first time test cyp user

[DJBeanPole]

thanks for the support!monday should be interesting.....do u think the fact that i had not eatin anythign played a factor, since i do IF style diet ?

Yes and no. The only reason I say no is because if you get bloodtested they tell you to fast prior to that and you are still puncturing a needle into your arm...

But for the yes side... at that point into your fast your are injecting a substance into yourself (not pulling something out like in donating blood) and your body is already on the sensitive side of things (insulin included) anyway so suddenly introducing something into your system when there really isn't much circulating to begin with is quite possibly a huge shock for it.

Just my .02.

 

[T-Bone]

Mkretz, you should talk to that guy "The Matrix" he knows a lot about this type of thing.

 

[superbeast668]

Yes and no. The only reason I say no is because if you get bloodtested they tell you to fast prior to that and you are still puncturing a needle into your arm...

But for the yes side... at that point into your fast your are injecting a substance into yourself (not pulling something out like in donating blood) and your body is already on the sensitive side of things (insulin included) anyway so suddenly introducing something into your system when there really isn't much circulating to begin with is quite possibly a huge shock for it.

Just my .02.

Agreed. Ive found it better to eat a little pre pin. Helps a little.

 

[mkretz]

ill make srue i eat somethin this time....i actually used to work with the matrix, he had me on gel for a while

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

ill make srue i eat somethin this time....i actually used to work with the matrix, he had me on gel for a while

how much gel per day did you take? and how much did it bring up your test?

 

[mkretz]

how much gel per day did you take? and how much did it bring up your test?

dont remember exactly, the max dose i think, got me in the 800s!

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

dont remember exactly, the max dose i think, got me in the 800s!

oh c'mon man, don't do me like that LOL....my script says 75 count of 2.5G androgel 1% for 30 days....but they gave me 30 count, Fin aholes....I'm going back tomorrow to tell them they gypped me....and they better not make like I'm a liar, been going there steady for my coreg for 8 years so they should trust me. maybe they left the extra bag in the pickup area? not sure. but I guess I would be averaging 6.25G a day? that is why I wanted to know so I could gauge the effectiveness of that type dosage, ~7G....

 

[mkretz]

i was taking the pump and doin around 10 a day i believe in order to get my leels around like 880 i think

 

[lboston]

i was taking the pump and doin around 10 a day i believe in order to get my leels around like 880 i think

Just curious--whyd you decide not to work with matrix?

 

[mkretz]

Just curious--whyd you decide not to work with matrix?

i actually worked wth him for a long time......he kinda just stopped answering me to tell you the truth, plus nothin was really getting better it seemed, i mean he made everythin sound great but there was always something mroe for me to buy and do and after liek a year it seemed liek nothing really had changed

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

Kretzy fired his azz you should fire your doctor too....I was gonna fire mine today, but his secretary had all the right answers so I will go along with the plan since it made sense, they are just being too careful wanting to slowly up the dosage month by month...thats cool though, I'm just gonna apply the gel to my balls and increase the absorption to the nth degree! LOL...

 

[mkretz]

i hear u there man, its a long procsess ive been goin through this for too long....and its only the beginning for me, and i cant fire my doc, i really got no where else to o.........

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

yeah its hard to fire doctors.....complicated....but I mean really....how the FCK am I gonna get "side effects" from a 2.5g gel packet once per day when its absorption is for shyt and I routinely have injected 400-700mg of test per week previously? and 2.5mg (probably) of test per day is gonna give me sides? c'mon man, I'm all for safety but damn thats called straight pus$yfooting around. HIT ME WITH THE 7.5 OR 10G PACKETS MAN!!!

 

[mkretz]

haha yea if i was ok with it u probably woudl be........i uess i shouldnt be too worried abotu sides if i didnt hae any from 10g per day of gel for a while and this is alot less than that.............i think

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

haha yea if i was ok with it u probably woudl be........i uess i shouldnt be too worried abotu sides if i didnt hae any from 10g per day of gel for a while and this is alot less than that.............i think

Are you on 100mg per week injections? if so it would be equivalent to 70mg-140mg of 10G androgel depending on absorption....should be a low of 10% and a high of maybe 20% at best depending on many factors....10G = 10mg per day of test at 10% absorption and 1% potency...so 7 days that is 70mg low/average figure, maybe upwards of 100mg or more if you got good absorption. So I'd say the 100mg injection is more similar than less potent in comparison to the 10G gel.

 

[SweetLou321]

Thanks man. I occasionally cycle PES erase just for comfort. Like your doc said, on that low of dose, needing a manzier isn't that likely....still, any educated guy on the subject still had a fear of ending up looking like Bob from Fight Club!

Do you use/ have you used DHEA ad well?

Im also using .25mg arimidex eod to eood. So no im not to worried. I do not react well to estrogen sides however. But 25mg is a low dose. Some research goes up to 200mg. Again topical is prefered. But im not the richest person.

 

[mkretz]

Are you on 100mg per week injections? if so it would be equivalent to 70mg-140mg of 10G androgel depending on absorption....should be a low of 10% and a high of maybe 20% at best depending on many factors....10G = 10mg per day of test at 10% absorption and 1% potency...so 7 days that is 70mg low/average figure, maybe upwards of 100mg or more if you got good absorption. So I'd say the 100mg injection is more similar than less potent in comparison to the 10G gel.

so it seems like this 100mgs per week may be good for me, im not gonna do anything for right now and jsut see how i react, i have bloods done again in a month, until then, my test will still be hiher than it was which i have to be happy about i uess

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

so it seems like this 100mgs per week may be good for me, im not gonna do anything for right now and jsut see how i react, i have bloods done again in a month, until then, my test will still be hiher than it was which i have to be happy about i uess

i'm willing to bet you'll be pleased with the 100mg injections....more consistent and reliable than the gel, you know exactly what you are injecting versus playing russian roulette with the gel absorption. once you get bloods done you will know for sure if you need to bump it up...problem is that the doctors idea of "ideal" test levels and your/my idea of ideal test levels? will be miles apart. They will probably deem 800's or 900's way too high and try to bump you down lol.

 

[mkretz]

yea he said he was shooting for liek 400-500, i want more dammit lol

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

yea he said he was shooting for liek 400-500, i want more dammit lol

350 is the top of low, bottom of normal range....so who the F would be satisfied with 400 and change is completely clueless. even the androgel packets shoot for 750-850 with the 10g packets and 600-650 with the 5g judging by the charts they include with the package insert. you should show him that and ask why he is shooting for almost half that much or 1/3 less. doesn't make sense, not like 700-800 test is gonna harm you, for a healthy male those levels can only help and make you healthier.

 

[lboston]

350 is the top of low, bottom of normal range....so who the F would be satisfied with 400 and change is completely clueless. even the androgel packets shoot for 750-850 with the 10g packets and 600-650 with the 5g judging by the charts they include with the package insert. you should show him that and ask why he is shooting for almost half that much or 1/3 less. doesn't make sense, not like 700-800 test is gonna harm you, for a healthy male those levels can only help and make you healthier.

I'm like you, I've had three if fervent doctors tell me that they like to get their patients to 450-500. Doesn't make sense to me. I started out on this biatch at 172, so that's way better than what I was, but @ 27 I want to be at the top of the scale.

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

I'm like you, I've had three if fervent doctors tell me that they like to get their patients to 450-500. Doesn't make sense to me. I started out on this biatch at 172, so that's way better than what I was, but @ 27 I want to be at the top of the scale.

yeah especially for you younger guys.....it just makes logical sense to be near top of the chart. For us guys 35 and older, especially in the 40's and 50's....we are trying to get into the 20's year old range of course which is not necessarily "normal" for our age.....so I can see the doctors potential argument there (still bullshyt but at least they have a leg to stand on with some sort of legit claim). I think they don't understand the whole concept of TRT, men want to get to the maximum levels (top 1/4 of the chart), as long as it does not interfere with their general health. if they can prove its interfering and causing some health issue, OK...if not then explain to me why I shouldn't be at "high" levels. I don't think they will have a legit answer to that question.

 

[mkretz]

yea, im 22....nothin abnormal about 800 test

 

[MrMarc]

Was reading these post yesterday lol haa you all are funny.

If I were you I would demand to see a endo. Doctor has no right to stop you from seeing a endo. I personally would sue the shizz out of them for prescribing such a low does and I would win that case to.

 

[lboston]

Thanks for sharing. I thought about working with him. What I can't understand is now he works with these doctors and has nearly no formal training in medicine. Seems like it would be a huge liability for the docs.

I'm also afraid it's nearly a sales scheme...

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

Was reading these post yesterday lol haa you all are funny.

If I were you I would demand to see a endo. Doctor has no right to stop you from seeing a endo. I personally would sue the shizz out of them for prescribing such a low does and I would win that case to.

they asked me "endo"??? when I mentioned it while inquiring about my low test number (they said "all clear" on the phone of course despite test score being marked low)...I had to ask for a copy of the results which they were more than happy to accommodate....then when I phoned them up for a referral to an endo they gave me the what for? spiel and said they do it out of the office there. so I inquired as to what methods they use etc...it was told to me either monthly shots of 100mg test (some do bi-weekly, both protocols are useless really though) and there are cases where they prescribe androgel. so I was like alright get back to me. call me back the next day and said I was not a candidate for shots since i was asymptomatic...so then we get the gel option of course...and low doses to assess tolerance of all things to add insult to injury (as if 2.5 G of 1% will harm me some way or give me sides). I'll play along if they bump me up eventually to 10G per week ...but if I encounter any more resistance I'm telling them refer me to an endo or I'm calling the cops...OK my lawyer LOL...

 

[lboston]

What do they mean by asymptotic?

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

What do they mean by asymptotic?

it means the opposite of symptomatic.....in other words you aren't showing any symptoms of the problem...in this case, lowered muscle mass, increased fat (esp estrogenic fat), lethargy, low sex drive/libido. I was not asked if I had any of these symptoms, yet going by my test result alone that should tell them there is a problem. but they never asked me if I had symptoms, and I did not complain about them....so they probably did a visual and said this guy is not having symptoms. I did not argue about it, i just said OK i'll try the gel. I'm willing to give anything a shot. I'll increase the absorption and take other things to potentiate the gel. I could have went off and told them I was never asked if I had these symptoms. as if you can visually tell if someone is lethargic or has low sex drive LMFAO.

 

[mkretz]

my doc is an endo :-(

 

[MrMarc]

it means the opposite of symptomatic.....in other words you aren't showing any symptoms of the problem...in this case, lowered muscle mass, increased fat (esp estrogenic fat), lethargy, low sex drive/libido. I was not asked if I had any of these symptoms, yet going by my test result alone that should tell them there is a problem. but they never asked me if I had symptoms, and I did not complain about them....so they probably did a visual and said this guy is not having symptoms. I did not argue about it, i just said OK i'll try the gel. I'm willing to give anything a shot. I'll increase the absorption and take other things to potentiate the gel. I could have went off and told them I was never asked if I had these symptoms. as if you can visually tell if someone is lethargic or has low sex drive LMFAO.

Why don't you buy your own test lol?

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

my doc is an endo :-(

this is sad......

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

Why don't you buy your own test lol?

yeah good question ....hadn't been in the test game for a number of years so I guess I just haven't looked around for it.....

 

[lboston]

it means the opposite of symptomatic.....in other words you aren't showing any symptoms of the problem...in this case, lowered muscle mass, increased fat (esp estrogenic fat), lethargy, low sex drive/libido. I was not asked if I had any of these symptoms, yet going by my test result alone that should tell them there is a problem. but they never asked me if I had symptoms, and I did not complain about them....so they probably did a visual and said this guy is not having symptoms. I did not argue about it, i just said OK i'll try the gel. I'm willing to give anything a shot. I'll increase the absorption and take other things to potentiate the gel. I could have went off and told them I was never asked if I had these symptoms. as if you can visually tell if someone is lethargic or has low sex drive LMFAO.

Lol-knew that's what it meant. I should have asked why they'd assume that. Horner, the endo I saw one time did the same thing. Told me I'm obviously muscular, have facial hair and strong, so....taken a multi vitamin for more energy. Needless to say I never went to the follow up!

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

Lol-knew that's what it meant. I should have asked why they'd assume that. Horner, the endo I saw one time did the same thing. Told me I'm obviously muscular, have facial hair and strong, so....taken a multi vitamin for more energy. Needless to say I never went to the follow up!

if you have any sort of decent muscle on you and are not fat, forget about it. You're "OK", don't worry the fact your test is at zero or ten....you'll be fine by the looks of ya. do they bother to realize we have to bust our ass to look like this? and "this" isn't even that great mind you....and if we, God forbid, had around normal or high test levels, it would be a MILLION times easier on us to look like this?

 

[mkretz]

goin in for my 2nd shot today..... worried, hopefully i dotn pass otu this tiem, my mom is gonna do it for me today and see how it goes

 

[superbeast668]

goin in for my 2nd shot today..... worried, hopefully i dotn pass otu this tiem, my mom is gonna do it for me today and see how it goes

Put some carbs in you. Youll be fine bro.

 

[lboston]

No feedback yet from OP--it's not lookin good boys!

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

No feedback yet from OP--it's not lookin good boys!

hahaha, I was thinking the same thing...its like a soap opera, "what happened to kretz today at the doctor"....did his mom inject him? did he inject himself? did he chicken out? did he fire the doctor? did he faint and hit his head and get admitted to ICU? these are the questions I must know every day!

 

[lboston]

hahaha, I was thinking the same thing...its like a soap opera, "what happened to kretz today at the doctor"....did his mom inject him? did he inject himself? did he chicken out? did he fire the doctor? did he faint and hit his head and get admitted to ICU? these are the questions I must know every day!

Lol-my bet is on fainting with a related head injury that followed. For the young guys sake I hope not!

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

Lol-my bet is on fainting with a related head injury that followed. For the young guys sake I hope not!

haha, I doubt it...they probably made sure he was in a room with no tables or chairs and all soft cushioned areas this thread is gonna be the next big thing with 1,000 replies

 

[lboston]

haha, I doubt it...they probably made sure he was in a room with no tables or chairs and all soft cushioned areas this thread is gonna be the next big thing with 1,000 replies

Lol-I hope so man. That's be legen-dary.

It's not lookin good bro. Kretz was updating his sh!t constantly...now he's nowhere in sight. Either he is slamming weights given his new found manhood or he's embarrassed and don't want to let us know...

Kretz--if youre reading this, we're here for you!!!!

 

[superbeast668]

Lol-I hope so man. That's be legen-dary.

It's not lookin good bro. Kretz was updating his sh!t constantly...now he's nowhere in sight. Either he is slamming weights given his new found manhood or he's embarrassed and don't want to let us know...

Kretz--if youre reading this, we're here for you!!!!

haha, I doubt it...they probably made sure he was in a room with no tables or chairs and all soft cushioned areas this thread is gonna be the next big thing with 1,000 replies

Lol-my bet is on fainting with a related head injury that followed. For the young guys sake I hope not!

hahaha, I was thinking the same thing...its like a soap opera, "what happened to kretz today at the doctor"....did his mom inject him? did he inject himself? did he chicken out? did he fire the doctor? did he faint and hit his head and get admitted to ICU? these are the questions I must know every day!

No feedback yet from OP--it's not lookin good boys!

I'm fuggin dieing over here guys. I've actually got tears from laughter. the poor dudes probably afraid to post.

 

[Danb2285]

I'm gettin in on this one before it hits 300 pages long lol

 

[lboston]

I'm fuggin dieing over here guys. I've actually got tears from laughter. the poor dudes probably afraid to post.

I've seen someone pass out from being stuck once... it was my wife. Pride hurts more than the needle!

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

KRETZ! KRETZ! KRETZ! KRETZ! KRETZ! KRETZ!

 

[superbeast668]

I've seen someone pass out from being stuck once... it was my wife. Pride hurts more than the needle!

ive passed out 3 times from needles. the first 2 were 12 ga getting slammed through my nipples. the third time i pushed 2.5mls into my glute in record time. when i pulled the pin i forgot to cotton ball it. i felt the blood. saw blood everywhere. started bugging out that i messed up and injected a vein.

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

I'm famous for (very) post-injection fainting, done that a few times....I'll be done injecting, walk to the kitchen to get a drink...on the way back to the bedroom I start falling out bounce off the walls....make it to the bed and faint ....or I'll finish the injection....be sitting on the bed...couple minutes go by....just looking around with the alcohol swab on the hole...next thing I know I wake up with my back on the bed LOL...just randomly fainted. not sure what that means? but its always post inject when it happens....which is rarely at best....

 

[lboston]

D@mn guys--glad I haven't had that experience yet.

Why were your nips injected? Piercing or surgery? If that's some new spot to hit in hopes of increasing absorption rates I'll have to pass!

 

[lboston]

KRETZ! KRETZ! KRETZ! KRETZ! KRETZ! KRETZ!

Gimme a K!...K...gimme an R!...R....

 

[WARBIRDWS6]

D@mn guys--glad I haven't had that experience yet.

Why were your nips injected? Piercing or surgery? If that's some new spot to hit in hopes of increasing absorption rates I'll have to pass!

other than injecting DHT into my nips for gyno? I would suppose the only other reason would be nipple rings