribulus, 10,000 iu vitamin D (just got my labs, Vit D was perfect, right in the middle of the line. Also took zinc, magnesium, ate a high fat diet with healthy fats,tons of olive oil. Also mucuna for the L dopa to lower prolactin and stimulate LH.
I realize you just hopped on this thread Zig, but I believe when you say things like "you're doing this on your own, thinking you're doing everything right, and not understanding that changing one hormone or neurochemical has downstream effects"
Zig, did you read the post because I put reference ranges and my levels. Calling 47 T level, suicidal depression and anxiety as normal is very concerning. Normal is only determined through comparison to other things of the same basis. For example, 10 foot tall would not be normal compared to a normal 5'10" male.
Sir, I must respectfully say that you are wrong. I read studies, rarely going arbitrary advice on forums ect. I spend all day at the computer researching things from the liver and enzymes, gut health, diet and supplementation, endocrinology, psychology, I could keep going but its taking up too much of my post. I DO understand the way many things work in regards to these subjects. Remember, I'm going into the medical field, I'm not just reading arbitrary statements by people who MAY or MAY NOT understand the basis of something. I am supremely dedicated to learn about the entire body. And the things you said about how I said "it could be insulin resistence, ect" was based on real LABS. Not speculation regarding subjective feelings and symptoms. And I say it "could be" because it's logical to be openminded about possiblities. Much better than me just saying "Oh yeah, I have insulin resistence" I'd rather be unsure and openminded than be certain about something that is incorrect. I call myself 'Factsmachine' because I am only concerned with the facts. And the fact is I know it's better to know something for sure before you just say "yeah that's the problem, now lets ignore all of the other possiblities"
Also, I pointed out that I had felt these things that were directly related with my testosterone levels BEFORE I chose to cycle, The cycle made them worse, of course due to the nature of endogenous suppression of hormones. Buddy, don't take that stand that you understand me completely. That to me is blatant disrespect. You may apologize, or admit your faults regarding these arbitrary and prejudice remarks.
Therapy, yes I need it. And I previously stated that "I'd rather be a heroin addict than feel like killing myself everyday." Sir, I have no problem with putting exogenous substances in my body in order to feel "normal". I was doing tons of drugs before I got on T therapy and Klonopin for my social panic (low dose klonpin prescribed for everyday, I take it as needed, every other day or before a social interaction that is in my perception stressful. I need to change my patterns before I even think about dropping my klonopin. Kpin is meant to be used for me as a how do i say it... A catalyst for change, not a solution. The changes come just like CBT. The klonopin is helping me socialize and get out of social isolation. I don't take it and expect it to fix everything, it is a stepping stone for my recovery.
Don't lead the beat the dead horse train, Scherbs. I said I am feeling better, so saying that "messing" with my hormones won't make me feel better. Well. I am. This emotionally charged authority figure banter is not helping my condition. I'm getting my needs checked off on the list to recovery, don't dispute me because obviously, it's helping.
Really, if you guys haven't been in my shoes then how could you make statements like "I'm messing up my body, stop with the hormones, talk to a healthcare provider." when I did, and he doesn't even understand many of the basic things regarding me.
This is not a pissing contest, this is an oppurtunity for education on both sides. Take advantage of it guys, just scolding me for wanting to get better by being experimental doesn't change anything or help my recovery.
Hello? I'm not suicidal, I'm enjoying life again. Stop telling me everything I'm doing is wrong. Rather, help me and we can make progress and learn things together. I'm wondering why your perspective, Zig is the way it is. I want to try to understand why you think these things. Your speculations, and my cross analysis would allow for more learning.
One more thing. I had labs done yesterday, I got my E2 level today, but I'll wait till tomorrow when I should get the Free T, Total T, and possibly the DHT labs so we can stay more organized. However i will say this, Even with dosing my axiron properly (it was 3 weeks into it when I got the labs done) and using AI's, my levels were still above optimal. Maybe I feel better with higher E2, maybe I'll feel better with lower E2. TRT is not a quick fix all, and it takes adjusting to find each individuals "sweet spot"
I'd like for this post to give more insight to myself, and everybody else. Thank you again, brothers.
Guys, it is important to understand that age has nothing to do with how much somebody knows. It's a reasonable speculation, but how do you automatically assume that you know more than me, and that my doctor knows more than me, when clearly we've already disproven the doctor with his lack of knowledge reagarding these important subjects.
Yo, Yoked, he didn't put down the frequency of injections, and he said take 1ml (200mg), and i took 100mg instead because it seemed as though he just gave me the wrong starting dosage. So I can't do another injection this week because it would make me run out too soon. Next week however, it'll be splitting it up 2 times weekly at the appropriate 50mg dosage. Also yoked, I understand your statement about the Ectomorph thing. You're right also when you say better to not need an AI and just have a slightly lower T level. Ideally I'd like to be around 800, but with the HCG coming into play soon I will probably need an AI. And yes, HCG should be used by me so I will remain fertile and still have testicular function. My testicles are already hanging only slightly, and are more squishy and have lost about 40-50% of size
Yes Sam, I'm 19, and to optimize quality of life it is definitely preferrable to be in the upper ranges for free T. And Definitely need to find a progressive Doctor. This one I have is not only terrible with TRT, my dad is having troubles with them everywhere from paperwork, to them not understanding that no pharmacy here has his pain pills (hydrocodone) in stock and may not for months down the road. So they wrote him another prescription for the same ****, Hydrocodone. Then they dispute his claims that the other stuff they put him on is affecting his memory. How could they be so sure?
When I was saying "my mood has been what a normal person would probably feel, after the real possibility of my aunt dying any second" you thought I was talking about Normal testosterone levels. No, I was talking about my mood and attitude. Which has changed COMPLETELY in the last 2 weeks.
I understand you don't EXPECT a 19 year old to know these things but you must remember, FACTS are FACTS regardless of who says them. For example stating "I'm a doctor, I know that test injections should be 200mg every other week" is an obvious indication of fallacy by status..
You said that I caused all of these problems with a mild cycle of 4 weeks with proper PCT? No, sir. I felt like ****, had ED, suicidal depression, anxiety, no confidence, aggression, I could go on. But lets put 2 and 2 together.. I felt TERRIBLE before I even touched any hormonals. Then since TRT, ALL of these things have been approving to an amazing degree. Correlation does not apply causation, yes we both know this, but it is logical. But its also a FACT that i am feeling better.
First, I did a cycle of 4 weeks, epi 40mg a day, 200mg T cyp once a week.
Then, I ended the cycle, and hopped on Nolva at 40mg/day. I did a proper PCT. I did take tribulus, 10,000 iu vitamin D (just got my labs, Vit D was perfect, right in the middle of the line. Also took zinc, magnesium, ate a high fat diet with healthy fats,tons of olive oil. Also mucuna for the L dopa to lower prolactin and stimulate LH.
I realize you just hopped on this thread Zig, but I believe when you say things like "you're doing this on your own, thinking you're doing everything right, and not understanding that changing one hormone or neurochemical has downstream effects"
Zig, did you read the post because I put reference ranges and my levels. Calling 47 T level, suicidal depression and anxiety as normal is very concerning. Normal is only determined through comparison to other things of the same basis. For example, 10 foot tall would not be normal compared to a normal 5'10" male.
Sir, I must respectfully say that you are wrong. I read studies, rarely going arbitrary advice on forums ect. I spend all day at the computer researching things from the liver and enzymes, gut health, diet and supplementation, endocrinology, psychology, I could keep going but its taking up too much of my post. I DO understand the way many things work in regards to these subjects. Remember, I'm going into the medical field, I'm not just reading arbitrary statements by people who MAY or MAY NOT understand the basis of something. I am supremely dedicated to learn about the entire body. And the things you said about how I said "it could be insulin resistence, ect" was based on real LABS. Not speculation regarding subjective feelings and symptoms. And I say it "could be" because it's logical to be openminded about possiblities. Much better than me just saying "Oh yeah, I have insulin resistence" I'd rather be unsure and openminded than be certain about something that is incorrect. I call myself 'Factsmachine' because I am only concerned with the facts. And the fact is I know it's better to know something for sure before you just say "yeah that's the problem, now lets ignore all of the other possiblities"
Also, I pointed out that I had felt these things that were directly related with my testosterone levels BEFORE I chose to cycle, The cycle made them worse, of course due to the nature of endogenous suppression of hormones. Buddy, don't take that stand that you understand me completely. That to me is blatant disrespect. You may apologize, or admit your faults regarding these arbitrary and prejudice remarks.
Therapy, yes I need it. And I previously stated that "I'd rather be a heroin addict than feel like killing myself everyday." Sir, I have no problem with putting exogenous substances in my body in order to feel "normal". I was doing tons of drugs before I got on T therapy and Klonopin for my social panic (low dose klonpin prescribed for everyday, I take it as needed, every other day or before a social interaction that is in my perception stressful. I need to change my patterns before I even think about dropping my klonopin. Kpin is meant to be used for me as a how do i say it... A catalyst for change, not a solution. The changes come just like CBT. The klonopin is helping me socialize and get out of social isolation. I don't take it and expect it to fix everything, it is a stepping stone for my recovery.
Don't lead the beat the dead horse train, Scherbs. I said I am feeling better, so saying that "messing" with my hormones won't make me feel better. Well. I am. This emotionally charged authority figure banter is not helping my condition. I'm getting my needs checked off on the list to recovery, don't dispute me because obviously, it's helping.
Really, if you guys haven't been in my shoes then how could you make statements like "I'm messing up my body, stop with the hormones, talk to a healthcare provider." when I did, and he doesn't even understand many of the basic things regarding me.
This is not a pissing contest, this is an oppurtunity for education on both sides. Take advantage of it guys, just scolding me for wanting to get better by being experimental doesn't change anything or help my recovery.
Hello? I'm not suicidal, I'm enjoying life again. Stop telling me everything I'm doing is wrong. Rather, help me and we can make progress and learn things together. I'm wondering why your perspective, Zig is the way it is. I want to try to understand why you think these things. Your speculations, and my cross analysis would allow for more learning.
One more thing. I had labs done yesterday, I got my E2 level today, but I'll wait till tomorrow when I should get the Free T, Total T, and possibly the DHT labs so we can stay more organized. However i will say this, Even with dosing my axiron properly (it was 3 weeks into it when I got the labs done) and using AI's, my levels were still above optimal. Maybe I feel better with higher E2, maybe I'll feel better with lower E2. TRT is not a quick fix all, and it takes adjusting to find each individuals "sweet spot"
I'd like for this post to give more insight to myself, and everybody else. Thank you again, brothers.
Jiigzz
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You cycled prior to your labs, correct? This would shut you down like no tomorrow. Of course your T levels were so low. That is a blatant misjudgement on your part. I did not say 47 was normal but I very much doubt they were thst low pre cycle. You and only you made them that low before your blood test which produced a false outcome.
Second, you spoke to one doctor your clearly not happy with. Why then didnt you change doctors? Seems the most obvious step forward, no?
Thirdly, in no way shape or form did I disrespect you. So no apology is needed on my behalf. You may disregard my advice but you stringing technical terms together does not make you knowledgable, it just means you know big words. If this is helping you, then by all means continue. Its not my concern. But for your long term health and well being my advice to seek a new doctor/ endo and a councellor stand.
Its also important to note that increased T, regardless of initial value, will improve almost anyones mood. You can search testosterone and mood and youll see a lot of threads people claiming the same. This doesnt mean, however, that their levels were initially low.
Edit: im not judging at all fyi. If you like the route you are taking then go for it. You know you better than we do. You posted on a message board and asked for opinions. I gave mine. That is all.
factsmachine
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I did cycle prior to labs. I also said that I felt worse after the cycle. But had the same symptoms prior to the cycle. Have you ever thought that my T level was really low for my age, and hormones were off, and that doing a cycle actually guaranteed that I would receive treatment? Because say, everything was at the very bottom of the range or right below it before, I sealed my fate and now I'm recovering. I have no regrets from cycling. If anything I've learned from my mistakes, and gained valuable insight.
I've seen the Doctor twice, we just started. Already looking for other docs. I am proactive and searching for better docs, obvious step forward, yes.
Some of your advice was factual and valid, however a lot of it was misjudgement. I can understand your perspective, I think most 19 year olds are stupid as well, so naturally a man such as yourself who is very opinionated would choose to judge me by my age rather than other factors and the knowledge I have.
Stringing technical terms together doesn't make one smart, this is how I naturally talk. If I were to dumb it down for you, that would be a form of belittling. I thought since we're both men and atleast one of us has a good understanding of the topic that we could speak in terms that make sense and provide more important details.
Go ahead, check me on my mistakes and flaws. This provides greater insight, which you can obviously tell this is my main motive for going on this board.
Talk to me like you would a man your age. We will be on common ground at that point.
If you feel no apology is needed, and that everything you say still stands.
Then well, let's backtrack, "I never disrespected or judged you in any way" of course you judged, that's how we navigate through life. And disrespect is all in perception, and me saying "saying that I don't know what I'm talking about. Using technical terms doesn't mean you understand. And talking about things that are most likely beyond your understand" Those are all judgements, and in objective way they are just that. I could choose to not care, or I could acknowledge that you are still treating me like you would a kid that acts like he always knows what he's talking about without doing much research. Far from the truth, my friend. I don't know everything, I'm not always right. But the point is I try to understand, and put wholehearted effort into countless hours into every single day to gain knowledge. So don't belittle my efforts.
You are right in the sense that I need an endo, good doctor, and a therapist. Those are coming up, rome wasn't built in a day.
scherbs
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OP:
I too am not judging, but before you dismiss me as an "emotionally charged authority figure", realize that I know EXACTLY what the f*&k I am talking about as someone who struggled with and survived an eating disorder and a host of other sh!t when I was your age.
Due to the poor decisions I made back then--the biggest one being that I didn't seek the help I needed until it was almost too late--I did a very good job of screwing my body up to the point where I am on TRT at the all too young age of 34,
Glad you are feeling better but I hope that you are putting a priority on healing your mental health over and above your manipulation of your hormones. I truly hope that I am wrong here, but if you ignore or deprioritize the treatment of your mental health, you will be simply re-arranging the chairs on a ship with a seriously compromised hull.
Please take my advice from the place where I intend it: I am not preaching. . .I am just hoping that you don't make the same mistakes I did.
God be with you
Jiigzz
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I understand what you are saying, but understand this: you dont know, and still dont know, what is the cause of your emotions. You assumed it was low T and medicated as such - despite you feeling better, it does not mean that low T was the cause, but rather higher T may just be masking the underlying problem. You are speculating, pure and simple. Low T may well have been your issue but now you wont know for certain. In any case, the T may be overriding the real issue.
The thing is, you are free to do as you like - but understand your limitations. A lot of people try practice outside what they actually understand; in my field, I see people commonly suggest advice that is counter intuitive for recovery or for enhanced performance. They think they understand but the issue is often more complex than what they think.
If it works, cool go ahead. Thats all. Goodluck
factsmachine
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Congratulations on getting through your disorders and problems!
I am definitely putting my mental health number one. Many of my problems are due to other people abusing me, and my attitude changed accordingly. I am skeptical as hell of 90% of people because my brain changed my patterns to People=danger, panic,abuse, ulterior motives and causing pain. So now I am trying to shift back towards empathy and connection. I had tried for a while before I got these new meds, failed and dug my own grave much deeper. and now I feel the strength and courage to change my patterns, and climb out of this nifty grave I dug for the last few years.
Speculations come in the form of insight and ideas. They are a stepping stone towards true understanding. Had I never speculated that I had low T, or anxiety, I would have never crossed the bridge to go see a doctor.
I believe in exploring new things, tradition destroys room for growth. Growth is a priority.
I appreciate your advice, sir.
Yolked
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The other thing you fail to include is your opiate addiction. Which will shutdown T. As well as shutdown from whatever hormones you messed with. Peptides etc... which you talk about on other posts like you're a different person with different issues hardly letting on about the other issues. Before you start any hormone treatment you gotta be at homeostasis for 3 months. ATLEAST. I believe you have major psychological issues that will just get worse without treatment BEFORE anything else. Learn to accept and cope. You're a recovering addict before anything else. You really are asking for trouble with trt at your age.
factsmachine
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So, the same approach as before eh? Fail to include? It's in my posts. Other issues? I don't conside testosterone and mental issues to be related to patellar tendonitis. Different person? Lol, no.
Cite me studies, references, articles that show that 3 months is clear cut before starting hormonal treatment. Show me data that says that MT2 and GHRP shut down testosterone production.
Learn to accept and cope? Buddy you're a little behind. We've already discussed this. And major psychological issues getting worse? I don't think you saw my previous posts.. I am getting better in all aspects. Sure I had a drug craving, and transient anxiety today, and I have easy access to hydromorphone. I took half of a kpin and continued my day.
Issues are slowly subsiding, patterns take times to undo. But the more I focus on how depressed and how anxious I am, the worse I will get. This is subjective and differs from person to person, but with myself I find it to be especially true. My living conditions are ****ty, but they can not be changed. I can't change anybody but myself and the way I respond to outside stressors.
Cite me studies, references, articles that show that 3 months is clear cut before starting hormonal treatment. Show me data that says that MT2 and GHRP shut down testosterone production.
Learn to accept and cope? Buddy you're a little behind. We've already discussed this. And major psychological issues getting worse? I don't think you saw my previous posts.. I am getting better in all aspects. Sure I had a drug craving, and transient anxiety today, and I have easy access to hydromorphone. I took half of a kpin and continued my day.
Issues are slowly subsiding, patterns take times to undo. But the more I focus on how depressed and how anxious I am, the worse I will get. This is subjective and differs from person to person, but with myself I find it to be especially true. My living conditions are ****ty, but they can not be changed. I can't change anybody but myself and the way I respond to outside stressors.
Yolked
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You're less than a month out of opiate dependency... you haven't let ANYTHING come back to homeostasis. Nor have you dealt with the issues that caused that. You think you're in the clear of that? And HRT will take those feelings away? No way.. I have been apprehensivly supportive of your decisions but I'm really starting to see you have deep issues that are going to be a long term battle for you, and are not going to be fixed with hrt. You think you can just take a shot and everything will be ok? HRT is an ongoing treatment with things changing constantly and needing to deal with ups and downs along the way. Very few have it easy and don't need careful attention and constant monitoring and fairly frequnt adjustments before finding the sweet spot and usually at some point will need another adjustment.. 800tt is a high end number very few naturally have no matter WHAT AGE... youth just means you're at your peak and not all guys peaks are that hi. This obsession with the numbers tells me alot about your thought process... it's not about the numbers. It's about how you feel. You're not an alpha type and you can't become one thru chemicals. Cope, accept and deal. And yes age has EVERYTHING to do with your knowledge and wisdom, there will ALWAYS be someone older with more knowledge experience and wisdom. That's just life... deal with it. You have soo much more to learn and you think you have it figured out. You may feel better short term, right now, but long term that will wear off when you find things aren't all they are cracked up to be just because you have muscles and a working penis... WAAY more to life than that. Nothing that lasts is an overnight fix, it's short term and not addressing the deep issues that really have you messed up.
factsmachine
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you really are getting ffurther and further away from the point aren't you? I'm not even going to address any of your "points", they've just gone further outside of logical reasoning than before. hahaha.
thanks, yolked.
thanks, yolked.
Yolked
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Nope. There's your immaturity showing right there. ..
Yolked
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Some wet behind the ears know it all kid... you think because you read a lot you know what's up... ALOT TO LEARN
Yolked
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These guys giving you advice aren't doing it for their health. And you want to act like you know better. Good luck with an attitude like that. Won't address the hard truths I speak of.
Yolked
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You went through puberty. You got pubic hair and your voice changed and your nuts dropped? if you truly had hormone issues they would've probably showed themselves. You probably created a worse problem than it was and now want the quick fix..
factsmachine
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Your posts shifted from figuring things out and providing helpful advice to personal attacks and "you don't know it all kid"
I'll make this simple and easy for you so that you can understand it.
PATTERNS TAKE TIME TO UNDO. I AM NOT IN THE CLEAR. I AM FEELING BETTER HOWEVER MY PATTERNS HAVEN'T UNDONE THEMSELVES IN ONE DAY.
Numbers matter less than attitude. I stated that it's preferred to have higher T. TRT is not a miracle fix-all cure. And it doesn't happen overnight. I say that I am working on my issues and you attack me with all this BS. I wonder where you got hurt, where you felt you had to personally attack me in order to make up for something? You have been through similar issues I know, is this bringing up some past issues for you? That's not my intentions, we are here to help, give advice and learn from each other.
You continually say there are deep issues. Causing all of my problems. Now let's see:
As a kid, parents divorced, mom never paid attention to me. I was an intellectual outlier to normal kids. Have had anger to the point of violence since about 8 years old. Lost all my friends because my mom switched my schools. I worked hard to get back to my old school and all my friends weren't there for me anymore. I met new friends, had girls all around me, everybody wanted to be around me. Then after i found drugs at 14 and was locked up i lost them all. Then I finally found 2 "real" friends. One started a fight with me and he never spoke to me again. I have been low level depressed on and off for about 6 years. Then from 17-19 major depression social anxiety and suicidal ideation.
I am afraid of aabandonment, afraid of people hurting me due to the past. I raised myself. I don't allow myself to feel empathy for other people because I hate them all.
I understand my issues. Think I know it all? No, if I knew it all then I would have this all fixed. But personally attacking me and saying you're not an alpha and never will be, attacking my personality and masculinity will only be met with resistence. And if older people have more knowledge, why don't you understand the precious sentence? Shouldn't you "know" because you're older? Drop the age BS. It's not true. Correlation doesn't imply causation.
I'll make this simple and easy for you so that you can understand it.
PATTERNS TAKE TIME TO UNDO. I AM NOT IN THE CLEAR. I AM FEELING BETTER HOWEVER MY PATTERNS HAVEN'T UNDONE THEMSELVES IN ONE DAY.
Numbers matter less than attitude. I stated that it's preferred to have higher T. TRT is not a miracle fix-all cure. And it doesn't happen overnight. I say that I am working on my issues and you attack me with all this BS. I wonder where you got hurt, where you felt you had to personally attack me in order to make up for something? You have been through similar issues I know, is this bringing up some past issues for you? That's not my intentions, we are here to help, give advice and learn from each other.
You continually say there are deep issues. Causing all of my problems. Now let's see:
As a kid, parents divorced, mom never paid attention to me. I was an intellectual outlier to normal kids. Have had anger to the point of violence since about 8 years old. Lost all my friends because my mom switched my schools. I worked hard to get back to my old school and all my friends weren't there for me anymore. I met new friends, had girls all around me, everybody wanted to be around me. Then after i found drugs at 14 and was locked up i lost them all. Then I finally found 2 "real" friends. One started a fight with me and he never spoke to me again. I have been low level depressed on and off for about 6 years. Then from 17-19 major depression social anxiety and suicidal ideation.
I am afraid of aabandonment, afraid of people hurting me due to the past. I raised myself. I don't allow myself to feel empathy for other people because I hate them all.
I understand my issues. Think I know it all? No, if I knew it all then I would have this all fixed. But personally attacking me and saying you're not an alpha and never will be, attacking my personality and masculinity will only be met with resistence. And if older people have more knowledge, why don't you understand the precious sentence? Shouldn't you "know" because you're older? Drop the age BS. It's not true. Correlation doesn't imply causation.
factsmachine
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Now, if you'll excuse me I'm going to snort some hydromorphone. Because according to you, these problems will take forever to figure out and I can't just try to start fresh.
No, **** that. I'm going to the gym. I have a good start, I'm going to stay with it. Not even gonna take my anxiety pill.
No, **** that. I'm going to the gym. I have a good start, I'm going to stay with it. Not even gonna take my anxiety pill.
Jiigzz
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Would attach but on phone but seemed relevant to thread: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B0z976CCAAAZqC8.jpg
Yolked
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The thing is I sat back and watched how you reacted and it's kinda hasty, like trying to do too much at one time. Which is asking for trouble. Overwhelm yourself and you'll probably take backwards steps. It almost seemed like you did all this stuff to sabotage your hormone levels to justify hrt.. and who really knows what peptides side effects are... they're experimental drugs after all. No personal attacks just being blunt. You're not going to turn into something you're not from hrt. Life is nasty and will bite when least expecting. No past issues for me. I didn't have "low T" issues when I was 19 and only after old age, stressed out from job, drug's, spine surgery, not enough sleep, etc did I have hormone issues... but I've moved on, I'm like a different person with a different way of life. And not because of hrt or something I have to take. Learned to cope with my issues with help from counseling and made major changes and stabilized my world first. No chemicals for many months. Several years at same good job and built myself up emotionally. You're not learning to do that and are leaning on chemicals for that. Not good message for a recovering addict. And here you are conforming what I'm saying about deep issues? And you're using chemicals to cope with this not on your own.. so you use trt to get through this and then what? You stay on for life? How you gonna cope without it? you're a different person with and without. It changes the way you view things and your reactions. You learn how to cope without it and you will always be able to cope without it.. life skillz Without the chemicals or the very minimal medication and not hormones till you're at homeostasis for longer time.. what have you done to boost natural levels? I haven't seen any of your post seeking information to boost natty levels I understand the use of the klonopin and you're going about it right using for flare ups avoiding daily use as much as possible... that 47tt result is after opiate detox while still having some acute withdrawal issues for up to several weeks... chronic issues like depression are sure to follow... It's funny how younger people are only ones who think age doesn't matter as far a knowledge and wisdom. Like life experiences count for nothing when they're probably more important than anything you can read on a monitor. It's a fact you haven't been clean for more than a month. That's not enough time for homeostasis. It's all very rushed. Precious sentence? Yeah poor you...
factsmachine
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I'm seeking to learn more, you guys know about things I don't and I know about things you guys dont. I did feel good, I actually met people for a change and mamade friends, got some numbers. To me, this is more important than TRT, Klonopin, forums, or anything.
I live an an anhedonic life and I haven't had "real pleasure" in so long I have no idea what people do for fun. So far my activities are walking, jogging (knee is starting to get better woo!), internet, gym, sleep. That's my life. I don't know what to do to seek out fun. Nothing really seems fun? But I know I need to get out there and do SOMETHING.
It's hard to meet people in a new town. I'm honestly clueless where to go.
As far as t levels go I read and tried so many different things. I ate lots of monounsaturated fats especially olive oil. Nuts, bacon, chicken, beef, greens, eggs, oatmeal. Supplements I tried tribulus, ashwagandha, boron, t boosting sups. Fenugreek gave me some libido. But my E.D was so bad even before my cycle I was unable to get an erection. Even tried cialis, didn't work.
Factors influencing my T (positive and negative)
Low perceived social status. This can influence gnrh, as it can be regulated by social dominance.
depression for years and anxiety.
High fat diet (the testosterone diet)
Herbs (none of which worked)
Erase armistane (improvement)
I already have about 10% bf
opiate addiction and withdrawl. I had quit opiates approx 2 weeks before my blood test and was taking Nolvadex. Hadn't taken any peptides in at least a month before the blood test.
tried mucuna extract, that boosted my libido but it made my emotions really extreme.
My intentions weren't to get on TRT. I just mentioned that the cycle probably sealed the deal to get me a rx, so in hindsight it was a good idea.
Currently, I have been on axiron 2 pumps a day as rxed, for aprox 3 weeks. My nipples quickly got really sensitive and I took erase because my doc didn't want to even test my E2 and definitely wouldn't prescribe me AI's. (Or HCG). Even with erase I came out with estrogen levels of 37 on my blood test 3 days ago. And it felt like they were lower than usual to me, I had much less bloating in certain areas (no diet changes).
Current goals: get back in the gym 4 days in the week.
find better Dr willing to prescribe AI and HCG as needed. Also willing to actually give me a proper hormone panel.
My current doc said he doesn't care how my levels got so low, he said he's giving me T to see if the symptoms improved. I questioned this and asked for an Endo refferal. He simply said no.
Find a hobby, meet people, get into college and take a social skills/leadership/communication course along with core classes.
Get food stamps so I can eat better. My family hardly ever buys groceries.
get a job.
Take care of my grandma, help my dad (he's going through a lot of what I am as well. Although not as bad.)
Change social patterns and learn to trust.
A good start
I live an an anhedonic life and I haven't had "real pleasure" in so long I have no idea what people do for fun. So far my activities are walking, jogging (knee is starting to get better woo!), internet, gym, sleep. That's my life. I don't know what to do to seek out fun. Nothing really seems fun? But I know I need to get out there and do SOMETHING.
It's hard to meet people in a new town. I'm honestly clueless where to go.
As far as t levels go I read and tried so many different things. I ate lots of monounsaturated fats especially olive oil. Nuts, bacon, chicken, beef, greens, eggs, oatmeal. Supplements I tried tribulus, ashwagandha, boron, t boosting sups. Fenugreek gave me some libido. But my E.D was so bad even before my cycle I was unable to get an erection. Even tried cialis, didn't work.
Factors influencing my T (positive and negative)
Low perceived social status. This can influence gnrh, as it can be regulated by social dominance.
depression for years and anxiety.
High fat diet (the testosterone diet)
Herbs (none of which worked)
Erase armistane (improvement)
I already have about 10% bf
opiate addiction and withdrawl. I had quit opiates approx 2 weeks before my blood test and was taking Nolvadex. Hadn't taken any peptides in at least a month before the blood test.
tried mucuna extract, that boosted my libido but it made my emotions really extreme.
My intentions weren't to get on TRT. I just mentioned that the cycle probably sealed the deal to get me a rx, so in hindsight it was a good idea.
Currently, I have been on axiron 2 pumps a day as rxed, for aprox 3 weeks. My nipples quickly got really sensitive and I took erase because my doc didn't want to even test my E2 and definitely wouldn't prescribe me AI's. (Or HCG). Even with erase I came out with estrogen levels of 37 on my blood test 3 days ago. And it felt like they were lower than usual to me, I had much less bloating in certain areas (no diet changes).
Current goals: get back in the gym 4 days in the week.
find better Dr willing to prescribe AI and HCG as needed. Also willing to actually give me a proper hormone panel.
My current doc said he doesn't care how my levels got so low, he said he's giving me T to see if the symptoms improved. I questioned this and asked for an Endo refferal. He simply said no.
Find a hobby, meet people, get into college and take a social skills/leadership/communication course along with core classes.
Get food stamps so I can eat better. My family hardly ever buys groceries.
get a job.
Take care of my grandma, help my dad (he's going through a lot of what I am as well. Although not as bad.)
Change social patterns and learn to trust.
A good start
Yolked
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The "no fun" thing is long term opiate withdrawal. Gets better with time. The need to hurry up and fix it is not a good approach. 2 weeks after detox isn't enough time for anything to return to normal.
factsmachine
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I've tried meditation, it made my heart race. I can only do it on klonopin. Exercise helps a ton. What else helps the post acute withdrawl syndrme?
Yolked
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This stuff takes time and overnight fixes get overnight results that won't last. Permanent longterm results come from blood sweat and tears... you seem prone to aromatization which elevates estro, contributes to ED and depression... longterm. You should get a short term boost but if levels too high, just gonna cause problems. You need longterm permanent fixes. So if you feel better on test then trt? You start taking Test for longterm now and you'll never restore natty levels. It just gets harder the further you go. I'd exhaust EVERY Avenue possible to boost T levels. Which I don't think you have.. you have done some but didn't mention more than a few things. And if opiate use has been happening simultaneously then you don't really know results you could've had. You gotta put in some time working these remedies and combinations.
factsmachine
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It's too early to say. But I'm considering staying on TRT until I feel like I have changed my patterns, gotten through the opiate withdrawl, not needing klonopin, have a good social group.
Then I'll look around for the proper way to come off. After that, an AI a few times a week could keep my T levels at a good range. Numbers aren't that important to me once I'm strong and stable. But I need to have a higher T level than I did before my cycle, as it obviously wasn't sufficient.
Ergo log has a study that shows one letrozole pill a week quadroupled natural T. The study involved older men, but it could do me good. I'll cross that bridge when I get there. Atleast I have a libido now, my ED is getting better. I feel slightly more motivated than before. And my strength is actually going up consistently. Went from 2 wide grip pull ups pre cycle, to 6 on cycle. Then with TRT I'm at 20. Just added a plate today and hit 5.
It'll be weeks or even months till I get full benefits though, correct? What took the longest for you to improve, Yolked?
Then I'll look around for the proper way to come off. After that, an AI a few times a week could keep my T levels at a good range. Numbers aren't that important to me once I'm strong and stable. But I need to have a higher T level than I did before my cycle, as it obviously wasn't sufficient.
Ergo log has a study that shows one letrozole pill a week quadroupled natural T. The study involved older men, but it could do me good. I'll cross that bridge when I get there. Atleast I have a libido now, my ED is getting better. I feel slightly more motivated than before. And my strength is actually going up consistently. Went from 2 wide grip pull ups pre cycle, to 6 on cycle. Then with TRT I'm at 20. Just added a plate today and hit 5.
It'll be weeks or even months till I get full benefits though, correct? What took the longest for you to improve, Yolked?
Jiigzz
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Good stuff man, nice to hear things are progressing well so far. It does seem like you are going through a lot, especially for someone your age so just keep at it.I'm seeking to learn more, you guys know about things I don't and I know about things you guys dont. I did feel good, I actually met people for a change and mamade friends, got some numbers. To me, this is more important than TRT, Klonopin, forums, or anything.
I live an an anhedonic life and I haven't had "real pleasure" in so long I have no idea what people do for fun. So far my activities are walking, jogging (knee is starting to get better woo!), internet, gym, sleep. That's my life. I don't know what to do to seek out fun. Nothing really seems fun? But I know I need to get out there and do SOMETHING.
It's hard to meet people in a new town. I'm honestly clueless where to go.
As far as t levels go I read and tried so many different things. I ate lots of monounsaturated fats especially olive oil. Nuts, bacon, chicken, beef, greens, eggs, oatmeal. Supplements I tried tribulus, ashwagandha, boron, t boosting sups. Fenugreek gave me some libido. But my E.D was so bad even before my cycle I was unable to get an erection. Even tried cialis, didn't work.
Factors influencing my T (positive and negative)
Low perceived social status. This can influence gnrh, as it can be regulated by social dominance.
depression for years and anxiety.
High fat diet (the testosterone diet)
Herbs (none of which worked)
Erase armistane (improvement)
I already have about 10% bf
opiate addiction and withdrawl. I had quit opiates approx 2 weeks before my blood test and was taking Nolvadex. Hadn't taken any peptides in at least a month before the blood test.
tried mucuna extract, that boosted my libido but it made my emotions really extreme.
My intentions weren't to get on TRT. I just mentioned that the cycle probably sealed the deal to get me a rx, so in hindsight it was a good idea.
Currently, I have been on axiron 2 pumps a day as rxed, for aprox 3 weeks. My nipples quickly got really sensitive and I took erase because my doc didn't want to even test my E2 and definitely wouldn't prescribe me AI's. (Or HCG). Even with erase I came out with estrogen levels of 37 on my blood test 3 days ago. And it felt like they were lower than usual to me, I had much less bloating in certain areas (no diet changes).
Current goals: get back in the gym 4 days in the week.
find better Dr willing to prescribe AI and HCG as needed. Also willing to actually give me a proper hormone panel.
My current doc said he doesn't care how my levels got so low, he said he's giving me T to see if the symptoms improved. I questioned this and asked for an Endo refferal. He simply said no.
Find a hobby, meet people, get into college and take a social skills/leadership/communication course along with core classes.
Get food stamps so I can eat better. My family hardly ever buys groceries.
get a job.
Take care of my grandma, help my dad (he's going through a lot of what I am as well. Although not as bad.)
Change social patterns and learn to trust.
A good start
The reason I questioned what you know is not to s*** on you, but rather open your eyes to something beyond what you are basing all this on. A lot of the symptoms of Low T can also be due to a host of other things and I just want to make you aware of that.
Its like how people **** on Docs for misdiagnosing but forget that they rely on how accurately and to the extent in which you discuss your symptoms. So if you have ass your explanation or if what you are describing is very broad (I.e I have a sore throat) then chances are those symptoms outline half a billion possible illnesses. Thats why its best to find a doctor who is willing to walk through treatment with you and help you identify what exactly is going on to help you in the long run.
Hope it all works out for you
factsmachine
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I was about to unsubscribe and leave the board. Antagonists don't help in the current situation. I don't expect you guys to be therapists. That's why I'm going to see one.
I need more support like this. I can't find it I most places, but life is like that. Nobody will be there to support you always. I must be self sufficient and learn.
Jiigzz, I can see from your point of view. I agree that 90% of all people my age aren't self aware, don't have an understanding of much but that they see themselves as "the best thing that ever happened".
That's why I don't like people my age. I like humble well rounded intelligent people. I rarely find that. But I also must learn to be tolerant and adapt to different types of people.
Although you could have made your point in a better way, I know it's easier to just tell somebody, "hey buddy, you don't know ****". I'm an outlier for sure, I don't try to be arrogant or know it all. I'll find a way to express my knowledge in a way that seems humbler, or more like I don't have all the answers. I put a great deal of time into reading research papers and I have a good self esteem of my intellect. So it doesn't feel good when somebody discredits hard work.
I'll stick around on the boards. But I shouldn't rely so much on other people.
What I'm going through isn't easy by any means, my past experiences give me knowledge and insight that most people my age don't have. So in this respect, yolked, age does play a part. But I wouldn't say that every adult is knowledgeable. Experience is valuable. Now I'm going outside to experience the world.
I need more support like this. I can't find it I most places, but life is like that. Nobody will be there to support you always. I must be self sufficient and learn.
Jiigzz, I can see from your point of view. I agree that 90% of all people my age aren't self aware, don't have an understanding of much but that they see themselves as "the best thing that ever happened".
That's why I don't like people my age. I like humble well rounded intelligent people. I rarely find that. But I also must learn to be tolerant and adapt to different types of people.
Although you could have made your point in a better way, I know it's easier to just tell somebody, "hey buddy, you don't know ****". I'm an outlier for sure, I don't try to be arrogant or know it all. I'll find a way to express my knowledge in a way that seems humbler, or more like I don't have all the answers. I put a great deal of time into reading research papers and I have a good self esteem of my intellect. So it doesn't feel good when somebody discredits hard work.
I'll stick around on the boards. But I shouldn't rely so much on other people.
What I'm going through isn't easy by any means, my past experiences give me knowledge and insight that most people my age don't have. So in this respect, yolked, age does play a part. But I wouldn't say that every adult is knowledgeable. Experience is valuable. Now I'm going outside to experience the world.
Jiigzz
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Agreed and I apologise if I came across that way. After a long time on these boards sometimes I forget these are real people with real issues, so for that I apologise.
Keep us updated and ill do my best to help where I can. If you want to chat through PM then we can do that as well.
factsmachine
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I do agree brotha. I know how it is. I'll pm you if I need some help.
I called my doc because I've had frequent stomach pain and diarrhea. Low appetite, and when I eat it hurts pretty bad. They said to go to the urgent care. So here I am, omw to see what's going on with my stomach.
I was 160 2 months ago, I was 142 today weighed at the gym. My appetite has been terrible. Hopefully they figure this out. I'm letting the doctor take control of this one. No nausea, just diarrhea and stomach pain.
They asked me about testicular pain. I said yeah, persistent ache 24/7 and they're about 60% of normal size. Don't know why they asked that.
I called my doc because I've had frequent stomach pain and diarrhea. Low appetite, and when I eat it hurts pretty bad. They said to go to the urgent care. So here I am, omw to see what's going on with my stomach.
I was 160 2 months ago, I was 142 today weighed at the gym. My appetite has been terrible. Hopefully they figure this out. I'm letting the doctor take control of this one. No nausea, just diarrhea and stomach pain.
They asked me about testicular pain. I said yeah, persistent ache 24/7 and they're about 60% of normal size. Don't know why they asked that.
Jiigzz
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Dont overthink anything as that may work you up. They will have shrunk due to the TRT - test downregulates LH and so your testes will no longer be producing test, hence the size. Thats normal. hCG mimics LH so that the testes maintain fullness.
Not sure what the stomach pain could be due to as it could be any number of things
factsmachine
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Yeah, I'll have to order it online. My dad still wants me to stick with this doctor. So I'll probably have E2 issues with the HCG.
factsmachine
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Got all the way to the urgent care and dad doesn't want to pay the copay he's not responsive. In his own world, he doesn't listen anymore.
I'll just treat myself with prilosec otc. Hopefully it gets better. I'm getting a job, moving out ASAP. Maybe the deck will be stacked in my favor then. Or maybe my pathetic parents paved the way for my problems with their genes. Whatever.
I just want to be happy and succeed, do good things for the world.
I'll just treat myself with prilosec otc. Hopefully it gets better. I'm getting a job, moving out ASAP. Maybe the deck will be stacked in my favor then. Or maybe my pathetic parents paved the way for my problems with their genes. Whatever.
I just want to be happy and succeed, do good things for the world.
factsmachine
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That's a bro right there. Stay on my thread, I'll try to pm you tomorrow when I wake up.
You sound like you know how I can get through this and gain the mental benefits of those substances then going on a slow taper.
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INPUT: What Is Optimal TRT Dosage? This Says Lower...
- Started by JYD
- Replies: 7
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