body re-comp cycle...

[t_dot_porkchop]

hey AM brothers,

let me know how you feel about the following body re-comp cycle im planning to run shortly:

week 1-2: M1T - 5mg ED
week 1-6: Mdien - starting at 5mg ED and working up to 20mg ED
week 3-6: 1-test transdermal - 350mg ED
week 3-6: M5AA - 40-60mg preworkout

week 7-10: PCT - nolva and liver care

I know that im probably going to be pretty lethargic without a test/4-AD base, but i really do not want any wet compounds in this one. currently, im 27, 195lbs, 6'1" and my BF% is around 15-16%. I want to stay around the same weight (200 max), but shift the LBM%:BF%...getting down to 11-12% would be great. ive done a few cycles already, but this would be the first time on anything methylated.

what do you think?

 

[Pirate!]

I wouldn't stack M1T and MD, even at those low doses, personally. Too hard on the liver. Maybe you could wait until week three to start the MD?

 

[tribaltek]

Stacking 5mg M-Dien with 5mg M-1-T would be no more toxic than taking 10mg M-1-T (actually, it would probably be less toxic).

Like I said before T-Dot, I think this will go well for you IF you can handle the lethargy that M-1-T brings. But at 5mg I really don't see it being too bad. Best of luck :thumbsup:

 

[NPursuit]

Stacking 5mg M-Dien with 5mg M-1-T would be no more toxic than taking 10mg M-1-T (actually, it would probably be less toxic).

Please post up the studies proving this.

 

[Dr. Jones]

The simple fact here is that we really don't know just how hepatoxic these new methylated compounds are. Referring back to an earlier thread on stacking methyls, Bobo wrote:

"Metabolites are usually more toxic than the actual substance itself. With one substance you have metabolites from 1 substance whether its a low dosage or not. Add another substance to that mix and you double the amount of active metabolites. You also double the amount of nutrients needed by the liver (mainly glycine, cysteine, glutamine, methionine, taurine, glutamic acid and aspartic acid).

Also if this occurs you can have Phase I and Phase II of liver detoxification that are out of balance and a build up of intermediate metabolites can occur which in turn can lead to tissue damage and eventually disease."

The bottom line is there are not enough clinical studies to really understand the health consequences of stacking these new methyls. I'm sure I'm not alone when I say "why risk it?" There are plenty of safer ways to use these compounds and still get great results....is it absolutely necessary to risk your health for the possibility of one or two more pounds of muscle? It's your liver though, so it's your call.....just check back with me when you hit 30 and realize that you're not actually invicible.

 

[lancelot]

I know that im probably going to be pretty lethargic without a test/4-AD base, but i really do not want any wet compounds in this one.
what do you think?

seriously, i would love to do an effective dry cycle, but i've been unsuccesful in the past(dam M4OHN). i'm currently on M1T/4-ad and i'm bloated even with nolva eod, formestane trans, and 6-oxo trans. But, you are going to be a walking zombie with just the 1-test/M1T and no 4-ad. you should be dry though as long as you keep the m1T dosage low and cycle length short. Not sure what MD will do.

 

[NPursuit]

The simple fact here is that we really don't know just how hepatoxic these new methylated compounds are. Referring back to an earlier thread on stacking methyls, Bobo wrote:

"Metabolites are usually more toxic than the actual substance itself. With one substance you have metabolites from 1 substance whether its a low dosage or not. Add another substance to that mix and you double the amount of active metabolites. You also double the amount of nutrients needed by the liver (mainly glycine, cysteine, glutamine, methionine, taurine, glutamic acid and aspartic acid).

Also if this occurs you can have Phase I and Phase II of liver detoxification that are out of balance and a build up of intermediate metabolites can occur which in turn can lead to tissue damage and eventually disease."

The bottom line is there are not enough clinical studies to really understand the health consequences of stacking these new methyls. I'm sure I'm not alone when I say "why risk it?" There are plenty of safer ways to use these compounds and still get great results....is it absolutely necessary to risk your health for the possibility of one or two more pounds of muscle? It's your liver though, so it's your call.....just check back with me when you hit 30 and realize that you're not actually invicible.

That was the point of my post. I don't want to see people posting crap that they don't have any concrete data on, and possibly jeopardizing someone's health in the process.

 

[t_dot_porkchop]

so then i should try at all costs to avoid stacking M1T and MD at the same time?

what is the current verdict on M5AA?

 

[tribaltek]

I thought we saw labs showing M-1-T to be the most toxic of all of the new compounds. If that does not mean that 10mg of M-1-T is worse than 5mg M-1-T plus 5mg of another substance, than I stand corrected. I'm not looking to push false info, but I believed this to be the truth from what I have read on here and other boards.

Please post up the studies proving this.

 

[NPursuit]

so then i should try at all costs to avoid stacking M1T and MD at the same time?

what is the current verdict on M5AA?

IMO, yes you should avoid it. IMO you should avoid stacking ANY methylated compound. It's just too early in the game to know what the consequences are going to be from these compounds.

 

[NPursuit]

I thought we saw labs showing M-1-T to be the most toxic of all of the new compounds. If that does not mean that 10mg of M-1-T is worse than 5mg M-1-T plus 5mg of another substance, than I stand corrected. I'm not looking to push false info, but I believed this to be the truth from what I have read on here and other boards.

We have seen liver tests done, but that only tells half of the story. We haven't seen enough data on M1T, let alone the new methylated compounds.

 

[Rictor33]

so then i should try at all costs to avoid stacking M1T and MD at the same time?

what is the current verdict on M5AA?

Definatley. I think that stacking two methylated compounds that are relatively new is a very bold move that could turnout bad. Why risk it? The same goes for mixing other types of little-known drugs. Im sure that 1-test trans and any one of those methylated compounds together will get you what you're looking for. And doing 1-test trans and M1T could really be a miserable experience, I was so tired on M1T alone I could barely function properly at 20 mg/day. 1-Test lethargy wasn't bad, but M1T kicked my ass then kicked it some more.

 

[t_dot_porkchop]

so a methyl is not equal to a methyl???

i mean, there are guys doing their first AAS cycle popping 30, 40 or 50mg of dbol ED. what about a-bombs at 50-100mg ED????

i just dont see how 5mg of M1T and 5mg of MD can be so harsh to be so frowned upon when complete AAS NOOBS are told to pop 5 times as much dbol....

 

[Dr. Jones]

so a methyl is not equal to a methyl???

i mean, there are guys doing their first AAS cycle popping 30, 40 or 50mg of dbol ED. what about a-bombs at 50-100mg ED????

i just dont see how 5mg of M1T and 5mg of MD can be so harsh to be so frowned upon when complete AAS NOOBS are told to pop 5 times as much dbol....

That's right...."a methyl is not necessarilly equal to another methyl." Do you honestly think that Dbol is equal to Winstrol? Also, I cannot stress enought that we simply don't know enough about these new methyls to know what's safe and what isn't. Play it smart!

 

[t_dot_porkchop]

i wanna play it smart, but i also dont want to cut myself short by being too cautious.

question: should i even consider the M1T in this cycle?

 

[Dr. Jones]

i wanna play it smart, but i also dont want to cut myself short by being too cautious.

question: should i even consider the M1T in this cycle?

There's no question that M1T is the strongest of the OTC PH/ Pro Steroids currently available. That said, if you havne't taken it before, I think you'll see nice gains running it for two weeks by itself. You can start at 5mg and work up to 10mg. Personally, I saw amazing results stacking 10mg of M1t with 450mg of 4ad prop/ week (from Sledge Test). That said, if you're absolutely unwilling to ad any 4ad, I'd recommend dropping the Mdien completely. You may want to consider the addition of clen during weeks 2-3 (just watch your blood pressure--hawthorn berry can be useful here), ECA during weeks 4-5, and clen during during weeks 6-7 (that way you'll continue the clen a bit into your PCT.

 

[milwood]

you know what worked freaking great for me recently was M4OHN and 3-alpha t/d. You could try this, or do MDien with 3-alpha. Then you won't catch hell for mixing methyls (and I don't want that to sound like I don't have concerns about that too!) I actually started with 1T and 4AD t/d for 2 weeks, added 2 weeks of M1T, then went to M4OHN, first with M5AA, then I switched to 3-alpha to avoid stacking M's. Of course, this (MDien and 3-alpha) would be pretty androgenic. I gotta say that 40mg M4OHN and 150mg t/d of 3-alpha was a killer body comp stack for the final 4 weeks of my 8 week cycle; hardness, vascularity, energy, and no sides. I kept 200 mg 1T t/d throughout the 8 weeks too. I'd do this cycle again for sure, maybe with a little tweaking.