XI-KT or Alpha Seven for a recomp/cut. Which one?

[tenorguy33]

Hey guys! Looking at running XI-KT or Alpha Seven on a cut/recomp heading into summer. I may add in Oral Epi-Andro as well. I have used Epi before but this would be my first time running the iconic or IL products.

From my research they both work well for my goals. In your experience which would you go with? (Alpha 7 OR XI-KT)

Also, would an OTC PTC be sufficient after this run? I was thinking 8 weeks on and then I would run m-test, inhibit E, b-aet, and possibly cycle assist as a PCT.

 

[cheftepesh1]

Hey guys! Looking at running XI-KT or Alpha Seven on a cut/recomp heading into summer. I may add in Oral Epi-Andro as well. I have used Epi before but this would be my first time running the iconic or IL products.

From my research they both work well for my goals. In your experience which would you go with? Also, would an OTC PTC be sufficient after this run? I was thinking 8 weeks on and then I would run m-test, inhibit E, b-aet, and possibly cycle assist as a PCT.

Oral epi I would look at alpha gainz version. As far as pct look at adding sustain alpha as it’s synergistic to adding others for libido and other benefits.

 

[thebigt]

Hey guys! Looking at running XI-KT or Alpha Seven on a cut/recomp heading into summer. I may add in Oral Epi-Andro as well. I have used Epi before but this would be my first time running the iconic or IL products.

From my research they both work well for my goals. In your experience which would you go with? (Alpha 7 OR XI-KT)

Also, would an OTC PTC be sufficient after this run? I was thinking 8 weeks on and then I would run m-test, inhibit E, b-aet, and possibly cycle assist as a PCT.

before i recommend one or the other 1st tell what doses you would run at?

 

[Smont]

I'm using thermoamp right now and I believe it's most noticable benifits lie in body composition/recomp

 

[thebigt]

I'm using thermoamp right now and I believe it's most noticable benifits lie in body composition/recomp

 

[Smont]

What you thinking about lol

 

[tenorguy33]

before i recommend one or the other 1st tell what doses you would run at?

I would likely run the Alpha 7 at the recommended 5 pumps or the XI-KT at 2ml. (From what I’ve seen searching the forums, 11 keto seems to shine for recomp at the higher end of the dosing scheme.)

If I did EpiAndro I would do 600mg a day. I have done 900mg before with no side effects but don’t want to over do it with the addition of another hormonal product.

I am open to knowledge/advice if there is a better way though.

 

[tenorguy33]

I'm using thermoamp right now and I believe it's most noticable benifits lie in body composition/recomp

I do have a bottle of it in my cupboard, could definitely give it a try.

 

[thebigt]

I would likely run the Alpha 7 at the recommended 5 pumps or the XI-KT at 2ml. (From what I’ve seen searching the forums, 11 keto seems to shine for recomp at the higher end of the dosing scheme.)

If I did EpiAndro I would do 600mg a day. I have done 900mg before with no side effects but don’t want to over do it with the addition of another hormonal product.

I am open to knowledge/advice if there is a better way though.

ok, just making sure--both of those dosing schemes would be very adequate..i see guys running 11 keto at lower doses. 2ml or 200mg daily is a great dose for 11 keto and is hard to beat for recomp/cut--although i am a huge fan of alpha seven.

 

[stankyleg]

11>7 in my experience. 7 dried out my joints. 11 just leans me out. At my age, it's really my fav. No sides. It's a great stack with trt. You'll love 11kt bro. Best of luck brother

 

[KvanH]

What you thinking about lol

I'm thinking about burgers. Big juicy burgers with a lot of cheese. And fries. Crispy greasy fries. Mayonnaise. Ketchup. Milkshake. Not that anyone asked.

 

[KvanH]

Based on the experiences I've read, I'd choose 11-KT for cutting. And I kind of did, as I started Ultra 11 today = )

 

[AndroRage]

11>7 in my experience. 7 dried out my joints. 11 just leans me out. At my age, it's really my fav. No sides. It's a great stack with trt. You'll love 11kt bro. Best of luck brother

How did you run the 11kt in terms of stack & dosage Bro? You don’t like A7 or just prefer 11kt?

Thanks!

 

[stankyleg]

Absolutely brother. The seven keto supplement that I used was oral, and not transdermal. But it did tank my cortisol levels like nothing else. I do not recall the dosage, or the brand(ax something?). I do remember when I cut the dosage in half, it did not mitigate the joint problems. I revisited it a few months later, with the same outcome. 11kt, I have used multiple times with great success. Since I'm on trt, I will run it a bit longer than what is typically recommended. 8 to 10 weeks, moving from 150 mg, up to 300 mg at its pinnacle. 200 mg of testosterone until the last couple weeks, when I drop it to 125 mg a week, and usually 60 mg of VAR for the last 6 weeks. Keep in mind, this advice is coming from someone who is closer to 50 years old then he is to 40. The 7keto experiment would have taken place in my late 30s. Hope this helps brother.

 

[stankyleg]

Absolutely brother. The seven keto supplement that I used was oral, and not transdermal. But it did tank my cortisol levels like nothing else. I do not recall the dosage, or the brand(ax something?). I do remember when I cut the dosage in half, it did not mitigate the joint problems. I revisited it a few months later, with the same outcome. 11kt, I have used multiple times with great success. Since I'm on trt, I will run it a bit longer than what is typically recommended. 8 to 10 weeks, moving from 150 mg, up to 300 mg at its pinnacle. 200 mg of testosterone until the last couple weeks, when I drop it to 125 mg a week, and usually 60 mg of VAR for the last 6 weeks. Keep in mind, this advice is coming from someone who is closer to 50 years old then he is to 40. The 7keto experiment would have taken place in my late 30s. Hope this helps brother.

Sorry, I left out some information there. The 7 KT lowered my cortisol to the point that my joints absolutely killed me all the time. Whenever I would lift, especially leg movements, it felt like my tendons were about to explode

 

[KvanH]

Absolutely brother. The seven keto supplement that I used was oral, and not transdermal. But it did tank my cortisol levels like nothing else. I do not recall the dosage, or the brand(ax something?). I do remember when I cut the dosage in half, it did not mitigate the joint problems. I revisited it a few months later, with the same outcome. 11kt, I have used multiple times with great success. Since I'm on trt, I will run it a bit longer than what is typically recommended. 8 to 10 weeks, moving from 150 mg, up to 300 mg at its pinnacle. 200 mg of testosterone until the last couple weeks, when I drop it to 125 mg a week, and usually 60 mg of VAR for the last 6 weeks. Keep in mind, this advice is coming from someone who is closer to 50 years old then he is to 40. The 7keto experiment would have taken place in my late 30s. Hope this helps brother.

I feel like mentioning, that Androsterone is the key ingredient in Alpha 7, while it does have 7-keto also. That's a pretty odd reaction to 7-keto, as it shouldn't effect cortisol much. It's main effect is thermogenic. Maybe it was actually something else you were taking, or spiked with something? Not looking to argue or dismiss your experience, I just find it unusual.

 

[stankyleg]

I feel like mentioning, that Androsterone is the key ingredient in Alpha 7, while it does have 7-keto also. That's a pretty odd reaction to 7-keto, as it shouldn't effect cortisol much. It's main effect is thermogenic. Maybe it was actually something else you were taking, or spiked with something? Not looking to argue or dismiss your experience, I just find it unusual.

All real possibilities my man. I could revisit it. Try different manufacturer. It could possibly have been another ingredient in that particular supplement. I do remember it was marketed that seven keto was the star of the show. I've never tried seven by itself. If it's not supposed to modulate cortisol, then, it might make a fantastic stack with the 11kt. I may order a seven keto product and stack right now. That would be an easy way to find out. Thanks bro

 

[AndroRage]

Absolutely brother. The seven keto supplement that I used was oral, and not transdermal. But it did tank my cortisol levels like nothing else. I do not recall the dosage, or the brand(ax something?). I do remember when I cut the dosage in half, it did not mitigate the joint problems. I revisited it a few months later, with the same outcome. 11kt, I have used multiple times with great success. Since I'm on trt, I will run it a bit longer than what is typically recommended. 8 to 10 weeks, moving from 150 mg, up to 300 mg at its pinnacle. 200 mg of testosterone until the last couple weeks, when I drop it to 125 mg a week, and usually 60 mg of VAR for the last 6 weeks. Keep in mind, this advice is coming from someone who is closer to 50 years old then he is to 40. The 7keto experiment would have taken place in my late 30s. Hope this helps brother.

Which product do you recommend for 11KT?

what would you say is minimum effective/optimal dosage Bro?

looking to stack with Var and test actually.

Oh and Alpha 7 is 7 Keto and Androsterone (which I think someone posted before)

 

[stankyleg]

Which product do you recommend for 11KT?

what would you say is minimum effective/optimal dosage Bro?

looking to stack with Var and test actually.

Oh and Alpha 7 is 7 Keto and Androsterone (which I think someone posted before)

I've used our legion, Olympus, and done some lab research with Apex alchemy and rats arm.

Effective dose would vary from person to person. For me, it really shines at 300 mg a day. But if I'm doing a long run, I start at 150 and work my way up.

It wouldn't surprise me in the least if I was having just some sort of odd reaction to seven keto that nobody else on Earth has ever experienced. Real talk

 

[tenorguy33]

ok, just making sure--both of those dosing schemes would be very adequate..i see guys running 11 keto at lower doses. 2ml or 200mg daily is a great dose for 11 keto and is hard to beat for recomp/cut--although i am a huge fan of alpha seven.

Thanks for the advice. I’m going to give the 11 keto a go in May/June and then might give Alpha 7 a try in the fall.

Upon comparing, it appears Ultra 11 is slightly more economical between it and XI-KT given size of bottle and amount of 11 keto.

Any difference between these two products (carrier, smell, dry time, etc) in your experience? Or are they basically the same?

 

[stankyleg]

Thanks for the advice. I’m going to give the 11 keto a go in May/June and then might give Alpha 7 a try in the fall.

Upon comparing, it appears Ultra 11 is slightly more economical between it and XI-KT given size of bottle and amount of 11 keto.

Any difference between these two products (carrier, smell, dry time, etc) in your experience? Or are they basically the same?

I've never used ultra 11. But the other iconic formulations stuff I've used is my favorite carrier to date. Quick dry, but not so quick that you feel like you didn't get to spread it around good. Minimal smell. Not greasy. IF is smoke.

 

[stankyleg]

Correction. Bro. I apologize. I had my math wrong. I start at 75 and work up to 150. Sh!t bro. My bad man.

 

[thebigt]

I've never used ultra 11. But the other iconic formulations stuff I've used is my favorite carrier to date. Quick dry, but not so quick that you feel like you didn't get to spread it around good. Minimal smell. Not greasy. IF is smoke.

hell yes.....i'm with you on how good iconic products are--my rep pay is products and i love using them, i've used every single one of the products several times, and in all honesty i've bought many of the products with my own cash!!!

love iconic formulations!!!!

 

[NegativeMass]

I like both, but in my experience 11 keto is superior for cutting and drying out. Androsterone gives me more drive and performance benefits. Both are great and can be combined.

 

[cheftepesh1]

hell yes.....i'm with you on how good iconic products are--my rep pay is products and i love using them, i've used every single one of the products several times, and in all honesty i've bought many of the products with my own cash!!!

love iconic formulations!!!!

This man knows transdermals. He has literally tested and used every product and has many runs under his belt. If any ones advice is worth it’s weight it is thebigt.

 

[thebigt]

This man knows transdermals. He has literally tested and used every product and has many runs under his belt. If any ones advice is worth it’s weight it is thebigt.

thank you for the kind words...it's true that i've tried and used a great many transdermals and feel right at home representing a company that specializes in transdermals...and am very fortune to work with you, my friend @cheftepesh1 and for a great guy like @delsolrob i'm a very happy camper!!!

 

[delsolrob]

11-keto is going to be the supperior compound for recomp.

Ultra Eleven is a killer deal for 11-keto - but a lot of it comes down to what your preference is in the carrier. some people love salvo and some people love the gels.

I would really recommend using Ultra Eleven while it's still available.

 

[AndroRage]

Correction. Bro. I apologize. I had my math wrong. I start at 75 and work up to 150. Sh!t bro. My bad man.

IL XIKT is 85mg per ml Bro so what were you running it at?

 

[stankyleg]

IL XIKT is 85mg per ml Bro so what were you running it at?

I didn't take xikt up to 2 ml. I do recall going real hard on the Olympus labs stuff, but both my bottles had undesolved product in the bottom when the pump ran dry. I don't recall how much was left, although I remember scraping it out and weighing it. My rat is on 150, if my label is accurate, currently. But being the overthinker I am, I'm starting to wonder. I saw a 3+3 xikt/7 combo a couple days ago I'm considering pulling the trigger on. If I do, I'll parallel the dose on the 11.

 

[tenorguy33]

11-keto is going to be the supperior compound for recomp.

Ultra Eleven is a killer deal for 11-keto - but a lot of it comes down to what your preference is in the carrier. some people love salvo and some people love the gels.

I would really recommend using Ultra Eleven while it's still available.

I’m going to put an order in for the Ultra 11 here soon. I appreciate the feedback and your interaction/advice for members of the forum. I have used your All Out Ultra and enjoy it. I have ThermoAmp and All Out Sweat in my cabinet to try once I’m in the swing of a cut.

This will be my first experience with your topicals but it sounds like it should be a great experience based on the high praise. Looking forward to it!

 

[thebigt]

I’m going to put an order in for the Ultra 11 here soon. I appreciate the feedback and your interaction/advice for members of the forum. I have used your All Out Ultra and enjoy it. I have ThermoAmp and All Out Sweat in my cabinet to try once I’m in the swing of a cut.

This will be my first experience with your topicals but it sounds like it should be a great experience based on the high praise. Looking forward to it!

good luck!!!

 

[Neversummer]

Does anyone know or seen studies of 11Kt‘s effects on liver, kidney or lipids?

 

[stankyleg]

Does anyone know or seen studies of 11Kt‘s effects on liver, kidney or lipids?

I can't speak to a study, but I will say all oral except var give me pale stool. I see no difference with 11kt. I'm sure it has to have a lipid effect. I can report back soon. I have to give bloods shortly.

 

[thebigt]

I can't speak to a study, but I will say all oral except var give me pale stool. I see no difference with 11kt. I'm sure it has to have a lipid effect. I can report back soon. I have to give bloods shortly.

i'm also curious to see how your blood work comes back!!!

always good when guys are willing to give updates on blood work-thank you in advance!!!

 

[stankyleg]

i'm also curious to see how your blood work comes back!!!

always good when guys are willing to give updates on blood work-thank you in advance!!!

I'll have cholesterol numbers in about 2 weeks. In 3 months, I'll have a full panel done. I've only got two weeks left on this run, and I'll be finishing up another run straight into that blood work. So that will tell everything. I'm currently doing 30 days on, about 40 days off, then another 30 days on.

 

[cheftepesh1]

I’m going to put an order in for the Ultra 11 here soon. I appreciate the feedback and your interaction/advice for members of the forum. I have used your All Out Ultra and enjoy it. I have ThermoAmp and All Out Sweat in my cabinet to try once I’m in the swing of a cut.

This will be my first experience with your topicals but it sounds like it should be a great experience based on the high praise. Looking forward to it!

If you need a discount code chef is good for 20% off.

 

[stankyleg]

i'm also curious to see how your blood work comes back!!!

always good when guys are willing to give updates on blood work-thank you in advance!!!

2 months ago my cholesterol was 157. 3 days ago it was 172. Both were fasted state draw. Not destroyed, or out of range, but definitely a difference.

 

[Neversummer]

2 months ago my cholesterol was 157. 3 days ago it was 172. Both were fasted state draw. Not destroyed, or out of range, but definitely a difference.

did HDL drop and LDL go up? Or was it just an increase in LDL?

 

[stankyleg]

did HDL drop and LDL go up? Or was it just an increase in LDL?

HDL and LDL were not checked. I'll get that done in july. This was just a complimentary cholesterol check with a blood donation. But I know from my past experience, I've never seen the cholesterol jump without a drop in my good lipids. I'm just thankful that it's still within range. The last time I did tren, I went from around 140 to 240. Then pct with cardarine for 6 weeks and got it almost all the way back down on the next draw. This is a little more mild than a var run, as far as cholesterol level goes, for me at least. I'll make my own thread in july, and post dosages, and blood work

 

[Smont]

HDL and LDL were not checked. I'll get that done in july. This was just a complimentary cholesterol check with a blood donation. But I know from my past experience, I've never seen the cholesterol jump without a drop in my good lipids. I'm just thankful that it's still within range. The last time I did tren, I went from around 140 to 240. Then pct with cardarine for 6 weeks and got it almost all the way back down on the next draw. This is a little more mild than a var run, as far as cholesterol level goes, for me at least. I'll make my own thread in july, and post dosages, and blood work

I use carderine with stuff like orals to keep my cholesterol in check, but, I've always wondered, is it really keeping it in check or just masking the numbers. I'm going to use it regardless but I can't help but wonder

 

[stankyleg]

i'm also curious to see how your blood work comes back!!!

always good when guys are willing to give updates on blood work-thank you in advance!!!

Just got bloods back. HDL/LDL ratio was 2.2. Great. Omega 3 at 2gms, gotu kola, milk thistle and saw palmetto as support supp. Well, Really life staples.

 

[stankyleg]

More in depth report......
Ast 24
Alt 18
Triglycerides 62
HDL/LDL ratio 2.2
Cholesterol 170
11kt seems like the safest physique enhancement compound of the androgens.

 

[cheftepesh1]

More in depth report......
Ast 24
Alt 18
Triglycerides 62
HDL/LDL ratio 2.2
Cholesterol 170
11kt seems like the safest physique enhancement compound of the androgens.

Number don’t look to bad

 

[stankyleg]

Number don’t look to bad

Bro. Ima 45 yr old former hell raiser, and androgen abuser. I'm effen stoked.

 

[Neversummer]

More in depth report......
Ast 24
Alt 18
Triglycerides 62
HDL/LDL ratio 2.2
Cholesterol 170
11kt seems like the safest physique enhancement compound of the androgens.

numbers look good! Thanks for sharing this Information. There really isn’t much data out there but from what little I have seen is the effect on blood markers is minimal

 

[PARASXOS]

Guys ,whoever chooses to go the 11 kt route watch out for hair loss... It can wreck the hair unfortunately

 

[LeanEngineer]

Guys ,whoever chooses to go the 11 kt route watch out for hair loss... It can wreck the hair unfortunately

Luckily most of us men are heading toward the hair loss/bald as we age so may not be too much of a concern for most. Or I might just be trying to make myself feel a little better since i'm bald

 

[delsolrob]

Guys ,whoever chooses to go the 11 kt route watch out for hair loss... It can wreck the hair unfortunately

If you're prone, any androgen will cause hair loss...I've not seen too many people complain about shedding on 11-keto

 

[cheftepesh1]

If you're prone, any androgen will cause hair loss...I've not seen too many people complain about shedding on 11-keto

I’ve never had an issue personally.

 

[PARASXOS]

If you're prone, any androgen will cause hair loss...I've not seen too many people complain about shedding on 11-keto

Many people from my environment who have used it experienced it.. myself included ofc. Yep the truth is if u're prone any compound will accelerate the hair loss