Unanswered WTF is causing gyno symptoms?**Updated with Blood Work**

[Aging Lifter]

Long story short. Had gyno surgery about 7 years ago due to prohormone use in my 20's. Have not used any prohormone in at least 10 years. Haven't had symptoms since the surgery.

Fast forward to today. I Have been on a 12 week recomp. Super clean diet, training is dialed in. Supplements consist of creatine, glutamine, glycine, bcaa's and whey.

Started Eviscerate Supernova on 04/26/19. No symptoms noted.

Started M-test and Inhibit-e on 05/03, at the recommended doses. On 05/04 observed the familiar tingling, puffiness and pain in nipples. Thought it was an anomaly as there is no way one day on a "natural test booster" could cause gyno.

3 days go by and the symptoms continued. I immediately stopped the M-test and Inhibit-e. Pain still exists.

I Stopped Eviscerate and the Pain still exists.

It's been a week and half and it hasn't stopped. No lump growth but there is pain, tenderness and puffiness.

The only thing else that goes in my body besides clean food/water is Claritin/Loratadine which I have been taking for 4 months following a poison oak exposure.

I can't for the life of me figure out what it is. I have made great progress on my recomp. I've gained muscle, lost fat. Abs are starting to show and now this BS.

Wtf is happening? I would really hate to have to undergo another surgery.

Posted in the AAS forum due to more knowledge on the subject should be on this board.

Thank You

 

[ValiantThor08]

Appears like you have raised testosterone enough to aromatize enough into estrogen causing the gyno.

I take DAA, I get gyno. My test naturally soars, I get gyno. I take different herbs, I get gyno. Appears you and I are very prone to get gyno, other guys are not. You might want to pick up some Ralox.

 

[xR1pp3Rx]

perhaps its not gyno...

loratadine side effects has this listed: Swelling or tingling in the face, mouth, throat, hands, feet, arms, or lower legs

perhaps your feeling it in the lower chest via the arms or arm pits.

obviously spit balling but I agree there is NO WAY 1 day on a test booster is going to do dick all.

 

[Socalmk6gti]

perhaps its not gyno...

loratadine side effects has this listed: Swelling or tingling in the face, mouth, throat, hands, feet, arms, or lower legs

perhaps your feeling it in the lower chest via the arms or arm pits.

obviously spit balling but I agree there is NO WAY 1 day on a test booster is going to do dick all.

"going to do dick all"

Never heard this, but made me lol.


And I agree

 

[ValiantThor08]

perhaps its not gyno...

loratadine side effects has this listed: Swelling or tingling in the face, mouth, throat, hands, feet, arms, or lower legs

perhaps your feeling it in the lower chest via the arms or arm pits.

obviously spit balling but I agree there is NO WAY 1 day on a test booster is going to do dick all.

Maybe his diet being spot on raising his test.

 

[NGtrains]

Maybe his diet being spot on raising his test.

No way it would raise it that much. At least not in my experience.

 

[ValiantThor08]

No way it would raise it that much. At least not in my experience.

Depends on where you are coming from. For me, I can tell a difference in my test levels based on my diet/lifestyle changes.

 

[NGtrains]

Depends on where you are coming from. For me, I can tell a difference in my test levels based on my diet/lifestyle changes.

It must be individual differences. While I do feel better eating clean, I never thought it was that drastic a difference. But for me going from relatively clean to super clean wasn’t a huge difference.

Maybe the better feeling was the T and I just don’t know it

 

[Cjg]

M test has boron.. boron can raise estrogen

 

[ValiantThor08]

M test has boron.. boron can raise estrogen

I thought boron had the potential to lower it.

 

[xR1pp3Rx]

I thought boron had the potential to lower it.

i believe it depends on what kind of boron.. the newer stuff raises it the older stuff lowered it in men

 

[Aging Lifter]

Thanks for the responses. I have had actual gyno so I know what it feels like. Real gyno F-ing hurts. Many people confuse being fat with gyno. I can assure you the Pain I'm feeling is symptoms associated with gyno. If you have had it you would know what im talking about. It's not something that can be confused with something else.

The plan is to get some Nolva right away and try to knock it out .

I'm also dumping the Claritin.

I'm just at a loss for wtf is causing it.

 

[nostrum420]

IF that's legit divanil, that could explain it.

1 You're not in your 20s anymore and your e2 production is a bit higher. It's a natural part of aging especially if you're a dad.

2 Your breast tissue is fairly e2 sensitive, hence the previous bout of gyno.

3 A dose of divanil knocks some e2 that was bound to SHBG loose and the spike aggravates the aforementioned sensitive tissue reacts.

 

[Aging Lifter]

IF that's legit divanil, that could explain it.

1 You're not in your 20s anymore and your e2 production is a bit higher. It's a natural part of aging especially if you're a dad.

2 Your breast tissue is fairly e2 sensitive, hence the previous bout of gyno.

3 A dose of divanil knocks some e2 that was bound to SHBG loose and the spike aggravates the aforementioned sensitive tissue reacts.

Divanil in the M-Test?

I mean I felt it almost instantly after taking the stuff. It's just hard for me to believe it happened that fast. A gram of test wouldn't cause instant gyno symptoms like that.

 

[Aging Lifter]

Just found this thread which seems to confirm:

Divanil is causing mild gyno flareups - AnabolicMinds.com

First off i have some mild pre-existing gyno, so am obviously prone in the first place This is the second time i have used a divanil produc, and it has caused issues The first time i ran Activate Xtreme solo last September and had pain in my left nip throughout use... thought maybe it was just...

anabolicminds.com

 

[Jeremyk1]

IF that's legit divanil, that could explain it.

1 You're not in your 20s anymore and your e2 production is a bit higher. It's a natural part of aging especially if you're a dad.

2 Your breast tissue is fairly e2 sensitive, hence the previous bout of gyno.

3 A dose of divanil knocks some e2 that was bound to SHBG loose and the spike aggravates the aforementioned sensitive tissue reacts.

I actually didn’t even think about this. One more thing you didn’t mention, since divanil should be unbinding test, it’s possible to have more aromatization due to higher enzyme activity with the freed up test. Don’t know how significant any of this will be, but if you’re sensitive, it’s possible.

 

[ValiantThor08]

Never say never..

 

[nostrum420]

Divanil in the M-Test?

I mean I felt it almost instantly after taking the stuff. It's just hard for me to believe it happened that fast. A gram of test wouldn't cause instant gyno symptoms like that.

A gram of T wouldn't because the androgenic effects of the T would take effect before the downstream e2 effects. In this case you liberated T and e2 at the same time. This would be more akin to taking a birth control pill than a gram of T.

 

[nostrum420]

I actually didn’t even think about this. One more thing you didn’t mention, since divanil should be unbinding test, it’s possible to have more aromatization due to higher enzyme activity with the freed up test. Don’t know how significant any of this will be, but if you’re sensitive, it’s possible.

That could contribute to exacerbating the issue over time but it wouldn't explain the near instant onset of symptoms. Good point though and certainly something to consider if OP intends to use the product again.

 

[Colin]

Long story short. Had gyno surgery about 7 years ago due to prohormone use in my 20's. Have not used any prohormone in at least 10 years. Haven't had symptoms since the surgery.

Fast forward to today. I Have been on a 12 week recomp. Super clean diet, training is dialed in. Supplements consist of creatine, glutamine, glycine, bcaa's and whey.

Started Eviscerate Supernova on 04/26/19. No symptoms noted.

Started M-test and Inhibit-e on 05/03, at the recommended doses. On 05/04 observed the familiar tingling, puffiness and pain in nipples. Thought it was an anomaly as there is no way one day on a "natural test booster" could cause gyno.

3 days go by and the symptoms continued. I immediately stopped the M-test and Inhibit-e. Pain still exists.

I Stopped Eviscerate and the Pain still exists.

It's been a week and half and it hasn't stopped. No lump growth but there is pain, tenderness and puffiness.

The only thing else that goes in my body besides clean food/water is Claritin/Loratadine which I have been taking for 4 months following a poison oak exposure.

I can't for the life of me figure out what it is. I have made great progress on my recomp. I've gained muscle, lost fat. Abs are starting to show and now this BS.

Wtf is happening? I would really hate to have to undergo another surgery.

Posted in the AAS forum due to more knowledge on the subject should be on this board.

Thank You

Get ralox or nolva immediately, if you don't have either already (which you should).

I think the PH and anti-e, even used at such a short time, are to blame.

I'd consider clomid or test injections for TRT, been a while since I looked but 25mg/ED is the dose commonly used for TRT in males, IIRC. Do some digging on pubmed, print out some abstracts, take them to an endo.

Eviscerate has no hormonal action AFAIK, should be fine using it. To be extra safe, avoid applying it on your chest.

 

[Aging Lifter]

That could contribute to exacerbating the issue over time but it wouldn't explain the near instant onset of symptoms. Good point though and certainly something to consider if OP intends to use the product again.

Thanks for the replies. Today feels a lot better. No pain but there is still mild tingling.

I definitely will not be using the product again or any other product that might cause the problem to arise again.

 

[nostrum420]

Thanks for the replies. Today feels a lot better. No pain but there is still mild tingling.

I definitely will not be using the product again or any other product that might cause the problem to arise again.

Glad you're feeling better!

 

[Aging Lifter]

What dosage protocol with Nolvadex would be recommended in this case?

 

[ChocolateClen]

20/20/10/10 should be fine to take care of it maybe less time but make sure you taper off it

 

[Aging Lifter]

20/20/10/10 should be fine to take care of it maybe less time but make sure you taper off it

Is that 4 weeks or 4 days?

 

[ChocolateClen]

Is that 4 weeks or 4 days?

Weeks, you might be able to get away with 2 weeks at 20 and that’s it but I noticed if I don’t taper off my gyno flares up after again

 

[Aging Lifter]

Thank You

 

[Aging Lifter]

Day 2 with Nolva and the tenderness and puffiness is still there.

It only seems to bother me in the afternoon.

Getting a little worried.

 

[nostrum420]

Yeeeah, it's gonna take a little time. Are you using an ai as well?

 

[Aging Lifter]

Not at this time.

 

[nostrum420]

Not at this time.

Could be good to add some exem if symptoms don't start to subside in a week or so.

 

[manifesto]

Did you have the gland removed?

I didnt think it was possible to get gyno again if the gland was completely removed

 

[manifesto]

Sorry if you already answered that. Did not see it in the thread

 

[Aging Lifter]

Glands on both sides were removed to the best of my knowledge.

When I originally had it, I believe it was a prolactin related issue.

Any possibility of that being the case now?

 

[manifesto]

Glands on both sides were removed to the best of my knowledge.

When I originally had it, I believe it was a prolactin related issue.

Any possibility of that being the case now?

Did you have it done through your health care insurance or a private plastic surgeon?

 

[Aging Lifter]

Did you have it done through your health care insurance or a private plastic surgeon?

Private plastic surgeon.

 

[Aging Lifter]

Felt a lot better yesterday and so far so good today.

 

[Chados]

Could be the classic "its always in the back of my head so now I start to believe I have it and maybe even start touching the nipples and make them sore"

 

[Aging Lifter]

Had a cheat meal which included sufficient carbs and two beers on Saturday night.

Pain and puffiness returned Sunday morning and is still present today.

 

[manifesto]

Carbs and beer almost always cause my gyno to flare up

 

[Aging Lifter]

It flared up on Saturday and has not calmed down despite 40mg/Day of Nolvadex.

Going today for blood work.

 

[manifesto]

It flared up on Saturday and has not calmed down despite 40mg/Day of Nolvadex.

Going today for blood work.

Good call on the bloodwork. Only way to really tell what's going on

 

[Aging Lifter]

I'm just concerned that even with the blood work most doctors won't know how to help.

 

[manifesto]

They may not but then you will have an idea of what's going on, and you can look for a new doctor if need be, and continue your research

 

[Aging Lifter]

That's the plan.

 

[user567]

It flared up on Saturday and has not calmed down despite 40mg/Day of Nolvadex.

Going today for blood work.

well sleep well in knowing the tissue will not grow while on Nolva until you find your answers.

With some people its more about the TEST to E2 ratio than it is about the total E2.

 

[doogans]

Interesting to see if you can get to the bottom of this. I had to get a mammogram and ultrasound a few years back on my left nip. Turned out I had gyno but it was never surgically removed. I was taking Soy Lecithin granules at the time(for phosphatidic acid) and I'm pretty sure that's what caused it to flare up to the extreme it did. Some will say that soy has no effect on estrogen. Others claim the phytoestrogens in soy can trigger these symptoms. Either way, I wish you luck brother!

 

[manifesto]

This is why it is important to make sure all of the gland is removed with surgery I believe.

If there is no gland, there can be no gyno. Any puffiness can only be chest fat or perhaps water retention

 

[Aging Lifter]

Based on what I'm feeling, I believe they must not have removed the entire gland, which really sucks.

Just got my blood drawn. Should have results within 48 hours.

 

[manifesto]

Alright. Good luck. Keep us posted.